WHO WON? GOLOVKIN OR CANELO?

[Tomasino]

Canelos *strength and conditioning* programme definitely seems to have been *geared* towards muscle bulk, which may well have been why he lacks a bit of *juice* in a lot of rounds, there are long periods of rounds where you wonder if he is rope a *doping* the other fighter, but as I say I think it's more a lack of *juice* than a deliberate tactic, because Alvarez doesn't have a very HiGH output he is very easy to outwork. You almost wish there had been a little bit of *needle* between them maybe that would have *pumped Alvarez full of* the will and desire, the *testosterone*-type aggression, that he needed.

What are you trying to say

The *chemistry* of the fight was good but Canelos *performance* could have been *enhanced* by a different emphasis in his *strength and conditioning* programme. Mind you, who needs to actually win 7 rounds when the judges are clearly either *on drugs*, or corrupt as fvck.

[jamamb]

canelo was easily the better boxer when he could muster the energy but he had issues with the pressure and was still getting hit to much in relation to how much he was landing, which wasnt as high as it could've been if he thrown more. ggg shouldve won by a couple but i wasnt impressed, though he was a 35 year old fighting a much younger opponent

ppl talk of ggg being a hagler level fighter but for me he's only slightly better than Sergio Martinez. the drop in performance with increase in opponent should be perspective. he can still beat or deserve to beat these fighters like jacobs and canelo, but now its just bare minimum advantages. at the highest levels he lacks speed, dimensions and defense

[Cyclops]

canelo was easily the better boxer when he could muster the energy but he had issues with the pressure and was still getting hit to much in relation to how much he was landing, which wasnt as high as it could've been if he thrown more. ggg shouldve won by a couple but i wasnt impressed, though he was a 35 year old fighting a much younger opponent

ppl talk of ggg being a hagler level fighter but for me he's only slightly better than Sergio Martinez. the drop in performance with increase in opponent should be perspective. he can still beat or deserve to beat these fighters like jacobs and canelo, but now its just bare minimum advantages. at the highest levels he lacks speed, dimensions and defense

They waited for him to get old and get old he did. I agree with you it's an anticlimax to a career. Sergio banjoed Paul Williams and beat an absolutely ginormous middleweight in Pavlik, although Hopkins had already taken Pavlik's soul at that point. How old was Martinez when he finally fell to bits? I think he would have struggled with both GGG and this juiced up version of Canelo, even in his peak. And I really liked Martinez.

[Tanzio]

canelo was easily the better boxer when he could muster the energy but he had issues with the pressure and was still getting hit to much in relation to how much he was landing, which wasnt as high as it could've been if he thrown more. ggg shouldve won by a couple but i wasnt impressed, though he was a 35 year old fighting a much younger opponent

ppl talk of ggg being a hagler level fighter but for me he's only slightly better than Sergio Martinez. the drop in performance with increase in opponent should be perspective. he can still beat or deserve to beat these fighters like jacobs and canelo, but now its just bare minimum advantages. at the highest levels he lacks speed, dimensions and defense

They waited for him to get old and get old he did. I agree with you it's an anticlimax to a career. Sergio banjoed Paul Williams and beat an absolutely ginormous middleweight in Pavlik, although Hopkins had already taken Pavlik's soul at that point. How old was Martinez when he finally fell to bits? I think he would have struggled with both GGG and this juiced up version of Canelo, even in his peak. And I really liked Martinez.

I like both of these assessments.

Hagler v 3G would have been a tremendous battle but I cannot see it other than Hagler taking it. 3G would get the fight he has been calling for over the years with Hagler and more.

I do think that 3G is better than any version of SMartinez and I was a big fan of the Argentinian. Although the version of SMartinez who defeated Pavlik and PWill would have put up a great battle v 3G and he would have defeated any but the most recent version of GingerHead. Let's not forget what SMartinez did to a huge, healthy JCC Jr late in his run compared to what GingerHead managed against The Corpse of Junior.

The jury is still out on GingerHead at MW. There are big, gifted and skilled prime sharks in the water.

[jamamb]

martinez was very good. Its not a knock on ggg to be around that level (slightly better). golovkin is to limited to be a truly special fighter though, at least if were talking about the best in history. i think being 35 hes not at his best, but he always had issues with speed and defense (couldnt move his head if his life depended on it) and no, its not just cus hes letting ppl hit him so he lure big names into fights

[J]

I had it for El Freckles 6-5-1.

Swept the first three with his eye-catching punches, next five Golovkin with his caveman-like pursuit and pressure. Ninth I couldn't separate them, perhaps on reflection GGG could have just shaded it which would have been a draw. Final three Canelo rallied to snatch the win.

I think Canelo squandered too many rounds laying on the ropes. If he can rectify that in a rematch he could win more decisively. Not easy because of Golovkin's power and the sort of aggressive stalking that hasn't been since since Tuan Jim had a Facebook.

How did you lot score it?

Golovkin won eight rounds. You talked shite before the fight, you're talking shite now.

this!

[chrisnew86]

canelo was easily the better boxer when he could muster the energy but he had issues with the pressure and was still getting hit to much in relation to how much he was landing, which wasnt as high as it could've been if he thrown more. ggg shouldve won by a couple but i wasnt impressed, though he was a 35 year old fighting a much younger opponent

ppl talk of ggg being a hagler level fighter but for me he's only slightly better than Sergio Martinez. the drop in performance with increase in opponent should be perspective. he can still beat or deserve to beat these fighters like jacobs and canelo, but now its just bare minimum advantages. at the highest levels he lacks speed, dimensions and defense

But he is aggressive, has KO power, can take a shot ( has an unreal chin )

These things make him one of my favourite fighters of all time, fantastic to watch

[Autobarn]

martinez was very good. Its not a knock on ggg to be around that level (slightly better). golovkin is to limited to be a truly special fighter though, at least if were talking about the best in history. i think being 35 hes not at his best, but he always had issues with speed and defense (couldnt move his head if his life depended on it) and no, its not just cus hes letting ppl hit him so he lure big names into fights

Martinez was outstanding, and he was also in the same boat as Golovkin.

Martinez couldn't get a shot at Vernon Forrest at 154, just as Golovkin couldn't get a shot at Martinez at 160.

Martinez stepped up a weight, put in some fierce and brilliant performances versus Pavlik, Williams, Dzinziruk, a career best Macklin, and deserved his top 10 p4p status. His late career surge really was a revelation.

Martinez got a controversial, gruelling defeat in one of his biggest fights, and avenged it. Golovkin was just held to a controversial draw, in a very good fight, maybe the best at 160 since Martinez-Williams I. Let's see what happens next.

Golovkin like Martinez at the time, slowing down in his mid '30s. Has a small window, likewise, to put in a few great performances..

[Autobarn]

martinez was very good. Its not a knock on ggg to be around that level (slightly better). golovkin is to limited to be a truly special fighter though, at least if were talking about the best in history. i think being 35 hes not at his best, but he always had issues with speed and defense (couldnt move his head if his life depended on it) and no, its not just cus hes letting ppl hit him so he lure big names into fights

I rate Golovkin. It hurt him not being able to get the fights during his prime. Also, all those KO wins against passive or just blown away early opponents prevented him from building stamina.

(It is the curse of the puncher, and it happened to Benn, McClellan, Julian Jackson where a savage finisher comes up against a wall... Benn to his credit did overcome this, the dramatic KO losses to Eubank and Watson.)

But, Kassim Ouma gave Golovkin problems, really found him easy to hit I recall. Early career signs of vulnerability.

[JoeCorrao]

I scored it 7/3 with 2 even to Alvarez 117 - 113

Alvarez out boxed Golovkin for most of the fight.

He made Golovkin miss that many times it was unreal. That's what boxing is all about.

Anyone can get in there and just walk forward. Alvarez used ring generalship to win the bout.

Hahahhaha...Teddy Atlas said it perfectly...watch his take

[gilgamesh]

I scored it 7/3 with 2 even to Alvarez 117 - 113

Alvarez out boxed Golovkin for most of the fight.

He made Golovkin miss that many times it was unreal. That's what boxing is all about.

Anyone can get in there and just walk forward. Alvarez used ring generalship to win the bout.

Congratulations. In one post you just destroyed any credible you could ever have as a judge of Boxing.

Might as well say that Kevin Johnson beat Vitali Klitschko. He laid on the ropes, and made Vitali miss some shots...that's what Boxing's all about right?

[JoeCorrao]

I had it for El Freckles 6-5-1.

Swept the first three with his eye-catching punches, next five Golovkin with his caveman-like pursuit and pressure. Ninth I couldn't separate them, perhaps on reflection GGG could have just shaded it which would have been a draw. Final three Canelo rallied to snatch the win.

I think Canelo squandered too many rounds laying on the ropes. If he can rectify that in a rematch he could win more decisively. Not easy because of Golovkin's power and the sort of aggressive stalking that hasn't been since since Tuan Jim had a Facebook.

How did you lot score it?

Golovkin won eight rounds. You talked shite before the fight, you're talking shite now.

this!

this!

[Grilling Machine]

Pirog's still the great unknown in this particular mix. Jacobs was lighter, younger, and pretty green at the time, but as I much as I enjoyed Pirog's skills, I didn't give him more than an outside chance against Golovkin until now. I'd still favour Golovkin because he was in his prime when they were supposed to meet, but I find it easier to visualise Pirog running him close. I don't think he'd get knocked out any more; stopped late on, maybe.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Sadly I missed the first 4, and it didn't record, but in the remainder of the fight canelo only seemed to work for 30 seconds of each round and GGG seemed to land more consistently and dictate the pace.

[Autobarn]

Yes Pirog was a loss to middleweight boxing. He was very impressive decimating Jacobs. But he had injuries and apparently wasn't built for a long career.

Alvarez reminds me of DLH, always tiring in the big fights.

[CaptainSpacerod]

Canelos *strength and conditioning* programme definitely seems to have been *geared* towards muscle bulk, which may well have been why he lacks a bit of *juice* in a lot of rounds, there are long periods of rounds where you wonder if he is rope a *doping* the other fighter, but as I say I think it's more a lack of *juice* than a deliberate tactic, because Alvarez doesn't have a very HiGH output he is very easy to outwork. You almost wish there had been a little bit of *needle* between them maybe that would have *pumped Alvarez full of* the will and desire, the *testosterone*-type aggression, that he needed.

[BroughtonRulesRefuge]

I had it for El Freckles 6-5-1.

Swept the first three with his eye-catching punches, next five Golovkin with his caveman-like pursuit and pressure. Ninth I couldn't separate them, perhaps on reflection GGG could have just shaded it which would have been a draw. Final three Canelo rallied to snatch the win.

I think Canelo squandered too many rounds laying on the ropes. If he can rectify that in a rematch he could win more decisively. Not easy because of Golovkin's power and the sort of aggressive stalking that hasn't been since since Tuan Jim had a Facebook.

How did you lot score it?

--- Not bad for a congenital glue bagger Jimbo.

All the other Laddy Gagas are a'gaggin' over the draw. I had Canelo by 4, but if I assign my 4 even rounds to Golokin, it's a draw, well within the parameters, but I did not see Canelo dominating early as you did. I gave him 4 of the last five that matches in between 2 judges giving him 3 of the last 5 and one, the regrettable Byrd giving the byrd to boxing everytime she suits up, gave him 5 of the last five.

All in all it stirred up the little creepy crawlies out of their woodwork to swarm all over another Vegas crap shoot like it was chocolate nuggets...

[Loynesy]

Just chronic levels of stupidity on this thread.

Virtually every boxing writer of note, and the 23,000 people watching it live must all be stupid.

[dalcumly]

As I've said elsewhere I will NEVER pay extra to watch any fight so I've had to wait until tonight to see it on youtube.

Having read all the reports, comments etc and being a Golovkin fan I could eventually score the fight for myself.

I gave 7 rounds to Golovkin, 4 to Alvarez and 1 even. If I choose to give the even round to Alvarez that makes my scorecard 115-113 Golovkin.

The only way anyone could give the fight to Alvarez was if you are the type of person whose prepared to give a round to boxer A who lands 2/3 solid shots and boxer B lands 20/30 shots but none of them were particularly eye-catching. It comes down to choice.

We'll ignore the buffoon who scored it 118-110 but I can see how the other two scored it. I was under the impression that the scoring was so bad it should have been investigated by the FBI, that's not my opinion now. Only Byrd has the problem. She's either daft or corrupt, no other explanation.

Having seen the scorecards and noticed that all 3 judges gave 10,11 and 12 to Alvarez I sat back tonight to watch his domination. I gave the 10th and 11th to Golovkin!!!!

My even round incidentally was the 5th.

[boilingalive]

I thought Golovkin 7-5

[Kilburn]

I've just watched it this morning for the first time and also scored it 7-5 Golovkin. I was a lot more impressed by Alvarez than I was expecting to be, after the general response last week. It was a good close fight and Canelo coped well.

Don't hate me but, sometimes I think GGG gets too much credit for being the beast that he is, rather than for what the beast is actually doing.

[brilo33]

GOLOVKIN won by at least 3rds in a brilliant fight , which has been tarnished but the cards which is a shame as both boxers gave their all in a throwback fight , and they answered questions we wanted answered .like was triple g a certified hall of fame middleweight champ BIG yes , saul is a top skillful fighter with a great chin himself

[Tuan_Jim]

Don't hate me but, sometimes I think GGG gets too much credit for being the beast that he is, rather than for what the beast is actually doing.

Exactly right.