Realistically how good/in shape is Ortiz at this stage-38y/o to be a solid threat for Wilder ?

[apollo creed]

Personally I'm rooting for Ortiz but age is a major factor in this fight. Also a fixed fight/decision isn't totally out of the question. See the Malik Scott vs Wilder fight.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

[apollo creed]

You think Ortiz is gonna be put to sleep by Wilder?

[IronFrost]

Excuses . excsuses lmao. Who is there better besides Luis Ortiz lmao? Only Joshua.

You are just shitting in your pants thaT Wilder will prove you wrong and you wont have any reason to hate.

PATHETIC

[Noxy]

I think he's one of the top heavies out there. 38 isn't necessarily old, it depends on the person. I don't see him as an old 38

[apollo creed]

Excuses . excsuses lmao. Who is there better besides Luis Ortiz lmao? Only Joshua.

You are just shitting in your pants thaT Wilder will prove you wrong and you wont have any reason to hate.

PATHETIC

I have Ortiz as the most skilled hw atm but I doubt about his stamina and his reflexes at this age. Anyway , Ortiz is still the best fighter that Wilder could fight beside Joshua and let's say Povetkin.

[apollo creed]

I think he's one of the top heavies out there. 38 isn't necessarily old, it depends on the person. I don't see him as an old 38

He started his pro career in 2010, so he may be ok at this age.

[candyslim]

Personally I'm rooting for Ortiz but age is a major factor in this fight. Also a fixed fight/decision isn't totally out of the question. See the Malik Scott vs Wilder fight.

I think a fix is totally out of the question. Consider the facts:

1. Ortiz is – or at least definitely is, if he didn’t take the Wilder fight – the mandatory challenger for Anthony Joshua’s WBA title.

2. He is/was, guaranteed to fight Joshua after Pulev which Eddie Hearn has said (AJ’s next fight) will be February/ March 2018

3. As mandatory challenger he gets (correct me if I’m wrong) 25% of the total purse which in a Joshua fight at Wembley or even Cardiff, which would be at least double what he’ll be getting for fighting Wilder.

4. He might beat Joshua. Stylistically it might suit him more than Wilder. Joshua is unlikely to be boxing off the back foot.

5. If Ortiz were to beat Wilder which he clearly believes he can, that unification fight will be his and he will get even more money than he would have got as mandatory.

6. Haymon has already paid off Stiverne so that is a deduction from the profit from this fight. Ortiz will need to be paid win or lose. How much more money do you think Ortiz would demand in order to throw the fight?
Clue: It would need to be not only a lot more than he would have got for a clean fight against Wilder but it would also need to be a lot more money than he would have got for his mandatory challenge to Joshua.

7. Would this make any kind of financial sense? I can see no way that it could.

As to the original point of the thread … well that’s the multi-million dollar question isn’t it?

[apollo creed]

Personally I'm rooting for Ortiz but age is a major factor in this fight. Also a fixed fight/decision isn't totally out of the question. See the Malik Scott vs Wilder fight.

I think a fix is totally out of the question. Consider the facts:

1. Ortiz is – or at least definitely is, if he didn’t take the Wilder fight – the mandatory challenger for Anthony Joshua’s WBA title.

2. He is/was, guaranteed to fight Joshua after Pulev which Eddie Hearn has said (AJ’s next fight) will be February/ March 2018

3. As mandatory challenger he gets (correct me if I’m wrong) 25% of the total purse which in a Joshua fight at Wembley or even Cardiff, which would be at least double what he’ll be getting for fighting Wilder.

4. He might beat Joshua. Stylistically it might suit him more than Wilder. Joshua is unlikely to be boxing off the back foot.

5. If Ortiz were to beat Wilder which he clearly believes he can, that unification fight will be his and he will get even more money than he would have got as mandatory.

6. Haymon has already paid off Stiverne so that is a deduction from the profit from this fight. Ortiz will need to be paid win or lose. How much more money do you think Ortiz would demand in order to throw the fight?
Clue: It would need to be not only a lot more than he would have got for a clean fight against Wilder but it would also need to be a lot more money than he would have got for his mandatory challenge to Joshua.

7. Would this make any kind of financial sense? I can see no way that it could.

As to the original point of the thread … well that’s the multi-million dollar question isn’t it?

The money AJ vs Wilder fight could generate would make a lot of sense.Wilder is a much known name than Ortiz, plus he's the only hw champion in US. The fight would be sold like the US hw champion vs the UK hw champion and it would make a big buzz!

[RScarf1]

I think Wilder is going to win, unfortunately. They waited until Ortiz was 38 to give him a title shot. I think Ortiz will be slower than Wilder and that will be the difference. Maybe it will go to a decision.

[littlepug]

Wilder will jab his way to a decision

[apollo creed]

I think Wilder is going to win, unfortunately. They waited until Ortiz was 38 to give him a title shot. I think Ortiz will be slower than Wilder and that will be the difference. Maybe it will go to a decision.

very good point.

[Lackeos]

We won't know how much fitness and motivation Ortiz brings to the fight until we actually see him in the ring (or at least see him at the weigh-in). An unmotivated boxer can gain a lot of weight in a one-year layoff.

In the Ortiz - David Allen fight, I credit Allen for fighting slickly, but Ortiz was pretty slow of foot. Allen would circle, and Ortiz is like "... yeah, I'm not gonna chase you. Seems like an awful lot of work." I think if Wilder attempts to square-up with Ortiz (which he won't), then Ortiz will have no difficulty landing body shots, since he is the shorter fighter, has long arms, skillful hands, and likes to go to the body. If Wilder gets on his bike, then Ortiz isn't going to be able to find him.

[apollo creed]

We won't know how much fitness and motivation Ortiz brings to the fight until we actually see him in the ring (or at least see him at the weigh-in). An unmotivated boxer can gain a lot of weight in a one-year layoff.

In the Ortiz - David Allen fight, I credit Allen for fighting slickly, but Ortiz was pretty slow of foot. Allen would circle, and Ortiz is like "... yeah, I'm not gonna chase you. Seems like an awful lot of work." I think if Wilder attempts to square-up with Ortiz (which he won't), then Ortiz will have no difficulty landing body shots, since he is the shorter fighter, has long arms, skillful hands, and likes to go to the body. If Wilder gets on his bike, then Ortiz isn't going to be able to find him.

I could see Wilder stopping Ortiz, mostly because Ortiz may get lazy in this fight.

[candyslim]

Personally I'm rooting for Ortiz but age is a major factor in this fight. Also a fixed fight/decision isn't totally out of the question. See the Malik Scott vs Wilder fight.

I think a fix is totally out of the question. Consider the facts:

1. Ortiz is – or at least definitely is, if he didn’t take the Wilder fight – the mandatory challenger for Anthony Joshua’s WBA title.

2. He is/was, guaranteed to fight Joshua after Pulev which Eddie Hearn has said (AJ’s next fight) will be February/ March 2018

3. As mandatory challenger he gets (correct me if I’m wrong) 25% of the total purse which in a Joshua fight at Wembley or even Cardiff, which would be at least double what he’ll be getting for fighting Wilder.

4. He might beat Joshua. Stylistically it might suit him more than Wilder. Joshua is unlikely to be boxing off the back foot.

5. If Ortiz were to beat Wilder which he clearly believes he can, that unification fight will be his and he will get even more money than he would have got as mandatory.

6. Haymon has already paid off Stiverne so that is a deduction from the profit from this fight. Ortiz will need to be paid win or lose. How much more money do you think Ortiz would demand in order to throw the fight?
Clue: It would need to be not only a lot more than he would have got for a clean fight against Wilder but it would also need to be a lot more money than he would have got for his mandatory challenge to Joshua.

7. Would this make any kind of financial sense? I can see no way that it could.

As to the original point of the thread … well that’s the multi-million dollar question isn’t it?

The money AJ vs Wilder fight could generate would make a lot of sense.Wilder is a much known name than Ortiz, plus he's the only hw champion in US. The fight would be sold like the US hw champion vs the UK hw champion and it would make a big buzz!

I wouldn't argue with that but provided they keep winning Joshua and Wilder are on a collision course anyway. If Haymon or Wilder doubted Deontay's ability to beat Ortiz (fairly) then why take the fight? DW could have let AJ take care of Ortiz saying that he had no choice but to fight his BS Mandatory (By BS I mean Bermane Stiverne, honest) then he's got a voluntary against somebody eminently beatable, and then provided Ortiz (or Pulev) hasn't derailed AJ, the fight is going to happen regardless.

Ortiz is a proud man who is convinced he is going to beat Wilder and then set up a unification in London against Joshua. Apart from considerations about pride, reputation and morality, if you just look at it in terms of making money, seriously how much would Haymon have to pay Ortiz to take a dive?

Why would AH potentially turn the show into a loss when Wilder will probably start favourite to win the fight anyway?

So why has Wilder taken this fight?

a) Public criticism of his failure to participate in a meaningful fight has grown and grown. Some have even called into question whether he was ever intending to go to Moscow. Having turned down £4.5m to fight Whyte I imagine that was the last straw for many of the faithful.

b) Eddie Hearn has also been critical saying that Wilder needs a name on his resume to "earn" his share of the unification extravaganza.

c) Wilder is also a proud man and it hurts him to hear people attacking his resume, his integrity and his courage. Time to take the bull by the horns and who better to prove his mettle that the man he'd been accused of ducking for five years, the bogeyman, Luis Ortiz.

d) Luis Ortiz having crushed Bryant Jennings recently enough for that to be a powerful memory yet a Luis Ortiz who hadn't looked good since that day and at 38 years old (at least), raising the distinct possibility that it's exactly the right time to fight him.

I'm not knocking him. Wilder is taking a huge gamble just as Ortiz is. When you look down the rankings I don't think it's possible to find a more dangerous defence than Luis Ortiz even now. I am loving the prospect of this clash and whatever the result both fighters will deserve respect for taking this fight when they could have taken the easy route.

[SaadOffTheDeck]

You think Ortiz is gonna be put to sleep by Wilder?

Perhaps, this thread sucks.

[apollo creed]

I think a fix is totally out of the question. Consider the facts:

1. Ortiz is – or at least definitely is, if he didn’t take the Wilder fight – the mandatory challenger for Anthony Joshua’s WBA title.

2. He is/was, guaranteed to fight Joshua after Pulev which Eddie Hearn has said (AJ’s next fight) will be February/ March 2018

3. As mandatory challenger he gets (correct me if I’m wrong) 25% of the total purse which in a Joshua fight at Wembley or even Cardiff, which would be at least double what he’ll be getting for fighting Wilder.

4. He might beat Joshua. Stylistically it might suit him more than Wilder. Joshua is unlikely to be boxing off the back foot.

5. If Ortiz were to beat Wilder which he clearly believes he can, that unification fight will be his and he will get even more money than he would have got as mandatory.

6. Haymon has already paid off Stiverne so that is a deduction from the profit from this fight. Ortiz will need to be paid win or lose. How much more money do you think Ortiz would demand in order to throw the fight?
Clue: It would need to be not only a lot more than he would have got for a clean fight against Wilder but it would also need to be a lot more money than he would have got for his mandatory challenge to Joshua.

7. Would this make any kind of financial sense? I can see no way that it could.

As to the original point of the thread … well that’s the multi-million dollar question isn’t it?

The money AJ vs Wilder fight could generate would make a lot of sense.Wilder is a much known name than Ortiz, plus he's the only hw champion in US. The fight would be sold like the US hw champion vs the UK hw champion and it would make a big buzz!

I wouldn't argue with that but provided they keep winning Joshua and Wilder are on a collision course anyway. If Haymon or Wilder doubted Deontay's ability to beat Ortiz (fairly) then why take the fight? DW could have let AJ take care of Ortiz saying that he had no choice but to fight his BS Mandatory (By BS I mean Bermane Stiverne, honest) then he's got a voluntary against somebody eminently beatable, and then provided Ortiz (or Pulev) hasn't derailed AJ, the fight is going to happen regardless.

Ortiz is a proud man who is convinced he is going to beat Wilder and then set up a unification in London against Joshua. Apart from considerations about pride, reputation and morality, if you just look at it in terms of making money, seriously how much would Haymon have to pay Ortiz to take a dive?

Why would AH potentially turn the show into a loss when Wilder will probably start favourite to win the fight anyway?

So why has Wilder taken this fight?

a) Public criticism of his failure to participate in a meaningful fight has grown and grown. Some have even called into question whether he was ever intending to go to Moscow. Having turned down £4.5m to fight Whyte I imagine that was the last straw for many of the faithful.

b) Eddie Hearn has also been critical saying that Wilder needs a name on his resume to "earn" his share of the unification extravaganza.

c) Wilder is also a proud man and it hurts him to hear people attacking his resume, his integrity and his courage. Time to take the bull by the horns and who better to prove his mettle that the man he'd been accused of ducking for five years, the bogeyman, Luis Ortiz.

d) Luis Ortiz having crushed Bryant Jennings recently enough for that to be a powerful memory yet a Luis Ortiz who hadn't looked good since that day and at 38 years old (at least), raising the distinct possibility that it's exactly the right time to fight him.

I'm not knocking him. Wilder is taking a huge gamble just as Ortiz is. When you look down the rankings I don't think it's possible to find a more dangerous defence than Luis Ortiz even now. I am loving the prospect of this clash and whatever the result both fighters will deserve respect for taking this fight when they could have taken the easy route.

Everybody has his price and Ortiz may be there to be beaten, that Wilder's resume to look decent and worthy for a fight against AJ. I really hope to be wrong and both Ortiz and Wilder to have a war inside the ring and the best man to win.

[apollo creed]

You think Ortiz is gonna be put to sleep by Wilder?

Perhaps, this thread sucks.

[candyslim]

We won't know how much fitness and motivation Ortiz brings to the fight until we actually see him in the ring (or at least see him at the weigh-in). An unmotivated boxer can gain a lot of weight in a one-year layoff.

In the Ortiz - David Allen fight, I credit Allen for fighting slickly, but Ortiz was pretty slow of foot. Allen would circle, and Ortiz is like "... yeah, I'm not gonna chase you. Seems like an awful lot of work." I think if Wilder attempts to square-up with Ortiz (which he won't), then Ortiz will have no difficulty landing body shots, since he is the shorter fighter, has long arms, skillful hands, and likes to go to the body. If Wilder gets on his bike, then Ortiz isn't going to be able to find him.

I could see Wilder stopping Ortiz, mostly because Ortiz may get lazy in this fight.

You don't need to worry about Luis Ortiz's motivation. If what he cared about was money and a quiet life he'd have sat around until he fought Joshua first quarter next year for what, $10m? I'm just guessing but whatever it is, it's a lovely retirement sum, if he loses. He doesn't even need to train. And were he to actually win ... Oh man!

But no he wants Wilder as a voluntary, how much does that pay? ... A million? ... two? ... more than that?

He is not going to take that fight and take a dive or fail to show up it makes no sense. He is not expecting to lose.

It'll be a great fight and the only way Luis Ortiz disappoints is if he really has gone backwards without him realizing just how far.

[funso banjo baby]

Ortiz isn't as good as many make out...but he's still a spectacularly good opp for Wilder who has fought at an appalling level as alphabet champ

[Badhusker]

Personally I'm rooting for Ortiz but age is a major factor in this fight. Also a fixed fight/decision isn't totally out of the question. See the Malik Scott vs Wilder fight.

Don't feed the troll.

[candyslim]

Well I thought I'd crushed all thought of that possibility using logic to show why it's not financially feasible, but I can only conclude that some are inoculated at birth against the power of reason.