Calzaghe fight KESSLER god damnid

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 06 Apr 2006, 05:14

I was thinking, the Calzaghe-Otis Grant rumour must be full of shit. Why? Because isn't Otis going to get spanked by Librado Andrade on Saturday?

Would Calzaghe fight someone as dangerous as Andrade? Would Andrade's ppl be that ambitious so early?

johnswan1 · Post by **johnswan1** » 06 Apr 2006, 05:19

I don't know why some people here are saying that Kessler needs to step up his level of opposition and prove himself. He has already beaten Mundine (3rd) and Siaca (6th). Joe C has beaten only Lacy (5th) and Reid (8th). The next step for Kessler would be to fight either Joe C, Beyer or Green if he beats Mundine. There is no point in Joe staying in this division if he's not willing to fight Kessler as who else here would be a big money draw? I don't think there is anything for Joe to prove at Light Heavyweight. If he beats Tarver, Tarver is too old. Johnson would be a risk but so what if he beat him. Clinton Woods? Can't imagine he'd get much credit for that either.

Ring ratings in the Super Middleweight are as follows:

C C 465 JOE CALZAGHE 41-0 (31)
1 1 70 MIKKEL KESSLER 37-0 (28)
2 2 183 MARKUS BEYER 34-2 (13)
3 3 185 ANTHONY MUNDINE 25-3 (20)
4 4 115 DANNY GREEN 21-2 (19)
5 5 71 JEFF LACY 21-1 (17)
6 6 285 MANNY SIACA 20-5 (18)
7 7 49 OTIS GRANT 38-2-1 (17)
8 8 115 ROBIN REID 38-5-1 (27)
9 9 42 LIBRADA ANDRADE 22-0 (16)
10 10 5 CHAD DAWSON 22-0 (15)

Deram · Post by **Deram** » 06 Apr 2006, 07:31

johnswan1 wrote:I don't know why some people here are saying that Kessler needs to step up his level of opposition and prove himself. He has already beaten Mundine (3rd) and Siaca (6th). Joe C has beaten only Lacy (5th) and Reid (8th). The next step for Kessler would be to fight either Joe C, Beyer or Green if he beats Mundine. There is no point in Joe staying in this division if he's not willing to fight Kessler as who else here would be a big money draw? I don't think there is anything for Joe to prove at Light Heavyweight. If he beats Tarver, Tarver is too old. Johnson would be a risk but so what if he beat him. Clinton Woods? Can't imagine he'd get much credit for that either.

Ring ratings in the Super Middleweight are as follows:

C C 465 JOE CALZAGHE 41-0 (31)
1 1 70 MIKKEL KESSLER 37-0 (28)
2 2 183 MARKUS BEYER 34-2 (13)
3 3 185 ANTHONY MUNDINE 25-3 (20)
4 4 115 DANNY GREEN 21-2 (19)
5 5 71 JEFF LACY 21-1 (17)
6 6 285 MANNY SIACA 20-5 (18)
7 7 49 OTIS GRANT 38-2-1 (17)
8 8 115 ROBIN REID 38-5-1 (27)
9 9 42 LIBRADA ANDRADE 22-0 (16)
10 10 5 CHAD DAWSON 22-0 (15)

Well, that is true. With Kessler promising to fight at the weight calzaghe choses - Joe should not be shy and put the fight up. Joe would have everything his own way - the fight would most probably be in the UK because Kessler has no problem with travelling (although of course he prefers to fight at home) and if Calzaghe says he cannot make SMW anymore then Kessler is willing to do the fight at any other weight too.

Come on Joe...

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 06 Apr 2006, 08:44

Anyone got a link to what Kessler said then?

The way Kessler jumped in and out with the jab with Lucas would be made for Joe.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 06 Apr 2006, 08:46

I must get around to watching my Kessler compilation this weekend to see whether this guy is being overrated or not.

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 06 Apr 2006, 13:01

johnswan1 wrote:I don't know why some people here are saying that Kessler needs to step up his level of opposition and prove himself. He has already beaten Mundine (3rd) and Siaca (6th). Joe C has beaten only Lacy (5th) and Reid (8th). The next step for Kessler would be to fight either Joe C, Beyer or Green if he beats Mundine. There is no point in Joe staying in this division if he's not willing to fight Kessler as who else here would be a big money draw? I don't think there is anything for Joe to prove at Light Heavyweight. If he beats Tarver, Tarver is too old. Johnson would be a risk but so what if he beat him. Clinton Woods? Can't imagine he'd get much credit for that either.

Ring ratings in the Super Middleweight are as follows:

C C 465 JOE CALZAGHE 41-0 (31)
1 1 70 MIKKEL KESSLER 37-0 (28)
2 2 183 MARKUS BEYER 34-2 (13)
3 3 185 ANTHONY MUNDINE 25-3 (20)
4 4 115 DANNY GREEN 21-2 (19)
5 5 71 JEFF LACY 21-1 (17)
6 6 285 MANNY SIACA 20-5 (18)
7 7 49 OTIS GRANT 38-2-1 (17)
8 8 115 ROBIN REID 38-5-1 (27)
9 9 42 LIBRADA ANDRADE 22-0 (16)
10 10 5 CHAD DAWSON 22-0 (15)

.... and they shouldn't have made Cazalghe champ fgor a win over Lacy. Otherwise the top 6 are exacty as I have them (and had them also before the Calzaghe-Lacy fight), except that in my ranking Calzaghe and Kessler switch places. And the Ring ranking actually confirms that they should.

johnswan1 · Post by **johnswan1** » 06 Apr 2006, 13:15

pundit wrote:
johnswan1 wrote:I don't know why some people here are saying that Kessler needs to step up his level of opposition and prove himself. He has already beaten Mundine (3rd) and Siaca (6th). Joe C has beaten only Lacy (5th) and Reid (8th). The next step for Kessler would be to fight either Joe C, Beyer or Green if he beats Mundine. There is no point in Joe staying in this division if he's not willing to fight Kessler as who else here would be a big money draw? I don't think there is anything for Joe to prove at Light Heavyweight. If he beats Tarver, Tarver is too old. Johnson would be a risk but so what if he beat him. Clinton Woods? Can't imagine he'd get much credit for that either.

Ring ratings in the Super Middleweight are as follows:

C C 465 JOE CALZAGHE 41-0 (31)
1 1 70 MIKKEL KESSLER 37-0 (28)
2 2 183 MARKUS BEYER 34-2 (13)
3 3 185 ANTHONY MUNDINE 25-3 (20)
4 4 115 DANNY GREEN 21-2 (19)
5 5 71 JEFF LACY 21-1 (17)
6 6 285 MANNY SIACA 20-5 (18)
7 7 49 OTIS GRANT 38-2-1 (17)
8 8 115 ROBIN REID 38-5-1 (27)
9 9 42 LIBRADA ANDRADE 22-0 (16)
10 10 5 CHAD DAWSON 22-0 (15)

.... and they shouldn't have made Cazalghe champ fgor a win over Lacy. Otherwise the top 6 are exacty as I have them (and had them also before the Calzaghe-Lacy fight), except that in my ranking Calzaghe and Kessler switch places. And the Ring ranking actually confirms that they should.

I think Ring had Lacy behind only Joe C and Kessler prior to the Calzaghe fight and I think under their criteria, a fight between 1st and 3rd produces the champion if there isn't already one. I don't think Kessler should be ahead of Joe either, not yet anyway.

excellfmsltd · Post by **excellfmsltd** » 06 Apr 2006, 13:35

kessler is good. i know, sparred many rounds with him.... he is the hardest match for joe at the weight.. but i still fancy joe if he is anything like last time....inside view..

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 06 Apr 2006, 14:41

johnswan1 wrote:I think Ring had Lacy behind only Joe C and Kessler prior to the Calzaghe fight and I think under their criteria, a fight between 1st and 3rd produces the champion if there isn't already one. I don't think Kessler should be ahead of Joe either, not yet anyway.

If I am not mistaken their rule says that under exceptional circumstances a bout #1 vs. #3 CAN produce the Ring champion. In 2002 # 1 Ottke beat #3 Mitchell but the Ring did not give Ottke the championship (and rightly so). So there is an element of discretion, and the Ring magazine exercized in Calzaghe's/Lacy's favor.

I believe they were just tired of having no the s-m champion for so many years; but this is no good reason. They shouldn't have given Calzaghe the championship without fighting Kessler.

P

PS: ranking Calzaghe #1 and Kessler #2 is OK, based on achievement.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 06 Apr 2006, 14:53

Ottke could've been Ring champ, beating Mitchell who must've been #3

Deram · Post by **Deram** » 06 Apr 2006, 23:03

pundit wrote:
johnswan1 wrote:I think Ring had Lacy behind only Joe C and Kessler prior to the Calzaghe fight and I think under their criteria, a fight between 1st and 3rd produces the champion if there isn't already one. I don't think Kessler should be ahead of Joe either, not yet anyway.
If I am not mistaken their rule says that under exceptional circumstances a bout #1 vs. #3 CAN produce the Ring champion. In 2002 # 1 Ottke beat #3 Mitchell but the Ring did not give Ottke the championship (and rightly so). So there is an element of discretion, and the Ring magazine exercized in Calzaghe's/Lacy's favor.

I believe they were just tired of having no the s-m champion for so many years; but this is no good reason. They shouldn't have given Calzaghe the championship without fighting Kessler.

P

PS: ranking Calzaghe #1 and Kessler #2 is OK, based on achievement.

The simple reason is that the Ring didn't believe Mitchell e\would win in germany. This time they thought the amerixcan would win and announced that the fight therefore was for the ring championship too.

Unexpectedl Joe won and they had to give him the champ seat. something I by the way find fair and I am glad the Ring got screwed there. Historically there has never been a fight between 1 and 3 producing a Ring champ without an AMERICAN as one of the fighters. Which I think sucks - I would rather there could be a unbiased organisation, but so far the Ring is actually almost the best we have. That just says a little about how badly it looks.

Axe · Post by **Axe** » 07 Apr 2006, 00:29

johnswan1 wrote:I don't know why some people here are saying that Kessler needs to step up his level of opposition and prove himself. He has already beaten Mundine (3rd) and Siaca (6th). Joe C has beaten only Lacy (5th) and Reid (8th). The next step for Kessler would be to fight either Joe C, Beyer or Green if he beats Mundine. There is no point in Joe staying in this division if he's not willing to fight Kessler as who else here would be a big money draw? I don't think there is anything for Joe to prove at Light Heavyweight. If he beats Tarver, Tarver is too old. Johnson would be a risk but so what if he beat him. Clinton Woods? Can't imagine he'd get much credit for that either.

Ring ratings in the Super Middleweight are as follows:

C C 465 JOE CALZAGHE 41-0 (31)
1 1 70 MIKKEL KESSLER 37-0 (28)
2 2 183 MARKUS BEYER 34-2 (13)
3 3 185 ANTHONY MUNDINE 25-3 (20)
4 4 115 DANNY GREEN 21-2 (19)
5 5 71 JEFF LACY 21-1 (17)
6 6 285 MANNY SIACA 20-5 (18)
7 7 49 OTIS GRANT 38-2-1 (17)
8 8 115 ROBIN REID 38-5-1 (27)
9 9 42 LIBRADA ANDRADE 22-0 (16)
10 10 5 CHAD DAWSON 22-0 (15)

I agree with those rankings, Lacy has certainly dropped quite a ways after the defeat to Joe.

Chad Dawson is now at 175, however, so is no longer ranked in the top ten at SMW.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 07 Apr 2006, 08:39

fornicating hell pundit, you must really worship the ground Kessler walks on. Change the bastard record mate, are you his boyfriend/agent/manager?

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 07 Apr 2006, 08:55

Terence wrote: Wasn't he under Arum for the two US fights (Arum called him my "British Hagler") and Warren for Gerald, although Benn felt at the time McClellan was brought over to beat him up and take his belt as he was being a right pain in the arse for Frank? Plus it would have made Frank closer to King and the Jones-McClellan superfight?

Yes that's right I think. And Benn wasn't too far wrong with his idea that SN saw this as an easy win for the G man ( as did everyone else )

Milwaukee Sentinel -

Andy Ayling, public relations spokesman for Sports Network in London, said McClellan was well received when he arrived in London last Thursday.

"The people here are really taking to him. They want to know if he is the man that possesses all of that great power," Ayling said in a telephone interview from London.

McClellan is training in a facility about five minutes from where Benn once lived, but the fans appear to be siding with McClellan.

Benn recently made his fans upset when he closed his camp and fired his manager, Ayling said.

"That sent up the white flag," he said.

The media in London is predicting that McClellan will knock Benn out.

"Nigel has strong, raw power and puts you in the mind of Mike Tyson, but we feel if it comes down to a slugfest, McClellan will knock him out before the fifth round," Ayling said.

Ah the wonders of the internet..whatever happened to that Ayling bloke?

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 07 Apr 2006, 10:17

Hmm, sounds like SN were really hoping for a McClellan win. Sounds like a load of old bollocks, as if the fans were going to side with Gerald over Benn....ludicrous.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 07 Apr 2006, 10:43

Terence wrote:Ottke should have been Champ. The Ring fucked him over. The Ring makes it up as it goes along. Shocking how they gave VK his spurs for doing F-all yet it took them years to respect Lennox Lewis who was practically booed out the sport by Larry Merchant in his final interview.

apparently it doesn't count if you "do it in Germany", that's the impression I get from reading Farhood in BM and that Rodriguez guy on maxboxing

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 07 Apr 2006, 10:58

jamesmcdonnell wrote:fornicating hell pundit, you must really worship the ground Kessler walks on. Change the bastard record mate, are you his boyfriend/agent/manager?

Not at all - I am just not prepared to let Calzaghe get away with a well-calculated and reatively easy win over Lacy and claim championship status, while still having avoided the real chaellenges.

Btw, there are so many blind Calzaghe-huggers here that one Kessler-advocate is needed to produce some degree of balacne...

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 07 Apr 2006, 11:04

Aren't there any other areas of boxing that you could take about? We take your point, you think Kessler is better than Calzaghe, but christ mate, can't we move on?

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 07 Apr 2006, 11:04

Deram wrote: The simple reason is that the Ring didn't believe Mitchell e\would win in germany. This time they thought the amerixcan would win and announced that the fight therefore was for the ring championship too.

Unexpectedly Joe won and they had to give him the champ seat. something I by the way find fair and I am glad the Ring got screwed there. Historically there has never been a fight between 1 and 3 producing a Ring champ without an AMERICAN as one of the fighters. Which I think sucks - I would rather there could be a unbiased organisation, but so far the Ring is actually almost the best we have. That just says a little about how badly it looks.

So are you saying the Ring did NOT give it to Ottke because they expected him to unify, but the had to give it the Clazaghe because they expected him not to unify?

Btw, I think Ottke should only have gotten the Ring-C after beating Calzaghe - and Calzaghe should only get it after beating Kessler. If there is no other obvious competitor fine, but in both cases there was/is.

But you're right that the Ring apparenlty wants to have it both ways, and his criteria arent't quite clear.

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 07 Apr 2006, 11:13

jamesmcdonnell wrote:Aren't there any other areas of boxing that you could take about? We take your point, you think Kessler is better than Calzaghe, but christ mate, can't we move on?

I agree. Pundit, can we have your thoughts on Pornsawan Kratingdaenggym?

Reckon Kessler could take him?

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 07 Apr 2006, 11:14

pundit wrote:
jamesmcdonnell wrote:fornicating hell pundit, you must really worship the ground Kessler walks on. Change the bastard record mate, are you his boyfriend/agent/manager?
Not at all - I am just not prepared to let Calzaghe get away with a well-calculated and reatively easy win over Lacy and claim championship status, while still having avoided the real chaellenges.

Btw, there are so many blind Calzaghe-huggers here that one Kessler-advocate is needed to produce some degree of balacne...

won't help Kessler's case that he might be fighting William Joppy next.

Ideally Beyer should have risen to Kessler's challenge, while Calzaghe was whipping Lacy (has to be said, I think calzaghe has been indifferent as to his s/m rivals). Would have been a clear pair of semifinals, raising each winner's profile. That would have made much more of a stir, but what does Beyer do, but say, 'I'll fight the Calzaghe-Lacy winner'. Nothing wrong with Beyer's skills, but I don't like his attitude and he won't have a big fight until late in the year. If Beyer had taken the bait, Warren wouldn't be able to overlook the Dane, who would have beaten Beyer

With so many good fighters at 168-175 (Calzaghe, Kessler, Beyer, Adamek, Briggs, Woods, Tarver, Johnson, Erdei), it is a bit naff that so few of them are fighting each other for whatever reason.

Pisses me off every time someone says Calzaghe can now try and impress America. Why so? Wasn't that what the Lacy fight was for...Tarver won't be around long, and the other option is a farce vs R Jones. Woods, Kessler, Beyer all have lucrative markets to aim for in their own right, and the Americans can tune in if they want.

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 07 Apr 2006, 11:23

jamesmcdonnell wrote:Aren't there any other areas of boxing that you could take about?

Just check the forum.

JC · Post by JC » 07 Apr 2006, 11:28

Kessler should fight Manfrado Jr, he'd win confortably but get way more TV exposure in America.

I know Manfrado would have no business being in the ring with Kessler, but niether does Joppy.

hitman_hatton1 · Post by **hitman_hatton1** » 07 Apr 2006, 11:49

jamesmcdonnell wrote:fornicating hell pundit, you must really worship the ground Kessler walks on. Change the bastard record mate, are you his boyfriend/agent/manager?

ottke-mitchell wasn't for the ring title cos calzaghe was clearly 2nd best and u can't just ignore him.

kessler has been champion for 5 minutes and has a couple of good wins. calzaghe was champ for nigh on 6 yrs and couldn't just be left out.

no way was ottke ever no1 in my opinion, even though he was edging his way past better opposition at times.

Southpaw Stylist · Post by **Southpaw Stylist** » 07 Apr 2006, 11:57

pundit wrote:
jamesmcdonnell wrote:fornicating hell pundit, you must really worship the ground Kessler walks on. Change the bastard record mate, are you his boyfriend/agent/manager?
Not at all - I am just not prepared to let Calzaghe get away with a well-calculated and reatively easy win over Lacy and claim championship status, while still having avoided the real chaellenges.

Btw, there are so many blind Calzaghe-huggers here that one Kessler-advocate is needed to produce some degree of balacne...

I agree. Too many.

Calzaghe is good, but let's not hype him, he beat someone who was overhyped, that's about it. Jeff Lacy's actual skill was always crap.

Joe Calzaghe is one of those irritating fighters who I'd love to see in a fight where he is the underdog based on actual achievement rather than typical British wariness of anyone that can punch a bit.

Calzaghe fight KESSLER god damnid

calzaghe v kessler