Francesco Damiani-How Good Was He ?

[Bricks]

Well, three world titles just weren't enough, were they?

It did not happen overnight, but it was in the 2000s. I remember in the 1990s HBO started a policy where they would not even mention the WBO on the air. Lampley would say something like "he has a title from an organization that we don't recognize." (Right after the ring announcer would refer to someone as the WBO champion.)

This was supposed to be some sort of ethical stand concerning the paper title situation.
However, they dropped that policy after a while.

The promoters and the networks like have a lot of "world titles" (and undefeated fighters) because they think it helps promotes fights.

The numerous titles have been one of the factors in boxing's downfall.

I think 1995/96 was the year it turned around for the wbo... for the first time a legit bona fide hw people respected as champ in riddick bowe....young guns like barerra,hamed ,de la hoya and michaelzewski as champs,names like eubanks......

Prior to that there were too many Mickey house titles and title fights early on before that.that said, moorer,hearns and camacho were good early champs

[Caractacus]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6s_HtyKh0Do

[Ambling Alp II]

Well, three world titles just weren't enough, were they?

It did not happen overnight, but it was in the 2000s. I remember in the 1990s HBO started a policy where they would not even mention the WBO on the air. Lampley would say something like "he has a title from an organization that we don't recognize." (Right after the ring announcer would refer to someone as the WBO champion.)

This was supposed to be some sort of ethical stand concerning the paper title situation.
However, they dropped that policy after a while.

The promoters and the networks like have a lot of "world titles" (and undefeated fighters) because they think it helps promotes fights.

The numerous titles have been one of the factors in boxing's downfall.

I think 1995/96 was the year it turned around for the wbo... for the first time a legit bona fide hw people respected as champ in riddick bowe....young guns like barerra,hamed ,de la hoya and michaelzewski as champs,names like eubanks......

Prior to that there were too many Mickey house titles and title fights early on before that.that said, moorer,hearns and camacho were good early champs

I guess that helped, but still nobody considered the title to mean very much at that time.

Virtually nobody considered Bowe the "real" Champion again after winning the WBO title.

[Caractacus]

Here is Francesco Damiani winning the WBO Heavyweight title in a short but action filled fight over Johnny Du Plooy
May.9.1989.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeYXqIOrWks

[Caractacus]

Franceso Damiani's 25th professional fight against ( 6 ft 1" ?) Argentian heavyweight Daniel Eduardo Neto
December 1989.(BTW Damiani knocks one of the "T"'s off of Neto here apparently)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZEGrGM8Fso

[Caractacus]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmWSSFeJ4bs

[Kalan]

When he was the WBO champion, nobody consider it a major belt. Neither he nor Mercer (or Bennt, or Hide for that matter) were considered real champions and it is annoying that people now retroactively make it out to be that this title meant something.

It meant more when George Foreman delegitimized the Lineal Heavyweight Title by fighting cherry-picks Schulz, Grimsley, and Saverese. He fought 3 times in 3 years, and commercialized the title as if it were his property... Just like Martinez, Cotto, and Canelo delegitimized the Lineal Middleweight Title by refusing to fight Gennady Golovkin.

[Caractacus]

[gregor]

I did not see a lot of him, but what I did he was not bad. He had some boxing ability and could punch. He should have beat Mercer, but quit once he got hurt.

Did not look like quitting for me - the referee waved it off . I am not sure if the reason was Damiani failing to stand back in time (he was up, but IMO about half a second too late) or his obviously broken nose.

[Kalan]

James Broad was Damiani’s toughest opponent eh??? Whooo baby...That's really funny,

It's interesting how your toughest opponent is always one of the more inept and chinny guys you ever fought, but somebody who you beat... Every time I hear an interviewer ask a boxer that question I always get ready for some bullcrap…

Ali a few fights after losing to Joe Frazier said something like... "Toughest opponent? Whew... Cooper was tough.. Chuvalo was real tough... Doug Jones was a very tough fight... I'll probably say Karl Mildenberger was my toughest... His southpaw style gave me fits.”

Floyd Patterson.... "I fought so many really great fighters.. Pete Rademacher kept getting up every time I knocked him down.. Eddie Machen was exceptionally tough.. Jerry Quarry was a tough kid, but not the toughest.. Cassius Clay? Well, I had a bad back and couldn't test him.. The Liston fights were over too fast to gage his effectiveness.. Johansson was the first guy to really beat me and that was my toughest loss because I was such a big favorite to beat him. I’ll go with Ingo.” He also ranked Ingo well over Liston for his top 10 Heavyweights of all time. He didn't include himself.

Joe Frazier.... “I fought a lot of tough guys. Bonavena.. Jerry.. Clay.. I really can’t say who was the toughest opponent I fought. They were all tough.” No mention of Foreman of course.

[Kalan]

But as for how good Damiani was...

He was a very sloppy and poorly conditioned Heavyweight... He was a poor man's Gerry Cooney... He had a better chin than Cooney but a very soft and flabby body... He needed a strength coach and a nutritionist to get the fat off and apply some muscle and strength to his frame... He needed a boxing coach because he was strictly a brawler... He got hit all the time.. He had no footwork, jab, or defensive expertise such as a Larry Holmes would have -- but at that time Larry was very fat also -- but fat or in shape Holmes could go 12 or 15 rounds easy as pie because he knew exactly what he was doing... If Holmes could really hit, and was physically strong and very well conditioned instead of super fat, he would have had the package.

This is what separates Joshua from Heavyweights of earlier generations.

[Crease]

When did that happen & why are the likes of the WBF, IBO etc not considered to be 'majors'?

That happened around the early 2000s. The strength of an organization is the Champions that it has throughout the weight classes and the WBO had A LOT of brilliant fighters holding their titles around that time, which helped them gained credibility and acceptance from the other bodies.

[Crease]

Francesco Damiani-How Good Was He?

Not very good, I'm afraid.

Looking at his record, which the only objective way of judging any fighter - he showed that he had a bit of talent about him, but his losses to Ray Mercer and Oliver McCall suggest that he would have struggled against other top 10 Heavyweights of the '90s.

His great achievement was winning and holding that WBO Heavyweight Championship, yet it's difficult to give him full credit for it considering that ne never beat an established World Champion for it.
So well it is a very good achievement becoming World Heavyweight Champion, he can't get full credit for it.

How good do you think he could have been?

But isn't the difficulty of rating him? We never seen him fight multiple credible contenders like a Razor Ruddock, a Phil Jackson, or a Michael Moorer - so we'll never know how good he could have been.

And that's not even counting the top guy like Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis & Bowe. All four of which, I'd say would have beaten him handily enough.

[Flump]

James Broad was Damiani’s toughest opponent eh??? Whooo baby...That's really funny,

It's interesting how your toughest opponent is always one of the more inept and chinny guys you ever fought, but somebody who you beat... Every time I hear an interviewer ask a boxer that question I always get ready for some bullcrap…

Ali a few fights after losing to Joe Frazier said something like... "Toughest opponent? Whew... Cooper was tough.. Chuvalo was real tough... Doug Jones was a very tough fight... I'll probably say Karl Mildenberger was my toughest... His southpaw style gave me fits.”

Floyd Patterson.... "I fought so many really great fighters.. Pete Rademacher kept getting up every time I knocked him down.. Eddie Machen was exceptionally tough.. Jerry Quarry was a tough kid, but not the toughest.. Cassius Clay? Well, I had a bad back and couldn't test him.. The Liston fights were over too fast to gage his effectiveness.. Johansson was the first guy to really beat me and that was my toughest loss because I was such a big favorite to beat him. I’ll go with Ingo.” He also ranked Ingo well over Liston for his top 10 Heavyweights of all time. He didn't include himself.

Joe Frazier.... “I fought a lot of tough guys. Bonavena.. Jerry.. Clay.. I really can’t say who was the toughest opponent I fought. They were all tough.” No mention of Foreman of course.

Damiani didn't say that, an earlier poster did.

[Flump]

But as for how good Damiani was...

He was a very sloppy and poorly conditioned Heavyweight... He was a poor man's Gerry Cooney... He had a better chin than Cooney but a very soft and flabby body... He needed a strength coach and a nutritionist to get the fat off and apply some muscle and strength to his frame... He needed a boxing coach because he was strictly a brawler... He got hit all the time.. He had no footwork, jab, or defensive expertise such as a Larry Holmes would have -- but at that time Larry was very fat also -- but fat or in shape Holmes could go 12 or 15 rounds easy as pie because he knew exactly what he was doing... If Holmes could really hit, and was physically strong and very well conditioned instead of super fat, he would have had the package.

This is what separates Joshua from Heavyweights of earlier generations.

He was nothing like Gerry Cooney, except he was white.

[Kalan]

But as for how good Damiani was...

He was a very sloppy and poorly conditioned Heavyweight... He was a poor man's Gerry Cooney... He had a better chin than Cooney but a very soft and flabby body... He needed a strength coach and a nutritionist to get the fat off and apply some muscle and strength to his frame... He needed a boxing coach because he was strictly a brawler... He got hit all the time.. He had no footwork, jab, or defensive expertise such as a Larry Holmes would have -- but at that time Larry was very fat also -- but fat or in shape Holmes could go 12 or 15 rounds easy as pie because he knew exactly what he was doing... If Holmes could really hit, and was physically strong and very well conditioned instead of super fat, he would have had the package.

This is what separates Joshua from Heavyweights of earlier generations.

He was nothing like Gerry Cooney, except he was white

He was big.... He was white.... He was aggressive.... He was easy to hit.... He had no footwork.... He couldn't box well

He also had black hair... a prominent nose... a hairy chest... pasty skin... low self esteem... and many personal problems.

[Caractacus]

I think Francesco Damiani would have given Mike Tyson some problems in the ring just from his style and the angle his punches came from.

[Caractacus]

Check out Francesco Damiani in this amateur fight from April.15. 1982.
World Amateur Boxing Championship in Munch Germany.

[Kalan]

Check out Francesco Damiani in this amateur fight from April.15. 1982.
World Amateur Boxing Championship in Munch Germany.

Both amateurs (Damiani and Stevenson) looked extremely amateurish -- with both .bouncing around too much and showing no smoothness... Damiani lost his next fight in the tournament to Tyrell Biggs who also beat him in the Olympics... Biggs beat Damiani primarily by being a much smoother boxer and having better skills... Briggs washed out in the pros... He was overmatched badly early in his pro career like Marvis Frazier was.... He was brutalized by a 31-0 Mike Tyson when he had 15 fights.... He was knocked out 5 X by the time he had 24 fights.... You wonder why some boxing managers are such idiots, rushing kids up the ladder who have so much potential.

Daminai wasn't rushed, but he didn't improve any from his amateur days during his pro career.... He still threw tons of wild flailing punches and was a virtual punching bag for more clever operators like Ray Mercer who put him down for the 10-count with a punch to the nose... It was funny because Oliver McCall kept trying for that same uppercut to the nose throughout his Damiani fight... He didn't land it, but beat the Hell out of the Italian... Damiani turned tail from the action and walked away after taking a hard right.... He quit -- doing a NO MAS ending to his entire career.

[jont]

He was not a virtual punching bag for Ray Mercer... Mercer barely did anything before he launched the punch that broke the Italian's nose... Damiani was a decent fighter and I would have loved to see him fight Moorer and Truth Williams

[Kalan]

Damiani was getting beaten up by Mercer.

Mercer was never hurt and landing good shots on Damiani.....breaking him down... McCall hit him with even sharper and better shots... That was one of the few times you'll see a name boxer quit on his feet in mid round from a vicious beating... Damiani lacked the conditioning to keep a battle of attrition going against a resolute and iron tough opponent... When you see a very flabby opponent who lacks strength you know he won't sustain a real war for the distance.

But a fight where there was no give in either warrior was Lewis vs Mercer... Not a great boxing match but a great fight... A tough way to win - but if you lack an elite jab and defensive skills often size, strength, and physicality will win it.

[Lennox]

Damiani was getting beaten up by Mercer.

Mercer was never hurt and landing good shots on Damiani.....breaking him down... McCall hit him with even sharper and better shots... That was one of the few times you'll see a name boxer quit on his feet in mid round from a vicious beating... Damiani lacked the conditioning to keep a battle of attrition going against a resolute and iron tough opponent... When you see a very flabby opponent who lacks strength you know he won't sustain a real war for the distance.

But a fight where there was no give in either warrior was Lewis vs Mercer... Not a great boxing match but a great fight... A tough way to win - but if you lack an elite jab and defensive skills often size, strength, and physicality will win it.

You got some serious memory issues. The fight is on you tube I suggest you go watch so you can repatriate your pickled mind. Anyone that watches the fight will see you are an idiot poster.
Francesco was about 5th in the world at his best but top 10 for 3 years, on neutral soil he would have beaten Frank Bruno. Mickey Duff thought very highly of him and any mandatory that would have involved the pair Mickey would have taken another route. I thought Mercer would beat FD pre fight but after an even first round, no one could say FD was not miles ahead on the cards until he got caught, FD was a clinical points scorer, quite cautious but boxed like a chess player thinking ahead, yes his conditioning was not the best. Oliver McCall beat him as well but McCall was a pretty good fighter too. On the night he should have fought Holyfield, Bert Cooper stepped in and nearly stopped Evander. I don't think he would have beaten EH and almost certain he would have got quickly knocked out if he had fought Tyson, but I think he would have been too clever for Bruno and Gary Mason and frustrated them. Bruno and Damianni were defenitely 1st and 2nd in Europe at the time.

[Boxing Writer]

Francesco Damiani-How Good Was He?

Not very good, I'm afraid.

Looking at his record, which the only objective way of judging any fighter - he showed that he had a bit of talent about him, but his losses to Ray Mercer and Oliver McCall suggest that he would have struggled against other top 10 Heavyweights of the '90s.

His great achievement was winning and holding that WBO Heavyweight Championship, yet it's difficult to give him full credit for it considering that ne never beat an established World Champion for it.
So well it is a very good achievement becoming World Heavyweight Champion, he can't get full credit for it.

How good do you think he could have been?

But isn't the difficulty of rating him? We never seen him fight multiple credible contenders like a Razor Ruddock, a Phil Jackson, or a Michael Moorer - so we'll never know how good he could have been.

And that's not even counting the top guy like Tyson, Holyfield, Lewis & Bowe. All four of which, I'd say would have beaten him handily enough.

I agree with everything in your post with the exception of Phil Jackson being a credible contender. He definitely wasn't -

[Caractacus]

I think Damiani may have turned pro a bit late (going on 27 years old in 1985)
What if he had turned pro at the end of 1982 ?
He would have had probably at least 25 pro fights by 1985.
How would he have done against Michael Spinks as Spinks second title defense of the IBF title in 1986 ?

[tennessee]

Mercer vs Damiani was fight that got me hooked on boxing. Became big fan and got into the amateurs.