I am not going to kick the guy when he`s down, but ask the question where did it all go wrong for Audley?.
Was he too old to turn proffesional and reach the expected level he and others around him expected?
Did he squander his ability with too many outside interests, or did he just lack the ability full stop?
Did he go about it all wrong when he first turned pro?, would he have been better to let others more experienced guide him and choose the route to go instead of choosing his own opponents and who to teach him the pro way?
Lets be sensible and just give truthfull reasons, he has had enough nasty comments the last couple of years
Audley has/had ability and skills, but he simply does not have the heart, courage & determination that other fighters' do possess.
Audley told Claude Abrahams of Boxing News, that his life has changed, having got married and soon-to-become a father for the 1st time, he has lost all fire and desire for Boxing.
Razor wrote:
GETTING RICH TOO SOON HAS FUCKED HIM BIG TIME SERIOUSLY.
I agree, if you already have more money than you ever expected to it must be very hard to push yourself that exrta bit.
When the going gets tough it must be easy to think why should I do this when I already have enough to live decent on.
But is Audley that well off now? he could not have earned that much money in his actual fights, and the large sums he got given to him when he first turned pro must have been seriously eaten into to maintain the lifestyle he has been living, and the people he has around him have got to be expensive also.
It hasn't gone wrong, it was all part of the plan to get rich off the back of an Olympic gold medal, whilst taking the path of least resistance.
How else can you explain the painfully slow progress & all the "injuries"?
I admire him in a perverse way, as he has managed to con the public & get extremely rich whilst doing so.
He's laughing at all of us right now, whilst counting his millions.
He's disgraced boxing, especially when you consider that there are greater fighters than he, who have far more courage & fortitude & they struggle to exist!
Same scenario as Lewis Francis and other sports people nowadays in this country. They get it all before they're done anything. Linford Christie, Daley THompson, Steve Redgrave, Nigel Benn all great sport people who worked hard to achieve things and got no help in the process. These people nowadays settle for mediocrity!
Last edited by Arsenal on 15 Apr 2006, 14:59, edited 1 time in total.
Arsenal wrote:Same scenario as Lewis Francis and other sports people nowadays in this country. They get it all before they're done anything. Linford Christie, Daley THompson, Steve Redgrave, Nigel Benn all great sport people who worked hard to achieve things and got no help in the process. These people settle for mediocrity!
I think a lot of people, including Audley, were kidding themselves as to how good he was in the first place. Anytime he promised he would become Heavyweight champion it just seemed so insincere.
Sad thing is that Auldey has ended up a national laughing stock and can hardly show his face in public. He really did bring it all upon himself with all his BS. I just hope he retires now and doesn't continue embarrassing himself.
He was an amateur boxer for a long time, and he saw the points scoring system come along and become the main way of scoring. He's six foot seven, with a massive reach, and he sussed out a way of landing single punches on the other guy, of varying power, that scored points with the judges. Everything was then based around that. Fitness, tactics, etc. And it worked for him, he won the gold medal.
The problem is, the pro game is totally different. He did okay against hand picked bums and many a fighter has gone a long way, and made a lot of money, by only recording their wins against hand picked opponents.
When you're the gold medal winner, unbeaten and getting lots of publicity, it must be very difficult to do a U-turn, so you carry on with what you're doing. Meanwhile, other unbeaten heavyweights lost their perfect records, but all the while, Audley kept winning. There was allegedly and others slagging him off at every opportunity, but Audley kept winning. Meanwhile, world titles change hands, the fortunes of fellow British prospects rise and fall, other contenders emerge and fall by the wayside, and so on - but you just have to keep winning, so despite all the flack Audley kept adding victims to his unbeaten record.
After a few decent wins in America, some critics seemed on the verge of accepting that he might amount to something, and he risked it all against Danny Williams. He must have gone into that fight thinking he could win, and if he had beaten Williams, he'd have won the domestic title, firmly established himself in the world top ten rankings, and put one over on allegedly. He may have been just a couple of bouts away from a world title shot.
Of course, he stank the joint out, lost, and became a national joke. Then last night he did it all again, apparently even worse.
I think he simply rode the crest of the wave from the moment he won the Olympic games, and he never learned anything in the pro ranks. If it hadn't been Danny Williams or Guinn, it would have been somebody else.
Perhaps now he'll look back and wonder if he should have spent more time developing his skills and facing tougher opponents, on undercards instead of top of the bill, where the pressure to shine meant he was only ever going to handpick bums. I remember when Evander Holyfield stepped up to heavyweight, and had his second or third bouts at the new weight against James Tillis and Pinklon Thomas. Evander was honest enough to admit that, as things stood after he'd beaten Thomas, on that form he wasn't going to win the heavyweight title. He said this publicly, and knuckled down to bettering himself (after, incidentally, a glorious reign as cruiserweight champ) and of course we all know how things turned out for Evander.
Audley's problem was that he took the wrong path to the top. At least, that's my take on it.
He was an overated amateur, fought in a piss poor Super Heavyweight devision and got lucky in the first round of the Olympics.
They nearly scraped the Super Heavyweight devision after the 2000 games.
He has decent handspeed and good combinations FOR A BIG GUY and a big frame, but that is it.
There was evidence that he couldn't fight for 2 MINUTES sustained at the Olympics.... In most of the rounds, he would go behind.... then land with 5-6 combination.... the let the other guy comeback.... then land another combination.
None of this mis management crap, he's simply not good enough. Yes, he wasn't managed effectively.... but he's simply not good enough and, as I said in another post, if he was managed effectively he would have been exposed before and a hell of a lot poorer as a result.
If he was good enough, he could have beaten the version of Danny Williams he faced after 5 pro fights
He was an amateur boxer for a long time, and he saw the points scoring system come along and become the main way of scoring. He's six foot seven, with a massive reach, and he sussed out a way of landing single punches on the other guy, of varying power, that scored points with the judges. Everything was then based around that. Fitness, tactics, etc. And it worked for him, he won the gold medal.
The problem is, the pro game is totally different. He did okay against hand picked bums and many a fighter has gone a long way, and made a lot of money, by only recording their wins against hand picked opponents.
When you're the gold medal winner, unbeaten and getting lots of publicity, it must be very difficult to do a U-turn, so you carry on with what you're doing. Meanwhile, other unbeaten heavyweights lost their perfect records, but all the while, Audley kept winning. There was allegedly allegedly and others slagging him off at every opportunity, but Audley kept winning. Meanwhile, world titles change hands, the fortunes of fellow British prospects rise and fall, other contenders emerge and fall by the wayside, and so on - but you just have to keep winning, so despite all the flack Audley kept adding victims to his unbeaten record.
After a few decent wins in America, some critics seemed on the verge of accepting that he might amount to something, and he risked it all against Danny Williams. He must have gone into that fight thinking he could win, and if he had beaten Williams, he'd have won the domestic title, firmly established himself in the world top ten rankings, and put one over on allegedly allegedly. He may have been just a couple of bouts away from a world title shot.
Of course, he stank the joint out, lost, and became a national joke. Then last night he did it all again, apparently even worse.
I think he simply rode the crest of the wave from the moment he won the Olympic games, and he never learned anything in the pro ranks. If it hadn't been Danny Williams or Guinn, it would have been somebody else.
Perhaps now he'll look back and wonder if he should have spent more time developing his skills and facing tougher opponents, on undercards instead of top of the bill, where the pressure to shine meant he was only ever going to handpick bums. I remember when Evander Holyfield stepped up to heavyweight, and had his second or third bouts at the new weight against James Tillis and Pinklon Thomas. Evander was honest enough to admit that, as things stood after he'd beaten Thomas, on that form he wasn't going to win the heavyweight title. He said this publicly, and knuckled down to bettering himself (after, incidentally, a glorious reign as cruiserweight champ) and of course we all know how things turned out for Evander.
Audley's problem was that he took the wrong path to the top. At least, that's my take on it.
If I were handling/advising an unbeaten heavyweight, my number one priority, overriding all others, would be to keep him unbeaten for as long as possible, preferably all the way to a title shot. If you're going to lose, lose in a world title shot because at least you're then an "ex-world title challenger" and in this age of multiple titles, fighters can be good for several world title shots. By all means learn your trade along the way, but keep that record spotless. It makes you stand out from the pack and the longer you maintain it, the more likely it is that unbeaten rivals will fall by the wayside. They always do.
For a long time, Audley managed to remain unbeaten. Remember when Danny Williams went to Germany and got blitzed by Sinan Samil Sam ? Audley gloated publicly and at that moment in time it looked like, domestically, the torch had been passed. Ironic how Williams has both beaten Audley, and outlasted him - and I think it's safe to assume this, as Danny has a big summer fight in front of a big ground at the G-Mex centre in front of an ITV crowd of millions, with a proposed world title challenge to possibly follow, while Audley's career just disappeared down the u-bend. But, getting back to the point, while Danny went to Germany and got beat, Audley kept the unbeaten record going.
He lacked the connections to get any meaningful fights so all he could do was keep the momentum going. It's hard to knock an unbeaten record. The moment your perfect record is blown, you're at the back of the queue, paydays have a zero missing, and the rebuilding process is long and hard.
So I think that, as us boxing fans look to where it all went wrong, you can appreciate the reasoning behind some of the things that Audley did.
Maybe, along the way, he started to believe his own hype ? Maybe he thought that the skills and experience required to go all the way would be automatically picked up in the 2-3 bouts which would take him to a world title ?
My only fear now is that Harrison gets a title shot, we all know what boxing is like it wouldn't suprise me coming off 2 losses that Audley gets a 'so called easy defence' by the major champs, lets hope not for boxing sake.
The differences are that he has an experienced person making the fights, he is an ideal age to turn pro..and learn and he is being kept busy
But just like Audley did in the beginning, he too is fighting noticably smaller guys, he is being hyped to silly expectations, his style is more suited to the scoring amateur system, he has too many outside interests.....and he has been given lots and lots of money already...
jim jims post was a good one but wrong in that had audley fought better opponents earlier he would have been exposed before making a cart load of dough.
another poster said he was mismanaged and had he been "managed effectively" he would have been found out earlier!! come on, no manager on earth wants his cash cow to be slaughtered. harrison has succeeded in his objective which was to earn a fortune without getting his head bashed in.
it is only we romantics who believe in things like honesty and integrity and courage and sporting contests that are disappointed.
and where did it all go wrong? if it went wrong (and i'm not sure that it did) there were two major factors
1. agreeing to fight danny williams
2. that moment early in his pro career when his trainer happened to mention that his opponents will try to hit him back
two events in audleys life that made him think a little bit
The Gold medal made Audley Harrison something that he is not, a World Contender!
It was big news for the UK boxing scene, like the Amir Khan show wagon is, and I think we were all under the false impression that this was the man to replace Lewis.
If Audley had never got a medal at the Olympics we would be talking about him as much on this forum as we talk about Courtney Fry, Audleys Olympic teammate.
While he has made a lot more money than most British Title fighters ever will, he has a made a laughthing stock of himself and what it is to be an Olympic champion.
I had a look at Paolo Vidoz to compare records against Audleys & how they both have progressed.
Audley beat Paolo 32-16 in the semi final of the 2000 Olympics
So while we have a close pro record, look at the different way in which there careers have gone.
Palo was Italy National Champion at fight number 10, (Audley Says at the time he is looking past UK Heavyweight title, he wants to go forward rather than backwards)
Paolo Lost fight 19 against Nikolay Valuev for the WBA International Heavyweight Title, (Audley cant even win domestic dust up, against unfit Williams, in britains biggest heavyweight fight since Bruno V Lewis)
Paolo Wins Vacant European (EBU) Heavyweight Title & IBF Inter-Continental Heavyweight Title. Defending 2 times. (Audley loses next comeback fight from a career that never got started & becomes joke of english boxing)
Two good points made there by ABAboxing and Harrygreb.
Maybe Audley did succeed, in so much as earning very good money out of boxing, but at what price?
he is a laughting stock and will forever be remembered for the wrong reasons, and when his name is brought up to make an example it will be an uncompimentry one to say the least
And it does really bring home just what an Olympic medal today means...a big fat nothing in terms of proffesional boxing success.
Audley has heart, he went into the ring enough times to prove that.
What he lacked was desire, I think his age and already bulging bank balance made all the difference.
I think if you're the size of Audley Harrison, with a gold medal on the sideboard, and you watch guys like Ruiz, Rahman and Brewster frequently winning and losing versions of the heavyweight title, then you have got to fancy your chances of at least matching them.
I don't believe it was Audley's grand plan to only milk it for the first 20-25 pro bouts, until he inevitably got found out. After all the deductions - tax, training/promotional expenses, there can't have been a massive amount of money left, even on the hundred grand a throw BBC paydays. He hasn't been earning big purses in America. I don't believe he's got millions in the bank at this point in his career - maybe one or two, but not millions. He's had a glimpse at the kind of lifestyle that was awaiting him, but if his earning power is now effectively over, his dreams and aspirations are finished, in terms of living the multimillionaire lifestyle for the rest of his days.
What he's earned so far is small change compared to the riches he could have accumulated had he gone all the way, and Audley would have to be the biggest bonehead of all time to simply turn pro and think "I've no chance of making it all the way, so I'll just milk it for a couple of dozen fights and then walk away". That is pretty unrealistic for a guy of his size and amateur pedigree, in this age of mediocre heavyweight champs and contenders.
I just don't believe this was his gameplan. Not when you watch the likes of Ruiz, Rahman and co, winning and losing versions of the title. Wladimir Klitschko is damaged goods and always a punch away from defeat, Byrd's reflexes are shot and he's coming to the end of the road, and absolute non-entities like Jameel McCline get world title shots. Christ, even Oliver McCall is WBC number three !
Obviously the wheels have come off the bandwagon in spectacular fashion and Audley's career is over whether he accepts it or not, but I just can't accept that he turned pro with no real belief; maybe if the top heavyweights were of peak-1970's calibre then possibly, but not with the shower of sxxxe we are blessed with today. Along the way, since he turned pro, things have gone wrong well before Danny Williams burst the bubble, but surely Audley fancied his chances when he started out against hapless Mike Middleton ?!
There is no way Audley planned to milk it. No need to look that deep into the whys and where-fores. He simply just isnt as good as he thought he was. I mean you can argue bout natural talent, but at the end of the day, potential or no potential, when he has stepped in the ring with ok'ish opponents he has failed spectacularly. No-one made him fight like that. He wasn't instructed to throw as little punches as possible. No more excuses, it will be a bloody miracle if this guy comes back and does ANYTHING, let alone wins a title of some merit.
harrygreb wrote:
another poster said he was mismanaged and had he been "managed effectively" he would have been found out earlier!! come on, no manager on earth wants his cash cow to be slaughtered. harrison has succeeded in his objective which was to earn a fortune without getting his head bashed in.
It was me who said this, and I agree.... Audley WAS managed effectively because of all his flaws. He went as far as he could go with his ability (ability is everything, not just skills on a punch bag).
However, if Audley was the real deal (and obviously his early management team... Colin McMillan etc knew he wasn't) then he should have progressed as a far faster rate than he did. Whilst Ricky Hatton earned a shit load of money, there will always be the what if he got his chance sooner.
The Danny Williams he faced was arguably the worst holder of a legitimate stepping stone belt in recent memory.
