Holyfield (1988) vs. Usyk (2018) at CW ?

[ValMar]

Who wins in this fantasy match ? How ?

[jamamb]

holy was unreal at cruiser. he could do absolutely f@cking everything and wasnt giving up size. you should do a more balanced match.

what about usyk vs:

jc gomez
adamek
qawi
mormeck
haye
nelson
cunningham
de leon

[ValMar]

holy was unreal at cruiser. he could do absolutely f@cking everything and wasnt giving up size. you should do a more balanced match.

what about usyk vs:

jc gomez
adamek
qawi
mormeck
haye
nelson
cunningham
de leon

I wouldn't like to be misunderstood, Holyfield is/was one of my favourite boxers, but Usyk is more than excellent one, too....
Usyk vs Haye (fit/healthy) might be a wonderful match by the end of this year.

[SenorPipino]

Holyfield was special.

Usyk might be the best cruiserweight today, but he certainly didn't look like a special fighter against Breidis.

He barely squeezed by. He'll probably also squeeze by Gassiev in the finals should Gassiev overcome Dorticos (no sure thing).

Usyk seemed hittable. At least against Breidis. A fine boxer, excellent jab, but he doesn't appear to be the puncher his record suggests.

His pressure was key against Breidis.

In a fight with Holyfield, it would be the American Bronze medalist who would be applying that pressure at a work rate that would wear down Usyk.

I don't think that Usyk offers the kind of arsenal that could discourage Holyfield. The Ukrainian would connect early and move smartly, but Holyfield would gradually close the distance and begin battering Usyk.

By the 8th round Holyfield would have assumed full control and it's just a matter of whether a worn down Usyk can survive to the final bell.

Usyk is a real good cruiserweight. But Evander Holyfield was very well the GOAT at that weight.

[jamamb]

holy was the cw goat. power, speed, great combos, stamina, etc

hed have too much for usyk.

[boxing_rocks]

Holyfield, and it wouldn't be close.

[klitoris]

Idk why people instantly writing off Usyk after a close an exciting fight. Briedis is a damn good fighter and there is no shame in winning against him in a close fight.

Holyfield had one of the most exciting and close fights with Qawi early in his CW career. After that fight Qawi went on to never win a title again and lost another 8 fights. Briedis is a potential future CW champion once Usyk leaves the division.

[jamamb]

i thought usyk won clearly vs briedis at least by 4 rounds and looked good. but holy was just on another level at cw. stronger and harder punching than usyk, probably faster, and unreal combinations. plenty of stamina too.

usyk also cant fight inside like holy could, holy could box or go in and tear ppl up,

[jamamb]

usyk can be the #2 though, better than gomez, nelson, de leon, etc

[tiny_acres]

Why do people insist on placing a current fighter who is still developing in a fantasy March up with an atg????
This frustrates the crap out of me.
Let's let his career play out a bit before we get into atg discussions

[boxing_rocks]

Why do people insist on placing a current fighter who is still developing in a fantasy March up with an atg????
This frustrates the crap out of me.
Let's let his career play out a bit before we get into atg discussions

Exactly. There is a good chance the guy will get beaten in 4 months, and they are comparing him to the best cruiser ever?

[Boxing Writer]

Holyfield would beat Usyk, Dorticos and Gassiev. Last two would be an easy work for Evander. Usyk might be tougher one IF he boxed the way he did when he was working with James Ali Bashir (Glowacki fight). Bashir didn't chage his style at all - Usyk boxed exactly the same way he did in the amateurs under tutelage of Anatoly Lomachenko. But since leaving Bashir Usyk is trying to be more aggressive, to look more impressive. He doesn't move as much as he used to, he doesn't use his jab as much as he did before, he brawls more and he gets hit more than ever. Holyfield would beat any version of Usyk, but more aggressive version of Usyk would be easier to handle for EH.

[SenorPipino]

Why do people insist on placing a current fighter who is still developing in a fantasy March up with an atg????
This frustrates the crap out of me.
Let's let his career play out a bit before we get into atg discussions

But it's fair game under current standards.

You say that Usyk is still developing and that's true.

But once he wins a world title--an accomplishment supposedly representative of achieving boxing's pinnacle---then he's open for comparison.

It's unfortunate that in this era so many fighters are able to snag championship belts with practically nothing more than novice professional experience.

Usyk has just 14 pro fights and wins a world title in only his 10th bout.

In the not too long ago past, that was practically unheard of. Today it's an all too common occurrence.

But you can't have it both ways. If you're going to strap on a world title belt, a fighters' deficiencies can't be casually dismissed or ignored simply because he's "inexperienced" or "hasn't developed."

No matter how few fights you have, if you're thrust on to the world title stage and you're talented enough to win one, then there's no reason to eschew comparisons to any champion who came before.

[BroughtonRulesRefuge]

Holyfield was special.

- Yeah, special shortbus dumb and couldn't box a lick as he showed against Qawi and Bowe, Ruiz, Sherman Williams, well, maybe dumber the more apt description.

Keep the candles burning long enough, and maybe you sillys can come up with a stock journeyman cruiser he could beat.

[Mexi-Box]

Why do people insist on placing a current fighter who is still developing in a fantasy March up with an atg????
This frustrates the crap out of me.
Let's let his career play out a bit before we get into atg discussions

But it's fair game under current standards.

You say that Usyk is still developing and that's true.

But once he wins a world title--an accomplishment supposedly representative of achieving boxing's pinnacle---then he's open for comparison.

It's unfortunate that in this era so many fighters are able to snag championship belts with practically nothing more than novice professional experience.

Usyk has just 14 pro fights and wins a world title in only his 10th bout.

In the not too long ago past, that was practically unheard of. Today it's an all too common occurrence.

But you can't have it both ways. If you're going to strap on a world title belt, a fighters' deficiencies can't be casually dismissed or ignored simply because he's "inexperienced" or "hasn't developed."

No matter how few fights you have, if you're thrust on to the world title stage and you're talented enough to win one, then there's no reason to eschew comparisons to any champion who came before.

Usyk isn't a novice at all. Glowacki, Hunter, Mchunu, Huck, and Briedis is an absolute bombshell of a gauntlet. I don't think he's still developing. I think it's more that Usyk will look unstoppable once he enters the HW divison, and we'll mistake it for him being prime.

CW is just currently such a stacked division. I think a more fair comparison would be Holyfield vs. Usyk at HW. Usyk will look like Lomachenko when he enters the HW division and cleans it out.

[NateJR]

..

[Lackeos]

Holyfield would win this.

[IKSRTFO]

Holyfield would waste him. When in doubt, ask yourself how do you see Usyk vs Tyson, Bowe, Foreman, and Lewis. Yes, Holy lost a few of these but I don't see Usyk even lasting the distance with some of the guys Holyfield has been in the ring with.

[ClivePatrickLyons]

Terrible fight for Usyk Holy in 8 easy rounds.

[SenorPipino]

Holyfield was special.

- Yeah, special shortbus dumb and couldn't box a lick as he showed against Qawi and Bowe, Ruiz, Sherman Williams, well, maybe dumber the more apt description.

Keep the candles burning long enough, and maybe you sillys can come up with a stock journeyman cruiser he could beat.

Yeah, but you're a Holyfield hater from was waaaaaay back.

What's the matter? Did he once ignore your begging, whiney request for an autograph when you were just a wee lad still wetting your jammies?

[Heretic]

Why do people insist on placing a current fighter who is still developing in a fantasy March up with an atg????
This frustrates the crap out of me.
Let's let his career play out a bit before we get into atg discussions

But it's fair game under current standards.

You say that Usyk is still developing and that's true.

But once he wins a world title--an accomplishment supposedly representative of achieving boxing's pinnacle---then he's open for comparison.

It's unfortunate that in this era so many fighters are able to snag championship belts with practically nothing more than novice professional experience.

Usyk has just 14 pro fights and wins a world title in only his 10th bout.

In the not too long ago past, that was practically unheard of. Today it's an all too common occurrence.

But you can't have it both ways. If you're going to strap on a world title belt, a fighters' deficiencies can't be casually dismissed or ignored simply because he's "inexperienced" or "hasn't developed."

No matter how few fights you have, if you're thrust on to the world title stage and you're talented enough to win one, then there's no reason to eschew comparisons to any champion who came before.

Yes yes we all know that you need to beat the mandatory 15 taxi drivers before you can call yourself a true pro and start to aim for the title

Many of the eastern european boxers go pro later than many of the americans do. They are more experienced and can jump right in the top mix when they do go for the pro ranks. Nothing wrong with that

[littlepug]

Holyfield was a different animal to Usyk, a true professional fighter whereas Usyk has the look of a 12 round amateur boxer

[asdfjkl]

I'd say Holyfield, easely actually, even real heavyweights struggled with Holyfield

[jamamb]

yes, holyfield was an atg heavy, now imagine him at a weight where he was plenty big compared to his opponents. size was his biggest limitation with bowe and lewis around and he still beat bowe and hurt him plenty and fought very closely vs lewis in the rematch. and of course he pounded the crap out of tyson, who did not have a big size advantage like the other two did.

[SenorPipino]

I'd say Holyfield, easely actually, even real heavyweights struggled with Holyfield

Yes, some struggled.

And a few actually got their ass kicked.