Teddy Atlas: Canelo Might Beat 'Overrated' Golovkin Easy!

[Ruthless-RKO]

Veteran trainer and longtime ESPN expert analyst Teddy Atlas believe Mexican superstar Saul "Canelo' Alvarez (49-1-2, 34 KOs) is going to win the rematch with IBF, IBO, WBA, WBC middleweight champion Gennady Golovkin (37-0-1, 33 KOs).

Atlas felt Golovkin clearly won the first fight and was outraged by the draw.

"I thought Golovkin won that fight. I thought it was a joke [that it was scored a draw]. I'm not saying that everything Golovkin did was right. I don't think that you should be penalized because you didn't fight as good as people thought you should. If you win - you win, and that's all it should be," Atlas told SiriusXM Radio's At The Fights.

At the same time, Atlas does not like what he saw from Golovkin in that fight - and in several other recent contests.

"I think Golovkin is a guy who is starting to slip. I also think and I said it before it was popular to say, that he was an overrated guy. I said it a long time ago that he wasn't as great as people are putting him up to be. He beat a lot of junior middleweights, a lot of 35, 36, 37-year-old European junior middleweights where he was overmatching them. I didn't see him as that great [fighter everyone said he was], but I thought he won this fight and won it clearly," Atlas said.

As far as the rematch, Atlas is not only picking Canelo to win, but he won't be surprised if the Mexican boxer makes it look easy.

"I'll tell you, in a rematch I'm going to go the other way and pick Canelo - because Golovkin is slipping, there is no doubt about it. And Canelo has more upside, he's the younger guy, he's gained confidence from the first fight. He wasn't sure if he could handle the size and the strength, so now he's sure that he can and he's going to be more consistent from an offensive standpoint and I think he will win the fight this time and I think he might win the fight easy," Atlas said.

http://www.BS.com/teddy-atlas- ... sy--124964

[Ruthless-RKO]

One thing I don't understand about Atlas. He has never rated GGG and always been the only ESPN guy to not include him in hi own top 10 P4P list. That's his own opinion..

Now he still calls GGG overrated EVEN THOUGH he had GGG winning the fight. I heard someone say he had it 10-2 to GGG... So what does even make Canelo? The fact that he couldn't beat an 'overrated' GGG.

You can only beat what's infront of you and whoever fights you. His resume of defences isn't that bad, can't be if Saunders' last 3 defences will be former GGG victims (Monroe, Lemieux & Murray)..

After every fight, he's always called for other MW champions, when it was Martinez, Cotto, Chavez Jr. etc. I don't know about if any negotiations where ever carried out. But other fighters chased the 'other' fights where they would potentially make more money.

[jamamb]

of course he will

[Enlightened-One]

Even if you don't agree with Teddy Atlas' words, he's technically correct about his claim in regards to Golovkin having faced an awful lot of smaller guys (i.e. former welterweights and light middleweights), such as the likes of: Willie Monroe Jr., Marco Antonio Rubio, Osumanu Adama, Kell Brook, Matthew Macklin, Nobuhiro Ishida, Kassim Ouma etc.

[Deleted_Scenes]

Even if you don't agree with Teddy Atlas' words, he's technically correct about his claim in regards to Golovkin having faced an awful lot of smaller guys (i.e. former welterweights and light middleweights), such as the likes of: Willie Monroe Jr., Marco Antonio Rubio, Osumanu Adama, Kell Brook, Matthew Macklin, Nobuhiro Ishida, Kassim Ouma etc.

Fair enough on Brook and Ouma, but not sure about the others. Ouma was also too early on to be relevant, and Brook was just a replacement after Eubank Jr lost his pen - the only other option was not fight.

Monroe, Adama, Rubio, Macklin and Ishida aren't smaller though. Just because a couple of them could make 154 a decade earlier when they were younger and before they filled out properly, or boiled down heavily just as a one-off (Macklin), doesn't make them any less natural middleweights at the time they fought Golovkin.

Monroe - only weighed in under 154 once in his entire career, and a full size middleweight at least 5 years before facing Golovkin.
Adama - Pretty regularly fights at 168, sometimes 175. He was the bigger man against Golovkin.
Rubio - Nothing below 160 for nearly a decade. He did fight a few fights at or above 168 though.
Macklin - Fought a few fights at JMW in his teens/early 20s, but apart from one exception since, he's a career middleweight.
Ishida - On weight, he's a maybe. Jumped up and down between 154 and 160, but it's worth noting he had a decent height and reach advantage. He was boiling down to make 154. One year later, he was fighting as a heavyweight.

You can look at any fighter's record and say 'this guy came up from a lower weight', but it's irrelevant if it's years before. Their natural fighting weight at the time of the fight is what matters. Only Brook and Rosado were genuinely coming up in weight. Far more of Golovkin's opponents have either regularly struggled to make 160, or regularly fought at 168 either before or immediately after fighting Golovkin (Jacobs, Murray, Wade, Stevens, Lemieux - plus Adama and Rubio, who apparently were smaller...).

Anyway, Atlas is an idiot. The fighter he's now claiming looked like crap in the first fight, won 10 rounds on his OWN scorecard, and was apparently the victim of the biggest robbery in boxing ever...

[Ruthless-RKO]

Anyway, Atlas is an idiot. The fighter he's now claiming looked like crap in the first fight, won 10 rounds on his OWN scorecard, and was apparently the victim of the biggest robbery in boxing ever...

That is what I made of it. He has one of the biggest b**ch fits ever! Like the Horn/Pac one.
Like I mentioned. If an 'overrated' boxer wins on his scorecard wide against Canelo of all boxers, How can he be overrated? Also what does that make Canelo?

[Enlightened-One]

Even if you don't agree with Teddy Atlas' words, he's technically correct about his claim in regards to Golovkin having faced an awful lot of smaller guys (i.e. former welterweights and light middleweights), such as the likes of: Willie Monroe Jr., Marco Antonio Rubio, Osumanu Adama, Kell Brook, Matthew Macklin, Nobuhiro Ishida, Kassim Ouma etc.

Fair enough on Brook and Ouma, but not sure about the others. Ouma was also too early on to be relevant, and Brook was just a replacement after Eubank Jr lost his pen - the only other option was not fight.

Monroe, Adama, Rubio, Macklin and Ishida aren't smaller though. Just because a couple of them could make 154 a decade earlier when they were younger and before they filled out properly, or boiled down heavily just as a one-off (Macklin), doesn't make them any less natural middleweights at the time they fought Golovkin.

Monroe - only weighed in under 154 once in his entire career, and a full size middleweight at least 5 years before facing Golovkin.
Adama - Pretty regularly fights at 168, sometimes 175. He was the bigger man against Golovkin.
Rubio - Nothing below 160 for nearly a decade. He did fight a few fights at or above 168 though.
Macklin - Fought a few fights at JMW in his teens/early 20s, but apart from one exception since, he's a career middleweight.
Ishida - On weight, he's a maybe. Jumped up and down between 154 and 160, but it's worth noting he had a decent height and reach advantage. He was boiling down to make 154. One year later, he was fighting as a heavyweight.

You can look at any fighter's record and say 'this guy came up from a lower weight', but it's irrelevant if it's years before. Their natural fighting weight at the time of the fight is what matters. Only Brook and Rosado were genuinely coming up in weight. Far more of Golovkin's opponents have either regularly struggled to make 160, or regularly fought at 168 either before or immediately after fighting Golovkin (Jacobs, Murray, Wade, Stevens, Lemieux - plus Adama and Rubio, who apparently were smaller...).

Anyway, Atlas is an idiot. The fighter he's now claiming looked like crap in the first fight, won 10 rounds on his OWN scorecard, and was apparently the victim of the biggest robbery in boxing ever...

As I said before, Teddy Atlas is “technically” correct about Golovkin having faced a lot of opponents that previously campaigned in the professional ranks as welterweights or light middleweights, whereas GGG has been 165lbs as an amateur and 160lbs as a pro for the last sixteen years.

I don’t entirely disagree with some of the points you’ve made, but Atlas’ comment is factually-accurate, even if you don't want it to be.

[Deleted_Scenes]

Anyway, Atlas is an idiot. The fighter he's now claiming looked like crap in the first fight, won 10 rounds on his OWN scorecard, and was apparently the victim of the biggest robbery in boxing ever...

That is what I made of it. He has one of the biggest b**ch fits ever! Like the Horn/Pac one.
Like I mentioned. If an 'overrated' boxer wins on his scorecard wide against Canelo of all boxers, How can he be overrated? Also what does that make Canelo?

Exactly. According to him, Canelo lost a near shutout to a faded fighter who was never that good to begin with. I don't think he listens to himself speak sometimes.

As I said before, Teddy Atlas is “technically” correct about Golovkin having faced a lot of opponents that previously campaigned in the professional ranks as welterweights or light middleweights, whereas GGG has been 165lbs as an amateur and 160lbs as a pro for the last sixteen years.

I don’t entirely disagree with some of the points you’ve made, but Atlas’ comment is factually-accurate, even if you don't want it to be.

That's not what Atlas said though...

"He beat a lot of junior middleweights, a lot of 35, 36, 37-year-old European junior middleweights"

That's his quote. He never mentioned weights they previously campaigned at years earlier. According to that, he's saying they were JMWs right then, when Golovkin fought them.

You can't twist it and just say he meant at some point years ago or whenever, because that's not what he said. And, as stated, Golovkin (since first appearing on HBO) has fought more opponents who outweighed him than opponents coming up from below.

That's fact. Only Brook and Rosado were from below 160. Rosado isn't even European, and neither were 35+ when they fought Golovkin.

Factually, that quote is utter garbage.

What you're twisting it into and making it out to mean, yes that might be correct. A handful of GGG opponents did fight at 154 many years beforehand. So what? As I said, every fighter's record is littered with the same. And those who did fight at 154 early in their careers, without checking, I'm not sure any of them were European and over 35... so Atlas is still wrong...

[Stuarty]

GGG has lost a step and I wouldn't be surprised if Canelo won the rematch but it won't be easy. If it's so overrated then why did GGG win the first contest? Forget the snidey scorecards, GGG won that fight. I'd like GGG to target the body more in the rematch and slow Canelo down. I'll be rooting for Golovkin but it's a toss up IMO.

[Stuarty]

Canelo and Golden boy bided their time well where Golovkin is concerned.

[Ruthless-RKO]

GGG has lost a step and I wouldn't be surprised if Canelo won the rematch but it won't be easy. If it's so overrated then why did GGG win the first contest? Forget the snidey scorecards, GGG won that fight. I'd like GGG to target the body more in the rematch and slow Canelo down. I'll be rooting for Golovkin but it's a toss up IMO.

He was unable to target much at the body in the first fight because of Canelo's movement. Also, had he missed shots to the body, you're leaving yourself open to a terrific counter puncher.

I'd like GGG to win AGAIN.. but I'm not really looking forward to it. Last fight left a bad taste, and it's still there.

[Stuarty]

GGG has lost a step and I wouldn't be surprised if Canelo won the rematch but it won't be easy. If it's so overrated then why did GGG win the first contest? Forget the snidey scorecards, GGG won that fight. I'd like GGG to target the body more in the rematch and slow Canelo down. I'll be rooting for Golovkin but it's a toss up IMO.

He was unable to target much at the body in the first fight because of Canelo's movement. Also, had he missed shots to the body, you're leaving yourself open to a terrific counter puncher.

I'd like GGG to win AGAIN.. but I'm not really looking forward to it. Last fight left a bad taste, and it's still there.

Yeah GGG was definitely more apprehensive than usual because of what was coming back. He usually cuts the ring off well to land his body shots. I just hope it's fair scoring this time round. If that fuckin silly daft bitch bird is anywhere near the fight I won't be watching! It's a disgrace she's even still in the sport.

[Ruthless-RKO]

He was unable to target much at the body in the first fight because of Canelo's movement. Also, had he missed shots to the body, you're leaving yourself open to a terrific counter puncher.

I'd like GGG to win AGAIN.. but I'm not really looking forward to it. Last fight left a bad taste, and it's still there.

Yeah GGG was definitely more apprehensive than usual because of what was coming back. He usually cuts the ring off well to land his body shots. I just hope it's fair scoring this time round. If that fuckin silly daft bitch bird is anywhere near the fight I won't be watching! It's a disgrace she's even still in the sport.

To be fair, he did cut the ring off well. Not throughout the fight, but majority of it. He was never on the backfoot for more than 30 seconds in a round either.

[SenorPipino]

One thing I don't understand about Atlas. He has never rated GGG and always been the only ESPN guy to not include him in hi own top 10 P4P list. That's his own opinion..

Now he still calls GGG overrated EVEN THOUGH he had GGG winning the fight. I heard someone say he had it 10-2 to GGG... So what does even make Canelo? The fact that he couldn't beat an 'overrated' GGG.

You can only beat what's infront of you and whoever fights you. His resume of defences isn't that bad, can't be if Saunders' last 3 defences will be former GGG victims (Monroe, Lemieux & Murray)..

After every fight, he's always called for other MW champions, when it was Martinez, Cotto, Chavez Jr. etc. I don't know about if any negotiations where ever carried out. But other fighters chased the 'other' fights where they would potentially make more money.

When Atlas describes Golovkin as overrated, he's not just talking about it being on a contemporary level.

He's also talking historically.

Sure, Atlas has never been impressed with Golovkin's portfolio. Until he fought the undersized Brook, Golovkin ran over a fairly dismal crop of middleweights.

Brook had the skill but not the size or strength to beat Golovkin. Nevertheless, he had little problem connecting on the champion.

If Brook was a natural 160 pounder, the fight very well may have gone in a different direction.

Jacobs was the first true quality middleweight Golovkin faced. Not surprisingly he snapped Golovkin's lengthy KO streak and nearly his unbeaten record.

Quality was starting to catch up with Golovkin. Not age as so many Golovkin apologists maintain.

And with Canelo, Golovkin again had to face another quality fighter, who damn near outpointed him.

On my card he did. But I'm accustomed to judges and fans who are enamored with the guy who comes forward and conveniently overlook who's landing the more solid, effective punches.

Even if Atlas somehow scored that fight for Golovkin (and a sharp boxing mind like Atlas should know better) he understands that Golovkin is not the P4P wunderkind that some believe.

He's simply a tough, rugged, solid, but unimaginative fighter who has benefited from a string of weak opposition.

Put him in with top shelf boxers and suddenly he struggles. Suddenly he's exposed.

Therefore, Golovkin is only a fringe P4P contender. Not the top guy that so many have been fooled into believing based on his limited opponents.

Atlas also has said that he views Golovkin overrated in historical terms.

Before Golovkin started having his string of tough bouts, fans were quick to compare him with ATG middleweight.

Hagler, Monzon, Greb, Zale and Cerdan were all fair game in the discussion.

It was also fueled by Abel Sanchez' ludicrous claim that Golovkin was the 3rd best middleweight of all time.

Not a big deal really. Trainers are allowed to spread the BS about their own fighters. They don't have to believe it. They just want the public to.

But Atlas simply didn't buy into it and has always argued that Golovkin doesn't rank as an ATG.

That's Teddy's take as to why Golovkin is overrated.

He feels he could never hang with history's best and that his record and monster aura has been primarily built on the back of ordinary fighters.

So it's not surprising that Atlas expects the multi dimensional and rapidly improving Canelo to hand Golovkin his head on Cinco de Mayo night.

[gilgamesh]

He might beat him. He ain't gonna beat him easy.

[SenorPipino]

Abel Sanchez has been apprised of Atlas' comments and has fired back.

"Atlas is the one who is overrated. Always has been." Sanchez growled.


As a retort, it wasn't much. Plenty guys here at BR could come up with some much better below the belt insults, as they often do on a daily basis.

[greg]

"I think Golovkin is a guy who is starting to slip ..."

..kinda difficult to follow this logic..According to Teddy, GGG "is starting to slip" ...can edging on points against a bigger, a lot heavier and younger Jacobs on his home turf be considered "slipping"?...by the same token, can the win (according to Atlas) against the top p4p boxer be construed as "slipping"? I doubt it...

[Thomastearns]

Difficult to see why GGG gets so much criticism for being overrated. Real boxing fans can see this man is a gift to our sport.

His style is as action packed and entertaining as any middleweight since Tommy Hearns.

He's one of the politest champions since the great Floyd Patterson.

He's achieved everything the hard way on the road, taking not calling the shots.

He still gets as much respect from his fellow professionals as any boxer alive.

His record is as good as anyone fighting today and yet..there are still those who sneer.

I think on this occasion Teddy's is just trying to stir things up a little. He gives his reasons and they are credible, but like the rest of us he will have to wait another 8 weeks or so.

In the meantime he knows he needs to stay relevant. In today's corporate media world guys like Teddy Atlas are no longer seen as rough diamonds but more like dinosaurs, relics from a less polished time.

He was unequivocal in his contempt for the scoring in the first fight. Convinced like many that Canelo lost that one by a wide margin.

This time he expects to see a big improvement from Alvarez. We shall all see soon enough where the big improvement will come from.

[ElJefe]

The actual quotes re: Golvokin slipping and how Canelo might approach the rematch are perfectly valid statements. As is the opinion that just because you were less dominant than some people expected, you shouldn't be penalised on the cards. But he's OTT with his criticisms of Golovkin's resume IMO. The only middleweights that he hasn't fought since he became champion are the ones who clearly had no interest in fighting him.

Sometimes I think when there's a lot of hype around someone, Atlas can go too far the other way. It's fair enough to say "I need to see Golovkin tested before I can put him up there with other great middleweights." But Atlas tends to go too far and say "AHHH THIS GUY IS OVERRATED! WHO HAS HE FOUGHT!? TELL ME! WHOOO!? TELL MEEE!"

[IKSRTFO]

GGG is overrated and left off of his list because he thinks GGG hasn't fought anyone important, yet he has Errol Spence as number 10. GGG's resume is much better than Spence is currently.

[jamamb]

get ggg on espn and teddy would rate him top 3. i rate errol p4p too although i think teddy had him there even before he beat brook so ya a bit of a double standard admittedly (i do think spence is better although hes got to prove himself more)

[diddy]

He thinks GGG won clearly but loses the rematch because he’s slipping? This makes zero sense. If he’s slipping why would he beat Canelo, as he said, clearly? This guy is losing his mind.

Canelo is the overrated one. He’s lost 2, maybe 3 fights that weren’t considered losses. He’s the most pandered to boxer I can ever recall in my life. Good fighter. Not great. Just good.

[pound per pound]

Even if you don't agree with Teddy Atlas' words, he's technically correct about his claim in regards to Golovkin having faced an awful lot of smaller guys (i.e. former welterweights and light middleweights), such as the likes of: Willie Monroe Jr., Marco Antonio Rubio, Osumanu Adama, Kell Brook, Matthew Macklin, Nobuhiro Ishida, Kassim Ouma etc.

Didn't they boot this loud mouth from ESPN? Atlas is good for two things. Acting like a jerk, and offering the gamblers the best possible bet by picking the other guy.

Sure Golovkin fought some guys moving up, didn't Hagler and Monzon do the same? The difference is welter, or jr middles like Mayweather, Cotto, or Khan did not want to share the same ring with Golovkin, and for a good reason. He'd destroy them. Martinez, I believe did not want to fight Golovkin either.

Golovkin is approaching 36 years ( April 2018 ). Former greats like Hagler and Monzon retired at age 34. Not surprisingly Golovkin has slowed down a bit, but he should have been given the decision in the first fight with Canelo.

As it stands now, he's going to be 36 years old when the re-match happens vs. a prime version of Canelo, fighting him in Las Vegas with judges the promoters pick and performing in front of a large Latino crowd on Cinco de Mayo.

So Atlas, this time may be right, just don't bet on it with his track record.

I find his coward like " overrated " comment as phony as he never said that while Golovkin was in his prime. But now that he will be 36, Atlas says, Canelo Might beat " the Overrated " Golovkin easy.

[SenorPipino]

Several years ago, when Golovkin was still in his supposed prime, Atlas said that Golovkin doesn't deserve the hype because he hasn't exactly faced a murderers row of middleweights.

So he remains consistent in his critique of Golovkin.

But I don't agree that he's slipping because of age, as so many argue as some sort of defense.

His sudden string of less than overwhelming performances is simply due to the rise in the quality of opponents.

If he returns to fighting the Mothers of Mercy, I'm certain that Golovkin will mysteriously appear to be an ATG again.

[boxing_rocks]

Yes, Jacobs and Canelo were better than anybody Golovkin faced before, but he also accumulated wear and tear which affected his performances.