Will you root for Wilder or for Ortiz ?

[jamesmcdonnell]

Personally, there are only two relevant factors : boxing style and personality.
I don't care for nationality, ethnicity, race or religion.
For example : I like Spence, but I don't like Broner,etc...etc....

I agree.

I'm not quite sure why, but I find Wilder immensely irritating, I also find his actual face annoying.

Even so, I've nothing against him personally, and I don't have a reason to root for Ortiz, so I won't be rooting for anybody really.

[siablo14]

I'm going with Wilder here. Should be a good fight though. It will be interesting to see if Wilder can get Ortiz put of there early or not. There is a good chance Ortiz might last the distance, unless he gasses out.

The guy to watch for in the next 1.5 years is "Triple D", "Dangerous" Daniel Dubois!

If Wilder fears him, he will use his jab and reach like he did in the first Stiverne fight.

[siablo14]

TBH I genuinly don't like Wilder and knowing Wilder, he already knows something that makes sure this fight will never actually happen. Somehow, despite I'd really like to see Wilder losing, I would have prefered to see it against other guys, who actually still have a future in this sport, like Miller, Kownacki, Breazeale, Junlong Zhang, Rivas, Dinu, Ugonoh, Hrgovic, Gashi, Tony Yoka, Dubois.
At this moment, I don't really care, Ortiz doesn't have a future, so he will lose his next fight against anyone reasonable anyway.

Because of this, may the best men win. And if the fight actually happens, I just hope it will have a fair endresult, not a moment like what happened between AJ and Takam, because Takam clearly wasn't ended at the moment the fight stopped.

Breazeale doesn't have a future in top boxing. He will just be a gatekeeper.

[siablo14]

I voted "May the best man win" but I guess I hope that best man turns out to be Wilder.

Despite his drug history, I really like Ortiz. What I like most about him is his absolute belief in his own ability. Nothing illustrates this better than him risking his guaranteed mega retirement payout against Joshua by walking away from his WBA mandatory status in order to fight Wilder. He must have been so sure of beating Wilder and going on to fight AJ in a unification. There is no other explanation. That belief is about to be put to the test.

The trouble is Ortiz won't be around by 2020 so he isn't exactly the future of the heavyweight division. If Ortiz does expose Deontay's technical shortcomings and knocks him out, which is hardly a stretch of the imagination, then this will consign the most hotly anticipated showdown in the division, if not the whole of boxing., to the scrap-heap.

That will be like the massive finale that "The Wire" was moving toward, being scuppered by the kid shooting Omar. For those who don't know what I'm blathering about, I mean it'll be an enormous anti-climax.

Of course Parker could upset the apple-cart too.

I hear you man but The Wire had to keep it realistic and humble Omar. Omar was almost becoming super-human.

[caldo2025]

I personally think that Ortiz is going to sleep in this one and then cover your eyes and ears for the next year because Wilder is just going to be unbearable. We've seen how Wilder gets after knocking out taxi drivers. Imagine a KO over a quality boxer? Annoying. But I sure would like to see Ortiz win this one and bring Wilder down a peg. A Wilder loss would be the best thing to happen to the division and probably his career. Then we'd probably see more risk inside the division with matchups.

[asdfjkl]

TBH I genuinly don't like Wilder and knowing Wilder, he already knows something that makes sure this fight will never actually happen. Somehow, despite I'd really like to see Wilder losing, I would have prefered to see it against other guys, who actually still have a future in this sport, like Miller, Kownacki, Breazeale, Junlong Zhang, Rivas, Dinu, Ugonoh, Hrgovic, Gashi, Tony Yoka, Dubois.
At this moment, I don't really care, Ortiz doesn't have a future, so he will lose his next fight against anyone reasonable anyway.

Because of this, may the best men win. And if the fight actually happens, I just hope it will have a fair endresult, not a moment like what happened between AJ and Takam, because Takam clearly wasn't ended at the moment the fight stopped.

Breazeale doesn't have a future in top boxing. He will just be a gatekeeper.

He's still far better as anyone Wilder ever fought

[Tony1244]

and in another thread you were all high and mighty and looking down on people for being nationally biased in who they cheer for

funny because in that same thread you basically said that youre biased against euro fighters and generally hope for them to lose

Do you remember the exact quote? I'm not saying its impossible that I was hypocritical, as I believe all humans are hypocrites sometimes.

cs: Well said Tony. On the basis that a thief is a thief even if he/she spends little time doing it, I always say 'we are all of us hypocrites and the biggest ones are those who would deny it'.

I don't think there is anything wrong with rooting for nationality. Rooting for color is a bit uglier to me, but people still have every right to do it.

cs: During the seventies I was conscious that boxing and my favourite division was dominated by black guys. I would tend to favour the white fighters if only to show that we could fight too. Since the entry of Eastern Europe into pro boxing balance has been largely restored and now I can truthfully say that the colour of a man's skin is simply irrelevant to me. The idea of rooting based on skin colour strikes me as distasteful but perhaps, given what I said about the seventies, that bears out what we said about hypocrisy.

What I was trying to say was that knowing many Eastern European fans root for their own against an American makes it a bit more fun to root for the American. I don't think there anything wrong with that. I saw Wilder-Spilkva live in Brooklyn and almost everyone had a good time, I guess except for Spilkva at the end.

cs: Aint that the truth! (Szpilka at the end)

I guess it also helped the ending was not controversial and Kownacki had won his match earlier in the night.

[siablo14]

TBH I genuinly don't like Wilder and knowing Wilder, he already knows something that makes sure this fight will never actually happen. Somehow, despite I'd really like to see Wilder losing, I would have prefered to see it against other guys, who actually still have a future in this sport, like Miller, Kownacki, Breazeale, Junlong Zhang, Rivas, Dinu, Ugonoh, Hrgovic, Gashi, Tony Yoka, Dubois.
At this moment, I don't really care, Ortiz doesn't have a future, so he will lose his next fight against anyone reasonable anyway.

Because of this, may the best men win. And if the fight actually happens, I just hope it will have a fair endresult, not a moment like what happened between AJ and Takam, because Takam clearly wasn't ended at the moment the fight stopped.

Breazeale doesn't have a future in top boxing. He will just be a gatekeeper.

He's still far better as anyone Wilder ever fought

He is probably on the same level as Stiverne.

[SenorPipino]

Wilder, emphatically.

One of the most exciting in-ring performers in boxing.

A definite one-punch KO threat.

And an entertaining and marketable personality.

Pretty much the total package.

And how can you not root for a champion who was gracious enough to give the dangerous Cuban a second chance after screwing up?

Wilder opened a -180 favorite. The odds have been steadily climbing.

The latest odds have the Bronze Bomber a solid -320 choice.

A lot of Wilder believers out there.

[asdfjkl]

Breazeale doesn't have a future in top boxing. He will just be a gatekeeper.

He's still far better as anyone Wilder ever fought

He is probably on the same level as Stiverne.

Lol, there are well over a 100 boxers who would beat Stiverne, including Breazeale and I already predicted this long before the Wilder fight. Even most of the top 100 cruiserweight would beat him easely. He would be a great opponent for Andre Ward for example, Andre can't lose that one and the Americans are dumb enough to think it's any kind of special.

[siablo14]

He's still far better as anyone Wilder ever fought

He is probably on the same level as Stiverne.

Lol, there are well over a 100 boxers who would beat Stiverne, including Breazeale and I already predicted this long before the Wilder fight. Even most of the top 100 cruiserweight would beat him easely. He would be a great opponent for Andre Ward for example, Andre can't lose that one and the Americans are dumb enough to think it's any kind of special.

Americans? Where are you from?
Stiverne was a solid opponent in is first fight with Wilder. He was better than Charles Martin.

[asdfjkl]

He is probably on the same level as Stiverne.

Lol, there are well over a 100 boxers who would beat Stiverne, including Breazeale and I already predicted this long before the Wilder fight. Even most of the top 100 cruiserweight would beat him easely. He would be a great opponent for Andre Ward for example, Andre can't lose that one and the Americans are dumb enough to think it's any kind of special.

Americans? Where are you from?
Stiverne was a solid opponent in is first fight with Wilder. He was better than Charles Martin.

No he wasn't lol, he has never really been a solid opponent, Wilder just improved a tiny bit ever since. Come on, Wilder even struggled with Duhaupas! Who's most likely still his best opponent ever.

[gilgamesh]

Lol, there are well over a 100 boxers who would beat Stiverne, including Breazeale and I already predicted this long before the Wilder fight. Even most of the top 100 cruiserweight would beat him easely. He would be a great opponent for Andre Ward for example, Andre can't lose that one and the Americans are dumb enough to think it's any kind of special.

Americans? Where are you from?
Stiverne was a solid opponent in is first fight with Wilder. He was better than Charles Martin.

No he wasn't lol, he has never really been a solid opponent, Wilder just improved a tiny bit ever since. Come on, Wilder even struggled with Duhaupas! Who's most likely still his best opponent ever.

Yeah it's either Duhaupas or Stiverne (the first time he fought Stiverne not the totally unprepared schlub that stepped in the ring with Wilder for the rematch)

[asdfjkl]

Americans? Where are you from?
Stiverne was a solid opponent in is first fight with Wilder. He was better than Charles Martin.

No he wasn't lol, he has never really been a solid opponent, Wilder just improved a tiny bit ever since. Come on, Wilder even struggled with Duhaupas! Who's most likely still his best opponent ever.

Yeah it's either Duhaupas or Stiverne (the first time he fought Stiverne not the totally unprepared schlub that stepped in the ring with Wilder for the rematch)

The Stiverne who lost against Demetrice King and was actually losing against Ray Austin? Hahahahaha

[gilgamesh]

No he wasn't lol, he has never really been a solid opponent, Wilder just improved a tiny bit ever since. Come on, Wilder even struggled with Duhaupas! Who's most likely still his best opponent ever.

Yeah it's either Duhaupas or Stiverne (the first time he fought Stiverne not the totally unprepared schlub that stepped in the ring with Wilder for the rematch)

The Stiverne who lost against Demetrice King and was actually losing against Ray Austin? Hahahahaha

And had beaten Chris Arreola twice and was the defending WBC Champion at the time...if you're gonna say it, say it all.

Stiverne sucks. I know that. If you're trying to prove to me that Wilder sucks....you're preaching to the Choir. I f*cking hate Wilder and consider him an absolute coward...but even so he'd smash Briggs with ease. So would Stiverne. Briggs is a shot old man. Get that through your head.

[asdfjkl]

Yeah it's either Duhaupas or Stiverne (the first time he fought Stiverne not the totally unprepared schlub that stepped in the ring with Wilder for the rematch)

The Stiverne who lost against Demetrice King and was actually losing against Ray Austin? Hahahahaha

And had beaten Chris Arreola twice and was the defending WBC Champion at the time...if you're gonna say it, say it all.

Stiverne sucks. I know that. If you're trying to prove to me that Wilder sucks....you're preaching to the Choir. I f*cking hate Wilder and consider him an absolute coward...but even so he'd smash Briggs with ease. So would Stiverne. Briggs is a shot old man. Get that through your head.

Oh come on, junky lightweight Arreola is even worse! Despite he send Wilder to hospital and out of the ring for a month or 7 and even needed a tune up fight against another bum after that!

[gilgamesh]

The entire Heavyweight division sucks in case you hadn't noticed.

Outside of the Top 3 or 4 guys they all suck. Most wouldn't even crack the Top 20 in better eras of the sport.

[siablo14]

Lol, there are well over a 100 boxers who would beat Stiverne, including Breazeale and I already predicted this long before the Wilder fight. Even most of the top 100 cruiserweight would beat him easely. He would be a great opponent for Andre Ward for example, Andre can't lose that one and the Americans are dumb enough to think it's any kind of special.

Americans? Where are you from?
Stiverne was a solid opponent in is first fight with Wilder. He was better than Charles Martin.

No he wasn't lol, he has never really been a solid opponent, Wilder just improved a tiny bit ever since. Come on, Wilder even struggled with Duhaupas! Who's most likely still his best opponent ever.

I am not sold on Wilder. I am not a fan. I like technical fighters but Stiverne was a decent opponent in the first fight.

[gilgamesh]

Nor should you be sold on Wilder. He hasn't defended his title in 3 years against a single Top 10 ranked opponent. He's an absolute joke of a so called "Champion"

Big puncher, but the fact that he's been kept away from credible contenders as if they're the plague shows that the people that manage his career don't think much of him either.

He's only fighting Ortiz now because Ortiz has looked like sh*t for the last few years.

[ValMar]

The entire Heavyweight division sucks in case you hadn't noticed.

Outside of the Top 3 or 4 guys they all suck. Most wouldn't even crack the Top 20 in better eras of the sport.

I can not agree, I think there are 7 fighters on the top level : Joshua, Wilder, Parker, Ortiz, Povetkin, Haye (fit) and Fury (fit).
A- level : Whyte, Pulev, Miller, perhaps Breazeale.
Tomorrow, we will have Usyk and Gassiev, and Dubois and Hrgović are coming, perhaps Joyce, too......

[siablo14]

No he wasn't lol, he has never really been a solid opponent, Wilder just improved a tiny bit ever since. Come on, Wilder even struggled with Duhaupas! Who's most likely still his best opponent ever.

Yeah it's either Duhaupas or Stiverne (the first time he fought Stiverne not the totally unprepared schlub that stepped in the ring with Wilder for the rematch)

The Stiverne who lost against Demetrice King and was actually losing against Ray Austin? Hahahahaha

Ray had the reach and height advantage and used it until he was KO. That's the same strategy Wilder use to win the first fight.

[asdfjkl]

Yeah it's either Duhaupas or Stiverne (the first time he fought Stiverne not the totally unprepared schlub that stepped in the ring with Wilder for the rematch)

The Stiverne who lost against Demetrice King and was actually losing against Ray Austin? Hahahahaha

Ray had the reach and height advantage and used it until he was KO. That's the same strategy Wilder use to win the first fight.

Have you seen the "KO"? Ray was standing still with his hands up to the referee

[gilgamesh]

The entire Heavyweight division sucks in case you hadn't noticed.

Outside of the Top 3 or 4 guys they all suck. Most wouldn't even crack the Top 20 in better eras of the sport.

I can not agree, I think there are 7 fighters on the top level : Joshua, Wilder, Parker, Ortiz, Povetkin, Haye (fit) and Fury (fit).
A- level : Whyte, Pulev, Miller, perhaps Breazeale.
Tomorrow, we will have Usyk and Gassiev, and Dubois and Hrgović are coming, perhaps Joyce, too......

Povetkin is just about finished, and looked pretty mediocre of late, but he definitely has one of the better resumes of any current active Heavyweight. So I consider him to be among the Top names at the moment.

Parker's time as pretending to be one of the "Top guys" ends when Joshua smashes him in one sided fashion, from that one point on he gets knocked down there with the Breazeale's and the Whyte's, and stays there because that's all he ever really was in the first place.

Haye's just too injury prone to ever be taken seriously as a meaningful contender again. He's finished.

Ortiz is still a credible contender now and one of the Top guys. I hope he does well against Wilder and remains a credible contender, but I kinda expect Wilder to just kinda kick his ass at this point to be honest. Just a gut feeling. We'll see how it goes.

Fury (fit)... If you don't take Boxing seriously it don't take you seriously, and he's gonna find that out the next time he's in there with a dangerous opponent.

Joshua is THE Top guy in the division at the moment until someone can prove otherwise.

[ValMar]

The entire Heavyweight division sucks in case you hadn't noticed.

Outside of the Top 3 or 4 guys they all suck. Most wouldn't even crack the Top 20 in better eras of the sport.

I can not agree, I think there are 7 fighters on the top level : Joshua, Wilder, Parker, Ortiz, Povetkin, Haye (fit) and Fury (fit).
A- level : Whyte, Pulev, Miller, perhaps Breazeale.
Tomorrow, we will have Usyk and Gassiev, and Dubois and Hrgović are coming, perhaps Joyce, too......

Povetkin is just about finished, and looked pretty mediocre of late, but he definitely has one of the better resumes of any current active Heavyweight. So I consider him to be among the Top names at the moment.

Parker's time as pretending to be one of the "Top guys" ends when Joshua smashes him in one sided fashion, from that one point on he gets knocked down there with the Breazeale's and the Whyte's, and stays there because that's all he ever really was in the first place.

Haye's just too injury prone to ever be taken seriously as a meaningful contender again. He's finished.

Ortiz is still a credible contender now and one of the Top guys. I hope he does well against Wilder and remains a credible contender, but I kinda expect Wilder to just kinda kick his ass at this point to be honest. Just a gut feeling. We'll see how it goes.

Fury (fit)... If you don't take Boxing seriously it don't take you seriously, and he's gonna find that out the next time he's in there with a dangerous opponent.

Joshua is THE Top guy in the division at the moment until someone can prove otherwise.

Joshua is No. 1, of course, and I would like to see him facing devoted and fit Fury.

[siablo14]

The Stiverne who lost against Demetrice King and was actually losing against Ray Austin? Hahahahaha

Ray had the reach and height advantage and used it until he was KO. That's the same strategy Wilder use to win the first fight.

Have you seen the "KO"? Ray was standing still with his hands up to the referee

I can't remember it but it looked within the rules. What's your take on it?