Your scorecards for Ali V Norton III

thunderfromdownunder · Post by **thunderfromdownunder** » 15 Apr 2006, 23:32

If anybody has this fight watch it and post your scorecard, could make for good debating.
i put my tape on last night and after 15 rounds i had it
8 rounds Norton
6 rounds Ali
1 Even
or 144 - 142

thunderfromdownunder · Post by **thunderfromdownunder** » 16 Apr 2006, 01:01

i agree Ali won the second fight, by two or three rounds on my card.
but i think Kenny got screwed the third time round

HomicideHenry · Post by **HomicideHenry** » 16 Apr 2006, 01:06

I think Norton was screwed in his third match with Ali.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 16 Apr 2006, 08:40

It was a very close fight, but Ali won in my opinion. Tough style for Ali to work with. If Norton hadn't have broken Ali's jaw in the first fight, Norton would be given little notice in the history books. That one moment made his career. I think Ali would have won the first fight in a close one and we would have never been treated to this trilogy. Ali would have been crazy to come back for more of that. But he was forced to and we all got a great extended lesson in "style befuddlement".

THE DANCING MASTER · Post by **THE DANCING MASTER** » 17 Apr 2006, 18:53

I had it 8-6-1 for Ali.

Ezzard · Post by **Ezzard** » 18 Apr 2006, 08:50

Norton won the third fight. I've only seen the second fight once and thought Ali had the edge but I'd like to see it again.

Norton was done a great disservice in the 3rd fight by the judges and maybe it would have hastened Ali's exit from the sport...

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 19 Apr 2006, 13:30

Norton won his rounds big; Ali sneaked his, but sneak them he did. I had Ali ahead 8-7 in rounds.
Under the 10 point must, I would probably have favoured Norton. There was one round in particular, when Norton nearly crippled Ali with a body shot, I would have scored 10-8.

SteveO · Post by **SteveO** » 19 Apr 2006, 15:35

I watched it again and I agree it was a very close contest but Ali was an 8-6-1 winner in my book.

Les Darcy · Post by **Les Darcy** » 19 Apr 2006, 22:44

i havent scored fight 3 in a while but i think i have norton up 9-6 i watched the rematch the other day and had ali up 7-5

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 14 May 2006, 19:01

dempseyfire · Post by **dempseyfire** » 14 May 2006, 19:54

The fight wasn't even that close. Norton won 9-6 on my card. Maybe 8-6-1 being generous to the champ. He controlled almost the entire fight. Dictated the tempo, hurt Ali several times.

Norton was ROBBED. Plain and simple. I don't see it as even being questionable. There is no way Ali won that fight.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 14 May 2006, 20:48

and yet many other sane, reasonable, educated, fair minded people think differently on this one. Arthur Mercante an excellent judge had it 6-8 Ali and it was a unanimous decision. Where do you suppose the universe slipped a cog?

Les Darcy · Post by **Les Darcy** » 14 May 2006, 22:35

norton won, 9-6 i had it

dempseyfire · Post by **dempseyfire** » 15 May 2006, 12:28

BoxBuzz wrote:and yet many other sane, reasonable, educated, fair minded people think differently on this one. Arthur Mercante an excellent judge had it 6-8 Ali and it was a unanimous decision. Where do you suppose the universe slipped a cog?

The judges in Trinidad-Oscar, Whitaker-Chavez etc. were also respected judges. Unanimous decisions.

Were those correct as well?

Name me which rounds Ali won. No way in hell did he win 8 rounds, unless you think clowning around and posing wins you a round in professional boxing.

Ali was one of the greatest HW fighters of all time, but he lost to Norton twice.

The Great John L · Post by **The Great John L** » 15 May 2006, 12:47

When I watched the original free TV replay of this fight I thought Norton won a close decision, but it was a very close fight. I think the replay was on NBC, but I’m not sure. I remember they had Jerry Quarry as an analyst and he scored the fight a draw. I’ve since watched this fight 3 or 4 more times, and each time I’ve got Norton winning 8-7, but 8-7 either way or a draw is very reasonable. It definitely was not a robbery. Certainly not as much of a questionable decision as Norton’s decision over Jimmy Young.

The first two Ali-Norton fights were pretty easy to score. Norton should have gotten a comfortable UD in the first fight, as it really wasn’t close. Ali won the second fight by a decent margin, but the rubber match was pretty much a tossup.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 15 May 2006, 13:55

dempseyfire wrote:
BoxBuzz wrote:and yet many other sane, reasonable, educated, fair minded people think differently on this one. Arthur Mercante an excellent judge had it 6-8 Ali and it was a unanimous decision. Where do you suppose the universe slipped a cog?
The judges in Trinidad-Oscar, Whitaker-Chavez etc. were also respected judges. Unanimous decisions.

Were those correct as well?

Name me which rounds Ali won. No way in hell did he win 8 rounds, unless you think clowning around and posing wins you a round in professional boxing.

Ali was one of the greatest HW fighters of all time, but he lost to Norton twice.

Well I'm just one opinion and you and I disagree on Ali Norton but we do agree on Whitaker Chavez and DLH Trinidad on my scorecard at least. When I want to know who won a fight I simply look to the record and I let it go. At times I disagree but I don't hold the notion that I'm "right".

I have been told by many judges and I somewhat trust the notion that what you see up close may tell a different story and when three good judges agree I figure, maybe you had to be there. Toney had a controversial decision that went his way that fits in that catagory if my memory serves. It's just one of the things that I accept about the sport.

It seems even the best judges will sometimes simply have to do without our perfect judgement and be left to twist in the wind with their own errors. However in the case of Ali Norton you become one fight shy of perfection.....

OK don't take me to serious on that one. I'm the guy who told you that Lacy and Kostya were shoo-ins.

It's very interesting that when a winning fighter does not win the last round his crediblity ebbs....Hatton Collazo comes to mind. In 15 rounds would we have seen a different outcome? It did seem that way didn't it.

SteveO · Post by **SteveO** » 15 May 2006, 14:32

Looking at the fight again, I had Ali winning by a couple of rounds. Admittedly some of the rounds were close though.

dempseyfire · Post by **dempseyfire** » 15 May 2006, 19:28

BoxBuzz wrote:
dempseyfire wrote:
BoxBuzz wrote:and yet many other sane, reasonable, educated, fair minded people think differently on this one. Arthur Mercante an excellent judge had it 6-8 Ali and it was a unanimous decision. Where do you suppose the universe slipped a cog?
The judges in Trinidad-Oscar, Whitaker-Chavez etc. were also respected judges. Unanimous decisions.

Were those correct as well?

Name me which rounds Ali won. No way in hell did he win 8 rounds, unless you think clowning around and posing wins you a round in professional boxing.

Ali was one of the greatest HW fighters of all time, but he lost to Norton twice.
Well I'm just one opinion and you and I disagree on Ali Norton but we do agree on Whitaker Chavez and DLH Trinidad on my scorecard at least. When I want to know who won a fight I simply look to the record and I let it go. At times I disagree but I don't hold the notion that I'm "right".

I have been told by many judges and I somewhat trust the notion that what you see up close may tell a different story and when three good judges agree I figure, maybe you had to be there. Toney had a controversial decision that went his way that fits in that catagory if my memory serves. It's just one of the things that I accept about the sport.

It seems even the best judges will sometimes simply have to do without our perfect judgement and be left to twist in the wind with their own errors. However in the case of Ali Norton you become one fight shy of perfection.....

OK don't take me to serious on that one. I'm the guy who told you that Lacy and Kostya were shoo-ins.

It's very interesting that when a winning fighter does not win the last round his crediblity ebbs....Hatton Collazo comes to mind. In 15 rounds would we have seen a different outcome? It did seem that way didn't it.

Let me say that I'm not trying to know everything, or have the 'knowledge' regarding a boxing match. Many fights are close and can be scored in various ways. But honestly, I cannot possibly see how someone can score that fight for Ali. Ali was a big figure in boxing who made lots of money for many people in the sport. The Ali name meant lots of revenue. Certainly much more than Ken Norton. So in many of his fights in the 70s, he got what could be called prejudicial scoring in his favor b/c people didn't want to see Ali lose.

Even being generous to Ali, he still clearly loses that fight in my eyes, as well as vs Young. I believe in his prime he's probably able to beat both of them (although both would be tough fights) but I believe he lost those fights no question.

Ezzard · Post by **Ezzard** » 16 May 2006, 06:40

dempseyfire wrote:
BoxBuzz wrote:
dempseyfire wrote: The judges in Trinidad-Oscar, Whitaker-Chavez etc. were also respected judges. Unanimous decisions.

Were those correct as well?

Name me which rounds Ali won. No way in hell did he win 8 rounds, unless you think clowning around and posing wins you a round in professional boxing.

Ali was one of the greatest HW fighters of all time, but he lost to Norton twice.
Well I'm just one opinion and you and I disagree on Ali Norton but we do agree on Whitaker Chavez and DLH Trinidad on my scorecard at least. When I want to know who won a fight I simply look to the record and I let it go. At times I disagree but I don't hold the notion that I'm "right".

I have been told by many judges and I somewhat trust the notion that what you see up close may tell a different story and when three good judges agree I figure, maybe you had to be there. Toney had a controversial decision that went his way that fits in that catagory if my memory serves. It's just one of the things that I accept about the sport.

It seems even the best judges will sometimes simply have to do without our perfect judgement and be left to twist in the wind with their own errors. However in the case of Ali Norton you become one fight shy of perfection.....

OK don't take me to serious on that one. I'm the guy who told you that Lacy and Kostya were shoo-ins.

It's very interesting that when a winning fighter does not win the last round his crediblity ebbs....Hatton Collazo comes to mind. In 15 rounds would we have seen a different outcome? It did seem that way didn't it.
Let me say that I'm not trying to know everything, or have the 'knowledge' regarding a boxing match. Many fights are close and can be scored in various ways. But honestly, I cannot possibly see how someone can score that fight for Ali. Ali was a big figure in boxing who made lots of money for many people in the sport. The Ali name meant lots of revenue. Certainly much more than Ken Norton. So in many of his fights in the 70s, he got what could be called prejudicial scoring in his favor b/c people didn't want to see Ali lose.

Even being generous to Ali, he still clearly loses that fight in my eyes, as well as vs Young. I believe in his prime he's probably able to beat both of them (although both would be tough fights) but I believe he lost those fights no question.

I do think there is a ring of truth in Dempsey's words. Ali was a money machine and had to keep on winning. Saying that it was a close fight and at times Norton should have pressed more but I guess that Ali's reputation held him back. It was clsoe in terms of rounds but I still feel Norton won.