SMW Tournament - falling apart and badly planned

[Loki]

The recent Cruiserweight bouts were a breath of fresh air. I remember the previous tournament at 168, it suffered mainly with cancellations from injuries but had some really decent fights.

This iteration is a real let down in comparrision the aforementioned. The Groves/Eubank fight was good but I don’t understand why all the titles weren’t negotiated and included like at CW.

The IBF, WBO and WBC were decidedly absent. From memory, only the WBA strap was in the mix.

If you not take into consideration that Groces will probably won’t fight again until June and Braehmer has now pulled out, it really means this tournament has been reduced to mean sweet FA.

Surely it would’ve been better if DeGale (when he had the belt), Ramirez, Zuege and Benavidez were at least in the mix. I understand rankings and mandatories but I thought the idea of these tournaments were to establish something like the collective best on the planet at the weight.

Skolgund (I hope he’s OK), Yildirim, Cox and Brant you could argue should not have even been included.

[Deleted_Scenes]

According to the selection process, every world champion and every top 15 ranked fighter with the WBC, WBA, IBF & WBO was invited to apply to take part.

So the selection process for 168 was exactly the same as 200. The only reason the super middleweight tournament didn't turn out better, was half of the top fighters couldn't be arsed to sign up.

I think that says more about the fighting spirit, egos and greed of the fighters in the respective divisions, and overly protective nature of their promoters, than it does about the organisation of the tournament.

Certain American based boxers at 168 have tried to claim they were never asked - either they're lying to us, or their promoters lied to them and never informed them of any invite.

Want to blame someone? Blame Ramirez, Benavidez, Zeuge, Hart, Dirrells etc (DeGale was injured, so gets a pass), and their teams. They were all asked to join the party.

[Ruthless-RKO]

Want to blame someone? Blame Ramirez, Benavidez, Zeuge, Hart, Dirrells etc (DeGale was injured, so gets a pass), and their teams. They were all asked to join the party.

Kalle did say a few days ago. Everyone was invited. Everyone knew where and how to sign up. DeGale was about to be approached, but he suffered an injury. You're right, All the above are the reason. Dirrell vs. Smith was supposed to be for the WBC title in the 1/4 final. Dirrell dropped out. Zeuge might have been tied up in re-matching Epko or already ahd their first fight scheduled. (can't remember when they first fought actually.)

Ramirez was arguably the #1 in the division and didn't enter.. Wow! Fought Hart (a good fight) and Habib Ahmed instead.

[siablo14]

If Smith and Groves(fully fit) aren't in the final, it will be a let down.

[Loki]

According to the selection process, every world champion and every top 15 ranked fighter with the WBC, WBA, IBF & WBO was invited to apply to take part.

So the selection process for 168 was exactly the same as 200. The only reason the super middleweight tournament didn't turn out better, was half of the top fighters couldn't be arsed to sign up.

I think that says more about the fighting spirit, egos and greed of the fighters in the respective divisions, and overly protective nature of their promoters, than it does about the organisation of the tournament.

Certain American based boxers at 168 have tried to claim they were never asked - either they're lying to us, or their promoters lied to them and never informed them of any invite.

Want to blame someone? Blame Ramirez, Benavidez, Zeuge, Hart, Dirrells etc (DeGale was injured, so gets a pass), and their teams. They were all asked to join the party.

I didn’t realise all were invited but £ talks. I can’t believe any fighter would turn this down when there are belts on line and the prospect to make £. $ talks.

Does anyone know what the purses were for each fight and overall winner? Was it the same as CW?

[Deleted_Scenes]

I think the total prize money for the tournament was 50 mil (dollars?). 25 mil for each division.

No idea how that breaks down fight by fight though, but it averages 1.8mil per fighter per fight. It's not exactly peanuts, unless your name is Saul or Anthony...

[KiwiRider]

Ramirez ducked it. Smith and Groves are too big for him, he needs the size advantage.
And I'm glad the Dirrell name was not attached.

[Cent0089]

Skolgund (I hope he’s OK), Yildirim, Cox and Brant you could argue should not have even been included.

These are 4 undefeated prospects and they have a chance to become world elite because of the tournament. Unfortunately, they failed.

[Enlightened-One]

The recent Cruiserweight bouts were a breath of fresh air. I remember the previous tournament at 168, it suffered mainly with cancellations from injuries but had some really decent fights.

This iteration is a real let down in comparrision the aforementioned. The Groves/Eubank fight was good but I don’t understand why all the titles weren’t negotiated and included like at CW.

The IBF, WBO and WBC were decidedly absent. From memory, only the WBA strap was in the mix.

If you not take into consideration that Groces will probably won’t fight again until June and Braehmer has now pulled out, it really means this tournament has been reduced to mean sweet FA.

Surely it would’ve been better if DeGale (when he had the belt), Ramirez, Zuege and Benavidez were at least in the mix. I understand rankings and mandatories but I thought the idea of these tournaments were to establish something like the collective best on the planet at the weight.

Skolgund (I hope he’s OK), Yildirim, Cox and Brant you could argue should not have even been included.

Your criticism is unwarranted and hasn’t been researched, which is very disappointing to read, since it demonstrates a distinct lack of effort and knowledge on your part.

Click on the below hyperlink text to review the original explanation of the situation I provided more than two weeks ago about the state of the 168lbs WBSS tournament… and once you’ve done that, please supply your thoughts:

Rather than speculate about the reason why certain fighters chose not to compete in the WBSS, did anyone bother to read the official WBSS boxer selection process?

• 15th May, 2017 - Tournament enrolment commenced where all WBA, WBC, WBO and IBF Champions as well as all top 15 world-ranked contenders were given the opportunity make their application to enter the tournament
• 26th May, 2017 – Enrolment closed
• 6th July, 2017 – It was announced that Callum Smith, George Groves, Juergen Braehmer, Erik Skoglund and Jamie Cox would compete in the WBSS. On the same date, ESPN reported that Anthony Dirrell had breached one of the terms of his contract to face Callum Smith and also rejected an opportunity to compete in the tournament
• 7th July, 2017 – It was announced that Avni Yildirim, as well as the winner of the Chris Eubank Jr. vs. Arthur Abraham fight, will also join the WBSS
• 16th September, 2017 – The tournament commences with Callum Smith defeating Erik Skoglund

Dougie Fischer of The RING explained the most likely reason why US TV rejected the opportunity to cover the WBSS, which relates to the fact that Richard Schaefer and the Sauerland brothers were locked out of the three main networks:

• Showtime’s dates were already filled by PBC fighters
• HBO didn’t want to alienate Golden Boy by working with Richard Schaefer, who had previously burned bridges with both that network and promoter
• ESPN’s slate was already full with Top Rank and GBP shows for the remainder of the year

Therefore, it’s no coincidence that fighters with promoters affiliated to Showtime, HBO & ESPN either didn’t apply for the tournament or rejected an opportunity to compete in it.

So let’s take a look at the big name 168lb-ers that weren't included in the WBSS:

James DeGale - (PBC) - Wanted to face the winner of the WBSS tournament after recovering from injury
Badou Jack - (PBC) - Already had a light heavyweight bout lined-up and had no intention to return to 168lbs
Gilberto Ramirez - (Top Rank) - Injured during sparring at the time the WBSS was announced and chose to face the eventual winner
Anthony Dirrell - (PBC) - Rejected an opportunity to compete in the WBSS
Andre Dirrell - (PBC) – Did not enter the WBSS
Jose Uzcategui - (PBC) - Lost his bout against Andre Dirrell a couple of months prior to the announcement of the WBSS
Tyron Zeuge - Rejected an opportunity to compete in the WBSS
David Benavidez - (PBC) - Chose to compete for the vacant WBC title against Ronald Gavril
Jesse Hart - (Top Rank) – Did not enter the WBSS, branded the tournament as a joke and chose to face Gilberto Ramirez instead

In regards to those that did enter the WBSS 168lbs tournament, only three fighters weren’t rated in either The RING’s or ESPN’s divisional rankings from 160lbs to 175lbs, such as:
• Jamie Cox
• Erik Skoglund
• Avni Yildirim (chose to compete in the WBSS instead of exploiting his WBC ranking and challenge for that belt at 168lbs)

All four fighters that have progressed to the WBSS semi-final stage of the tournament are rated in the top-ten of that division by ESPN and/or The RING, with the likes of George Groves, Callum Smith and Chris Eubank Jr. universally considered as three of the top five 168lb-ers.

People are allowed to have their own opinions, but they aren’t entitled to their own facts!

[Best Coast]

Skolgund (I hope he’s OK), Yildirim, Cox and Brant you could argue should not have even been included.

These are 4 undefeated prospects and they have a chance to become world elite because of the tournament. Unfortunately, they failed.

Beg to differ. IMO they were all no-hopers who included only because better fighters were not available.

[Best Coast]

• 15th May, 2017 - Tournament enrolment commenced where all WBA, WBC, WBO and IBF Champions as well as all top 15 world-ranked contenders were given the opportunity make their application to enter the tournament
• 26th May, 2017 – Enrolment closed

Based on your own FACTS the WBSS enrollment only lasted 11 days and those who didnt submit applications during that far-too-brief enrollment period were not included. That sounds like McDonalds hiring burger-flippers...

That is no way to run a world-class tournament but rather a recipe for disaster!! If the WBSS cruiserweight had a similarly brief enrollment period then their success in getting a talent-loaded field of top-notch competitors was a "perfect storm" of world-class participants who happened to rapidly seize the opportunity!!

[Enlightened-One]

• 15th May, 2017 - Tournament enrolment commenced where all WBA, WBC, WBO and IBF Champions as well as all top 15 world-ranked contenders were given the opportunity make their application to enter the tournament
• 26th May, 2017 – Enrolment closed

Based on your own FACTS the WBSS enrollment only lasted 11 days and those who didnt submit applications during that far-too-brief enrollment period were not included. That sounds like McDonalds hiring burger-flippers...

That is no way to run a world-class tournament but rather a recipe for disaster!! If the WBSS cruiserweight had a similarly brief enrollment period then their success in getting a talent-loaded field of top-notch competitors was a "perfect storm" of world-class participants who happened to rapidly seize the opportunity!!

The tournament itself was announced on the 9th March, 2017. So all boxers, promoters and managers knew about it almost three months prior to the dealdine.

The enrolment period itself was purely about registering the interest of fighters that met their criteria. However, the Sauerlands and Schaefer could never force all high-profile boxers to agree to participate in it. So those that didn't enrol weren't considered.

What else could they have done?

[Best Coast]

• 15th May, 2017 - Tournament enrolment commenced where all WBA, WBC, WBO and IBF Champions as well as all top 15 world-ranked contenders were given the opportunity make their application to enter the tournament
• 26th May, 2017 – Enrolment closed

Based on your own FACTS the WBSS enrollment only lasted 11 days and those who didnt submit applications during that far-too-brief enrollment period were not included. That sounds like McDonalds hiring burger-flippers...

That is no way to run a world-class tournament but rather a recipe for disaster!! If the WBSS cruiserweight had a similarly brief enrollment period then their success in getting a talent-loaded field of top-notch competitors was a "perfect storm" of world-class participants who happened to rapidly seize the opportunity!!

The tournament itself was announced on the 9th March, 2017. So all boxers, promoters and managers knew about it almost three months prior to the dealdine.

The enrolment period itself was purely about registering the interest of fighters that met their criteria. However, the Sauerlands and Schaefer could never force all high-profile boxers to agree to participate in it. So those that didn't enrol weren't considered.

What else could they have done?

This brings up the larger issue of how proactive was the WBSS in RECRUITING top-notch talent at 168?

All the WBSS excuse-makers have been saying all along that Hart "refused"and Benavides "refused" and this guy & that guy "refused". But now it's sounding like very few fighters actually REFUSED but they only failed to APPLY. If that is the case then WBSS clearly blew their chance. If WBSS did not PERSONALLY CONTACT every qualified fighter to see if they would participate then they clearly FAILED in their mission to obtain the best talent.

If WBSS actively recruited 30 fighters and only half were interested then that still would give them a talent pool of 15 fighters that THEY could then narrow down to the best 8 available. The other 7 not selected could be kept (if they agreed) as alternates. Then they wouldnt have to resort to replacement fighters like this ex-kickboxer Nieky Holzken to fill in for a crucial semifinal bout!!

I return to the McDonalds burger-flipper analogy. When a world-class corporation has a top-notch executive position to be filled, they not only have an enrollment period where they except applications but they also actively recruit for the best available talent because of the importance of the position.

When Micky D's hires burger-flippers they dont recruit because that is an insignificant position.

Unfortunately it appears the WBSS adopted the McDonald's strategy for hiring burger-flippers instead of the strategy for an important, crucial executive position.

[jamamb]

how do you know guys like ramirez and benavidez werent asked. or are you just assuming that?

[Loki]

The recent Cruiserweight bouts were a breath of fresh air. I remember the previous tournament at 168, it suffered mainly with cancellations from injuries but had some really decent fights.

This iteration is a real let down in comparrision the aforementioned. The Groves/Eubank fight was good but I don’t understand why all the titles weren’t negotiated and included like at CW.

The IBF, WBO and WBC were decidedly absent. From memory, only the WBA strap was in the mix.

If you not take into consideration that Groces will probably won’t fight again until June and Braehmer has now pulled out, it really means this tournament has been reduced to mean sweet FA.

Surely it would’ve been better if DeGale (when he had the belt), Ramirez, Zuege and Benavidez were at least in the mix. I understand rankings and mandatories but I thought the idea of these tournaments were to establish something like the collective best on the planet at the weight.

Skolgund (I hope he’s OK), Yildirim, Cox and Brant you could argue should not have even been included.

Your criticism is unwarranted and hasn’t been researched, which is very disappointing to read, since it demonstrates a distinct lack of effort and knowledge on your part.

Click on the below hyperlink text to review the original explanation of the situation I provided more than two weeks ago about the state of the 168lbs WBSS tournament… and once you’ve done that, please supply your thoughts:

Rather than speculate about the reason why certain fighters chose not to compete in the WBSS, did anyone bother to read the official WBSS boxer selection process?

• 15th May, 2017 - Tournament enrolment commenced where all WBA, WBC, WBO and IBF Champions as well as all top 15 world-ranked contenders were given the opportunity make their application to enter the tournament
• 26th May, 2017 – Enrolment closed
• 6th July, 2017 – It was announced that Callum Smith, George Groves, Juergen Braehmer, Erik Skoglund and Jamie Cox would compete in the WBSS. On the same date, ESPN reported that Anthony Dirrell had breached one of the terms of his contract to face Callum Smith and also rejected an opportunity to compete in the tournament
• 7th July, 2017 – It was announced that Avni Yildirim, as well as the winner of the Chris Eubank Jr. vs. Arthur Abraham fight, will also join the WBSS
• 16th September, 2017 – The tournament commences with Callum Smith defeating Erik Skoglund

Dougie Fischer of The RING explained the most likely reason why US TV rejected the opportunity to cover the WBSS, which relates to the fact that Richard Schaefer and the Sauerland brothers were locked out of the three main networks:

• Showtime’s dates were already filled by PBC fighters
• HBO didn’t want to alienate Golden Boy by working with Richard Schaefer, who had previously burned bridges with both that network and promoter
• ESPN’s slate was already full with Top Rank and GBP shows for the remainder of the year

Therefore, it’s no coincidence that fighters with promoters affiliated to Showtime, HBO & ESPN either didn’t apply for the tournament or rejected an opportunity to compete in it.

So let’s take a look at the big name 168lb-ers that weren't included in the WBSS:

James DeGale - (PBC) - Wanted to face the winner of the WBSS tournament after recovering from injury
Badou Jack - (PBC) - Already had a light heavyweight bout lined-up and had no intention to return to 168lbs
Gilberto Ramirez - (Top Rank) - Injured during sparring at the time the WBSS was announced and chose to face the eventual winner
Anthony Dirrell - (PBC) - Rejected an opportunity to compete in the WBSS
Andre Dirrell - (PBC) – Did not enter the WBSS
Jose Uzcategui - (PBC) - Lost his bout against Andre Dirrell a couple of months prior to the announcement of the WBSS
Tyron Zeuge - Rejected an opportunity to compete in the WBSS
David Benavidez - (PBC) - Chose to compete for the vacant WBC title against Ronald Gavril
Jesse Hart - (Top Rank) – Did not enter the WBSS, branded the tournament as a joke and chose to face Gilberto Ramirez instead

In regards to those that did enter the WBSS 168lbs tournament, only three fighters weren’t rated in either The RING’s or ESPN’s divisional rankings from 160lbs to 175lbs, such as:
• Jamie Cox
• Erik Skoglund
• Avni Yildirim (chose to compete in the WBSS instead of exploiting his WBC ranking and challenge for that belt at 168lbs)

All four fighters that have progressed to the WBSS semi-final stage of the tournament are rated in the top-ten of that division by ESPN and/or The RING, with the likes of George Groves, Callum Smith and Chris Eubank Jr. universally considered as three of the top five 168lb-ers.

People are allowed to have their own opinions, but they aren’t entitled to their own facts!

Calm down dork. I have an important job and I’ve not got the time to research every item before I post it. It’s a discussion forum, not a peice of legislation underpinned by regulations that have been scrutinised by several anoraks.

I accept that I hadn’t researched very detail and I hadn’t realised it was offered to all champions but I stand by the original point. That is - why bother with it at all if only one belt was on the line and means that it wouldn’t get anywhere to find who is the pinnacle of the division. Surely there is other weight classes that suit better.

All this means TEO, is that you can go home, talk to you Mum and confirm what you’re having for dinner and then play with your trains all night in an engineers hat.

[Loki]

Based on your own FACTS the WBSS enrollment only lasted 11 days and those who didnt submit applications during that far-too-brief enrollment period were not included. That sounds like McDonalds hiring burger-flippers...

That is no way to run a world-class tournament but rather a recipe for disaster!! If the WBSS cruiserweight had a similarly brief enrollment period then their success in getting a talent-loaded field of top-notch competitors was a "perfect storm" of world-class participants who happened to rapidly seize the opportunity!!

The tournament itself was announced on the 9th March, 2017. So all boxers, promoters and managers knew about it almost three months prior to the dealdine.

The enrolment period itself was purely about registering the interest of fighters that met their criteria. However, the Sauerlands and Schaefer could never force all high-profile boxers to agree to participate in it. So those that didn't enrol weren't considered.

What else could they have done?

This brings up the larger issue of how proactive was the WBSS in RECRUITING top-notch talent at 168?

All the WBSS excuse-makers have been saying all along that Hart "refused"and Benavides "refused" and this guy & that guy "refused". But now it's sounding like very few fighters actually REFUSED but they only failed to APPLY. If that is the case then WBSS clearly blew their chance. If WBSS did not PERSONALLY CONTACT every qualified fighter to see if they would participate then they clearly FAILED in their mission to obtain the best talent.

If WBSS actively recruited 30 fighters and only half were interested then that still would give them a talent pool of 15 fighters that THEY could then narrow down to the best 8 available. The other 7 not selected could be kept (if they agreed) as alternates. Then they wouldnt have to resort to replacement fighters like this ex-kickboxer Nieky Holzken to fill in for a crucial semifinal bout!!

I return to the McDonalds burger-flipper analogy. When a world-class corporation has a top-notch executive position to be filled, they not only have an enrollment period where they except applications but they also actively recruit for the best available talent because of the importance of the position.

When Micky D's hires burger-flippers they dont recruit because that is an insignificant position.

Unfortunately it appears the WBSS adopted the McDonald's strategy for hiring burger-flippers instead of the strategy for an important, crucial executive position.

I agree; they should’ve done more and paid more. If they could only attract some top fighters, they should’ve just scrapped it and looked st a different weight.

[Loki]

All this really means is that a sh1t tournament just got sh1ttier.

[Best Coast]

how do you know guys like ramirez and benavidez werent asked. or are you just assuming that?

Based on Enlightened One's summary of the enrollment process. It doesnt sound like all the top-notch players at 168 were personally contacted but were just given a window of opportunity in which to APPLY. I dont know for sure that they were NOT asked, but I'm saying if ALL the top-notch fighters were not personally and proactively recruited then WBSS clearly dropped the ball on this one.

Perhaps things things fell together so quickly for the WBSS Cruiser tourney that Schaefer/Sutherland assumed all the top-notch talent at 168 would JUMP at the opportunity like the CWs did without being actively RECRUITED.

Whether it be a world-class corporation hiring an executive or a college coach talking to high school football players, recruitment involves more than just a formal request but involves PERSUASION and attempting to CONVINCE those being recruited that this is their best option.

Do you honestly believe that's what WSBB did in building their 168# roster?

[jamamb]

The tournament itself was announced on the 9th March, 2017. So all boxers, promoters and managers knew about it almost three months prior to the dealdine.

The enrolment period itself was purely about registering the interest of fighters that met their criteria. However, the Sauerlands and Schaefer could never force all high-profile boxers to agree to participate in it. So those that didn't enrol weren't considered.

What else could they have done?

This brings up the larger issue of how proactive was the WBSS in RECRUITING top-notch talent at 168?

All the WBSS excuse-makers have been saying all along that Hart "refused"and Benavides "refused" and this guy & that guy "refused". But now it's sounding like very few fighters actually REFUSED but they only failed to APPLY. If that is the case then WBSS clearly blew their chance. If WBSS did not PERSONALLY CONTACT every qualified fighter to see if they would participate then they clearly FAILED in their mission to obtain the best talent.

If WBSS actively recruited 30 fighters and only half were interested then that still would give them a talent pool of 15 fighters that THEY could then narrow down to the best 8 available. The other 7 not selected could be kept (if they agreed) as alternates. Then they wouldnt have to resort to replacement fighters like this ex-kickboxer Nieky Holzken to fill in for a crucial semifinal bout!!

I return to the McDonalds burger-flipper analogy. When a world-class corporation has a top-notch executive position to be filled, they not only have an enrollment period where they except applications but they also actively recruit for the best available talent because of the importance of the position.

When Micky D's hires burger-flippers they dont recruit because that is an insignificant position.

Unfortunately it appears the WBSS adopted the McDonald's strategy for hiring burger-flippers instead of the strategy for an important, crucial executive position.

I agree; they should’ve done more and paid more. If they could only attract some top fighters, they should’ve just scrapped it and looked st a different weight.

how much are they paying

[Enlightened-One]

Based on your own FACTS the WBSS enrollment only lasted 11 days and those who didnt submit applications during that far-too-brief enrollment period were not included. That sounds like McDonalds hiring burger-flippers...

That is no way to run a world-class tournament but rather a recipe for disaster!! If the WBSS cruiserweight had a similarly brief enrollment period then their success in getting a talent-loaded field of top-notch competitors was a "perfect storm" of world-class participants who happened to rapidly seize the opportunity!!

The tournament itself was announced on the 9th March, 2017. So all boxers, promoters and managers knew about it almost three months prior to the dealdine.

The enrolment period itself was purely about registering the interest of fighters that met their criteria. However, the Sauerlands and Schaefer could never force all high-profile boxers to agree to participate in it. So those that didn't enrol weren't considered.

What else could they have done?

This brings up the larger issue of how proactive was the WBSS in RECRUITING top-notch talent at 168?

All the WBSS excuse-makers have been saying all along that Hart "refused"and Benavides "refused" and this guy & that guy "refused". But now it's sounding like very few fighters actually REFUSED but they only failed to APPLY. If that is the case then WBSS clearly blew their chance. If WBSS did not PERSONALLY CONTACT every qualified fighter to see if they would participate then they clearly FAILED in their mission to obtain the best talent.

If WBSS actively recruited 30 fighters and only half were interested then that still would give them a talent pool of 15 fighters that THEY could then narrow down to the best 8 available. The other 7 not selected could be kept (if they agreed) as alternates. Then they wouldnt have to resort to replacement fighters like this ex-kickboxer Nieky Holzken to fill in for a crucial semifinal bout!!

I return to the McDonalds burger-flipper analogy. When a world-class corporation has a top-notch executive position to be filled, they not only have an enrollment period where they except applications but they also actively recruit for the best available talent because of the importance of the position.

When Micky D's hires burger-flippers they dont recruit because that is an insignificant position.

Unfortunately it appears the WBSS adopted the McDonald's strategy for hiring burger-flippers instead of the strategy for an important, crucial executive position.

It doesn't sound as though you understood the reasons why certain fighters didn't apply. It was mainly due to these guys adhering to their obligations to their promoters and TV networks.

Some of the other things you've stated is stuff that you dreamt up for the purpose to provide a fictional counter argument.

[Enlightened-One]

how do you know guys like ramirez and benavidez werent asked. or are you just assuming that?

Based on Enlightened One's summary of the enrollment process. It doesnt sound like all the top-notch players at 168 were personally contacted but were just given a window of opportunity in which to APPLY. I dont know for sure that they were NOT asked, but I'm saying if ALL the top-notch fighters were not personally and proactively recruited then WBSS clearly dropped the ball on this one.

Perhaps things things fell together so quickly for the WBSS Cruiser tourney that Schaefer/Sutherland assumed all the top-notch talent at 168 would JUMP at the opportunity like the CWs did without being actively RECRUITED.

Whether it be a world-class corporation hiring an executive or a college coach talking to high school football players, recruitment involves more than just a formal request but involves PERSUASION and attempting to CONVINCE those being recruited that this is their best option.

Do you honestly believe that's what WSBB did in building their 168# roster?

Please read my explanation again, since you've missed a key point that addresses the majority of your post.

Even Bob Arum has subsequently confirmed his reluctance to allow his fighters to enter the tournament, due to not wanting to risk his new relationship with ESPN.

I have provided an explanation that has been substantiated by first hand sources that people either haven't read or cannot digest.

[Best Coast]

how do you know guys like ramirez and benavidez werent asked. or are you just assuming that?

Based on Enlightened One's summary of the enrollment process. It doesnt sound like all the top-notch players at 168 were personally contacted but were just given a window of opportunity in which to APPLY. I dont know for sure that they were NOT asked, but I'm saying if ALL the top-notch fighters were not personally and proactively recruited then WBSS clearly dropped the ball on this one.

Perhaps things things fell together so quickly for the WBSS Cruiser tourney that Schaefer/Sutherland assumed all the top-notch talent at 168 would JUMP at the opportunity like the CWs did without being actively RECRUITED.

Whether it be a world-class corporation hiring an executive or a college coach talking to high school football players, recruitment involves more than just a formal request but involves PERSUASION and attempting to CONVINCE those being recruited that this is their best option.

Do you honestly believe that's what WSBB did in building their 168# roster?

Please read my explanation again, since you've missed a key point that addresses the majority of your post.

Even Bob Arum has subsequently confirmed his reluctance to allow his fighters to enter the tournament, due to not wanting to risk his new relationship with ESPN.

I have provided an explanation that has been substantiated by first hand sources that people either haven't read or cannot digest.

I read your quote from Arum and I am not disputing that but that doesnt change the fact that WBSS did not actively recruit the top fighters at 168. I do not doubt that impersonal form letters or e-mails were sent out to each eligible fighter based on the criteria involved, explaining to them they need to submit applications from 5/11-5/26, but that is NOT recruiting. Recruiting invloves persuading and convincing.

These are international businessmen & Schaefer was previously a Swiss banker. Do you honestly think when he was hiring a CEO for one of his banks that he did not actively RECRUIT that person by personally discussing with him the advantages of the position? If you believe that than you dont even have minimal understanding of business or capitalism. Do you think when Sauerland signed some of his bigger stars in years past he did not PERSONALLY recruit Henry Maske? I guarantee you he did because he was involved in direct competition with Universum for all the top ex-Soviet bloc fighters.

If they had similarly recruited the top fighters they would wouldnt have ended up with scrubs like Cox, Skoglund, Yildirm & Brant (who was not even rated at SM because he was fighting at 160) or an ex-kickboxer like Holzken as a replacement SEMI-FINALIST.

[TheGingerBomber]

I can't remember the timeline, but Benavidez vs Gavril would have been a great first round fight. Ramirez & Zuege are two of the most protected fighters around, Ramirez is sh!t too. Dirrells are utter pussys, poor Uzcatzgui has to rematch one of them and Degale was injured, so understandably weak.

[Enlightened-One]

Based on Enlightened One's summary of the enrollment process. It doesnt sound like all the top-notch players at 168 were personally contacted but were just given a window of opportunity in which to APPLY. I dont know for sure that they were NOT asked, but I'm saying if ALL the top-notch fighters were not personally and proactively recruited then WBSS clearly dropped the ball on this one.

Perhaps things things fell together so quickly for the WBSS Cruiser tourney that Schaefer/Sutherland assumed all the top-notch talent at 168 would JUMP at the opportunity like the CWs did without being actively RECRUITED.

Whether it be a world-class corporation hiring an executive or a college coach talking to high school football players, recruitment involves more than just a formal request but involves PERSUASION and attempting to CONVINCE those being recruited that this is their best option.

Do you honestly believe that's what WSBB did in building their 168# roster?

Please read my explanation again, since you've missed a key point that addresses the majority of your post.

Even Bob Arum has subsequently confirmed his reluctance to allow his fighters to enter the tournament, due to not wanting to risk his new relationship with ESPN.

I have provided an explanation that has been substantiated by first hand sources that people either haven't read or cannot digest.

I read your quote from Arum and I am not disputing that but that doesnt change the fact that WBSS did not actively recruit the top fighters at 168. I do not doubt that impersonal form letters or e-mails were sent out to each eligible fighter based on the criteria involved, explaining to them they need to submit applications from 5/11-5/26, but that is NOT recruiting. Recruiting invloves persuading and convincing.

These are international businessmen & Schaefer was previously a Swiss banker. Do you honestly think when he was hiring a CEO for one of his banks that he did not actively RECRUIT that person by personally discussing with him the advantages of the position? If you believe that than you dont even have minimal understanding of business or capitalism. Do you think when Sauerland signed some of his bigger stars in years past he did not PERSONALLY recruit Henry Maske? I guarantee you he did because he was involved in direct competition with Universum for all the top ex-Soviet bloc fighters.

If they had similarly recruited the top fighters they would wouldnt have ended up with scrubs like Cox, Skoglund, Yildirm & Brant (who was not even rated at SM because he was fighting at 160) or an ex-kickboxer like Holzken as a replacement SEMI-FINALIST.

It's no “coincidence” that no fighter affiliated to the PBC, GBP or Top Rank entered the 168lbs version of the WBSS tournament.

It's no “coincidence” that all of the American TV networks affiliated with the PBC, GBP or Top Rank, such as ESPN, Showtime or HBO, refused to televise both versions of the WBSS tournament.

It's no “coincidence” that the same sort of “coincidences” generally applies to the cruiserweight version of the WBSS tournament also.

Even Bob Arum has recently admitted that he wouldn't allow any of his fighters to compete in the WBSS, due to his relationship with ESPN.

You've assumed that the reason why some of the top 168lbs fighters didn't participate in the WBSS was due to incompetence on the part of the Sauerlands and Schaefer, whilst dismissing the possibility that boxing politics was the actual cause, which seems a bit strange considering the overwhelming amount of evidence that is easily accessible.

[boxing_rocks]

Was Korobov offered to participate? I realize that he is barely known, but so are some other participants and alternates.

Korobov is better than most of them. He easily outboxed Uzcategui who was beating Dirrell before dropping him after the bell.