Who, in boxing history, can demolish Anthony Joshua?

[Kalan]

Let's see how he does in his next several fights IF he steps up in competition. He is still limited. Comps are ridiculous at this point in time. His best win was against a 42 y/o way past his prime Vladimir.

I love it... 42? If you want to lie your ass off, why not make him 100? Wlad was 41 and in the best shape of his life (He said.)

Foreman KO'd Michael Moorer at 45 and Larry Holmes beat Ray Mercer at 42.... Old fighters are very smart fighters.... George and Larry weren't in a 10th the physical condition that Wladimir Klitschko was in for the Anthony Joshua fight....

You clowns kept saying AJ was too green, way over his head, and getting knocked out.... Now you say "He almost lost."

Those 70's clowns you keep talking about lost tons of fights... Wait until Joshua actually loses a fight before ripping him.

[HomicideHenry]

My list would be 100 names or better long, but Earnie Shavers would have poleaxed him definitely.

Yeah.... Just like you think Max Baer should have poleaxed Jimmy Braddock... Only he couldn't and you don't accept it...

And like Shavers poleaxed Ron Stander, Jerry Quarry, and Tex Cobb.... Except they absorbed everything Earnie threw and then beat the living shitt out of the chinny swinger... I can still see Earnie falling on his face when novice Stander belted him out... Shavers didn't want a rematch with the green fat kid..... And it's not as if you could miss Stander with a punch.

Earnie also went 15 rounds with Ali, and nearly kayoed him. He also nearly kayoed Larry Holmes. He also beat a fair amount of guys that were rarely ever stopped like Bugner. Sometimes people have off nights.

What fascinates me is how many people are saying AJ is the greatest ever, when he has yet to even prove he's the best man of his own era. It's Gerry Cooney all over again as far as I'm concerned, except now it's The Great Black Hope. He reminds me of the much ballyhooed Mac Foster, until Quarry knocked him out. The hype is huge on Joshua, but I'm not sold.

[SteveO]

AJ is a work in progress still, too early to definitively say who he'd beat and who he wouldn't. All the other fighters mentioned had a career that played out

Agreed, it's way to early to tell how great Joshua could potentially be.
We'll know better If he convincingly beats Parker, Wilder, Povetkin, Fury, Haye etc. in the next couple of years.

[Flump]

My list would be 100 names or better long, but Earnie Shavers would have poleaxed him definitely.

Yeah.... Just like you think Max Baer should have poleaxed Jimmy Braddock... Only he couldn't and you don't accept it...

And like Shavers poleaxed Ron Stander, Jerry Quarry, and Tex Cobb.... Except they absorbed everything Earnie threw and then beat the living shitt out of the chinny swinger... I can still see Earnie falling on his face when novice Stander belted him out... Shavers didn't want a rematch with the green fat kid..... And it's not as if you could miss Stander with a punch.

Earnie also went 15 rounds with Ali, and nearly kayoed him. He also nearly kayoed Larry Holmes. He also beat a fair amount of guys that were rarely ever stopped like Bugner. Sometimes people have off nights.

What fascinates me is how many people are saying AJ is the greatest ever, when he has yet to even prove he's the best man of his own era. It's Gerry Cooney all over again as far as I'm concerned, except now it's The Great Black Hope. He reminds me of the much ballyhooed Mac Foster, until Quarry knocked him out. The hype is huge on Joshua, but I'm not sold.

Only an infantile moron would say that a guy with one win over a world class fighter is the greatest ever. I like AJ and wish him all the best, he's great for boxing, but anybody saying that is just making a fool of themselves.

[gilgamesh]

Yeah.... Just like you think Max Baer should have poleaxed Jimmy Braddock... Only he couldn't and you don't accept it...

And like Shavers poleaxed Ron Stander, Jerry Quarry, and Tex Cobb.... Except they absorbed everything Earnie threw and then beat the living shitt out of the chinny swinger... I can still see Earnie falling on his face when novice Stander belted him out... Shavers didn't want a rematch with the green fat kid..... And it's not as if you could miss Stander with a punch.

Earnie also went 15 rounds with Ali, and nearly kayoed him. He also nearly kayoed Larry Holmes. He also beat a fair amount of guys that were rarely ever stopped like Bugner. Sometimes people have off nights.

What fascinates me is how many people are saying AJ is the greatest ever, when he has yet to even prove he's the best man of his own era. It's Gerry Cooney all over again as far as I'm concerned, except now it's The Great Black Hope. He reminds me of the much ballyhooed Mac Foster, until Quarry knocked him out. The hype is huge on Joshua, but I'm not sold.

Only an infantile moron would say that a guy with one win over a world class fighter is the greatest ever. I like AJ and wish him all the best, he's great for boxing, but anybody saying that is just making a fool of themselves.

It could only come from the level of mind that would say that a Basketball player beats arguably the greatest Heavyweight Boxer of all time at his own sport.

[Flump]

Earnie also went 15 rounds with Ali, and nearly kayoed him. He also nearly kayoed Larry Holmes. He also beat a fair amount of guys that were rarely ever stopped like Bugner. Sometimes people have off nights.

What fascinates me is how many people are saying AJ is the greatest ever, when he has yet to even prove he's the best man of his own era. It's Gerry Cooney all over again as far as I'm concerned, except now it's The Great Black Hope. He reminds me of the much ballyhooed Mac Foster, until Quarry knocked him out. The hype is huge on Joshua, but I'm not sold.

Only an infantile moron would say that a guy with one win over a world class fighter is the greatest ever. I like AJ and wish him all the best, he's great for boxing, but anybody saying that is just making a fool of themselves.

It could only come from the level of mind that would say that a Basketball player beats arguably the greatest Heavyweight Boxer of all time at his own sport.

I can't imagine anybody making such an absurd claim gil, especially someone who's been there and done it.

[BroughtonRulesRefuge]

AJ is a work in progress still, too early to definitively say who he'd beat and who he wouldn't. All the other fighters mentioned had a career that played out so you can point to fights where they struggled or lost to support your theories.

His only, by historical standards, good opponent had him on the floor and gassed but he showed heart to turn it around. So he has ticked some boxes but until we know the measure of the man it's hard to say.

- Well, now Flumpsie, you appear to be a lifetime work in progress still waiting for your introduction into Boxing 101.

Here's an introductory course I penned in an expansion of a previous posting where the topic was talked about in quite a more comprehensive fashion just before the Wlad fight. Really, now, will you tell us what grade are you in now?

{{ }}

Anthony Joshua: age 27, 18-0, 18 KO, 44 rounds, 3-0, 3 KO title record. The Josh prime pro career has only just started, yet he is currently the best he’s ever been, so how does that stack up with the best heavyweights ever in a fair comparison, F-A-I-R being the keyword here?

Cross referencing the timelines involved using statistical variables yields the following:

Jack Dempsey 12-1-5, 11 KO 1916, age 19, no contender 5 years before title

Joe Louis 18-0, 14 KO 1935, age 21, no contender 2 years before title

Rocky Marciano 18-0, 17 KO 1949, age 25, no contender 3 year before title

Muhammad Ali 18-0, 14 KO 1963, age 22, one contender Doug Jones 1 year before title

Joe Frazier 18-0, 16 KO 1967, age 23, no contender 1 year before title

George Foreman 18-0, 15 KO 1970, age 21, no contender 3 years before title

Larry Holmes 18-0, 13 KO 1975, age 26, no contender 3 years before title

Mike Tyson 18-0, 18 KO 1986, age 19, no contender 9 months before title

Lennox Lewis 18-0, 16 KO 1991, age 26, no contender 2 years before title

Wladimir Klitschko 18-0, 17 KO 1998, age 21, no contender 2 years before title

My conclusion: Josh whoops all save the possibilities of still green Joe Louis, Foreman, Tyson, or Wlad getting to him. Josh easily whoops all their comp at that stage with not many of Josh’s comp being whooped by their comp as they build their records on the timeline. Josh represents the new continuation of supersized heavyweights that has taken over the division since the reigns of Lewis and the Klitschkos. His biggest advantage besides size/strength/boxing ability is being a fully mature age 27 in his athletic prime years with unparalleled success, scarcely losing a round. Most of the others were much younger at the same stage and less developed.

These I take to be the protagonists’ best fight showing dominance without controversy or officiating help: Joshua–undefeated Dillon Whyte pretitle

Jack Dempsey–KO champion Jess Willard in a epic beatdown

Joe Louis– KO rematch of 52-7-4 Max Schmeling in the biggest ever fight of the day broadcast by radio internationally to an estimated 70 million radios with uncounted numbers of listeners in dozens of countries gathered wherever a radio could pick up the relayed broadcasts

Rocky Marciano– KO 149-19-8 LH champ Archie Moore

Muhammad Ali– UD 39-4 WBA champ Ernie Terrell

Joe Frazier– UD Undefeated champ Ali in Fight of The Century/Fight of the Year

George Foreman– KO undefeated champ Joe Frazier

Larry Holmes– UD 20-2 contender Randall Cobb
.
Mike Tyson– UD undefeated WBC champ Tony Tucker

Lennox Lewis– UD once defeated 37-1 contender David Tua

Wlad Klitschko– UD undefeated Alexander Povetkin in his homeland of Russia while Russia was engaged in a low level war against Klitschko’s native Ukraine, so political animosity and armament was off the shelf.

Could Joe Louis beat Max Schmeling with the rematch being held in Nazi Germany? We can’t say other to note it was easier to beat Max in Yankee Stadium than to travel to hostile Berlin. Can Wlad beat Josh in front of 90,000 screaming meemies in England’s Wembley Stadium? In two weeks we’ll have that answer.

My conclusion for now: Dempsey, Tyson, Frazier, Foreman, Lewis, and Wlad comprehensively whooped better fighters than did Josh, and certainly Rocky also by the legendary status of Moore who might well whoop Whyte also even if a bit of a stretch size and age wise. Whyte vs Terrell or Cobb would be good 50-50 scraps. I could go into the 2nd and 3rd best bouts showing dominance, but this project just a short refresher of the historical timelines of these fighters, and by the end of his career, Josh surely will have many more scalps in comparison. Thing is, if Josh whoops Wlad in his upcoming, bingo, now he has a comparable victory to Frazier.

Finally, let’s look at where the fighters were at age 27 as Josh currently is.

Jack Dempsey age 27, out of boxing for that year, title record 4-0, 4 KO.

Joe Louis age 27, beat Buddy Baer, Billy Conn, Lou Nova, Buddy Baer rematch, Abe Simon, all title fights before being inducted into the Army for 3 yrs. Title record of 22-0, 19 KO.

Rocky Marciano age 27, usually by KO beat Tiger Ted Lowry, Bill Wilson, Keen Simmons, Harold Mitchell, Art Henri, Willis Applegate, Rex Layne, and Freddie Beshore, all pre-title fights the year before his title with Rex Layne being his first Ring ranked scalp.

Muhammad Ali age 27, in boxing exile up before the US Supreme Court for judgement with a title record of 10-0, 8 KO.

Joe Frazier age 27, BTFO out of Ali in FOTC/FOY. Title record 8-0, 6 KO.

George Foreman age 27, KOed Ron Lyle, Joe Frazier, Scott Le Doux, and Dino Denis at the start of his comeback from Ali loss, title record of 3-1, 3 KO.

Larry Holmes age 27, beat Tom Prater, Horace Robinson, and Fred Houpe, all unranked pre-title fights 2 years before his title.

Mike Tyson age 27 incarcerated on bogus rape charges arranged by DKing. Title record of 10-1, 8 KO.

Lennox Lewis age 27, beat Razor Ruddock and then Tony Tucker for his first title(vacated by Big Dummy Bowe)

Wlad Klitschko age 27, beat a couple of minor fringe contenders looking for his 2nd title, title record of 6-1, 5 KO.

My conclusion: Ali and Tyson were unavailable, but more proven and would be the favorites. Rocky and Holmes were too poorly tutored to beat Josh if ever. Lewis was near the same unproven stage as Josh, but Dempsey, Louis, Foreman, and Wlad were more proven and have excellent chances of knocking Josh out with Josh being the underdog. As much as I love Frazier, this a bad size and style matchup for him that I’d pick Josh over in spite of Frazier being more proven. Lewis knocking out washed up versions of Razor Ruddock and Tony Tucker yields no confidence in him as he always looked ready to faint when entering the ring. Josh in comparison has the Eric Molina defense to take him to a 3-0, 3KO title record, and he’s coming up on the Wlad challenge, so he has 7 more months to make his 27 year old destiny.

In summary: Josh is up there by many measures in his current form or has surpassed many on this list at the comparable timelines, most particularly at the comparative 18-0 marks. He still has quite the gauntlet to traverse before being mentioned with the upper echelons of greats as I’m sure most already instinctively know.

[Kalan]

Earnie also went 15 rounds with Ali, and nearly kayoed him. He also nearly kayoed Larry Holmes. He also beat a fair amount of guys that were rarely ever stopped like Bugner. Sometimes people have off nights.

What fascinates me is how many people are saying AJ is the greatest ever, when he has yet to even prove he's the best man of his own era. It's Gerry Cooney all over again as far as I'm concerned, except now it's The Great Black Hope. He reminds me of the much ballyhooed Mac Foster, until Quarry knocked him out. The hype is huge on Joshua, but I'm not sold.

Only an infantile moron would say that a guy with one win over a world class fighter is the greatest ever. I like AJ and wish him all the best, he's great for boxing, but anybody saying that is just making a fool of themselves.

It could only come from the level of mind that would say that a Basketball player beats arguably the greatest Heavyweight Boxer of all time at his own sport.

Well, you had one amateur fight that you lost... You guys never fought professionally and don't know a damned thing about how vulnerable and beatable a top Heavyweight can be... even an ATG Heavyweight.

It's awful funny to me that Chamberlain and Ali went around promoting their fight on Television and giving interviews to reporters... AND THEN THE FIGHT NEVER CAME OFF!!!!!

Clear as a bell you hear Ali saying in this video to Chamberlain "I accept your challenge... AFTER I beat a few more contenders IF I beat them." .... WTF ... IF you beat them???? .... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mF57P1uUG0s

WTF are you PROMOTING a fight for if you want to fight a "few more challengers" first???? Makes no sense...

Do you know who Ali blamed in the end???? Ali blamed his manager Herbert Muhammad... Ali said "Herbert Muhammad won't let me fight Wilt Chamberlain." .... He had to come up with something. Chamberlain scared him to death.

And people continually compare Joshua to losers like Frank Bruno and Mac Foster??? ... Foster couldn't get out of his own way... Joshua won the Super Stars Competition with top athletes from every sport competing... In fact Joshua has been the ONLY HEAVYWEIGHT BOXER WHO EVER DID WELL IN SUPER STARS... Joshua is a great athlete... That's a good start on being a great boxer... A lot of Heavyweight boxers out there are terrible athletes... Like Foster and Bruno were.

And lets talk about Shavers.

Shavers had a few good showings against top Heavyweights like Ali and Holmes.... But he didn't win.... And those efforts don't wipe out his many KO losses at the hands of Ron Stander, Jerry Quarry, Tex Cobb etc... Those loaded swing were generally missing ANY skilled opponent he fought... And Earnie was there to be hit... A high skill level just wasn't there and he wasn't real big, strong, or tough... He went about 210 tops... He was more legend than real.

[Flump]

AJ is a work in progress still, too early to definitively say who he'd beat and who he wouldn't. All the other fighters mentioned had a career that played out so you can point to fights where they struggled or lost to support your theories.

His only, by historical standards, good opponent had him on the floor and gassed but he showed heart to turn it around. So he has ticked some boxes but until we know the measure of the man it's hard to say.

- Well, now Flumpsie, you appear to be a lifetime work in progress still waiting for your introduction into Boxing 101.

Here's an introductory course I penned in an expansion of a previous posting where the topic was talked about in quite a more comprehensive fashion just before the Wlad fight. Really, now, will you tell us what grade are you in now?

{{ }}

Anthony Joshua: age 27, 18-0, 18 KO, 44 rounds, 3-0, 3 KO title record. The Josh prime pro career has only just started, yet he is currently the best he’s ever been, so how does that stack up with the best heavyweights ever in a fair comparison, F-A-I-R being the keyword here?

Cross referencing the timelines involved using statistical variables yields the following:

Jack Dempsey 12-1-5, 11 KO 1916, age 19, no contender 5 years before title

Joe Louis 18-0, 14 KO 1935, age 21, no contender 2 years before title

Rocky Marciano 18-0, 17 KO 1949, age 25, no contender 3 year before title

Muhammad Ali 18-0, 14 KO 1963, age 22, one contender Doug Jones 1 year before title

Joe Frazier 18-0, 16 KO 1967, age 23, no contender 1 year before title

George Foreman 18-0, 15 KO 1970, age 21, no contender 3 years before title

Larry Holmes 18-0, 13 KO 1975, age 26, no contender 3 years before title

Mike Tyson 18-0, 18 KO 1986, age 19, no contender 9 months before title

Lennox Lewis 18-0, 16 KO 1991, age 26, no contender 2 years before title

Wladimir Klitschko 18-0, 17 KO 1998, age 21, no contender 2 years before title

My conclusion: Josh whoops all save the possibilities of still green Joe Louis, Foreman, Tyson, or Wlad getting to him. Josh easily whoops all their comp at that stage with not many of Josh’s comp being whooped by their comp as they build their records on the timeline. Josh represents the new continuation of supersized heavyweights that has taken over the division since the reigns of Lewis and the Klitschkos. His biggest advantage besides size/strength/boxing ability is being a fully mature age 27 in his athletic prime years with unparalleled success, scarcely losing a round. Most of the others were much younger at the same stage and less developed.

These I take to be the protagonists’ best fight showing dominance without controversy or officiating help: Joshua–undefeated Dillon Whyte pretitle

Jack Dempsey–KO champion Jess Willard in a epic beatdown

Joe Louis– KO rematch of 52-7-4 Max Schmeling in the biggest ever fight of the day broadcast by radio internationally to an estimated 70 million radios with uncounted numbers of listeners in dozens of countries gathered wherever a radio could pick up the relayed broadcasts

Rocky Marciano– KO 149-19-8 LH champ Archie Moore

Muhammad Ali– UD 39-4 WBA champ Ernie Terrell

Joe Frazier– UD Undefeated champ Ali in Fight of The Century/Fight of the Year

George Foreman– KO undefeated champ Joe Frazier

Larry Holmes– UD 20-2 contender Randall Cobb
.
Mike Tyson– UD undefeated WBC champ Tony Tucker

Lennox Lewis– UD once defeated 37-1 contender David Tua

Wlad Klitschko– UD undefeated Alexander Povetkin in his homeland of Russia while Russia was engaged in a low level war against Klitschko’s native Ukraine, so political animosity and armament was off the shelf.

Could Joe Louis beat Max Schmeling with the rematch being held in Nazi Germany? We can’t say other to note it was easier to beat Max in Yankee Stadium than to travel to hostile Berlin. Can Wlad beat Josh in front of 90,000 screaming meemies in England’s Wembley Stadium? In two weeks we’ll have that answer.

My conclusion for now: Dempsey, Tyson, Frazier, Foreman, Lewis, and Wlad comprehensively whooped better fighters than did Josh, and certainly Rocky also by the legendary status of Moore who might well whoop Whyte also even if a bit of a stretch size and age wise. Whyte vs Terrell or Cobb would be good 50-50 scraps. I could go into the 2nd and 3rd best bouts showing dominance, but this project just a short refresher of the historical timelines of these fighters, and by the end of his career, Josh surely will have many more scalps in comparison. Thing is, if Josh whoops Wlad in his upcoming, bingo, now he has a comparable victory to Frazier.

Finally, let’s look at where the fighters were at age 27 as Josh currently is.

Jack Dempsey age 27, out of boxing for that year, title record 4-0, 4 KO.

Joe Louis age 27, beat Buddy Baer, Billy Conn, Lou Nova, Buddy Baer rematch, Abe Simon, all title fights before being inducted into the Army for 3 yrs. Title record of 22-0, 19 KO.

Rocky Marciano age 27, usually by KO beat Tiger Ted Lowry, Bill Wilson, Keen Simmons, Harold Mitchell, Art Henri, Willis Applegate, Rex Layne, and Freddie Beshore, all pre-title fights the year before his title with Rex Layne being his first Ring ranked scalp.

Muhammad Ali age 27, in boxing exile up before the US Supreme Court for judgement with a title record of 10-0, 8 KO.

Joe Frazier age 27, BTFO out of Ali in FOTC/FOY. Title record 8-0, 6 KO.

George Foreman age 27, KOed Ron Lyle, Joe Frazier, Scott Le Doux, and Dino Denis at the start of his comeback from Ali loss, title record of 3-1, 3 KO.

Larry Holmes age 27, beat Tom Prater, Horace Robinson, and Fred Houpe, all unranked pre-title fights 2 years before his title.

Mike Tyson age 27 incarcerated on bogus rape charges arranged by DKing. Title record of 10-1, 8 KO.

Lennox Lewis age 27, beat Razor Ruddock and then Tony Tucker for his first title(vacated by Big Dummy Bowe)

Wlad Klitschko age 27, beat a couple of minor fringe contenders looking for his 2nd title, title record of 6-1, 5 KO.

My conclusion: Ali and Tyson were unavailable, but more proven and would be the favorites. Rocky and Holmes were too poorly tutored to beat Josh if ever. Lewis was near the same unproven stage as Josh, but Dempsey, Louis, Foreman, and Wlad were more proven and have excellent chances of knocking Josh out with Josh being the underdog. As much as I love Frazier, this a bad size and style matchup for him that I’d pick Josh over in spite of Frazier being more proven. Lewis knocking out washed up versions of Razor Ruddock and Tony Tucker yields no confidence in him as he always looked ready to faint when entering the ring. Josh in comparison has the Eric Molina defense to take him to a 3-0, 3KO title record, and he’s coming up on the Wlad challenge, so he has 7 more months to make his 27 year old destiny.

In summary: Josh is up there by many measures in his current form or has surpassed many on this list at the comparable timelines, most particularly at the comparative 18-0 marks. He still has quite the gauntlet to traverse before being mentioned with the upper echelons of greats as I’m sure most already instinctively know.

Well thanks for the statistics, most interesting. Not quite so much thanks for displaying a rare strain of illiteracy.

However the question was who in boxing history can demolish Anthony Joshua, not who at the same stage in their career could demolish Anthony Joshua. So I'm sorry to say that your meandering mixture of statistics, half truths and supposition are for this argument utterly irrelevant.

I'm just sorry, as I suspect we all are, that you had use several more words than usual to make a fool of yourself. I look forward to your next unfocused ramble with all the enthusiasm of my next colonoscopy....

[BroughtonRulesRefuge]

Well thanks for the statistics, most interesting. Not quite so much thanks for displaying a rare strain of illiteracy.

However the question was who in boxing history can demolish Anthony Joshua, not who at the same stage in their career could demolish Anthony Joshua. So I'm sorry to say that your meandering mixture of statistics, half truths and supposition are for this argument utterly irrelevant.

I'm just sorry, as I suspect we all are, that you had use several more words than usual to make a fool of yourself. I look forward to your next unfocused ramble with all the enthusiasm of my next colonoscopy....

- Sorry to hear about your upcoming brain surgery, but maybe a good purgatory solution might give your surgeon a reprieve from the rubber gloves.

My stat's show Joshua up with the elite on the timelines as well as passing a few, and in his current form there are only a handful of heavies that could possibly beat him with none being a guarantee, something obvious those of us not sequestered in their nether regions as you demonstrate in your potty posting history.

[Flump]

Well thanks for the statistics, most interesting. Not quite so much thanks for displaying a rare strain of illiteracy.

However the question was who in boxing history can demolish Anthony Joshua, not who at the same stage in their career could demolish Anthony Joshua. So I'm sorry to say that your meandering mixture of statistics, half truths and supposition are for this argument utterly irrelevant.

I'm just sorry, as I suspect we all are, that you had use several more words than usual to make a fool of yourself. I look forward to your next unfocused ramble with all the enthusiasm of my next colonoscopy....

- Sorry to hear about your upcoming brain surgery, but maybe a good purgatory solution might give your surgeon a reprieve from the rubber gloves.

My stat's show Joshua up with the elite on the timelines as well as passing a few, and in his current form there are only a handful of heavies that could possibly beat him with none being a guarantee, something obvious those of us not sequestered in their nether regions as you demonstrate in your potty posting history.

Ordinarily in instances where a clueless buffoon masquerading as a guru still harbours their point in spite of missing the original point I would come up with some smartass remark to make them look ridiculous.

In your case, I'm just going to let you speak for yourself...

[Kalan]

My list would be 100 names or better long, but Earnie Shavers would have poleaxed him definitely.

Yeah.... Just like you think Max Baer should have poleaxed Jimmy Braddock... Only he couldn't and you don't accept it...

And like Shavers poleaxed Ron Stander, Jerry Quarry, and Tex Cobb.... Except they absorbed everything Earnie threw and then beat the living shitt out of the chinny swinger... I can still see Earnie falling on his face when novice Stander belted him out... Shavers didn't want a rematch with the green fat kid..... And it's not as if you could miss Stander with a punch.

Earnie also went 15 rounds with Ali, and nearly kayoed him. He also nearly kayoed Larry Holmes. He also beat a fair amount of guys that were rarely ever stopped like Bugner. Sometimes people have off nights.

What fascinates me is how many people are saying AJ is the greatest ever, when he has yet to even prove he's the best man of his own era. It's Gerry Cooney all over again as far as I'm concerned, except now it's The Great Black Hope. He reminds me of the much ballyhooed Mac Foster, until Quarry knocked him out. The hype is huge on Joshua, but I'm not sold.

YOU don't have to be sold... You're not sold on the idea that Braddock beat Baer... Max Baer admitted that he had no boxing brain and said.., "I was never meant to be a boxer. Maybe an actor... maybe a lumberjack... maybe a pitchman... never a boxer ... I was as clever as Humpty Dumpty."

Comparing Anthony Joshua to Gerry Cooney is like comparing Vitali Klitschko to Michael Grant.. Grant was wide open like Cooney.. Ask Tomasz Adamek the difference cuz he fought both Vitali and Grant and he hasn’t hit Vitali yet.. At least Grant scored a clean win over punching bag Andrew Golota.. Bowe couldn’t do that.

Earnie Shavers got hit with everything.. His motto was "Kill or be Killed." ... You can't get to the top swinging for the fences unless you were lucky enough become the top contender in 1952... Shavers would have had a good shot back then.

Joshua outsmarted Wladimir Klitschko - one of the most intelligent and experienced ATG Heavyweight Champions... Josh got floored and Wladimir fans screamed "HE'S DONE... HE'S DONE!!!" You could see AJ talking to Klitschko in the 6th while Wlad was missing big shots.. "What were you telling Wlad?" .... "I was telling Wladimir, 'You have to finish me this round... If you don't I'm going to come back and knock you out.'" ... It looked like Wladimir was in control, but Joshua was.

It wasn't going to end well for unfortunate and unskilled big, tall guys like Riddick Bowe... For every shot Bowe landed he took 3.... Watch the first 3 rounds of Bowe versus Little Herbie Hide... If Bowe fought anybody who was a smart boxer he got hammered. Boxing was the wrong sport for him because he lacked the mental equipment for it. Bowe got away with ducking all the big punchers of his era -- Lewis, Mercer, McCall, Tyson, Tua etc... But he still got beaten to trash.

Evander Holyfield??? Holy gave his best and did fine -- but he got beaten by John Ruiz of all people... Ruiz knocked Holy down with a right hand... If Ruiz hits you with a slew of rights you can't be real good... Ruiz couldn't hit former Middleweight Champion Roy Jones in the ass with a hand full of sand. Roy had a solid defense.

Ali??? ... I have said Ali was a great fighter...and that's true...but he had his vulnerabilities like everybody.. He was too hittable and it was never going to end well for him.. Left hooks found a home on Ali's chin.. Not only did little guys like Sonny Banks and Henry Cooper deck Ali with left hooks, but Smokin' Joe landed a ton of them smack on his chin – almost too many to count really.. After their MSG fight, Ali looked like he was smuggling cantaloupes in his jaw.

Anthony Joshua doesn’t get ripped with anything. He doesn’t have those vulnerabilities that many ATG Heavyweights Champions had. He’s the best blend of offense and defense the Heavyweight Division has seen so far.

[gilgamesh]

^ Proof one more time that Kalan is a teenager (or at least thinks like one) and simply does not understand the effect that aging has on the body. He points to Holyfield's performances against Ruiz as if these are a reflection of a Prime Holyfield.

[Kalan]

Blaming your poor performances on age is another excuse... For anyone under 40, age is more of a mental barrier than a physical one... Up til 40 you overcome physical decline with far greater wisdom, skills, and knowledge of your craft.

Holyfield was 38 when he was floored and beaten by the none too smart, slick, or skilled John Ruiz....

Wladimir Klitschko was 38 when he fought his best fight against undefeated number 1 challenger, Kubrat Pulev smashing him out cold with brutal left hooks..

Larry Holmes was 42 when he outsmarted and out-slicked Undefeated Heavyweight Champion Ray Mercer (Mercer was stripped of the Title for fighting Holmes). Mercer knocked out Tommy Morrison and Francesco Damiani in his previous 2 fights - both Heavyweight Championship Fights, but he couldn't deal with Holmes.

George Foreman was 45 when he scored a KO victory over Undefeated Lineal Heavyweight Champion Michael Moorer.

And my kids have teenagers... I'm as old or older than about anyone who posts here... I guess I'm young at heart... Back in the '50's there was a popular song that went... "If you should survive til a hundred and five -- think of all you'll derive just by being alive... And here is the best part... You'll have a head start... If you are among the very young at heart."

[MrGuy]

I think he's got a chance against any of threm.

There are a few that I think would find a way to beat h im.

Foreman and Joshua is a 50/50 in my mind.....Holmes beats him, Lewis is a good bet, Ali would devise a plan that would outpoint him. I think he has a better than even chance against Liston and Tyson. Not sure I'd bet on a Holyfield encounter. IF this is his peak, then the K bros are good bets to beat him.....if he continues to improve.....then these odds shift a bit.

The smaller Heavyweights that were great would have a lot of work cut out for them. The Dempseys, Marciano's G.T and such. Hard to imagine them being able to deal with his size and abilities. I would favor him there.

I think he has to be careful against Wilder...but I'd favor Joshua.

The idea that "he's the best that's ever been" is a stretch to my way of thinking.

He beat an overrated old Wlad. Maybe he ends up being the best ever. From whats been seen so far though, not a chance against those guys. How does he beat Foreman and Tyson and lose to the Klitschkos?

[MrGuy]

Foreman, Frazier, Ali, Holyfield, Tyson, Lewis, Vitali, prime Wlad, Bowe, Holmes. For the moment I give AJ almost no chances against the legends.

Foreman would be easily outboxed in much better fashion than Jimmy Young did it .....

Holyfield was wide open for right hands from a tall fighter unless he chose to box, in which case he wouldn't stand a chance in Hell ..... As history proves, Lewis was wide open for right hand bombs from a good thrower with good height. He's a 1 or 2 round job for AJ ...... Vitali would be out boxed over 12. His legs were very stiff from massive Kickboxing injuries

Bowe was a punching bag and the dumbest fk of the group. He was a coward and a lazy assed trainer. So he'd be the easiest out ..... Wlad is the most dangerous, but AJ would outsmart him, and outlast him like he did last time ..... Holmes would be the toughest guy to outbox - but AJ is too big, strong, and quick for him. Larry had the reach on everybody he fought, but would be giving up reach and length to AJ. Larry would get behind, get careless, and get KO'd.

There has absolutely been NOBODY in Fistic History with Anthony Joshua combination of height, weight, reach, speed, power, smarts, and endurance over 12 rounds.... He was fresh as a daisy in the 11th round with Klitschko, pummeling Wladimir into a powder with non-stop combinations -- while Wlad was clearly spent physically and a gone goose.

Tyson Fury would be no different for Joshua.... Fury did nothing but control the distance with Wlad with his jab.... He stunk the place out with slow pacing and waiting all night for Wladimir to throw somthing or take the lead... It was a super slow fight like the Lewis-Holyfield stinkers... Joshua put on an ATG performance after he had all of 43 amateur fights and 44 professional rounds ... many of them shortened rounds.... We haven't seen this talent level before...

He has nowhere near the pure boxing ability of Young. Foreman destroys Joshua, Fury, and Wilder all in the same night. He beat an overrated old Wlad. A guy who spent most of his time clinching isnt an ATG.

[Kalan]

He beat an overrated old Wlad. Maybe he ends up being the best ever. From whats been seen so far though, not a chance against those guys. How does he beat Foreman and Tyson and lose to the Klitschkos?

ANSWER -- He DIDN'T lose to the Klitschkos... WTF? ... He knocked Wladimir down 3 times and finished him off... He wasn't as sloppy as Wilder and Ortiz were... They both looked awful and out of control... Joshua looked sharp and controlled throughout and was legitimately leading on all the scorecards... Wilder wasn't legitimately leading on all cards.

How could Foreman lose to weak little feather hitter Jimmy Young and and ever beat Joshua??? .... Impossible

And how could Tyson get knocked out by the chinny, 42 to 1 underdog (losing all the way) Buster Douglas and ever have a prayer of beating Joshua??? .... It's not happening in a million years.

Mikey was too small, short, and stubby .... and lacking in overall boxing skills to EVER beat a master boxer who stands 6'6" X 250 and is the biggest bomber you ever saw... George was too slow, unskilled, and easy to hit with everything to have a prayer of beating the much more skilled Joshua -- who is very fast, smart, cool under fire, and bigger and stronger.

George and Mikey looked terrible in their losses to massive underdogs...

People are trying to make Joshua out to be a loser -- when he's won every single fight he's had by KO... The only Heavyweight Champion in History who's won 5 Title Fights to have a record of all KO wins.

[MrGuy]

He beat an overrated old Wlad. Maybe he ends up being the best ever. From whats been seen so far though, not a chance against those guys. How does he beat Foreman and Tyson and lose to the Klitschkos?

ANSWER -- He DIDN'T lose to the Klitschkos... WTF? ... He knocked Wladimir down 3 times and finished him off... He wasn't as sloppy as Wilder and Ortiz were... They both looked awful and out of control... Joshua looked sharp and controlled throughout and was legitimately leading on all the scorecards... Wilder wasn't legitimately leading on all cards.

How could Foreman lose to weak little feather hitter Jimmy Young and and ever beat Joshua??? .... Impossible

And how could Tyson get knocked out by the chinny, 42 to 1 underdog (losing all the way) Buster Douglas and ever have a prayer of beating Joshua??? .... It's not happening in a million years.

Mikey was too small, short, and stubby .... and lacking in overall boxing skills to EVER beat a master boxer who stands 6'6" X 250 and is the biggest bomber you ever saw... George was too slow, unskilled, and easy to hit with everything to have a prayer of beating the much more skilled Joshua -- who is very fast, smart, cool under fire, and bigger and stronger.

George and Mikey looked terrible in their losses to massive underdogs...

People are trying to make Joshua out to be a loser -- when he's never lost...

Learn to read. It was implied he would beat Foreman and Tyson while losing to the Klitschkos. I didnt make the statement. You seem to believe these guys keep getting better as they've become bigger. Thats why we just witnessed the worst modern heavyweight era ever. Jab and grab is all.most of these huge guys do. In a real fight Tyson and Foreman kill these bums.

[Kalan]

You're full of it... How much clinching did you see in Joshua-Klitschko and Wilder-Ortiz... You saw clinching when Wilder was hurt and Ortiz was hurt -- otherwise not much at all in either fight... Ali used holding in place of an inside defense... It's an illegal tactic under Queensberry Rules and Ali should have had points deducted like Klitschko did.

Ali grabbed Foreman 20 times in just the 1st round... Along with tons of wrestling and shoving his head down... Ali grabbed Frazier repeatedly in their rematch... It was marred by holding throughout.. You are also going to see very little holding in the Joshua-Parker Fight.. Guys who can fight inside and out don't need to hold.

[Kalan]

Foreman, Frazier, Ali, Holyfield, Tyson, Lewis, Vitali, prime Wlad, Bowe, Holmes. For the moment I give AJ almost no chances against the legends.

Foreman would be easily outboxed in much better fashion than Jimmy Young did it .....

Holyfield was wide open for right hands from a tall fighter unless he chose to box, in which case he wouldn't stand a chance in Hell ..... As history proves, Lewis was wide open for right hand bombs from a good thrower with good height. He's a 1 or 2 round job for AJ ...... Vitali would be out boxed over 12. His legs were very stiff from massive Kickboxing injuries

Bowe was a punching bag and the dumbest fk of the group. He was a coward and a lazy assed trainer. So he'd be the easiest out ..... Wlad is the most dangerous, but AJ would outsmart him, and outlast him like he did last time ..... Holmes would be the toughest guy to outbox - but AJ is too big, strong, and quick for him. Larry had the reach on everybody he fought, but would be giving up reach and length to AJ. Larry would get behind, get careless, and get KO'd.

There has absolutely been NOBODY in Fistic History with Anthony Joshua combination of height, weight, reach, speed, power, smarts, and endurance over 12 rounds.... He was fresh as a daisy in the 11th round with Klitschko, pummeling Wladimir into a powder with non-stop combinations -- while Wlad was clearly spent physically and a gone goose.

Tyson Fury would be no different for Joshua.... Fury did nothing but control the distance with Wlad with his jab.... He stunk the place out with slow pacing and waiting all night for Wladimir to throw somthing or take the lead... It was a super slow fight like the Lewis-Holyfield stinkers... Joshua put on an ATG performance after he had all of 43 amateur fights and 44 professional rounds ... many of them shortened rounds.... We haven't seen this talent level before...

He has nowhere near the pure boxing ability of Young. Foreman destroys Joshua, Fury, and Wilder all in the same night. He beat an overrated old Wlad. A guy who spent most of his time clinching isnt an ATG.

Oh BULLCRAP!!! ... Young has 18 losses to go against 34 wins... After beating Foreman, he lost 3 of his next four fights... All Young had to do to get a shot at Larry Holmes was beat 10-win novice Ossie Ocasio in 2 attempts... He lost both fights... The inept Ocasio got the Title shot at Holmes -- and boy did Ocasio get his ass ripped 10 ways to Sunday.

Foreman gets out-boxed by anyone with a jab as quick and slick as Young's... But Joshua has a much better jab than Young and 10 X the right hand punching power... Even cloddishly slow Gerry Cooney beat the crap out of Young when he was at his best.. Cooney was super hittable, but Young couldn't reach him... Young is a short little guy and Cooney was too big and tall for him... Joshua is taller, faster, and 20 pounds heavier than wide open target, Cooney... AJ can slip and duck punches very well... Foreman couldn't slip a thing... He was at the mercy of a great jab and straight right hand... AJ has the best right hand leads ever.

[Crease]

Size & weight aren't everything.

AJ might be amazed by the ferocity of the attacks of Dempsey, Marciano, Frazier & Tyson.

And he might not be able to get near guys like Ali & Holmes.

[Kalan]

Joshua has the height and range on those guys... He reaches them very easily... Short guys like Shavers and Snipes floored Holmes with big swinging right hands... He could be reached.. Norton jabbed the crap out of Ali.. Kenny didn't have a slick jab, but I had him winning all 3 Ali fights... Ali and Holmes both had a lot of gloves in their faces from various 2nd raters.

As far as Marciano goes, he had no competition... If he had to face a big guy like Liston he would have been squashed like Patterson... Dempsey never fought a black contender and couldn't stop Light Heavyweight Tommy Gibbons... Tyson was run over by massive 42 to 1 underdog, Buster Douglas... Frazier was crushed by 6'3" X 217 George Foreman... Basically I don't see any of those guys doing crap to Joshua... They weren't skilled enough and very small and weak compared to AJ.

[MrGuy]

Foreman would be easily outboxed in much better fashion than Jimmy Young did it .....

Holyfield was wide open for right hands from a tall fighter unless he chose to box, in which case he wouldn't stand a chance in Hell ..... As history proves, Lewis was wide open for right hand bombs from a good thrower with good height. He's a 1 or 2 round job for AJ ...... Vitali would be out boxed over 12. His legs were very stiff from massive Kickboxing injuries

Bowe was a punching bag and the dumbest fk of the group. He was a coward and a lazy assed trainer. So he'd be the easiest out ..... Wlad is the most dangerous, but AJ would outsmart him, and outlast him like he did last time ..... Holmes would be the toughest guy to outbox - but AJ is too big, strong, and quick for him. Larry had the reach on everybody he fought, but would be giving up reach and length to AJ. Larry would get behind, get careless, and get KO'd.

There has absolutely been NOBODY in Fistic History with Anthony Joshua combination of height, weight, reach, speed, power, smarts, and endurance over 12 rounds.... He was fresh as a daisy in the 11th round with Klitschko, pummeling Wladimir into a powder with non-stop combinations -- while Wlad was clearly spent physically and a gone goose.

Tyson Fury would be no different for Joshua.... Fury did nothing but control the distance with Wlad with his jab.... He stunk the place out with slow pacing and waiting all night for Wladimir to throw somthing or take the lead... It was a super slow fight like the Lewis-Holyfield stinkers... Joshua put on an ATG performance after he had all of 43 amateur fights and 44 professional rounds ... many of them shortened rounds.... We haven't seen this talent level before...

He has nowhere near the pure boxing ability of Young. Foreman destroys Joshua, Fury, and Wilder all in the same night. He beat an overrated old Wlad. A guy who spent most of his time clinching isnt an ATG.

Oh BULLCRAP!!! ... Young has 18 losses to go against 34 wins... After beating Foreman, he lost 3 of his next four fights... All Young had to do to get a shot at Larry Holmes was beat 10-win novice Ossie Ocasio in 2 attempts... He lost both fights... The inept Ocasio got the Title shot at Holmes -- and boy did Ocasio get his ass ripped 10 ways to Sunday.

Foreman gets out-boxed by anyone with a jab as quick and slick as Young's... But Joshua has a much better jab than Young and 10 X the right hand punching power... Even cloddishly slow Gerry Cooney beat the crap out of Young when he was at his best.. Cooney was super hittable, but Young couldn't reach him... Young is a short little guy and Cooney was too big and tall for him... Joshua is taller, faster, and 20 pounds heavier than wide open target, Cooney... AJ can slip and duck punches very well... Foreman couldn't slip a thing... He was at the mercy of a great jab and straight right hand... AJ has the best right hand leads ever.

Young fought years past what he should've. Joshua is nowhere near the pure boxer he is. I dont care about Foremans faults. Sooner or later Joshua would be head first into the canvas.

[Kalan]

You're living in a Fantasy Land where the only good Heavyweights fought in the 70's.... You'll never see Joshua eat jabs like Foreman did... You'll never see him get knocked down by a feather hitter who weighs 211 - who couldn't beat a Cruiserweight... Young already had 5 losses going into the Foreman fight... Foreman was a massive favorite.

George was so embarrassed he quit the ring for 10 years after losing that fight.

[BoxBuzz]

Based on how the fight went with Wlad.....I think it's very reasonable to assume that Wlad in his Prime would CERTAINLY have beaten Joshua on that night. Just look how very good a rather old Wlad did against this guy who is currently being touted as POSSIBLY the best ever.....by certain overly optimistic supports like K-land.

Seems WAY too early to gift this guy special status. He could even have an unlucky night against Wilder and be kissing the canvas. Now I say "unlucky" because I happen to think that Joshua is better than Wilder and SHOULD win that fight.
'
But like Kalan correctly points out......even the Greats can be vulnerable......I mean that old washed up K bro had AJ down on the canvas as I recall.

Or did I just dream that?