Joe Joyce's career path

[sweetviolenturge]

I'm finding the way in which the "Juggernaught'" is going about his career very, very interesting. I don't recall a heavyweight being fast-tracked in this manner since Leon Spinks & even Leon started out fighting club fighters in six round bouts at the beginning of his career. He didn't fight his first ten round main event until he met Scott Ledoux in his sixth pro fight while Joyce fought a ten rounder right away in his pro debut. And having won the Commonwealth title in just his fourth pro contest Joyce fought a scheduled 12 rounder sooner than any other heavyweight that I can recall.
I wonder who's next? Hopefully, his people will be able to convince Dereck Chisora to take the fight. That will be an excellent barometer for Joyce. If he struggles ( or loses, of course ) then they know that it'll be time to slow things down & allow him to learn with a few more fights before stepping him up again. But, if he should KO Chisora then a top ten contender should follow within another fight or two.
If Chisora elects to not take the fight then Joyce's people should bring in someone like a Christian Hammer. A decent, experienced heavyweight who took Tyson deep & went 12 full rounds with Povetkin. A victory over him would be equitable to a win over Chisora.

[forcefraser]

Hammer didn’t really take Fury deep though did he? He was dominated every minute of every round before quitting.

Joyce is a 32 year old Olympian with over a dozen WBS fights behind him. He should be in decent level fights now, so it’s no surprise really.

I’d like to see him in with the likes of Miller, Kowaki, Breazel, Pulev. Throw the dice with him and get him in the mix. It’s not like he’s a teenager with no experience.

[joshj909]

Also worth considering who is going to take the fight. Chisora has already turned it down because losing to a 4-0 fighter ruins his ranking and reputation for those who don't know much about Joyce's amateur experience. Others would most likely follow suit unless there was enough money.

I think he could take on one of the ageing guys and take some decent ranking points before getting himself a shot at a contender, someone like Stiverne, Wach, Ustinov, Hammer. Someone like Takam would be a huge win but could be too risky too early.

Or take out one of the boxers weirdly high in the org rankings like Guillermo jones, Trevor Bryan (WBA), Laron Mitchell, Ebenezzer Tetteh (WBO).

[Lackeos]

Yeah, it was insane how Leon Spinks was fighting better opponents at age 23 than Joe Joyce is fighting at age 32. You could say it's amazing that a 32-year-old has already progressed to fighting opponents as good as Lenroy Thomas. That is way better than someone like Artur Szpilka, Andy Ruiz Jr, or Tom Schwarz; who were fighting opponents of that caliber when they were 23. Or Hughie Fury, beating Rudenko when he was 20. Or Agit Kabayel, beating way better opposition at age 25. So yeah, you could say Joe Joyce is a rare breed. If Joyce has already progressed this far by age 32, imagine how good he'll be when he's 50!

[Controversial]

He has a great engine which gives him a big advantage over a lot of the lumbering type HWs who are knackered after a few rounds. He isn't particularly great at anything but his sheer size, weight and fitness will give many fighters trouble.

[Enlightened-One]

Joe Joyce delivered an incredibly disappointing performance in his most recent performance against Lenroy Thomas.

The Brit is very agile, mobile, possesses relatively fast hands and has a high world-rate, but his technique is lacking somewhat and he doesn’t appear to be particularly heavy-handed either.

In his most recent outing, he forgot to use the jab and was throwing wide clumsy hooks, with many missing the mark.

He also kept his hands dangerously low and was walking into punching range against his overmatched journeyman with a complete disregard for protecting himself against his opponents’ blows.

And finally, his footwork was dire. He was walking in straight lines, walking towards his opponent instead of cutting off the ring.

Joe lacked finesse and appeared to be very clumsy with the execution of his offence and only won that bout due to his superior size and athleticism.

Joyce’s age means that his promoter and manager must fast-track his career, but I am very sceptical about his punching power and skill levels, because I feel that those areas are his weaknesses.

I reckon Joe Joyce’s career path will be similar to the previously over-hyped Michael Grant. He’ll inevitably gain some level of success during the remainder of his career, but will surely always come up short at world-level.

[sweetviolenturge]

Also worth considering who is going to take the fight. Chisora has already turned it down because losing to a 4-0 fighter ruins his ranking and reputation for those who don't know much about Joyce's amateur experience. Others would most likely follow suit unless there was enough money.

I think he could take on one of the ageing guys and take some decent ranking points before getting himself a shot at a contender, someone like Stiverne, Wach, Ustinov, Hammer. Someone like Takam would be a huge win but could be too risky too early.

Or take out one of the boxers weirdly high in the org rankings like Guillermo jones, Trevor Bryan (WBA), Laron Mitchell, Ebenezzer Tetteh (WBO).

Exactly. Joyce seems to be in a sort of Twilight zone where the fighters that he should be facing like Chisora are reluctant to face him for fear of losing their ranking & status to a 4-0 fighter. But, being on the fast track like he is it's not really an option for him to take a step back & start fighting the usual record padding mediocre opponents with losing records. So, perhaps pursuing a world ranking by beating someone already in the top fifteen but who can't afford to overprice themselves like Hammer, Tetteh, Mitchell, John Pierre Augustine etc. would be the best option. Then he could keep busy with men like Joey Dawejko who might be good enough to give him some good rounds of experience & allow us to gauge where Joyce is at since Dawejko has taken rated fighters like Amir Mansour & Bryant Jennings the 10 round limit in competitive fights. The winner of the upcoming Antonio Tarver - Travis Kaufmann bout could be an option as well.

[joshj909]

Also worth considering who is going to take the fight. Chisora has already turned it down because losing to a 4-0 fighter ruins his ranking and reputation for those who don't know much about Joyce's amateur experience. Others would most likely follow suit unless there was enough money.

I think he could take on one of the ageing guys and take some decent ranking points before getting himself a shot at a contender, someone like Stiverne, Wach, Ustinov, Hammer. Someone like Takam would be a huge win but could be too risky too early.

Or take out one of the boxers weirdly high in the org rankings like Guillermo jones, Trevor Bryan (WBA), Laron Mitchell, Ebenezzer Tetteh (WBO).

Exactly. Joyce seems to be in a sort of Twilight zone where the fighters that he should be facing like Chisora are reluctant to face him for fear of losing their ranking & status to a 4-0 fighter. But, being on the fast track like he is it's not really an option for him to take a step back & start fighting the usual record padding mediocre opponents with losing records. So, perhaps pursuing a world ranking by beating someone already in the top fifteen but who can't afford to overprice themselves like Hammer, Tetteh, Mitchell, John Pierre Augustine etc. would be the best option. Then he could keep busy with men like Joey Dawejko who might be good enough to give him some good rounds of experience & allow us to gauge where Joyce is at since Dawejko has taken rated fighters like Amir Mansour & Bryant Jennings the 10 round limit in competitive fights. The winner of the upcoming Antonio Tarver - Travis Kaufmann bout could be an option as well.

Couldn't agree more. I think Joyce and Haye should be looking up the previous paydays of some of these guys and seeing what they can offer to pay them knowing they will more than likely lose. I just don't see a big name like Chisora or Miller taking this fight while they can still afford to say no. Most of these others guys don't make as much money as Chisora so it's probably better looking outside of England because the UK purses are sky-high at the moment.

I think that a fight with Hammer is probably the best possible available to increase org rankings (WBA9, IBF12, WBO13), boxrec (12) ranking and maybe some European notability. Hammer takes tough fights when it means he might progress but i don't know how much he'd take it for a potentially big loss like this.

[sweetviolenturge]

It was announced today that Joyce is going to return to the ring in defense of his Commonwealth crown on June 15. Unfortunately, no opponent has been named thus far. But, obviously it has to be someone eligible to contest for the Commonwealth belt so I suppose that narrows it down a wee bit. Hopefully, it will be someone somewhat decent that will be more than just a warm body for him to knock over.

[funso banjo baby]

for a big guy Joyce doesn't seem to throw very hard punches at all.

[sweetviolenturge]

for a big guy Joyce doesn't seem to throw very hard punches at all.

And yet, they certainly appear to be getting the job done though, don't they?

[joshj909]

It was announced today that Joyce is going to return to the ring in defense of his Commonwealth crown on June 15. Unfortunately, no opponent has been named thus far. But, obviously it has to be someone eligible to contest for the Commonwealth belt so I suppose that narrows it down a wee bit. Hopefully, it will be someone somewhat decent that will be more than just a warm body for him to knock over.

Hughie has said no and Kean/Braidwood fight the same weekend. Limited options by choosing to defend.

I'd say this narrows it down to Teslenko, Miljas, Junior Fa, Rill, Ehwarieme, Leapai, McKean, or someone of an even lower calibre. You'd hope it's one of those first 3 otherwise it won't exactly be an improvement on his last fight.

Other option is finally completing a deal with Chisora.

[Enlightened-One]

for a big guy Joyce doesn't seem to throw very hard punches at all.

And yet, they certainly appear to be getting the job done though, don't they?

Did you watch his fight against Lenroy Thomas? It was the cumulative effect of his shots that forced the premature stoppage, rather than his raw power.

He landed so many punches that were bang on the target, against a journeyman that had been stopped numerous times before, but he had to land a hell of a lot of them in order to drop his opponent, which obviously suggests that Joe Joyce isn't a big puncher.

A lot of prospects are matched against relatively soft touches, in confidence-building type bouts, and the vast majority of them nearly always stop their overmatched opponents en route to their rise to the top, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that all of these rising stars should be considered as being “big punchers”.

[Lackeos]

for a big guy Joyce doesn't seem to throw very hard punches at all.

And yet, they certainly appear to be getting the job done though, don't they?

It is not as though he stopped a teak tough trial horse like Sherman Williams, Fres Oquendo, Oliver McCall, Friday Ahunanya, or Kevin Johnson (before they got super old). He hasn't gotten the job done against any jobs that were hard to get done. Actually, here's an interesting fact about Joyce. He hasn't fought anybody who has ever gone the distance against a single contender.

Actually, if you add all of Joyce's opponents together, you don't even get one journeyman. Seriously. They've collectively fought and lost to Breazeale, Whyte, Fedosov, Rossy (and Joyce x4). They are pretty inexperienced, on top of not being very durable or skilled. An actual journeyman like Zack Page, all by himself, has fought Pianeta, Mike Perez x2, Edmund Gerber, Tyson Fury, Manuel Charr, Luis Ortiz, Juan Carlos Gomez, Yoan Pablo Hernandez, Seth Mitchell, Kubrat Pulev, Johnathon Banks, and various other gatekeepers. And Zack Page has only been stopped 5 times out of his 45 defeats.

[marvelous marv]

I thought Joyce looked somewhat raw. The best thing for him would be to remain very active for the next two years. He should be in line for a big fight by then.

[oogiebe]

I thought Joyce looked somewhat raw. The best thing for him would be to remain very active for the next two years. He should be in line for a big fight by then.

x2

[sweetviolenturge]

for a big guy Joyce doesn't seem to throw very hard punches at all.

And yet, they certainly appear to be getting the job done though, don't they?

It is not as though he stopped a teak tough trial horse like Sherman Williams, Fres Oquendo, Oliver McCall, Friday Ahunanya, or Kevin Johnson (before they got super old). He hasn't gotten the job done against any jobs that were hard to get done. Actually, here's an interesting fact about Joyce. He hasn't fought anybody who has ever gone the distance against a single contender.

Actually, if you add all of Joyce's opponents together, you don't even get one journeyman. Seriously. They've collectively fought and lost to Breazeale, Whyte, Fedosov, Rossy (and Joyce x4). They are pretty inexperienced, on top of not being very durable or skilled. An actual journeyman like Zack Page, all by himself, has fought Pianeta, Mike Perez x2, Edmund Gerber, Tyson Fury, Manuel Charr, Luis Ortiz, Juan Carlos Gomez, Yoan Pablo Hernandez, Seth Mitchell, Kubrat Pulev, Johnathon Banks, and various other gatekeepers. And Zack Page has only been stopped 5 times out of his 45 defeats.

Actually, I think "Kingpin" Johnson would be an OK opponent for him now even though he's badly faded & just got stopped. Then I'd bring in a Dawejko or another type of step-up opponent.

[joshj909]

Looks like Miller has realised the WBA Regular shot might not come for a while, has called out Joyce.

[Pukka Cheese]

Joyce needs to keep doing what he is doing... Knocking out guys and calling out big names.
Haye & Schaefer need to get the cheque book out if they are serious about fast tracking him....

If they can afford Miller and he wants the fight then they should go for it.. I dont see it happening though.
Realistically their best option is Chisora - pay the man what he wants. Apparently Hughie vs Sexton peaked at 2.9m viewers on CH5 and this is a much bigger / better fight imo. Should do huge numbers & a KO victory would really get Joyces name out there.

Noticed old Dereck is also ranked highly (~#4) by the EBU, which is probably the route Joyce should take too.

[oogiebe]

These tweet re-posts are a pain in the arse!!

[KiwiRider]

I'd like Joyce to fight Miller. I don't rate just either yet, maybe I will rate the winner.
Does Haye have the money to get Miller?
It's good Miller has accepted he will not get a go at AJ until next year. He needs to keep busy and in shape.
Out of the top 25 heavys, none have a fight coming up, some have been out for 8 months or more. Sad state of affairs.

[oogiebe]

I'd like Joyce to fight Miller. I don't rate just either yet, maybe I will rate the winner.
Does Haye have the money to get Miller?
It's good Miller has accepted he will not get a go at AJ until next year. He needs to keep busy and in shape.
Out of the top 25 heavys, none have a fight coming up, some have been out for 8 months or more. Sad state of affairs.

That's actually pretty interesting. I'd like to see that too!

[SenorPipino]

Can't see any profit in it for Miller to take on a still raw guy like Joyce.

Joyce isn't a name yet. Has just a few fights. Four. Still an amateur.

What's in it for a top 10 fighter like Big Baby to challenge Joyce?

Hearn was talking about Miller-Joshua this summer. It's unlikely to happen.

It's quite a step down for Miller to change his sights and engage in a semi-high risk/absolutely no reward matchup with Joyce.

[oogiebe]

Can't see any profit in it for Miller to take on a still raw guy like Joyce.

Joyce isn't a name yet. Has just a few fights. Four. Still an amateur.

What's in it for a top 10 fighter like Big Baby to challenge Joyce?

Hearn was talking about Miller-Joshua this summer. It's unlikely to happen.

It's quite a step down for Miller to change his sights and engage in a semi-high risk/absolutely no reward matchup with Joyce.

All that doesn't change my mind. I'd still like to see it. Miller's a puss anyway.

[SenorPipino]

Can't see any profit in it for Miller to take on a still raw guy like Joyce.

Joyce isn't a name yet. Has just a few fights. Four. Still an amateur.

What's in it for a top 10 fighter like Big Baby to challenge Joyce?

Hearn was talking about Miller-Joshua this summer. It's unlikely to happen.

It's quite a step down for Miller to change his sights and engage in a semi-high risk/absolutely no reward matchup with Joyce.

All that doesn't change my mind. I'd still like to see it. Miller's a puss anyway.

Aren't all Big Baby's?