LINEAL TITLE IS ON THE LINE !

[ewenhay]

Oké, but then how should the line continue? Or should we just forget about the price completely?

Simple. The #1 heavyweight fights the #2 heavyweight and the winner is the new lineal champion.

So that made, AJ vs Povetkin and AJ became the winner? Sounds like a good idea to me, I'm sure all Americans agree with this.

No.

Even if you count Fury’s absence as a retirement it would make the lineal title currently vacant.

As others have said the winner of Fury v Wilder would need to face off with Joshua to create a new line.

[tiny_acres]

So that made, AJ vs Povetkin and AJ became the winner? Sounds like a good idea to me, I'm sure all Americans agree with this.

No.

Even if you count Fury’s absence as a retirement it would make the lineal title currently vacant.

As others have said the winner of Fury v Wilder would need to face off with Joshua to create a new line.

And why not Miller? Kownacki? Filip? Name them?

Simply put. Fury, Wilder and Joshua are the 3 best in the division. No matter what you think it is the consensus of the experts.
So the winner of Wilder vs Fury will need to face Joshua to iron out who is the true champ.

It's simple. No need to make it controversial

[Lennox]

Many saw Povetkin as #2 so AJ beating AP was for the lineal title.

Many say Fury vacated the lineal title.

Many say you can't vacate a lineal title unless you retire or fight at another weight.

[tiny_acres]

Many saw Povetkin as #2 so AJ beating AP was for the lineal title.

Many say Fury vacated the lineal title.

Many say you can't vacate a lineal title unless you retire or fight at another weight.

Excluding your ratings system. Very few saw Povetkin as number 2.

[DrDuke]

Fury didn't vacate anything, he was forced to be inactive, but he had never quit the sport. His multiple retirement announcements during the period of absence obviously can't be taken seriously. Fury could have moved down in the rankings, cause resumes of the others kept improving, but Tyson remained to be a lineal champ, cause he didn't retired and continued to be a man, who had defeated the man. So there's still the same lineal champion, it's the Gypsy King himself. It can WBA Regular, it can be WBA Super, it can be WBC, it can be WBC Silver, but there can be only one lineal champion. THERE'S ONLY ONE TYSON FURY!!!

[ewenhay]

Many saw Povetkin as #2 so AJ beating AP was for the lineal title.

Many say Fury vacated the lineal title.

Many say you can't vacate a lineal title unless you retire or fight at another weight.

Povetkin didn't have a belt post Fury’s exile. Which makes him insignificant in this particular equation

[tfgrudin]

Fury is the man who beat the man.

[Oiky]

You ain't the man til you've beaten fury

[greg]

..he has retired and lost it..no problem though if he's the first on the list to get it back..

[tiny_acres]

And why not Miller? Kownacki? Filip? Name them?

Simply put. Fury, Wilder and Joshua are the 3 best in the division. No matter what you think it is the consensus of the experts.
So the winner of Wilder vs Fury will need to face Joshua to iron out who is the true champ.

It's simple. No need to make it controversial

Well, to be fair, Wilder simply hasn't ever fought anyone of the level of Whyte, Miller, Parker, Filip Hrgovic, Joe Joyce, Dubois, Povetkin, Dychko, even Shannon Briggs, Ajagba, name it, anyone with a chin and a punch has allways been avoided.
So, why on earth he's considered to be top 3 is pretty unknown to me. In fact he's barely a heavyweight at all, all the guys I mentioned have fought at a higher weight then Wilder his heaviest weight. For me, Wilder is pretty much a hypejob, he's possibly not even the best heavyweight in America.


This is Deontay Wilder his last KO:
https://www.thesun.ie/video/boxing/deon ... -showdown/

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/boxin ... sh-TV.html

It's just sad to see, he seems to have the IQ of a 4 year old.

Imagine a real heavyweight doing this, the guy in the mascot might very well have died.

Your pure hatred makes you look more foolish than you already do.
No objectivity when you are listing others with way less credibility in their resume

[siablo14]

This is what I make of the lineal champion list:

John L. Sullivan (38-1-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/10547 1892-09-07
Was considered to be the first champion of the world as far as I know, who lost it to:
James J. Corbett (11-4-3) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9021 1897-03-17
Bob Fitzsimmons (61-8-4) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/10552 1899-06-09
James J. Jeffries (19-1-2) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9022 (retired at 1904-08-26 for 6 years and at 1910-07-04 fought:)
Jack Johnson (56-11-8) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/1187
Jess Willard (22-5-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/10602 1915-04-05
Jack Dempsey (54-6-9) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9009 1926-09-23
Gene Tunney (65-1-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9046 (retired without losing at 1928-07-26 so title go's back to:)
Jack Dempsey (54-6-9) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9009 1926-09-23
Who lost it for a second time to Gene Dempsey, so once again back to:
Jack Dempsey (54-6-9) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9009 1926-09-23
Who never lost against anyone else ever either.
So back to
Jess Willard (22-5-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/10602 1915-04-05
That's 11 years back in time (and that's how flaws start happening).
At 1919-07-04 he lost to Jack Dempsey as well, but that fight will be ignored then as well.
Luis Angel Firpo (31-4-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/10607 1923-07-12
Also he lost it against Jack Dempsey at 1923-09-14 so we go back even further then 1915-04-05 to see where the line can continue.
At 1926-05-30 Jack Johnson (who won his title from James J. Jeffries in 1910-07-04) eventually lost his titles, without anyone ever realising it against most likely unknown journeymen at the time:
Bob Lawson (55-32-6) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/11662
Battling Gahee (19-27-5) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/39882 won it a month later and lost it another month later
Red Uhlan (40-31-19) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/35825 1926-08-11
Fred Lenhart (101-22-13) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/34997 1926-10-28 in just his twelfth fight and coming from a loss won the lineal champion title still without anyone realising.
Harry Dillon (36-33-4) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/75705 1927-07-19 in a bout called the Pacific Coast Light Heavyweight Title was the unofficial heavyweight lineal champion of the world
Tiger Flowers (118-15-8) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/11336 1927-08-10
3 months, but 6 wins later, he would die at 16 November 1927 from complications following eye surgery. Just like Gene Tunney and Rocky Marciano,
Tiger Flowers died while beïng the lineal heavyweight champion with a weight of only 167 pounds. So back to:

Harry Dillon (36-33-4) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/75705 1927-07-19
Young Stribling (224-13-14) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/12052 1927-11-04 Now this was a serious heavyweight again, but officially lost on points on 1929-02-27
Jack Sharkey (37-13-3) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/10616 1930-06-12
Max Schmeling (56-10-4) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9041 1932-06-21 lost it back to Jack Sharkey, but "As a result of the controversial decision of this bout, the NYSAC barred any but "boxing experts" (sports writers, referees, judges) from broadcasting descriptions of future matches. "
Jack Sharkey (37-13-3) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/10616
Primo Carnera (88-14-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/12086 1933-06-29
Max Baer (66-13-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/12077 1934-06-14
Jim Braddock (47-24-4) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/12072 1935-06-13
Joe Louis (66-3-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9027 1937-06-22 despite arguably losing a few times, never officially lost till after he claimed he retired, but came back and finally officially lost at:)
Ezzard Charles (95-25-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9012 1950-09-27
Jersey Joe Walcott (51-18-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/11028 1951-05-30
Rocky Marciano (49-0-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9032 1952-09-23 Never lost it, so back to Jersey Joe Walcott 1951-05-30
Jersey Joe Walcott (51-18-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/11028 1951-05-30 Never lost it either, so back to Ezzard Charles 1950-09-27
Ezzard Charles (95-25-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9012 1950-09-27
Rex Layne (50-17-3) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/10351 1952-08-08
Roland LaStarza (57-9-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/12212 1953-02-13 lost it to Rocky Marciano, later lost it to Don Cockell 1954-03-30
Don Cockell (66-14-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/12221 1954-03-30 also lost it to Rocky Marciano, later lost it to Nino Vales 1955-09-13
Nino Valdes (48-18-3) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/10360 1955-09-13 Lost it to Bob Baker 1955-12-07
Bob Baker (51-16-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/12475 1955-12-07 Lost is to Tommy Jackson 1956-02-03
Tommy Jackson (34-9-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/10367 1956-06-08
Floyd Patterson (55-8-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9038 1959-06-26
Ingemar Johansson (26-2-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/12711 1960-06-20 lost it back to
Floyd Patterson (55-8-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9038 1962-09-25
Sonny Liston (50-4-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9031 1964-02-25
Muhammad Ali (56-5-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/180 "Due to legal troubles, Ali would not fight for the next three years.", "He officially retired on 1970-02-01 to allow the winner of the upcoming Joe Frazier-Jimmy Ellis unification bout to be considered the undisputed champion" (Joe Frazier won that bout), a short time later Joe Frazier won from Muhammad Ali as well 1971-03-08
Joe Frazier (32-4-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/147 1973-01-22
George Foreman (76-5-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/90 1974-10-30 Muhammad Ali won it back again
Muhammad Ali (56-5-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/180 1978-02-15
Leon Spinks (26-17-3) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/262 1978-09-15 Back to Muhammad Ali
Muhammad Ali (56-5-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/180 1980-10-02
Larry Holmes (69-6-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/150 1985-09-21
Michael Spinks (31-1-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/1286 1988-06-27
Mike Tyson (50-6-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/474 1990-02-11
James Douglas (37-6-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/584 1990-10-25
Evander Holyfield (44-10-2) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/499 1992-11-13
Riddick Bowe (43-1-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/1640 1993-11-06
Evander Holyfield (44-10-2) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/499 1994-04-22
Michael Moorer (52-4-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/1137 1994-11-05 Lost it to George Foreman. Yes, that George Foreman who won it earlier from Joe Frazier and lost it to Muhammad Ali back then.
George Foreman (76-5-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/90 1997-11-22
Shannon Briggs (60-6-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/4629 1998-03-28
Lennox Lewis (41-2-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/1853 2001-04-22
Hasim Rahman (50-9-2) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/6070 2001-11-17
Lennox Lewis (41-2-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/1853 never (officially) lost again, so back to Hashim Rahman

Hasim Rahman (50-9-2) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/6070 2001-11-17
Evander Holyfield (44-10-2) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/499 2002-06-11
Chris Byrd (41-5-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/4923 2002-12-14
Wladimir Klitschko (64-5-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/7035 2006-04-22
Tyson Fury (27-0-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/479205 2015-11-28 Seemed to have retired, so back to Wladimir Klitschko

Wladimir Klitschko (64-5-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/7035 2006-04-22
Anthony Joshua (22-0-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/659461 2017-04-29

And now all of a sudden Fury is back again, so he's calling himself the lineal champion again, just like Lennox Lewis still could do as well and then Fury would lose it again.

People that died, or most likely will die while beïng the lineal champion:
Gene Tunney (65-1-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9046 (retired at the age of 31)
Remarkebly, his only loss was against Harry Greb http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9019
Harry Greb died at the age of 31 and lost twice against:
Tiger Flowers (118-15-8) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/11336 (lineal heavyweight champion who died just a couple of days after his last fight at the age of 34, his last fight was a light heavyweight fight, Tiger Flowers never fought above 173 pounds)
Rocky Marciano (49-0-0) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/9032 (retired at the age of 32 and died at 45)
Lennox Lewis (41-2-1) http://boxrec.com/en/boxer/1853 2001-04-22 (Retired at the age of 37)


George Foreman, who had a massive break during his carreer lost it for the last time, 23 years after he won it for the first time.
Joe Louis had the lineal title for 13 years 3 months and 5 days in a row and lost it at the age of 36.

Can you do the same for middleweight?

[Cojimar 1946]

I would disagree with the consensus that Wilder, Fury, and Joshua are the best 3 heavyweights at present. I think one can make a good case that Povetkin was better than Wilder. Who has Wilder beaten that is as good as Povetkin?

Also Dubois, Hrgovic may well have surpassed Wilder by the time Joshua next fights.

[jameswilson]

I would disagree with the consensus that Wilder, Fury, and Joshua are the best 3 heavyweights at present. I think one can make a good case that Povetkin was better than Wilder. Who has Wilder beaten that is as good as Povetkin?

Also Dubois, Hrgovic may well have surpassed Wilder by the time Joshua next fights.

Yeah and maybe Dave Allen as well.

[jamamb]

furys a bit of an unknown at the moment. hasnt faced a live body in 3 years, left the trainer he did the best with and now with a highly inexperienced trainer, had all the weight gain and drug use, etc

he may not be as good as he was, and im pretty certain hes not better. if hes about the same it should be good enough to beat all but maybe a few guys, but either way i think wilders knocking him out