The HW champion = the absolute champion, yes or no ?

ValMar · Post by **ValMar** » 26 Nov 2018, 13:53

What do you think about ?

punchoutsb · Post by **punchoutsb** » 26 Nov 2018, 13:53

Depends on the HW champion, doesn’t it?

ValMar · Post by **ValMar** » 26 Nov 2018, 13:55

punchoutsb wrote: ↑26 Nov 2018, 13:53 Depends on the HW champion, doesn’t it?

Generally speaking.......

jamamb · Post by **jamamb** » 26 Nov 2018, 13:57

well if you just mean who would beat who in a boxing match, obviously overall the hws would have an advantage

manuel charr would beat nayoa inoue, etc

the best at hw would usually beat the best at the other divisions

but imo the hws dont provide the highest quality or most visually most appealing level of boxing skill. and so many ppl talk up hws as some super fun to watch division when there are so many slop fests

jamamb · Post by **jamamb** » 26 Nov 2018, 13:58

btw i dont at all understand you with the 'heavys need to be on the p4p list ' stuff youve said elsewhere, what does them being heavyweights have to do with rankings that cut out the weight element?

Onetimeonly · Post by **Onetimeonly** » 26 Nov 2018, 13:58

Not anymore. There is MMa too. All that baddest man on the planet stuff is not meant to be taken so seriously.

Ruthless-RKO · Post by **Ruthless-RKO** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:08

Heavyweight is the ultimate weight class.. Might not be anymore.. But you hear World Heavyweight champion.. You know that's the one.

jamamb · Post by **jamamb** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:09

yet little mexican and black and fillipino guys have been the biggest focus really in the last nearly 2 decades in boxing

and in mma an irish 5'8 150-ish (?) pound guy

KiwiRider · Post by **KiwiRider** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:21

There is a cruiser who could probably beat most of the heavyweights.
But no way are the top HW's any where near as skilled as guys like Garcia/Loma/Crawford/Uysk
To say Wilder or Joshua are top of the boxers is an insult to the guys I have named.

ValMar · Post by **ValMar** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:26

jamamb wrote: ↑26 Nov 2018, 13:58 btw i dont at all understand you with the 'heavys need to be on the p4p list ' stuff youve said elsewhere, what does them being heavyweights have to do with rankings that cut out the weight element?

It is my opinion. I might be wrong, of course.

BTW, I can not convince any of my friends to watch Lomachenko or Crawford (and, it is free, on cable tv) , but all of them would watch any HW-title match.

jamamb · Post by **jamamb** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:29

im just curious as to your logic for that, it makes no sense when talking about ratings that set size aside

ValMar · Post by **ValMar** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:30

jamamb wrote: ↑26 Nov 2018, 14:09 yet little mexican and black and fillipino guys have been the biggest focus really in the last nearly 2 decades in boxing

and in mma an irish 5'8 150-ish (?) pound guy

It might be in the your part of the world, but believe me, here, in the fukcing Balkan, it is quite different.

jamamb · Post by **jamamb** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:30

too bad the balkans hasnt been delivering the same money then

ValMar · Post by **ValMar** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:37

jamamb wrote: ↑26 Nov 2018, 14:29 im just curious as to your logic for that, it makes no sense when talking about ratings that set size aside

OK, for me, the HW champion = the absolute champion. The lists without the absolute champion is not valid.
Again, this is my personal opinion only , and I don't claim that everyone should think about this in the same way.

jamamb · Post by **jamamb** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:38

the hw champ because there the biggest right? irrelevant then if size isnt being included

but whatever

ValMar · Post by **ValMar** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:38

jamamb wrote: ↑26 Nov 2018, 14:30 too bad the balkans hasnt been delivering the same money then

I didn't understand you.

jamamb · Post by **jamamb** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:39

i mean you say a guy like fury is a huge mainstream star where your from, too bad for him then it doesnt convert into drawing power and cash like it did for guys like oscar, floyd, pac, mcgregor, canelo being stars in other areas

ValMar · Post by **ValMar** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:46

jamamb wrote: ↑26 Nov 2018, 14:39 i mean you say a guy like fury is a huge mainstream star where your from, too bad for him then it doesnt convert into drawing power and cash like it did for guys like oscar, floyd, pac, mcgregor being stars in other areas

Recently, McGregor is popular, too.......and a guy from Russia who beat him (Khabib ?)................

It would be too much consider Fury as a huge mainstream star, but he is quite popular. The "huge mainstream stars" are Messi and Ronaldo only.

Mexi-Box · Post by **Mexi-Box** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:48

Only if Usyk becomes the HW champion. He's one fighter that I can say his skills are easily p4p.

Onetimeonly · Post by **Onetimeonly** » 26 Nov 2018, 14:52

The last heavyweight that belonged in the top 5 p4p was holy field. Lewis the only one that could be top 10

Thomastearns · Post by **Thomastearns** » 26 Nov 2018, 15:11

The heavyweight mystique ended with Ali, returned briefly with Tyson and disappeared again.

The great era of the four kings mainly happened in the hiatus between Ali and Tyson. In recent times it's been Roy Jones, Mayweather, Pacquiao and now Canelo - none of whom were able to join Ali and Tyson in the public consciousness. Even decades later Tyson remains the best known boxer in the world.

This could all change in the next 12 months or so depending upon what happens next. This Joshua, Wilder, Fury (and maybe Usyk) scene is doing wonders for the profile of the heavyweight scene.

I'm hoping that we see a knockout this Saturday. A boring points win for Fury will do nothing to promote the division.

If Fury can win by KO, I hope he doesn't, but if he does, then Joshua v Fury could start taking on epic proportions.

Mexi-Box · Post by **Mexi-Box** » 26 Nov 2018, 15:19

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑26 Nov 2018, 14:52 The last heavyweight that belonged in the top 5 p4p was holy field. Lewis the only one that could be top 10

You're forgetting Wladimir Klitschko who was ranked #1-2 when Mayweather and Ward retired and Gonzalez was hovering around #1 p4p. It was a transitional state for the p4p list, though.

Onetimeonly · Post by **Onetimeonly** » 26 Nov 2018, 15:24

No I'm not, he never belonged.

Ruthless-RKO · Post by **Ruthless-RKO** » 26 Nov 2018, 15:29

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑26 Nov 2018, 15:24 No I'm not, he never belonged.

Really.. He beat every good HW for a stretch of 10 years.. With maybe one or 2 names missing. One being Vitali.

Onetimeonly · Post by **Onetimeonly** » 26 Nov 2018, 15:33

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑26 Nov 2018, 15:29
Onetimeonly wrote: ↑26 Nov 2018, 15:24 No I'm not, he never belonged.
Really.. He beat every good HW for a stretch of 10 years.. With maybe one or 2 names missing. One being Vitali.

The two best fighters he beat, haye and povetkin, his greatest asset was his size.