Prime Mike Tyson (1989) against the current top HWs ?

[gilgamesh]

The only danger would be Fury, but i'd favour Mike

Tyson often struggled with particularly tall guys, which there's no shortage of in the division at the moment. I really can't imagine him not catching them all with a big shot at one point though.

[fanman]

with his talent, he would be very near the top. wilder is a threat to anyone, but i think mike would be heavily favoured over him.
a prime povetkin or ortiz would actually be very dangerous fights for mike, but he'd still be favoured.
joshua and fury have the tools and height to beat him. not sure if they would though.

[greg]

..Mike was a beast in his prime.. Tyson I watched in the 80s would run through the most if not all top HWs of today like a mack truck..unfortunately having done his time, he was never the same when he returned in the 90s...

[oogiebe]

..Mike was a beast in his prime.. Tyson I watched in the 80s would run through the most top HWs of today like a mack truck..unfortunately having done his time, he was never the same when he returned in the 90s...

'86/87 he was unbeatable. The most destructive force I'd have ever seen, and I saw Liston; Foreman, etc. So fast and so much movement. Then he lost Cus (earlier); Jacobs; and then Rooney, and then he was a one punch thrower with no regard to defense. He got flatfooted and lazy.

[Thomastearns]

..Mike was a beast in his prime.. Tyson I watched in the 80s would run through the most top HWs of today like a mack truck..unfortunately having done his time, he was never the same when he returned in the 90s...

'86/87 he was unbeatable. The most destructive force I'd have ever seen, and I saw Liston; Foreman, etc. So fast and so much movement. Then he lost Cus (earlier); Jacobs; and then Rooney, and then he was a one punch thrower with no regard to defense. He got flatfooted and lazy.

Yes, I think the loss was 3 fold. I used to think it was just Rooney but it probably went deeper and allowed all the vultures a way in.

I also think the Tyson of 86/87 would beat all the top heavyweights of today. Possibly Fury could survive to the final bell but with the rest of them it would be question of how long.

Too fast, too accurate, too elusive, and far too relentless.

[oogiebe]

..Mike was a beast in his prime.. Tyson I watched in the 80s would run through the most top HWs of today like a mack truck..unfortunately having done his time, he was never the same when he returned in the 90s...

'86/87 he was unbeatable. The most destructive force I'd have ever seen, and I saw Liston; Foreman, etc. So fast and so much movement. Then he lost Cus (earlier); Jacobs; and then Rooney, and then he was a one punch thrower with no regard to defense. He got flatfooted and lazy.

Yes, I think the loss was 3 fold. I used to think it was just Rooney but it probably went deeper and allowed all the vultures a way in.

I also think the Tyson of 86/87 would beat all the top heavyweights of today. Possibly Fury could survive to the final bell but with the rest of them it would be question of how long.

Too fast, too elusive, and far too relentless.

When Cus died, Tyson still had a father figure in Jim Jacobs; when Jacobs died it was Bill Cayton, who is a very cold fish and on his best day couldn't fill the role. It was shortly thereafter that Don King got his stinky mitts on Mike and that really began to decay Iron Mike.

[candyslim]

Yeah, Fury's length would be a lot for Tyson to overcome. Fury's shear size could tucker the little guy out.

anyway, Wilder and even Cunningham managed to knock him down, so i think that Mike would knock Fury out... but yes, styles make fight and Fury's style and size would be a lot to overcome for Mike

Wilder has great length too. The Cunningham knockdown was inexcusable and was more a lack of focus for Fury than Cunninghams ability. It's difficult for me to see Tyson beating any of the top three guys today. Tyson always had trouble with the bigger guys. When they would try to clinch, Tyson always seemed to oblige, probably due to his lack of inside prowess. But AJ and Wilder are much bigger and can hit just as hard.

I never really appreciated the fact that Tyson had no inside game, even though I watched all his fights that made it to UK TV. Itwasn't until our friend OTO challenged me to watch them again that I did and realized he was right..

I don't khow if that peculiar omission in a heavyweight of his abbreviated stature increases or decreases my respect for his achievements.

[candyslim]

anyway, Wilder and even Cunningham managed to knock him down, so i think that Mike would knock Fury out... but yes, styles make fight and Fury's style and size would be a lot to overcome for Mike

Wilder has great length too. The Cunningham knockdown was inexcusable and was more a lack of focus for Fury than Cunninghams ability. It's difficult for me to see Tyson beating any of the top three guys today. Tyson always had trouble with the bigger guys. When they would try to clinch, Tyson always seemed to oblige, probably due to his lack of inside prowess. But AJ and Wilder are much bigger and can hit just as hard.

I never really appreciated the fact that Tyson had no inside game, even though I watched all his fights that made it to UK TV. It wasn't until our friend OTO challenged me to watch them again that I did and realized he was right..

I don't khow if that peculiar omission in a heavyweight of his abbreviated stature increases or decreases my respect for his achievements.

[oogiebe]

anyway, Wilder and even Cunningham managed to knock him down, so i think that Mike would knock Fury out... but yes, styles make fight and Fury's style and size would be a lot to overcome for Mike

Wilder has great length too. The Cunningham knockdown was inexcusable and was more a lack of focus for Fury than Cunninghams ability. It's difficult for me to see Tyson beating any of the top three guys today. Tyson always had trouble with the bigger guys. When they would try to clinch, Tyson always seemed to oblige, probably due to his lack of inside prowess. But AJ and Wilder are much bigger and can hit just as hard.

I never really appreciated the fact that Tyson had no inside game, even though I watched all his fights that made it to UK TV. Itwasn't until our friend OTO challenged me to watch them again that I did and realized he was right..

I don't khow if that peculiar omission in a heavyweight of his abbreviated stature increases or decreases my respect for his achievements.

I wouldn't say NO inside game, but it certainly wasn't his strength. My point being his giving in on clinches with bigger fighters. If you watch him vs the larger men, he would seemingly work his way to the inside, but when his opponent would go for he clinch, it appears Tyson would simply give in to it. Watch some vids and you'll see. (bonecrusher/douglas/etc.)

[oogiebe]

Every time Bonecrusher grabs, Mike obliges a clinch.

[TheGingerBomber]

Prime Mike Tyson vs Prime Dillian Whyte, imagine the pressers! You can see how it goes too, in your head.

early KO by Tyson, easy fight, just mismatch i would say

Yeah I think Dillian would be game and would try and throw with him after realising trying to box was no good because he’s not strong enough

[candyslim]

Wilder has great length too. The Cunningham knockdown was inexcusable and was more a lack of focus for Fury than Cunninghams ability. It's difficult for me to see Tyson beating any of the top three guys today. Tyson always had trouble with the bigger guys. When they would try to clinch, Tyson always seemed to oblige, probably due to his lack of inside prowess. But AJ and Wilder are much bigger and can hit just as hard.

I never really appreciated the fact that Tyson had no inside game, even though I watched all his fights that made it to UK TV. Itwasn't until our friend OTO challenged me to watch them again that I did and realized he was right..

I don't khow if that peculiar omission in a heavyweight of his abbreviated stature increases or decreases my respect for his achievements.

I wouldn't say NO inside game, but it certainly wasn't his strength. My point being his giving in on clinches with bigger fighters. If you watch him vs the larger men, he would seemingly work his way to the inside, but when his opponent would go for he clinch, it appears Tyson would simply give in to it. Watch some vids and you'll see. (bonecrusher/douglas/etc.)

Yes when I say no inside game that is 'relative' of course. On reviewing his fights it amazed me how many times he had a taller opponent at close quarters and fell into a clinch rather than let loose a barrage at the vulnerable torso. How great he might have been, eh?

[caldo2025]

Mike was ridiculously good and would have knocked all these guys out spectacularly in prime. With Mike, it all came down to his team and company he kept as his career went on. Once he started plucking his staff and surrounding himself with yes men instead of guys like Rooney, who didn’t let Mike cut corners in training camp, that’s when his invincibility started to erode. Look at his team in the corner when he lost to Buster. No names. No endswell in the corner? Kidding me?

[Thomastearns]

Mike was ridiculously good and would have knocked all these guys out spectacularly in prime. With Mike, it all came down to his team and company he kept as his career went on. Once he started plucking his staff and surrounding himself with yes men instead of guys like Rooney, who didn’t let Mike cut corners in training camp, that’s when his invincibility started to erode. Look at his team in the corner when he lost to Buster. No names. No endswell in the corner? Kidding me?

Yes, some may still be unaware of how carefully and meticulously Mike Tyson was built to become a human engine of destruction inside the ring by Cus D'Amato and his team. Nothing was left to chance. Their only initial doubts were regarding his size, but his power and accuracy nullified those concerns.

I doubt whether any of today's heavyweights train in anything like the hothouse conditions that Tyson did. He was familiar with the styles of all the great champions before him and was a big fan of Dempsey and Duran. His sense of focus was genuinely intimidating.

Boxing demands almost fanatical devotion, and for a while at least Mike Tyson was able to provide it.

[Enlightened-One]

Mike was ridiculously good and would have knocked all these guys out spectacularly in prime. With Mike, it all came down to his team and company he kept as his career went on. Once he started plucking his staff and surrounding himself with yes men instead of guys like Rooney, who didn’t let Mike cut corners in training camp, that’s when his invincibility started to erode. Look at his team in the corner when he lost to Buster. No names. No endswell in the corner? Kidding me?

I don’t buy into the idea that Tyson would have remained being considered as an “indestructible behemoth”, if he were able to continue working with the likes of Rooney and D'Amato.

Despite consistently delivering impressive performances, the heavyweight division was lacking talent during his title reign.
He was also a weak-minded gullible individual that wholeheartedly bought into his own media hype, which led to him making a hell of a lot of poor decisions, both in terms of his boxing career and also his personal life.

Tyson’s fans like to blame everyone else for Mike’s decline, but the responsibility for his own downfall falls squarely on his own shoulders.

There no guarantee that a 23 year old (adult) version of Mike Tyson would have continued paying attention to the likes of Rooney and D'Amato had they continued remaining part of his team. In fact, as we saw with Rooney, there’s more evidence to suggest that he would have inevitably sacked them at some point.

There’s a reason why Tyson never managed to overcome adversity inside the ring... and it was due to his own weak mindset.

Lewis and Holyfield had Tyson’s number. They possessed cast iron wills and had Mike avoided Buster Douglas and a custodial sentence, then he still would have tasted defeat against these men.

[Bard of Boxrec]

I hate to be pedantic

No you don’t.

You were actually doing ok in this thread until you suggested that Whyte would be a nightmare for Mike

Oh, and the good old ‘better nutrition and training methods’ chestnut

[caldo2025]

Mike was ridiculously good and would have knocked all these guys out spectacularly in prime. With Mike, it all came down to his team and company he kept as his career went on. Once he started plucking his staff and surrounding himself with yes men instead of guys like Rooney, who didn’t let Mike cut corners in training camp, that’s when his invincibility started to erode. Look at his team in the corner when he lost to Buster. No names. No endswell in the corner? Kidding me?

Yes, some may still be unaware of how carefully and meticulously Mike Tyson was built to become a human engine of destruction inside the ring by Cus D'Amato and his team. Nothing was left to chance. Their only initial doubts were regarding his size, but his power and accuracy nullified those concerns.

I doubt whether any of today's heavyweights train in anything like the hothouse conditions that Tyson did. He was familiar with the styles of all the great champions before him and was a big fan of Dempsey and Duran. His sense of focus was genuinely intimidating.

Boxing demands almost fanatical devotion, and for a while at least Mike Tyson was able to provide it.

Exactly. A lot of the youngsters on this site were not old enough to experience what Mike was in his prime. They form opinions based on the losses after his team was gone, the prison stint. We’re talking about two different boxers. Yes, I believe that some boxers were defeated before entering the ring due to Mike’s mystique but it didn’t matter. They were to be destroyed either way because he was that good.

And another thing, when you have a boxer that is so much better than everyone in their division, the lazy opinion is that the boxer had “poor competition”. Tyson had to defeat Guys like Tubbs, Tucker, Carl Williams, Bruno, Spinks, Ruddock, Tucker, Biggs etc. Any of these guys would give the top 3 current heavyweights all that they could handle. No doubt. For instance, people don’t realize how good Carl “The Truth” Williams was. That guy had all of the tools and so athletic with a fantastic jab. Carl would beat AJ right now in my opinion.

So it’s lazy thinking and it’s too common here on this site with these youngsters that don’t know what they are saying.

[oogiebe]

Mike was ridiculously good and would have knocked all these guys out spectacularly in prime. With Mike, it all came down to his team and company he kept as his career went on. Once he started plucking his staff and surrounding himself with yes men instead of guys like Rooney, who didn’t let Mike cut corners in training camp, that’s when his invincibility started to erode. Look at his team in the corner when he lost to Buster. No names. No endswell in the corner? Kidding me?

Yes, some may still be unaware of how carefully and meticulously Mike Tyson was built to become a human engine of destruction inside the ring by Cus D'Amato and his team. Nothing was left to chance. Their only initial doubts were regarding his size, but his power and accuracy nullified those concerns.

I doubt whether any of today's heavyweights train in anything like the hothouse conditions that Tyson did. He was familiar with the styles of all the great champions before him and was a big fan of Dempsey and Duran. His sense of focus was genuinely intimidating.

Boxing demands almost fanatical devotion, and for a while at least Mike Tyson was able to provide it.

Exactly. A lot of the youngsters on this site were not old enough to experience what Mike was in his prime. They form opinions based on the losses after his team was gone, the prison stint. We’re talking about two different boxers. Yes, I believe that some boxers were defeated before entering the ring due to Mike’s mystique but it didn’t matter. They were to be destroyed either way because he was that good.

And another thing, when you have a boxer that is so much better than everyone in their division, the lazy opinion is that the boxer had “poor competition”. Tyson had to defeat Guys like Tubbs, Tucker, Carl Williams, Bruno, Spinks, Ruddock, Tucker, Biggs etc. Any of these guys would give the top 3 current heavyweights all that they could handle. No doubt. For instance, people don’t realize how good Carl “The Truth” Williams was. That guy had all of the tools and so athletic with a fantastic jab. Carl would beat AJ right now in my opinion.

So it’s lazy thinking and it’s too common here on this site with these youngsters that don’t know what they are saying.

Yeah, having lived through early Tyson, he was like nothing we had seen before. Fighters beat before the first bell were the likes of Bruce Seldon; Alex Stewart; and even Mike Spinks. There was nothing like Tyson '86-87 before or after. I still go and watch his fight highlights at least once a month. It's unreal. You couldn't hit him; you couldn't avoid him; he had combinations that were downright unfair! We had never seen the likes of him. Style wise, it's probably true that regardless of handlers, a fighter couldn't be that physically active in the ring past mid twenties.

[ValMar]

Yes, some may still be unaware of how carefully and meticulously Mike Tyson was built to become a human engine of destruction inside the ring by Cus D'Amato and his team. Nothing was left to chance. Their only initial doubts were regarding his size, but his power and accuracy nullified those concerns.

I doubt whether any of today's heavyweights train in anything like the hothouse conditions that Tyson did. He was familiar with the styles of all the great champions before him and was a big fan of Dempsey and Duran. His sense of focus was genuinely intimidating.

Boxing demands almost fanatical devotion, and for a while at least Mike Tyson was able to provide it.

Exactly. A lot of the youngsters on this site were not old enough to experience what Mike was in his prime. They form opinions based on the losses after his team was gone, the prison stint. We’re talking about two different boxers. Yes, I believe that some boxers were defeated before entering the ring due to Mike’s mystique but it didn’t matter. They were to be destroyed either way because he was that good.

And another thing, when you have a boxer that is so much better than everyone in their division, the lazy opinion is that the boxer had “poor competition”. Tyson had to defeat Guys like Tubbs, Tucker, Carl Williams, Bruno, Spinks, Ruddock, Tucker, Biggs etc. Any of these guys would give the top 3 current heavyweights all that they could handle. No doubt. For instance, people don’t realize how good Carl “The Truth” Williams was. That guy had all of the tools and so athletic with a fantastic jab. Carl would beat AJ right now in my opinion.

So it’s lazy thinking and it’s too common here on this site with these youngsters that don’t know what they are saying.

Yeah, having lived through early Tyson, he was like nothing we had seen before. Fighters beat before the first bell were the likes of Bruce Seldon; Alex Stewart; and even Mike Spinks. There was nothing like Tyson '86-87 before or after. I still go and watch his fight highlights at least once a month. It's unreal. You couldn't hit him; you couldn't avoid him; he had combinations that were downright unfair! We had never seen the likes of him. Style wise, it's probably true that regardless of handlers, a fighter couldn't be that physically active in the ring past mid twenties.

Yes, at least 7 fighters he had defeated would have been among the top ten HWs in 2019.

[Enlightened-One]

I hate to be pedantic

No you don’t.

You were actually doing ok in this thread until you suggested that Whyte would be a nightmare for Mike

Oh, and the good old ‘better nutrition and training methods’ chestnut

In terms of the improvements in nutrition and training methods over the last thirty years, Mike Tyson himself made this claim. I previously posted a video of him stating this.

In terms of Dillian Whyte’s chances against a prime version of Mike Tyson, I never claimed the Brit would win, but I do believe he’d present a very stern challenge.

So perhaps you need to re-evaluate your opinion about my claims, since you’re not only disagreeing with me, you are also mocking Mike Tyson’s own words.

The reason why I’m pedantic is because people like you enjoy mocking a misprepreseted version of other people’s opinions.

[ezhmael]

He's only referring to the pressers since Whyte talks alot of thrash. That's the part that is interesting.

[caldo2025]

I hate to be pedantic

No you don’t.

You were actually doing ok in this thread until you suggested that Whyte would be a nightmare for Mike

Oh, and the good old ‘better nutrition and training methods’ chestnut

In terms of the improvements in nutrition and training methods over the last thirty years, Mike Tyson himself made this claim. I previously posted a video of him stating this.

In terms of Dillian Whyte’s chances against a prime version of Mike Tyson, I never claimed the Brit would win, but I do believe he’d present a very stern challenge.

So perhaps you need to re-evaluate your opinion about my claims, since you’re not only disagreeing with me, you are also mocking Mike Tyson’s own words.

The reason why I’m pedantic is because people like you enjoy mocking a misprepreseted version of other people’s opinions.

Oh and by the way, did you not once claim you’d quit following boxing or was that someone else?

Hey Dipshiiit, answer a question if you have any testicles at all-how old were you in the year 1990?