BoxRec Forum HW TOP 15 Ranking voting

[oogiebe]

I just don't see how Agit Kabayel is getting this kind of consideration. He hasn't fought in like 9 months and the one fight he had was against Miljan Rovcanin (3RD TKO). He struggled in a win over Chisora. He's disappeared. He's slow and sometimes seems out of condition. I just don't see it.

I agree with you actually. Maybe worth a reconsider. For me, the list gets extremely weak towards the bottom. I think he's benefitted more than maybe he should from Chisora's good showings against better fighters.

I'm thinking I've put Miller a bit high too.

OH I'm dropping Miller down at this point. This latest debacle has me at wit's end.

[jamamb]

rovcanin drew with dimitrenko who had just destroyed granat and later floored jennings, it was a decent win for kabayel to destroy him

look at the lack of depth, no idea why ppl are talking like kabayel doesnt belong in the lower top 15.....if u say that chances are uve still got in del (who he beat) or guys like hrvovic, joyce, hunter etc who havent won anything better

[dagilechia]

i also thought about dropping Miller down, but #8 is probably the lowest place for him, i can't rank Parker above him as he lost to Whyte (after a close fight though, i had it 113-112) and recently fought even worse opponent than Miller does. the problem with Miller is that he never stepped up so far, Parker at least fought a lot of decent fighters, he lost but i would still favour him over Whyte in a rematch

[dagilechia]

rovcanin drew with dimitrenko who had just destroyed granat and later floored jennings, it was a decent win for kabayel to destroy him

look at the lack of depth, no idea why ppl are talking like kabayel doesnt belong in the lower top 15.....if u say that chances are uve still got in del (who he beat) or guys like hrvovic, joyce, hunter etc who havent won anything better

the most surprising name on the list so far is obviously Marco Huck at #20, i am shocked that some people have him in top 15 at HW

[jamamb]

millers wins maks him top 10 easily imo, again, gotta compare him to others, in the lower top 10 no one really has major wins

[Onetimeonly]

rovcanin drew with dimitrenko who had just destroyed granat and later floored jennings, it was a decent win for kabayel to destroy him

look at the lack of depth, no idea why ppl are talking like kabayel doesnt belong in the lower top 15.....if u say that chances are uve still got in del (who he beat) or guys like hrvovic, joyce, hunter etc who havent won anything better

the most surprising name on the list so far is obviously Marco Huck at #20, i am shocked that some people have him in top 15 at HW

He beat the beloved povetkin IMO, granted that was ages ago.

[oogiebe]

rovcanin drew with dimitrenko who had just destroyed granat and later floored jennings, it was a decent win for kabayel to destroy him

look at the lack of depth, no idea why ppl are talking like kabayel doesnt belong in the lower top 15.....if u say that chances are uve still got in del (who he beat) or guys like hrvovic, joyce, hunter etc who havent won anything better

There most certainly is a lack of depth in the HW division, so it would be expected to have such disparate picks at the 11-15 places when there is a glut of 10 -13 fighters outside the top 10 who might probably be at least somewhat competitive with one another. At least I think so. My next ratings might probably be a might different. Tweaks are a comin'!

[oogiebe]

rovcanin drew with dimitrenko who had just destroyed granat and later floored jennings, it was a decent win for kabayel to destroy him

look at the lack of depth, no idea why ppl are talking like kabayel doesnt belong in the lower top 15.....if u say that chances are uve still got in del (who he beat) or guys like hrvovic, joyce, hunter etc who havent won anything better

the most surprising name on the list so far is obviously Marco Huck at #20, i am shocked that some people have him in top 15 at HW

I admit I rushed my ratings and rather than spend time on the last several places I inserted Huck on a coin flip. He'll probably be dropped from my rankings the next round.

[oogiebe]

rovcanin drew with dimitrenko who had just destroyed granat and later floored jennings, it was a decent win for kabayel to destroy him

look at the lack of depth, no idea why ppl are talking like kabayel doesnt belong in the lower top 15.....if u say that chances are uve still got in del (who he beat) or guys like hrvovic, joyce, hunter etc who havent won anything better

the most surprising name on the list so far is obviously Marco Huck at #20, i am shocked that some people have him in top 15 at HW

I admit I rushed my ratings and rather than spend time on the last several places I inserted Huck on a coin flip. He'll probably be dropped from my rankings the next round.

BTW: Rovcanin was even (split) on the scorecards vs Dimentrenko and was disqualified in the 10th. just to clarify.

[jamamb]

it was a draw (deductions saved dimi) but then it got changed after the fight in a very unusual move

[joshj909]

I'd be interested to hear what method everyone has used to rank their top15s. I personally looked at wins and losses on records and therefore had Kabayel above Chisora, and then used some subjectivity in closer decisions such as having Fury above Wilder.

I imagine some people have looked at performances and/or potential as well, hence having Huck who has only beat a nobody at HW, and Joyce who has potential but not really beat anyone?

[pico11]

1. Joshua
2. Fury
3. Wilder
4. Povetkin
5. White
6. Ortiz
7. Pulev
8. Parker
9. Hrgovic
10. Miller
11. Breazeale
12. Kownacki
13. Chisora
14. Jennings
15. Hunter

[conan_the_cribber]

I'd be interested to hear what method everyone has used to rank their top15s. I personally looked at wins and losses on records and therefore had Kabayel above Chisora, and then used some subjectivity in closer decisions such as having Fury above Wilder.

I imagine some people have looked at performances and/or potential as well, hence having Huck who has only beat a nobody at HW, and Joyce who has potential but not really beat anyone?

Kabayel sneaked in a MD against Chisora so they were about equal, with Kabayel slightly ahead. Since then, Kabayel has had one fight in 13 months and that against a guy with a totally inflated record. Chisora has won against the decent (not stellar) Carlos Takam and had a life and death fight against Whyte. While I respect recent head to head fights and not personal opinion should determine the rankings in any rating system, subsequent activity and performance should count as well, thereby flipping who is ahead out of the two of them.

[joshj909]

Kabayel sneaked in a MD against Chisora so they were about equal, with Kabayel slightly ahead. Since then, Kabayel has had one fight in 13 months and that against a guy with a totally inflated record. Chisora has won against the decent (not stellar) Carlos Takam and had a life and death fight against Whyte. While I respect recent head to head fights and not personal opinion should determine the rankings in any rating system, recent activity and performance should count as well, thereby flipping who is ahead out of the two of them.

I get that. I don't see a year ago being that long, make it two and they could be completely different boxers. Also, by beating Chisora and then Chisora beating Takam, I move Kabayel up along with Chisora. So, say prior to the fights they were ranked:
1. CT 2. DC 3. AK.
After the first
1..CT 2.AK 3.DC
and then after the second I will is make it
1.AK 2.DC 3.CT

Just my thought process,

[dagilechia]

I'd be interested to hear what method everyone has used to rank their top15s. I personally looked at wins and losses on records and therefore had Kabayel above Chisora, and then used some subjectivity in closer decisions such as having Fury above Wilder.

I imagine some people have looked at performances and/or potential as well, hence having Huck who has only beat a nobody at HW, and Joyce who has potential but not really beat anyone?

the most important factor to me was current potential (who beats who) but other factors like future potential and resume were important too.

[dagilechia]

20 votes now:

1. Anthony Joshua - 795 points (1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 1) -
2. Tyson Fury - 696 points (2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 2, 3, 2, 2, 2, 1, 2) -
3. Deontay Wilder - 629 points (4, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3, 5, 3, 3, 2, 6, 3, 2, 3, 3, 3, 3, 3) -
4. Dillian Whyte - 550 points (8, 4, 5, 4, 4, 4, 4, 7, 4, 5, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 6, 4, 4, 5) -
5. Alexander Povetkin - 537 points (3, 6, 7, 5, 5, 6, 5, 4, 3, 4, 5, 6, 2, 8, 5, 5, 4, 5, 5, 4) -
6. Luis Ortiz - 487 points (5, 5, 4, 6, 6, 5, 6, 5, 7, 6, 6, 5, 8, 7, 6, 7, 5, 6, 6, 6) -
7. Kubrat Pulev - 428 points (6, 9, 9, 7, 7, 8, 8, 6, 10, 7, 7, 8, 5, 6, 8, 6, 7, 7, 8, 7) -
8. Jarrell Miller - 408 points (7, 7, 6, 8, 8, 7, 7, 8, 8, 8, 9, 10, 7, 5, 7, 8, 8, 9, 9, 10) -
9. Joseph Parker - 382 points (9, 8, 8, 9, 9, 9, 9, 9, 6, 9, 8, 7, 9, 10, 9, 9, 9, 8, 7, 8) -
10. Dominic Breazeale - 286 points (11, 12, 10, 10, 11, 10, 10, -, 9, 10, 10, 13, 10, 9, 11, 11, 12, 11, 10, 11) -
11. Bryant Jennings - 226 points (13, 15, 12, 13, 14, 12, 13, 10, 15, 13, 11, 12, 12, 13, -, 10, -, 12, 12, 14) -
12. Adam Kownacki - 221 points (10, 10, -, 11, 12, 11, 11, -, 13, 11, 12, -, -, 11, 12, 12, 11, 10, 13, 12) -
13. Dereck Chisora - 204 points (14, 11, 14, 14, -, 15, 14, 12, 11, 15, 13, -, 11, 15, -, 14, 10, 15, 11, 13) -
14. Filip Hrgović - 154 points (12, 14, 11, 15, -, -, 15, 14, 12, -, -, 9, -, 12, 14, -, 13, -, -, 9) +1
15. Agit Kabayel - 139 points (-, -, 13, 12, -, 13, 12, 13, -, 14, 15, 15, -, 14, -, 13, 14, 13, -, -) -1
----------------------------------------------------------------------
16. Michael Hunter - 103 points (15, -, -, -, 10, -, -, -, -, -, -, 11, 15, -, 13, 15, 15, 14, -, 15) -
17. Christian Hammer - 74 points (-, -, -, -, -, 14, -, -, -, 12, 14, -, 13, -, 10, -, -, -, 14, -) -
18. Joe Joyce - 34 points (-, -, -, -, 13, -, -, -, 14, -, -, 14, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -) -
19. Hughie Fury - 30 points (-, -, 15, -, 15, -, -, 15, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -) -
20. Marco Huck - 26 points (-, 13, -, -, -, -, -, 11, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -) -
21. Carlos Takam - 11 points (-, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, 14, -, -, -, -, -, -, -) -
22. Sergey Kuzmin - 10 points (-, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, 15, -, -, -, -, -) -
22. Andy Ruiz - 10 points (-, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, -, 15, -) -

[conan_the_cribber]

Kabayel sneaked in a MD against Chisora so they were about equal, with Kabayel slightly ahead. Since then, Kabayel has had one fight in 13 months and that against a guy with a totally inflated record. Chisora has won against the decent (not stellar) Carlos Takam and had a life and death fight against Whyte. While I respect recent head to head fights and not personal opinion should determine the rankings in any rating system, recent activity and performance should count as well, thereby flipping who is ahead out of the two of them.

I get that. I don't see a year ago being that long, make it two and they could be completely different boxers. Also, by beating Chisora and then Chisora beating Takam, I move Kabayel up along with Chisora. So, say prior to the fights they were ranked:
1. CT 2. DC 3. AK.
After the first
1..CT 2.AK 3.DC
and then after the second I will is make it
1.AK 2.DC 3.CT

Just my thought process,

i get that too. Both your logic and my logic are valid arguments. If Kabayel had beaten anyone within the last year with any sort of pedigree, then he'd be ahead. But At this point in his career, by doing nothing, seems to indicate that Kabayel is going nowhere fast. It's a line call and we both had our reasons and logic for our choices.

[jamamb]

would it have seemed much better if kabayel destroyed dimitrenko instead of rovcanin? i mean because watch that fight, rovcanin gets the better of dimi and it was only a draw instead of a rovcanin win initially because of deductions in a fight where dimi was just as fouling. dimi was coming off a good win and is jennings best win in several years (dropping him too)

its not like rovcanin was a total unproven nobody, he was at least as good as dimi, who was around top 25 himself at the time

[ValMar]

20 votes. Well done !

[dagilechia]

Dimitrenko top 25 at that time? i doubt it. at least not for me, but yeah, maybe he was ranked by some in top 25 due to his win vs Granat but i had him probably at 40-50, i couldn't rank him higher after the Parker fight.

[jamamb]

i think around top 25 for sure, granat was starting to creep into top 15s when dimi flattened him and again when u move down the rankings outside top 10 or so your not dealing with much

[dagilechia]

update

1. Anthony Joshua - 22(21) 0 0 - 29 I 6'6''/198cm I 82''/208cm I 245lbs/111,2kg - next fight: 13.4.2019 v TBA
Born in: Watford, United Kingdom I Fighting out of: Watford, United Kingdom
Alias: AJ

2. Tyson Fury - 27(19) 0 1 - 30 I 6'9''/206cm I 85''/216cm I 256,5lbs/116,3kg - next fight: TBA
Born in: Manchester, United Kingdom I Fighting out of: Wilmslow, United Kingdom
Alias: Gypsy King

3. Deontay Wilder - 40(39) 0 1 - 33 I 6'7''/201cm I 83''/211cm I 212,5lbs/96,4kg - next fight: TBA
Born in: Tuscaloosa, United States I Fighting out of: Tuscaloosa, United States
Alias: The Bronze Bomber

4. Dillian Whyte - 25(18) 1(1) 0 - 30 I 6'4''/193cm I 78''/198cm I 246,5lbs/111,8kg - next fight: TBA
Born in: Port Antonio, Jamaica I Fighting out of: London, United Kingdom
Alias: The Body Snatcher

5. Alexander Povetkin - 34(24) 2(1) 0 - 39 I 6'2''/188cm I 75''/191cm I 222lbs/100,7kg - next fight: TBA
Born in: Kursk, Russia I Fighting out of: Chekhov, Russia
Alias: Russkij Vityaz

6. Luis Ortiz - 30(26) 1(1) 0 - 39 I 6'4''/193cm I 78''/198cm I 241lbs/109,3kg - next fight: 2.3.2019 vs Christian Hammer
Born in: Camagüey, Cuba I Fighting out of: Miami, United States
Alias: King Kong

7. Kubrat Pulev - 26(13) 1(1) 0 - 37 I 6'4,5''/194cm I 80''/203cm I 240,5lbs/109,1kg - next fight: TBA
Born in: Sofia, Bulgaria I Fighting out of: Sofia, Bulgaria
Alias: The Cobra

8. Jarrell Miller - 23(20) 0 1 - 30 I 6'4/193cm I 78''/198cm I 315lbs/143kg - next fight: TBA
Born in: New York, United States I Fighting out of: New York, United States
Alias: Big Baby

9. Joseph Parker - 25(19) 2(0) 0 - 27 I 6'4/193cm I 76''/193cm I 240,5lbs/109,2kg - next fight: TBA
Born in: Auckland, New Zealand I Fighting out of: Auckland, New Zealand
Alias: Lupesoliai La'auliolemalietoa

10. Dominic Breazeale - 20(18) 1(1) 0 - 33 I 6'7''/201cm I 81,5''/207cm I 256,5lbs/116,3kg - next fight: TBA
Born in: Glendale, United States I Fighting out of: Eastvale, United States
Alias: Trouble

11. Bryant Jennings - 24(14) 2(1) 0 - 34 I 6'3''/191cm I 84''/213cm I 225lbs/102,1kg - next fight: 18.1.2019 v Oscar Rivas
Born in: Philadelphia, United States I Fighting out of: Philadelphia, United States
Alias: By-By

12. Adam Kownacki - 18(14) 0 0 - 29 I 6'3''/191cm I 76''/193cm I 263lbs/119,4kg - next fight: 26.1.2019 v Gerald Washington
Born in: Łomża, Poland I Fighting out of: New York, United States
Alias: Babyface

13. Dereck Chisora - 29(21) 9(3) 0 - 35 I 6'1,5''/187cm I 74''/188cm I 246lbs/111,7kg - next fight: TBA
Born in: Mbare, Zimbabwe I Fighting out of: London, United Kingdom
Alias: Del Boy

14. Filip Hrgović - 7(5) 0 0 - 26 I 6'6''/198cm I 80''/203cm I 232,5lbs/105,5kg - next fight: TBA
Born in: Zagreb, Croatia I Fighting out of: Zagreb, Croatia
Alias: El Animal

15. Agit Kabayel - 18(13) 0 0 - 26 I 6'3''/191cm I 76''/193cm I 236,5lbs/107,3kg - next fight: TBA
Born in: Leverkusen, Germany I Fighting out of: Bochum, Germany
Alias: -

[oogiebe]

Sorry to say, the aesthetics are too busy now. Gettin' carried away with yerself Dag!

[dagilechia]

Sorry to say, the aesthetics are too busy now. Gettin' carried away with yerself Dag!

i will just make 2 versions in next votings: the shorter one at the start of voting and the longer one after assuming the votes.

[dagilechia]

Sorry to say, the aesthetics are too busy now. Gettin' carried away with yerself Dag!

now i'm just playing with it at the spare time too much of spare time i guess..