13th round of Jezzamundo's dream heavyweight tournament

jezzamundo · Post by **jezzamundo** » 12 May 2006, 21:57

Results from the 12th round are:

Ali UD12 Foreman
Louis KO8 Tyson
Holmes D12 Lewis
Marciano SD12 Frazier

So the points table reads:

1. Ali 1085 points (12-0-0, 2 ko)
2. Louis 1035 points (10-2-0, 7 ko)
3. Holmes 855 points (9-2-1, 3 ko)
4. Foreman 670 points (6-5-1, 6 ko)
5. Lewis 430 points (4-7-1, 2 ko)
6. Marciano 325 points (2-9-1, 1 ko)
7. Frazier 290 points (2-10-0, 1 ko)
8. Tyson 110 points (1-11-0, 1 ko)

The next (and second last!) round of fights are:

Ali vs Holmes (Ali won first fight UD12)
Louis vs Foreman (Louis won first fight KO7)
Marciano vs Tyson (Marciano won first fight TKO9)
Lewis vs Frazier (Lewis won first fight MD12)

Remember, this is a premier league style event and not a knockout competition. Once all fighters have fought each other twice the tournament is over and the fighter with the most points is the ultimate champion! Fights are 12 rounds, not 15, and fighters use 10 ounce gloves (not that I think that would make a real difference to any of the fights). For those who didn't read the first topic, these are 7 of my top 8 all-time heavies, I rate Tyson 12th from memory, but I found him just too interesting a fighter to leave out. The points system is as such:
KO win = 100 points
TKO win = 100 points
UD win = 90 points
MD win = 75 points
SD win = 60 points
Draw = 50 points
SD loss = 40 points
MD loss = 25 points
UD loss = 10 points
TKO loss = 0 points
KO loss = 0 points

BrocktonBlockbuster49 · Post by **BrocktonBlockbuster49** » 13 May 2006, 12:35

lennox lewis is getting horribly overated in this fantasy tournemant

the 3 swarmers are getting horribly underated in this tournament, ESPECIALLY mike tyson

i think larry is getting slightly overated since he does not match up well vs swarmers yet all 3 swarmers are 2-9 while larry is 9-2

MEISINGER · Post by **MEISINGER** » 13 May 2006, 12:37

be glad tyson is even listed in the tournament.tyson was a very good heavyweight but he was not in the elite eight.

BrocktonBlockbuster49 · Post by **BrocktonBlockbuster49** » 13 May 2006, 13:01

MEISINGER wrote:be glad tyson is even listed in the tournament.tyson was a very good heavyweight but he was not in the elite eight.

LENNOX LEWIS SHOULD NOT BE IN THIS TOURNAMENT. its ridiculous jack dempsey is not in, even though he clearly should be!

jezzamundo · Post by **jezzamundo** » 14 May 2006, 08:07

LENNOX LEWIS SHOULD NOT BE IN THIS TOURNAMENT. its ridiculous jack dempsey is not in, even though he clearly should be!

Is anyone going to vote?

Lewis is in because I rate him 7th of all-time. I rate Tyson 12th, but I put him in there because he creates so much interest. I think it is entirely concievable that Lewis would beat Marciano and Frazier, we know he beat a faded version of Tyson but many believe he would beat him prime also, and he would also stand a good chance of outboxing Foreman, especially in a rematch. I think stylistically he would give a lot of top fighters a lot of trouble, so I felt obliged to put him in there. Plus, there is significantly less concrete evidence to judge how good guys like Johnson and Dempsey were, hence my not including anyone earlier than Louis.

Anyway, back to business.

Holmes MD12 Ali - Ali has trouble with someone who can jab as well as him.
Louis UD12 Foreman - I think George can only win this fight earlier, but Joe is too good in rematches to even go down in this one.
Tyson TKO7 Marciano - Marciano takes a lot of big shots early, comes back, but is eventually stopped on cuts.
Lewis TKO8 Frazier - Lewis does better in the rematch, fighting to a defensive but effective plan and eventually wearing Joe down (plus I don't think Joe would like his uppercuts).

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 14 May 2006, 09:10

have patience I have a formula which requires certain weather patterns to resolve before I can enter my thoughts. (Had a huge huge flood and I'm tending to my basement)

Seamus · Post by **Seamus** » 14 May 2006, 10:32

Ali WUD 12 Holmes
Foreman KO 5 Louis
Tyson KO 2 Marciano
Lewis KO 3 Frazier

BrocktonBlockbuster49 · Post by **BrocktonBlockbuster49** » 14 May 2006, 11:42

Seamus wrote:Ali WUD 12 Holmes
Foreman KO 5 Louis
Tyson KO 2 Marciano
Lewis KO 3 Frazier

seamus u have the bigger is better disease my friend

foreman KO louis in a REMATCH? get outtta here

BrocktonBlockbuster49 · Post by **BrocktonBlockbuster49** » 14 May 2006, 11:49

Holmes MD12 Ali - Ali has trouble with someone who can jab as well as him.
Louis UD12 Foreman - I think George can only win this fight earlier, but Joe is too good in rematches to even go down in this one.
Tyson TKO7 Marciano - Marciano takes a lot of big shots early, comes back, but is eventually stopped on cuts.
Lewis TKO8 Frazier - Lewis does better in the rematch, fighting to a defensive but effective plan and eventually wearing Joe down (plus I don't think Joe would like his uppercuts).

rematches?

well we have to take into fact how each fighter does in rematch. so marciano and louis earn a lot of points here. even though some of u arnt taking this into consideration.

rematches

louis KO 2 foreman

ali 12 split holmes

marciano KO 13 tyson- tyson wins first fight, marciano finds a way in the rematch to survive a huge early storm and comeback and dominate tyson in the clinches and on the inside hamering him everywhere breaking tysons will in the late rounds hammering him to defeat.

lennox TKO 6 frazier- lennox was another great rematcher and i see him finding frazier this time and putting him away. frazier didnt have the huge right hand to threaten lennox

Seamus · Post by **Seamus** » 14 May 2006, 11:51

Brockton

You don't even make your own picks but you critique mine. Got news for you, the Heavyweight division in 2006 has the bigger is better disease.

Yes, I see Foreman destroying Louis. Scmeling, Galento, Nova and others got to the Brown Bomber, and they didn't have the same power or killer instinct as Big George.

Tyson's got Marciano beat in every category imagineable except heart. And with a natural 30 lb weight imagine, I see him knocking The Rock down until the ref as seen has seen enough.

I was watching footage of Frazier the other day, and all I can say is, great work rate, tremendous heart, but man was he was open for counters. Lewis is too big, too strong and Frazier is too easy to hit.

BrocktonBlockbuster49 · Post by **BrocktonBlockbuster49** » 14 May 2006, 11:59

Seamus wrote:Brockton

You don't even make your own picks but you critique mine. Got news for you, the Heavyweight division in 2006 has the bigger is better disease.

Yes, I see Foreman destroying Louis. Scmeling, Galento, Nova and others got to the Brown Bomber, and they didn't have the same power or killer instinct as Big George.

Tyson's got Marciano beat in every category imagineable except heart. And with a natural 30 lb weight imagine, I see him knocking The Rock down until the ref as seen has seen enough.

I was watching footage of Frazier the other day, and all I can say is, great work rate, tremendous heart, but man was he was open for counters. Lewis is too big, too strong and Frazier is too easy to hit.

actually marciano was stronger than tyson on the inside and a much better inside fighter. tyson did not apply his strength well and waas constantly bulled around in the clinches. this is a big area that marciano has an edge on. i also think marciano is not far behind tyson in punching power.

schmeling was a first class sneaky counterpuncher, who fought nothing like foreman. its a lot harder to see schmelings punches than big slow looping goerge foremans.

nova?? how did he get to louis? galento got to louis in a flash knockdown........

but if u want to play that game then fine..........old ali got to foreman, feather fisted jimmy young got to foreman, ron lyle similiar style to louis nearly knocked out foreman who had no exuses for his chin in this fight.

if these guys could get to foreman......so could the greatest puncher of all time in joe louis

lennox too big and too strong?? wut about the way a old past his prime blown up cruiser holyfield pressured lennox and basically won the rematch? lennox certainly wasnt too big and strong for holyfield.

i think lennox would win the rematch though, lennox was a great rematcher and frazier became worn out quickly and was never the type to be good and rematches not to mention frazier had trouble with big fighters his whole career even in his prime

Ezzard · Post by **Ezzard** » 15 May 2006, 04:30

Holmes WSD 12 Ali (Ali's got to lose sometime)
Louis WUD12 Foreman (Louis is more cautious after getting dropped in 1st fight. He has Foreman down late and takes a lopsided verdict)
Marciano KO Tyson 11
Frazier WUD 12 Lewis

Crease · Post by **Crease** » 15 May 2006, 12:18

I'm sorry Jeezamundo but I'm stopping to vote. I've basically lost confidence and respect for you, and I'm beginning to see your questionable tournament as a bit of a joke.

All I have to do is look at your league table.

1. Ali 1085 points (12-0-0, 2 ko)
2. Louis 1035 points (10-2-0, 7 ko)
3. Holmes 855 points (9-2-1, 3 ko)
4. Foreman 670 points (6-5-1, 6 ko)
5. Lewis 430 points (4-7-1, 2 ko)
6. Marciano 325 points (2-9-1, 1 ko)
7. Frazier 290 points (2-10-0, 1 ko)
8. Tyson 110 points (1-11-0, 1 ko)

I can understand Ali and Louis' positions HOWEVER, what the hell is Larry Holmes doing away up there? AND Lewis wouldn't last against either of the last 3 men in their prime!!!!

I can tell right away that your not to keen on brawlers and that's perhaps why you place them soo lowly.

SO LONG SUCKER!!!!!!!!!!!!

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 15 May 2006, 16:52

Forgive me but I have let imagination go and have lost my senses at this point.

Ali vs Holmes (Ali won first fight UD12) Ali again UD 12...

He could have but he didn't have the heart to take his former sparring partner out, the way "the partner" did to him.

Louis vs Foreman (Louis won first fight KO7) Foreman KO round 5.

Louis got careless and DOWN GOES LOUIS!!! He should have known that George brought the goods. Due to a totaly corrupt referee and Don King' interference the fight is called in 5 with Louis still in good shape and ready to continue. This was a terrible miscarriage of both judgement and justice and Foreman knows it. Perceptions being what they are Foreman gains luster he never deserves as a result.

Marciano vs Tyson (Marciano won first fight TKO9) Marciano KO 4

Billed as "Lets try that again" Marciano puts him away in four rounds Tyson just came to collect a check and go home.

Lewis vs Frazier (Lewis won first fight MD12) Frazier KO 8

Frazier KO's Louis in round 8 after a horrific pressure body pummeling. He catches the perfect Liver shot from Joe and he can not find his legs. Lewis could not get his jab going and Frazier just smothered him and worked the body for much of the fight.

jezzamundo · Post by **jezzamundo** » 15 May 2006, 22:27

I'm sorry Jeezamundo but I'm stopping to vote. I've basically lost confidence and respect for you, and I'm beginning to see your questionable tournament as a bit of a joke.

All I have to do is look at your league table.

1. Ali 1085 points (12-0-0, 2 ko)
2. Louis 1035 points (10-2-0, 7 ko)
3. Holmes 855 points (9-2-1, 3 ko)
4. Foreman 670 points (6-5-1, 6 ko)
5. Lewis 430 points (4-7-1, 2 ko)
6. Marciano 325 points (2-9-1, 1 ko)
7. Frazier 290 points (2-10-0, 1 ko)
8. Tyson 110 points (1-11-0, 1 ko)

I can understand Ali and Louis' positions HOWEVER, what the hell is Larry Holmes doing away up there? AND Lewis wouldn't last against either of the last 3 men in their prime!!!!

I can tell right away that your not to keen on brawlers and that's perhaps why you place them soo lowly.

SO LONG SUCKER!!!!!!!!!!!!

Why would you have lost respect for me? My vote generally only counts as about 10% of the total, so you can't exactly blame me for the state of the table! Your vote has counted towards the rankings to the same extent that mine has! I have not placed brawlers lowly, the general voting community has. You may not have noticed that I voted for Marciano to beat Foreman and Louis in rematches, as well as Frazier to beat Ali in both matchups.

Besides, I think it is really quite an accurate reflection. People have their opinions about Holmes, and he is generally well regarded on this forum. I personally think he had the ability to outbox pretty much anyone bar Ali, and he had the chin to stand up to the brawlers. As for how well Lewis would do against the bottom 3, again this is very much down to personal opinions, and no-one will truly know for sure. A lot of people simply can't see someone like Marciano beating Lewis when he has a 7 inch height advantage, 16 inch reach advantage, and 50lb weight advantage to get past. Similar goes for Frazier, whose major weapon was his left hook, a punch that Lewis generally blocked very well throughout his career (he was far more susceptible to straight rights).

If you don't want to vote that's fine, but I do respect you as a poster and appreciate that you have been a consistent voter throughout this tourament.

sockdolager · Post by **sockdolager** » 16 May 2006, 01:14

Ali vs Holmes (Ali won first fight UD12)
Louis vs Foreman (Louis won first fight KO7)
Marciano vs Tyson (Marciano won first fight TKO9)
Lewis vs Frazier (Lewis won first fight MD12)

Ali TKO 10 Holmes- ali able to stay at range and out jab Holmes. Late in the fight Ali gets inside and hits Holmes with 7 or 8 unanswered and the ref steps in.

Louis KO 7 Foreman- After surviving an early knockdown, Louis is able to dictate the fight and puts George down for the count with a great 1-2-3.

Tyson TKO 6 Marciano- Tyson has a lot of trouble hitting Marciano flush while the rock bends and avoids Tysons leaping lefthooks. After a great exchange Tyson finaly lands a shot and tears Rocky's cheek near off. The doctor at ringside stops the fight after the 5th round intermission when the cut is unable to be fixed.

Fraizer SD Lewis- Frazier is able to knock Lewis down in the 4th and again in the 7th to help him in earning a disputed split decision.

jezzamundo · Post by **jezzamundo** » 16 May 2006, 21:30

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 17 May 2006, 10:02

Let's try to make it interesting:

Ali vs Holmes - Draw 12. If any of the post WWII heavyweights could have given prime Ali an even fight it was Holmes.
Louis vs Foreman - Louis UD12. Sorry, but no upset can be constructed here.
Marciano vs Tyson - swarmer vs. swarmer. Marciano KO10, while behind on points and after hititing the floor a couple of times.
Lewis vs Frazier - Lewis KO5. Too big, too strong for Frazier.

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 17 May 2006, 10:03

Crease wrote:I'm sorry Jeezamundo but I'm stopping to vote. I've basically lost confidence and respect for you, and I'm beginning to see your questionable tournament as a bit of a joke.

All I have to do is look at your league table.

1. Ali 1085 points (12-0-0, 2 ko)
2. Louis 1035 points (10-2-0, 7 ko)
3. Holmes 855 points (9-2-1, 3 ko)
4. Foreman 670 points (6-5-1, 6 ko)
5. Lewis 430 points (4-7-1, 2 ko)
6. Marciano 325 points (2-9-1, 1 ko)
7. Frazier 290 points (2-10-0, 1 ko)
8. Tyson 110 points (1-11-0, 1 ko)

I can understand Ali and Louis' positions HOWEVER, what the hell is Larry Holmes doing away up there? AND Lewis wouldn't last against either of the last 3 men in their prime!!!!

I can tell right away that your not to keen on brawlers and that's perhaps why you place them soo lowly.

SO LONG SUCKER!!!!!!!!!!!!

Crease is obviously pissed that little man Marciano doesn't win everything by KO1.....

Don't bother with him.

jezzamundo · Post by **jezzamundo** » 17 May 2006, 23:49

Crease is obviously pissed that little man Marciano doesn't win everything by KO1.....
Don't bother with him.

I just hope he's read my reply and realised what a silly little boy he's been.

13th round of Jezzamundo's dream heavyweight tournament

13th round of Jezzamundo's dream heavyweight tournament

Re: 13th round of Jezzamundo's dream heavyweight tournament