Is Anthony Joshua among the top ten HWs since 2000 ?

[Onetimeonly]

Vitali’s career best win was Corrie sanders

What are your thoughts about Vitali being inducted into the IBHoF? Especially since you appear to have no respect for his accomplishments.

He's the least accomplished fighter in there.

In terms of accomplishment, is Vitali Klitschko less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Yes, though gatti is arguable.

[Enlightened-One]

Vitali’s career best win was Corrie sanders

What are your thoughts about Vitali being inducted into the IBHoF? Especially since you appear to have no respect for his accomplishments.

He's the least accomplished fighter in there.

In terms of accomplishment, is Vitali Klitschko less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Yes, though gatti is arguable.

Explain.

[Bard of Boxrec]

Vitali’s career best win was Corrie sanders

What are your thoughts about Vitali being inducted into the IBHoF? Especially since you appear to have no respect for his accomplishments.

He's the least accomplished fighter in there.

In terms of accomplishment, is Vitali Klitschko less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Yes, though gatti is arguable.

Explain.

No, you explain why he's so great

In his defence I would say p4p Vitali was better than Gatti.

[Onetimeonly]

Vitali’s career best win was Corrie sanders

What are your thoughts about Vitali being inducted into the IBHoF? Especially since you appear to have no respect for his accomplishments.

He's the least accomplished fighter in there.

In terms of accomplishment, is Vitali Klitschko less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Yes, though gatti is arguable.

Explain.

Explain what?

[Enlightened-One]

Vitali’s career best win was Corrie sanders

What are your thoughts about Vitali being inducted into the IBHoF? Especially since you appear to have no respect for his accomplishments.

He's the least accomplished fighter in there.

In terms of accomplishment, is Vitali Klitschko less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Yes, though gatti is arguable.

Explain.

Explain what?

You sincerely believe that Vitali Klitschko is the least accomplished fighter that has ever been inducted into the Hall-of-Fame (IBHoF).

I’ll ask you again, why do you feel that ‘Dr. Ironfist’ is less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Here’s a summary of Vitali Klitschko's professional career highlights to help you answer the question I’ve posed:

• Over the course of thirteen years, Vitali Klitschko engaged in seventeen world title fights, facing nine former world champions, despite being inactive for a four-year period during that timeframe.

• ‘Dr. Ironfist’ is a three-time world heavyweight champion and was rated amongst The RING’s top-ten heavyweight annual rankings nine times between the years 1999 to 2012. The only reason for him not being rated for four of those years was due to his temporary retirement.

• Vitali managed to reclaim his WBC world heavyweight title back from The RING’s second-highest ranked heavyweight fighter, Samuel Peter, without even bothering with a warm-up fight, despite being inactive for four years beforehand, due to retirement.

• Over the course of his 15½ year career in the pro ranks, Vitali scored 41 knockouts in the 47 bouts he competed in, with 91% of his victories coming by way of KO, the highest percentage of any former world heavyweight champion.

• His only losses were due to having suffered injuries. And he was even leading on all three official judges’ scorecards at the time both fights were stopped.

• Only Wladimir Klitschko, Joe Louis, Muhammad Ali and Larry Holmes have achieved more victories whilst competing in world heavyweight title fights.

Why do you sincerely believe that Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson are all far more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko?

• Ingemar Johansson won the world heavyweight title, but never defended it. He only fought 28 times in 11 years and doesn’t hold a victory over any other world champion, other than Floyd Patterson (a man he lost to twice). I can’t understand the reason why you feel he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitchko.

• In terms of Barry McGuigan, should one win over a past-his-prime Hall-of-Famer and two solid title defences solidify your belief that he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko?

• You seem willing to concede Arturo Gatti's lack of accomplishments, but yet he’s technically more accomplished than the likes of Ingemar Johansson and Barry McGuigan.

I understand fighters being inducted into the IBHofH, due to popularity in the sport or based on historical contribution/significance, but in terms of achievement, Vitali Klitschko is one of the most accomplished inductees there is.

[Thunder and Lightning]

Vitali’s career best win was Corrie sanders

What are your thoughts about Vitali being inducted into the IBHoF? Especially since you appear to have no respect for his accomplishments.

He's the least accomplished fighter in there.

In terms of accomplishment, is Vitali Klitschko less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Yes, though gatti is arguable.

Explain.

Explain what?

You sincerely believe that Vitali Klitschko is the least accomplished fighter that has ever been inducted into the Hall-of-Fame (IBHoF).

I’ll ask you again, why do you feel that ‘Dr. Ironfist’ is less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Here’s a summary of Vitali Klitschko's professional career highlights to help you answer the question I’ve posed:

• Over the course of thirteen years, Vitali Klitschko engaged in seventeen world title fights, facing nine former world champions, despite being inactive for a four-year period during that timeframe.

• ‘Dr. Ironfist’ is a three-time world heavyweight champion and was rated amongst The RING’s top-ten heavyweight annual rankings nine times between the years 1999 to 2012. The only reason for him not being rated for four of those years was due to his temporary retirement.

• Vitali managed to reclaim his WBC world heavyweight title back from The RING’s second-highest ranked heavyweight fighter, Samuel Peter, without even bothering with a warm-up fight, despite being inactive for four years beforehand, due to retirement.

• Over the course of his 15½ year career in the pro ranks, Vitali scored 41 knockouts in the 47 bouts he competed in, with 91% of his victories coming by way of KO, the highest percentage of any former world heavyweight champion.

• His only losses were due to having suffered injuries.

• Only Wladimir Klitschko, Joe Louis, Muhammad Ali and Larry Holmes have achieved more victories whilst competing in world heavyweight title fights.

Why do you sincerely believe that Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson are all far more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko?

Ingemar Johansson won the world heavyweight title, but never defended it. He only fought 28 times in 11 years and doesn’t hold a victory over any other world champion, other than Floyd Patterson (a man he lost to twice). I can’t understand the reason why you feel he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitchko.

In terms of Barry McGuigan, should one win over a past-his-prime Hall-of-Famer and two solid title defences solidify your belief that he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko?

You seem willing to concede the possibility that Arturo Gatti may only slightly more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko (even though Italian-born Canadian fighter is almost certainly less accomplished than ‘Dr. Ironfist’), but yet he’s technically accomplished more in the sport than the likes of Ingemar Johansson and Barry McGuigan.

Its unfair to compare Johansson to Vitali in that way, yes Vitali has alot more world title fights and stuff like that but there are 1000s of titles now (4 that matters), in Johanssons day there were 1 world title and you were the man if you had it.

Was Vitali ever the man inte division? He lost to the man, no matter how he lost he still lost.
When wlad was the man they never fought so Vitali only had second tier oponents alot of whom were world champions but if there was only one world title would any of them have held it?
Were any of his wins better than or even close to Floyd Patterson and Eddie Machen?

Im not saying Ingo was a better fighter but for his era he was more accomplished and fought better guys i think.
Also Ingemar Johansson is an anomaly, he is Swedish, a small country with no real boxing pedigree and he became world heavyweight champion, lets not kid ourself thats why he is in the hall of fame.

[Enlightened-One]

Vitali’s career best win was Corrie sanders

What are your thoughts about Vitali being inducted into the IBHoF? Especially since you appear to have no respect for his accomplishments.

He's the least accomplished fighter in there.

In terms of accomplishment, is Vitali Klitschko less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Yes, though gatti is arguable.

Explain.

Explain what?

You sincerely believe that Vitali Klitschko is the least accomplished fighter that has ever been inducted into the Hall-of-Fame (IBHoF).

I’ll ask you again, why do you feel that ‘Dr. Ironfist’ is less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Here’s a summary of Vitali Klitschko's professional career highlights to help you answer the question I’ve posed:

• Over the course of thirteen years, Vitali Klitschko engaged in seventeen world title fights, facing nine former world champions, despite being inactive for a four-year period during that timeframe.

• ‘Dr. Ironfist’ is a three-time world heavyweight champion and was rated amongst The RING’s top-ten heavyweight annual rankings nine times between the years 1999 to 2012. The only reason for him not being rated for four of those years was due to his temporary retirement.

• Vitali managed to reclaim his WBC world heavyweight title back from The RING’s second-highest ranked heavyweight fighter, Samuel Peter, without even bothering with a warm-up fight, despite being inactive for four years beforehand, due to retirement.

• Over the course of his 15½ year career in the pro ranks, Vitali scored 41 knockouts in the 47 bouts he competed in, with 91% of his victories coming by way of KO, the highest percentage of any former world heavyweight champion.

• His only losses were due to having suffered injuries. And he was even leading on all three official judges’ scorecards at the time both fights were stopped.

• Only Wladimir Klitschko, Joe Louis, Muhammad Ali and Larry Holmes have achieved more victories whilst competing in world heavyweight title fights.

Why do you sincerely believe that Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson are all far more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko?

• Ingemar Johansson won the world heavyweight title, but never defended it. He only fought 28 times in 11 years and doesn’t hold a victory over any other world champion, other than Floyd Patterson (a man he lost to twice). I can’t understand the reason why you feel he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitchko.

• In terms of Barry McGuigan, should one win over a past-his-prime Hall-of-Famer and two solid title defences solidify your belief that he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko?

• You seem willing to concede Arturo Gatti's lack of accomplishments, but yet he’s technically more accomplished than the likes of Ingemar Johansson and Barry McGuigan.

I understand fighters being inducted into the IBHofH, due to popularity in the sport or based on historical contribution/significance, but in terms of achievement, Vitali Klitschko is one of the most accomplished inductees there is.

Its unfair to compare Johansson to Vitali in that way, yes Vitali has alot more world title fights and stuff like that but there are 1000s of titles now (4 that matters), in Johanssons day there were 1 world title and you were the man if you had it.

Was Vitali ever the man inte division? He lost to the man, no matter how he lost he still lost.
When wlad was the man they never fought so Vitali only had second tier oponents alot of whom were world champions but if there was only one world title would any of them have held it?
Were any of his wins better than or even close to Floyd Patterson and Eddie Machen?

Im not saying Ingo was a better fighter but for his era he was more accomplished and fought better guys i think.
Also Ingemar Johansson is an anomaly, he is Swedish, a small country with no real boxing pedigree and he became world heavyweight champion, lets not kid ourself thats why he is in the hall of fame.

Apart from Floyd Patterson, Eddie Machen and Henry Cooper, the names on Ingemar Johansson’s resume are seemingly anonymous. And I’d argue that Machen and Cooper are not sufficiently good enough to elevate Johansson’s accomplishments above Klitschko’s. I don't believe that Ingemar consistently faced better guys than those ‘Dr. Ironfist’ fought.

In my mind, one win and two losses against Floyd Patterson is insufficient evidence to prove that Ingemar Johansson is more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko.

Why don't you try to persuade me by performing a similar exercise to what I’ve just done, by listing Ingemar Johansson’s professional career highlights?

I’m willing to revise my opinion if you can prove that Ingemar Johansson has accomplished more in the sport of boxing than Vitali Klitschko did.

A gentle reminder though, Vitali Klitschko was regarded as the best in the heavyweight division after Lennox Lewis’ final bout in 2003. He even once held The RING championship. Some would argue that he was a better fighter than his brother and considered him the best heavyweight in the world between 2008 to 2012. So during at least one point in time, Vitali Klitschko was actually universally regarded as being “the man” in the heavyweight division. This is a historical fact that cannot be refuted. I’m a little surprised you didn’t know this?

What about Barry McGuigan and Arturo Gatti? You didn't comment on those guys, did you?

[Thunder and Lightning]

Vitali’s career best win was Corrie sanders

What are your thoughts about Vitali being inducted into the IBHoF? Especially since you appear to have no respect for his accomplishments.

He's the least accomplished fighter in there.

In terms of accomplishment, is Vitali Klitschko less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Yes, though gatti is arguable.

Explain.

Explain what?

You sincerely believe that Vitali Klitschko is the least accomplished fighter that has ever been inducted into the Hall-of-Fame (IBHoF).

I’ll ask you again, why do you feel that ‘Dr. Ironfist’ is less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Here’s a summary of Vitali Klitschko's professional career highlights to help you answer the question I’ve posed:

• Over the course of thirteen years, Vitali Klitschko engaged in seventeen world title fights, facing nine former world champions, despite being inactive for a four-year period during that timeframe.

• ‘Dr. Ironfist’ is a three-time world heavyweight champion and was rated amongst The RING’s top-ten heavyweight annual rankings nine times between the years 1999 to 2012. The only reason for him not being rated for four of those years was due to his temporary retirement.

• Vitali managed to reclaim his WBC world heavyweight title back from The RING’s second-highest ranked heavyweight fighter, Samuel Peter, without even bothering with a warm-up fight, despite being inactive for four years beforehand, due to retirement.

• Over the course of his 15½ year career in the pro ranks, Vitali scored 41 knockouts in the 47 bouts he competed in, with 91% of his victories coming by way of KO, the highest percentage of any former world heavyweight champion.

• His only losses were due to having suffered injuries.

• Only Wladimir Klitschko, Joe Louis, Muhammad Ali and Larry Holmes have achieved more victories whilst competing in world heavyweight title fights.

Why do you sincerely believe that Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson are all far more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko?

Ingemar Johansson won the world heavyweight title, but never defended it. He only fought 28 times in 11 years and doesn’t hold a victory over any other world champion, other than Floyd Patterson (a man he lost to twice). I can’t understand the reason why you feel he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitchko.

In terms of Barry McGuigan, should one win over a past-his-prime Hall-of-Famer and two solid title defences solidify your belief that he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko?

You seem willing to concede the possibility that Arturo Gatti may only slightly more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko (even though Italian-born Canadian fighter is almost certainly less accomplished than ‘Dr. Ironfist’), but yet he’s technically accomplished more in the sport than the likes of Ingemar Johansson and Barry McGuigan.

Its unfair to compare Johansson to Vitali in that way, yes Vitali has alot more world title fights and stuff like that but there are 1000s of titles now (4 that matters), in Johanssons day there were 1 world title and you were the man if you had it.

Was Vitali ever the man inte division? He lost to the man, no matter how he lost he still lost.
When wlad was the man they never fought so Vitali only had second tier oponents alot of whom were world champions but if there was only one world title would any of them have held it?
Were any of his wins better than or even close to Floyd Patterson and Eddie Machen?

Im not saying Ingo was a better fighter but for his era he was more accomplished and fought better guys i think.
Also Ingemar Johansson is an anomaly, he is Swedish, a small country with no real boxing pedigree and he became world heavyweight champion, lets not kid ourself thats why he is in the hall of fame.

Apart from Floyd Patterson, Eddie Machen and Henry Cooper, the names on Ingemar Johansson’s resume are seemingly anonymous. And I’d argue that Machen and Cooper are not sufficiently good enough to elevate Johansson’s accomplishments above Klitschko’s. I don't believe that Ingemar consistently faced better guys than the guys ‘Dr. Ironfist’ fought.

In my mind, one win and two losses against Floyd Patterson is insufficient evidence to prove that Ingemar Johansson is more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko.

Why don't you try to persuade me by performing a similar exercise to what I’ve just done, by listing Ingemar Johansson’s professional career highlights?

I’m willing to revise my opinion if you can prove that Ingemar Johansson has accomplished more in the sport of boxing than Vitali Klitschko did.

What about Barry McGuigan and Arturo Gatti? You didn't comment on those guys, did you?

Its imposible to do that, Johansson and Vitali are 50 years apart, there werent 9 world champions for Ingo to face in his era, there were 2 he could logicaly have faced (Patterson and Liston) he beat all the best in europe and then the two best americans thats about it in a short career.
I also said the swedish thing meaning i dont think Ingo shuold realy be in either, hes in cuz he is swedish.

But as far as his wins being anonymous say other than Lewis and maybe Byrd the guys Vitali fought that anyone will remember in 50 years.
Im not saying Ingo is better but its such different eras its impossible to make the comparison in that way and yes beating Patterson and Machen i would say is enough since I dont think Vitali has anything better on his resume and he never beat the number 1 guy either.

Gatti and Mcguigan i will simply take your word for im not familiar enough to coment.

[Enlightened-One]

I dont think Vitali has anything better on his resume and he never beat the number 1 guy either.

Vitali Klitschko must have faced the top fighter rated by The RING, when he defeated Corrie Saunders, to claim The Ring heavyweight title, which he retained ownership of until his retirement in 2005.

‘Dr. Ironfist’ was regarded as the best heavyweight on the planet after Lennox Lewis' final bout in 2003 until 2005, when Klitschko retired. There was no controversy surrounding Vitali Klitschko’s claims to being the top-dog of the heavyweight division during this time.

Have a look at The RING’s annual ratings in 2004 and let me otherwise.

Some would argue that he was a better fighter than his brother and even considered him the best heavyweight in the world between 2008 to 2012.

So during at least one point in time, Vitali Klitschko was actually universally regarded as being “the man” in the heavyweight division. This is a historical fact that cannot be refuted.

Ingemar Johansson won the world heavyweight title, but never defended it. He only fought 28 times in 11 years and doesn’t hold a victory over any other world champion, other than Floyd Patterson (a man he subsequently lost to twice). I’d argue that Machen and Cooper are not sufficiently good enough to elevate Johansson’s accomplishments above Klitschko’s. I don't believe that Ingemar consistently faced better guys than the guys ‘Dr. Ironfist’ fought.

I can’t understand the reason why you feel he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitchko, but I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

[Thunder and Lightning]

I dont think Vitali has anything better on his resume and he never beat the number 1 guy either.

Vitali Klitschko must have faced the top fighter rated by The RING, when he defeated Corrie Saunders, to claim The Ring heavyweight title, which he retained ownership of until his retirement in 2005.

‘Dr. Ironfist’ was regarded as the best heavyweight on the planet after Lennox Lewis' final bout in 2003 until 2005, when Klitschko retired. Have a look at The RING’s annual ratings in 2004 and let me otherwise.

Some would argue that he was a better fighter than his brother and considered him the best heavyweight in the world between 2008 to 2012. So during at least one point in time, Vitali Klitschko was actually universally regarded as being “the man” in the heavyweight division. This is a historical fact that cannot be refuted.

Ingemar Johansson won the world heavyweight title, but never defended it. He only fought 28 times in 11 years and doesn’t hold a victory over any other world champion, other than Floyd Patterson (a man he subsequently lost to twice). I can’t understand the reason why you feel he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitchko, but I guess we'll have to agree to disagree

Thats fair we will agree to disagree all i said is its different eras, i dont understand how you can compare Vitali and Ingos accomplishments based on the number of champions he beat when there are so many more titles around now and Vitali also fought in whats generaly recognised as a very weak era and if beating Corrie Sanders makes you the man I think thats case and point.
Beating 9 champions is not possible if there was only 2 and by the time Liston was champ Ingo was retired, Joe Fraizer also only beat one universal world champion, a man he then lost to twice not comparing Ingo to Frazier at all just stating a fact not the same era.

Alot of Vitalis greatness is based on speculation and what could have been, i actually do think he was better than Wlad and a very good fighter but thats not an accomplishment its speculation.

[Onetimeonly]

Vitali’s career best win was Corrie sanders

What are your thoughts about Vitali being inducted into the IBHoF? Especially since you appear to have no respect for his accomplishments.

He's the least accomplished fighter in there.

In terms of accomplishment, is Vitali Klitschko less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Yes, though gatti is arguable.

Explain.

Explain what?

You sincerely believe that Vitali Klitschko is the least accomplished fighter that has ever been inducted into the Hall-of-Fame (IBHoF).

I’ll ask you again, why do you feel that ‘Dr. Ironfist’ is less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Here’s a summary of Vitali Klitschko's professional career highlights to help you answer the question I’ve posed:

• Over the course of thirteen years, Vitali Klitschko engaged in seventeen world title fights, facing nine former world champions, despite being inactive for a four-year period during that timeframe.

• ‘Dr. Ironfist’ is a three-time world heavyweight champion and was rated amongst The RING’s top-ten heavyweight annual rankings nine times between the years 1999 to 2012. The only reason for him not being rated for four of those years was due to his temporary retirement.

• Vitali managed to reclaim his WBC world heavyweight title back from The RING’s second-highest ranked heavyweight fighter, Samuel Peter, without even bothering with a warm-up fight, despite being inactive for four years beforehand, due to retirement.

• Over the course of his 15½ year career in the pro ranks, Vitali scored 41 knockouts in the 47 bouts he competed in, with 91% of his victories coming by way of KO, the highest percentage of any former world heavyweight champion.

• His only losses were due to having suffered injuries. And he was even leading on all three official judges’ scorecards at the time both fights were stopped.

• Only Wladimir Klitschko, Joe Louis, Muhammad Ali and Larry Holmes have achieved more victories whilst competing in world heavyweight title fights.

Why do you sincerely believe that Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson are all far more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko?

• Ingemar Johansson won the world heavyweight title, but never defended it. He only fought 28 times in 11 years and doesn’t hold a victory over any other world champion, other than Floyd Patterson (a man he lost to twice). I can’t understand the reason why you feel he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitchko.

• In terms of Barry McGuigan, should one win over a past-his-prime Hall-of-Famer and two solid title defences solidify your belief that he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko?

• You seem willing to concede Arturo Gatti's lack of accomplishments, but yet he’s technically more accomplished than the likes of Ingemar Johansson and Barry McGuigan.

I understand fighters being inducted into the IBHofH, due to popularity in the sport or based on historical contribution/significance, but in terms of achievement, Vitali Klitschko is one of the most accomplished inductees there is.

Mcguigan and Johansson beat a great fighter and a couple very good ones. Vitali beat nobody of note. He fought weak fighters in a weak era. At least his brother fought the best of the lot.

[Onetimeonly]

As for gatti, he has better wins than vitali but he proved to be thoroughly uncompetitive with hof level fighters while vitali once proved he could be. My #1 or #2 all-time fighter never fought for a title. Counting meaningless belts and ko% in this era leaves you unworthy of any serious consideration in a hof debate. Carry on kid

[oogiebe]

As for gatti, he has better wins than vitali but he proved to be thoroughly uncompetitive with hof level fighters while vitali once proved he could be. My #1 or #2 all-time fighter never fought for a title. Counting meaningless belts and ko% in this era leaves you unworthy of any serious consideration in a hof debate. Carry on kid

Did you actually read his novel????

[Onetimeonly]

As for gatti, he has better wins than vitali but he proved to be thoroughly uncompetitive with hof level fighters while vitali once proved he could be. My #1 or #2 all-time fighter never fought for a title. Counting meaningless belts and ko% in this era leaves you unworthy of any serious consideration in a hof debate. Carry on kid

Did you actually read his novel????

I skimmed it. It was a reasonable question.

[jamamb]

vitali has nothing on his resume historically meaningful. ya many defenses, but what win really stands out for the quality of opponent and nature of win

weve seen how guys like wilder too can defend the wbc for many fights and continually beat not great opposition. though beating ortiz is a better win then any of vitalis

longevity means not so much when its against guys like arreola. stepping up and beating an a level fighter once shows more then beating 10 c+ levels

[Enlightened-One]

Vitali’s career best win was Corrie sanders

What are your thoughts about Vitali being inducted into the IBHoF? Especially since you appear to have no respect for his accomplishments.

He's the least accomplished fighter in there.

In terms of accomplishment, is Vitali Klitschko less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Yes, though gatti is arguable.

Explain.

Explain what?

You sincerely believe that Vitali Klitschko is the least accomplished fighter that has ever been inducted into the Hall-of-Fame (IBHoF).

I’ll ask you again, why do you feel that ‘Dr. Ironfist’ is less accomplished than Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson?

Here’s a summary of Vitali Klitschko's professional career highlights to help you answer the question I’ve posed:

• Over the course of thirteen years, Vitali Klitschko engaged in seventeen world title fights, facing nine former world champions, despite being inactive for a four-year period during that timeframe.

• ‘Dr. Ironfist’ is a three-time world heavyweight champion and was rated amongst The RING’s top-ten heavyweight annual rankings nine times between the years 1999 to 2012. The only reason for him not being rated for four of those years was due to his temporary retirement.

• Vitali managed to reclaim his WBC world heavyweight title back from The RING’s second-highest ranked heavyweight fighter, Samuel Peter, without even bothering with a warm-up fight, despite being inactive for four years beforehand, due to retirement.

• Over the course of his 15½ year career in the pro ranks, Vitali scored 41 knockouts in the 47 bouts he competed in, with 91% of his victories coming by way of KO, the highest percentage of any former world heavyweight champion.

• His only losses were due to having suffered injuries. And he was even leading on all three official judges’ scorecards at the time both fights were stopped.

• Only Wladimir Klitschko, Joe Louis, Muhammad Ali and Larry Holmes have achieved more victories whilst competing in world heavyweight title fights.

Why do you sincerely believe that Barry McGuigan, Arturo Gatti and Ingemar Johansson are all far more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko?

• Ingemar Johansson won the world heavyweight title, but never defended it. He only fought 28 times in 11 years and doesn’t hold a victory over any other world champion, other than Floyd Patterson (a man he lost to twice). I can’t understand the reason why you feel he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitchko.

• In terms of Barry McGuigan, should one win over a past-his-prime Hall-of-Famer and two solid title defences solidify your belief that he’s more accomplished than Vitali Klitschko?

• You seem willing to concede Arturo Gatti's lack of accomplishments, but yet he’s technically more accomplished than the likes of Ingemar Johansson and Barry McGuigan.

I understand fighters being inducted into the IBHofH, due to popularity in the sport or based on historical contribution/significance, but in terms of achievement, Vitali Klitschko is one of the most accomplished inductees there is.

Mcguigan and Johansson beat a great fighter and a couple very good ones. Vitali beat nobody of note. He fought weak fighters in a weak era. At least his brother fought the best of the lot.

Your criticism of Vitali Klitschko is far too harsh, but if you don’t like the fellow, then that’s your prerogative. We don't all have to appreciate the same set of fighters.

To me, it's clear that Mcguigan and Johansson are both less accomplished than Vitali is, but there’s nothing stopping you from believing otherwise, because that’s the very nature of “faith”, it often compels people to ignore facts that conflict with their own beliefs.

We'll agree to disagree.

[Onetimeonly]

We'll agree that you don't know what you're talking about.

[jamamb]

chris arreola is seriously one of vitalis best wins

[Enlightened-One]

chris arreola is seriously one of vitalis best wins

Who else available could Vitali have fought that either his brother or himself didn't already face?

Prior to the David Lemieux bout, people were not only claiming that GGG was the pound-for-pound best in the sport, but that he was already a dead-cert first-ballot future Hall-of-Famer capable of beating all-time-greats like Marvin Hagler and Bernard Hopkins. Their argument was that it wasn’t Golovkin’s fault for not having faced better opposition.

Yet the majority of the same set of people are claiming that Vitali Klitschko is an undeserving member of the IBHoF, due to him not having faced better opposition.

To me, there’s a double-standard being applied here.

In my mind, it’s false to claim that Vitali didn’t face the very best his division had to offer. It is, however, reasonable to claim that the heavyweight division wasn’t strong during the Klitschko era of domination.

Two questions: did Vitali duck anyone? Was he able to face better fighters during his own era?

I don’t subscribe to the idea that Vitali and Wladimir tarnished their own legacies for not having fought each other. Their decision was reasonable and one most of us would make.

[Thunder and Lightning]

[quote=jamamb post_id=5128572 time=<a href="tel:1554128630">1554128630</a> user_id=199053]
chris arreola is seriously one of vitalis best wins

Who else available could Vitali have fought that either his brother or himself didn't already face?

Prior to the David Lemieux bout, people were not only claiming that GGG was the pound-for-pound best in the sport, but that he was already a dead-cert first-ballot future Hall-of-Famer capable of beating all-time-greats like Marvin Hagler and Bernard Hopkins. Their argument was that it wasn’t Golovkin’s fault for not having faced better opposition.

Yet the majority of the same set of people are claiming that Vitali Klitschko is an undeserving member of the IBHoF, due to him not having faced better opposition.

To me, there’s a double-standard being applied here.

In my mind, it’s false to claim that Vitali didn’t face the very best his division had to offer. It is, however, reasonable to claim that the heavyweight division wasn’t strong during the Klitschko era of domination.

Two questions: did Vitali duck anyone? Was he able to face better fighters during his own era?

I don’t subscribe to the idea that Vitali and Wladimir tarnished their own legacies for not having fought each other. Their decision was reasonable and one most of us would make.

His brother beating them doesnt mean anything does it?
He is a victim of being in a weak era but Wlad cleaned out the division and beat everybody, Vitali didnt and again saying he would is again speculation, their accomplishments are not the same, why didnt Vitali go for Haye, Povetkin, Rahman, Chagaev, Valuev, Ibragimov or Thompson he didnt clean out anything.

If people said that about GGG they were wrong too IMO.

[Onetimeonly]

[quote=jamamb post_id=5128572 time=<a href="tel:1554128630">1554128630</a> user_id=199053]
chris arreola is seriously one of vitalis best wins

Who else available could Vitali have fought that either his brother or himself didn't already face?

Prior to the David Lemieux bout, people were not only claiming that GGG was the pound-for-pound best in the sport, but that he was already a dead-cert first-ballot future Hall-of-Famer capable of beating all-time-greats like Marvin Hagler and Bernard Hopkins. Their argument was that it wasn’t Golovkin’s fault for not having faced better opposition.

Yet the majority of the same set of people are claiming that Vitali Klitschko is an undeserving member of the IBHoF, due to him not having faced better opposition.

To me, there’s a double-standard being applied here.

In my mind, it’s false to claim that Vitali didn’t face the very best his division had to offer. It is, however, reasonable to claim that the heavyweight division wasn’t strong during the Klitschko era of domination.

Two questions: did Vitali duck anyone? Was he able to face better fighters during his own era?

I don’t subscribe to the idea that Vitali and Wladimir tarnished their own legacies for not having fought each other. Their decision was reasonable and one most of us would make.

His brother beating them doesnt mean anything does it?
He is a victim of being in a weak era but Wlad cleaned out the division and beat everybody, Vitali didnt and again saying he would is again speculation, their accomplishments are not the same, why didnt Vitali go for Haye, Povetkin, Rahman, Chagaev, Valuev, Ibragimov or Thompson he didnt clean out anything.

If people said that about GGG they were wrong too IMO.

[NateJR]

How can anyone put Wilder, Joshua or Fury in the top 5 when they haven't even proven who's the best current heavyweight. Much less #1 or top 3 since 2000. WOW.

[oogiebe]

How can anyone put Wilder, Joshua or Fury in the top 5 when they haven't even proven who's the best current heavyweight. Much less #1 or top 3 since 2000. WOW.

I can see it, but I'm not keen on historical ranking of active fighters. It's like reviewing a book with the last several chapters missing. But if pushed, I'd put them at least in the top 10 since 2000 with Joshua in top five.

[Enlightened-One]

[quote=jamamb post_id=5128572 time=<a href="tel:1554128630">1554128630</a> user_id=199053]
chris arreola is seriously one of vitalis best wins

Who else available could Vitali have fought that either his brother or himself didn't already face?

Prior to the David Lemieux bout, people were not only claiming that GGG was the pound-for-pound best in the sport, but that he was already a dead-cert first-ballot future Hall-of-Famer capable of beating all-time-greats like Marvin Hagler and Bernard Hopkins. Their argument was that it wasn’t Golovkin’s fault for not having faced better opposition.

Yet the majority of the same set of people are claiming that Vitali Klitschko is an undeserving member of the IBHoF, due to him not having faced better opposition.

To me, there’s a double-standard being applied here.

In my mind, it’s false to claim that Vitali didn’t face the very best his division had to offer. It is, however, reasonable to claim that the heavyweight division wasn’t strong during the Klitschko era of domination.

Two questions: did Vitali duck anyone? Was he able to face better fighters during his own era?

I don’t subscribe to the idea that Vitali and Wladimir tarnished their own legacies for not having fought each other. Their decision was reasonable and one most of us would make.

His brother beating them doesnt mean anything does it?
He is a victim of being in a weak era but Wlad cleaned out the division and beat everybody, Vitali didnt and again saying he would is again speculation, their accomplishments are not the same, why didnt Vitali go for Haye, Povetkin, Rahman, Chagaev, Valuev, Ibragimov or Thompson he didnt clean out anything.

If people said that about GGG they were wrong too IMO.

People spontaneously mention names in almost a Tourette’s Syndrome style manner, as if to boast about their boxing knowledge, but if they were really knowledgeable and understood timelines, it’ll be clear they’re talking nonsense!

It’s like saying that Vitali’s resume is utter garbage because he never faced Muhammad Ali! FFS!

Review the boxers that were competing and considered as top-ten world-rated fighters during Vitali’s period of activity, when he was still competing (i.e. not retired).

Here are the facts:

• David Haye 'turned down' a fight against Vitali Klitschko in favour of a fight with Dereck Chisora. I'm pretty sure Haye also turned down the Vitali bout in favour of facing his brother Wladimir.

• Vitali had already retired by the time his brother faced Alexander Povetkin.

• Vitali was retired by the time when Hasim Rahman was on the world scene. Wladimir had already signed-up for the Rahman bout, when Vitali came out of retirement to face The RING's second-best heavyweight in 2008, which was Samuel Peter.

• Wladimir faced Chagaev, during a time when Vitali was defending his WBC title against unbeaten opposition (i.e. Chris Arreola).

• Vitali was retired when Nikolay Valuev arrived on the world scene, with the Russian retiring shortly after ‘Dr. Ironfist’ made his ring return. Apparently Vitali did try to make that bout. but Valuev wasn't interested (Dr. Ironfist's words).

• Wladimir had already beaten Ibragimov and Thompson before Vitali made his comeback in 2008.

• It's important to note that when Vitali came out of retirement in 2008, he faced The RING's second-best heavyweight in 2008, which was Samuel Peter.

• People also forget that Odlanier Solis was perceived as a real threat to Vitali Klitschko prior to their bout, but the Cuban was decimated inside a single round by ‘Dr. Ironfist’.

If you’re going to challenge me, do your research, don’t bark some random words that bear no relation to reality whatsoever! All you’re doing is highlighting your own lack of knowledge! FFS!

[ValMar]

I agree with EO, at least 90 %, considering Vitali's career. As I know, he had never ducked any fighter. I remember some rumours about potential fight against Valuev, but a few persons know what happened, and who was guilty because the fight had never happened.
I accept that it has been pretty weak HW era, but Holmes' reign has not been better, and almost noone blamed Holmes because of that.

I can not agree with EO about Solis. He had not been decimated by Vitali, he had lost because of injury.