George Foreman vs. Larry Holmes in 1999: Who Wins?

[Ruthless-RKO]

Between them, these two all-time greats compiled astonishing numbers: 145 wins, just 11 losses, and a staggering 112 KO’s. George Foreman and Larry Holmes – two of the greatest heavyweights of the 1970s, in fact of all-time. But in the opinion of some, there is something missing from the records of both men: they somehow managed to avoid fighting one another during their ’70s prime.

The the two former champs did actually come oh, so close to getting it on, however – in 1999.

At this time, with both greats well into their forties – in fact, in the case of “Big George,” who is almost a year older than Holmes, his fifties – pen was put to paper. The fight was all set for January 23rd of 1999, with Foreman guaranteed a $9 million payday, Holmes $4 million.

But with just days to go, and after both legends had embarked on a press tour to hype the intriguing match-up, Foreman bailed out when promoter Roger Levitt failed to pay George his promised advance. Basically, Levitt’s cheque bounced and so did the fight – right off the schedule. What to think of this? Is it a good thing the two heavyweight fossils never met, or was boxing history robbed of a fascinating fight between the two men who are today the last surviving contributors to a golden age for the heavyweight division?

Holmes, to this day bitter towards Foreman (perhaps due to jealousy) might well have jabbed, jabbed, jabbed his way to a decision win over the course of the ten-rounds the fight was set for. Or maybe Foreman, no slouch himself when it came to the art of throwing and landing a punishing and frequent left jab, would have pounded out a decision win himself. A KO, either way, was always going to be unlikely; due in some part to how slow and lacking in killer snap both veterans were, but also due to the fact that both heavyweight kings were blessed with the kind of granite chin any modern day heavy would kill for.

Maybe it would have been a slo-mo embarrassment, or maybe Holmes, then 65-6(44) and Foreman, then 76-5(68) would have reached back in time and produced one last prideful effort in giving us an eventful fight that saw one of the most enduring heavyweight grudges put to rest. Today, a fan of Foreman can make a great case for a win by “Big George,” while at the same time a Holmes fan can convincingly insist how “The Easton Assassin” would have walked away with the victory.

These days, Foreman could care less about this fight, or about any fight. George is as content as can be with how his career went; the losses he suffered included. But Holmes, still moved by some perceived lack of respect, would probably tell you how, in all honestly, he still has the urge to beat up on Foreman.

It might have happened in 1999, or maybe Foreman would have bashed Holmes around for thirty-minutes. Maybe this fight is better left to the ranks of Dream Fights, to the imagination of we fans.

[DrDuke]

They both were faded pretty much by then. In the fist half of the 90s they were decent, especially Foreman, but by 1999 they were too old. In the early 90s I'd pick Foreman, but in their 1999 versions I favor Holmes. It would have been a sad to watch fight, like Holmes-Bonecrusher 2, which took place exactly in 1999, and Holmes' jab would be the only relatively good thing in this bout. Larry would take the decision.

[HomicideHenry]

Holmes in a unaminous decision. I love them both but Larry no matter how old he was had George's number. George in his 40s was still a plodder and Holmes in his 40s was still pretty slick. I'd argue Holmes wide decision over Mercer was worth more than the bulk of Foreman's comeback victories.

[Brian Seneca]

I am from Harrisburg Pennsylvania so Larry was like OUR heavyweight champion. As is often said he was underrated and under appreciated. But an all time great nonetheless. I also love Foreman 1st and 2nd versions. But I have to give the edge to Holmes. He was very difficult to stop. I still maintain had he more time before Tyson he goes the distance and gives Mike his toughest defense. He got up from Shavers and Snipes. I know that was prime Holmes but George was even slower in 99. Holmes by decision

[Woldemar]

Holmes by UD.

[StrabaBox29]

Holmes was technically close to Ali, so i would say Holmes would win...

[BroughtonRulesRefuge]

- Yes, as we near the end of a beautifully bountiful spring, tis the time of the year for the pasture bound cow patties to sprout forth hallucinogenic mushrooms for dharma bums so inclined to seek enlightenment on moonless nights so they won't be filled with buckshot from any irate rancher.

"I saw my life was a vast, glowing empty page and I could do anything thing I want."

Since George and Larry are the same age, let's follow their time line on boxrec, ever hear of it? Easy as pie it is starting with career records, that being George 76-5, 68 KO and Lar being 69-6, 44 KO.

Age 19: George with barely 20 ama fights wins gold at the storied high altitude 68 Mexico City Olympics. Lar still learning to tie his shoes properly so he don't stumble sweeping the warehouse.

Age 20: George in his 4th pro fight KOs the NJ State heavy champ and future Ali title contender, Chuck Wepner, in 3 rds. Lar's warehouse duties have expanded to include sanitation.

Age 21: George KOs former Ali contender and future rematch opponent, George Chuvalo in 2 rds. Chuvalo would go the distance with Ali in both fights and gave him some of his hardest work. Lar straps on his first pair of boxing gloves and ends up under the wings of Ali and Dundee before entering the 72 Olympic trials. With Ali blabbering to Cosell how Lar gonna win Gold, Duane Bobick KTFOs him that STFO of Ali, damnedest thing I ever saw on live TV, a now stricken mute Ali!.

Age 24: George KO Frazier in 2 for the undisputed title. Lar pro debut in with 7 no hopers.

Age 25: George KO Norton in 2 before his fateful Rumble in the Jungle with Ali. Lar 2 more no hopers.

Age 26: George his infamous 5 men x 3rd exhibition in Canada covered by ABC and Cosell complete with Ali screaming "You ain't never getting no rematch you bum." George KO 3 of the 5 including Judge who had taken Lar the distance a couple years before.  Lar his most fruitful year of no hopers, 9 in all though he does get revenge on Duane when he knocks out his lesser brother of the other mother, Rodney. Atta Boy, Tiger!

Age 27: George comes back with a Ring FOY vs Lyle featuring a short 20 min rd after George KDs Lyle with subsequent KDs ending in KO Lyle rd 5, often rated as the best heavyweight fight ever. Lar beats his first fringe contender, Roy Williams, UD.

Age 28: After several more KOs including retiring Frazier permanently, Ring #1 George gets smothered by the oppressive heat and humidity Puerto Rico on a DKing undercard by Jimmy Young, a fight I had him winning since all Young did was run around. Lar buried even further on the undercard against Horace Robinson. Yes, THAT Mrs. Robinson!

If they were ever gonna fight, there it was. Lar not yet ready for the golden era of George that included Jimmy Young and all the rest. Obviously the public wouldn't know Lar from a bum steer then, so no impetus for any big fights. George retires to his ranch and ministry, the last of the big three, leaving only Norton as the last fighter of the Golden Age standing, barely after 3 hard fought decisions with Ali and a few painful minutes against Foreman.

And Norton as much as I admired him, never won a title match, his title was conferred by the WBC because Ali skipped the mandatory rematch. Lar's best wins are the rusty, inexperienced and injury prone Cooney who in spite of only 86 rds of experience, was outboxing Lar on the cards until his multiple low blow infractions, and Spoon whom most saw handle Lar easily, Spoons best performance. So, end of the day, Lar couldn't carry Rocky's jock strap.

After consecutive title losses to Mike Spinks who actually was a highly credentialed title holder, he retires in a snit fit only to become jealous of all the money and fame flooding all of boxing with young Tyson. Lar stalks him at every defense for a year, savaging him in interviews and is finally granted a title shot in 88, near fatal as Mike literally left 39 yr old Lar crucified on the canvas for 5 minutes. Another retirement after a record of 0-3 against standing champs. Not looking good for him and only due to get worse.

During that interim, the 38 yr old Foreman begins his comeback in 87 that resulted in a final tally of 31-3, 26 KO and a world and lineal title. George began with the single motivation beating Tyson. After working his way up the chain, when Tyson was offered that fight by King, Tyson went full hysteric saying he'd never face such a brute as Foreman, so now not only is Ali ducking Foreman, Tyson too. Neither ducked tubby Lar.

Age 39 George KOs Qawi in 7 who was not that far removed from putting Field in the hospital on death's doorstep. Age 40 he KOs Cooper in 2, the same Cooper who was one punch from lifting the title from Field. 41 yr old George KOs Cooney in 2. 42 yr old George muller's Field enough to have him hanging on for dear life the last few rds to lose a decision that those of us watching in my group thought George deserved. Jealous at all the $$$ and accolades George is raking in, 42 yr old Lar begins his 2nd comeback.

Age 44 George takes on young buck Morrison and quickly sends him fleeing for his young life for a new stick and run style the unrepentant slugger had never revealed before for the decision. Age 43 Lar takes a rather dubious decision over Mercer who was making headlines disrespecting boxing and greatly disrespecting Lar in the ring, one handedly choking him out almost to the point of brain damage before the ref manages to pull him off. So they give the decision to Lar that earns him a shot at the now damaged Field who no longer possessed the power and invincibility after George neutered him. Lar's best moment was laying on the ropes with a hand illegally holding him up through the fight when he caught Field coming in for the kill with the perfect elbow that opened him up like a stuck pig. Alas to no avail, so now Lar is 0-4 against real titlists. 

Age 45 Foreman slowing but still powerful enough to flatten lineal titlist Moorer for a 1000 count in a tough fight. Age 46 Lar loses to the crack addicted McCall for his WBC title. Lar now 0-5.

George makes 3 nondescript defenses of his lineal as the IBF and WBA strip him for not jumping through their hoops. Age 48 quickly sends big stud Shannon Briggs fleeing to the ropes for rope burn to finally dethrone the brute force of old, fat George that most thought yet another illicit decision against the champ, and George retires for a rest much like God after the creation. Age 48 Lar loses a decision against Brian Neilson for his IBO title, now 0-6.

Age 50 Lar starts an oldtimer series against Bonecrusher and Weaver and tries to sucker George in, but as already noted, the promoter couldn't raise the money, the reasons being that nobody ever wanted to see Lar fight George because 1, they didn't know Lar from a bum in Georges great beginning and 2, Lar was so far down George who was actually a ranked heavy for most of the 90s, not Lar. 

Now it's harmless fun that group of Barney fans can gather round for Harry Potter conjuring and such, but I ain't into Hollywood special effects. In the real world, it was always George 7 days a week and thrice on Sundays in between church

The Way it Was Back in the Day ! 

[gilgamesh]

Holmes could win in it in 1999. It's more interesting to wonder what would've happened in 1989.

[BoxBuzz]

The best time for Foreman to win this in my opinion would have been in and around 92, when Foreman's effort against Holyfield looked much more credible than Holmes attempt.

[DrDuke]

The best time for Foreman to win this in my opinion would have been in and around 92, when Foreman's effort against Holyfield looked much more credible than Holmes attempt.

Absolutely.