Classic American West Coast Boxing

[chrisjs1985]

Well said Roger.

I wasn’t born yet when he was fighting so I learned of him through researching boxing history and ordering old fight tapes when I was in my mid teens. He instantly became a favorite. He was an artist AND an entertainer. Truly one of the best boxers of any era from any country.

[dagosd2000]

Well said Roger.

I wasn’t born yet when he was fighting so I learned of him through researching boxing history and ordering old fight tapes when I was in my mid teens. He instantly became a favorite. He was an artist AND an entertainer. Truly one of the best boxers of any era from any country.

I saw him after he had retired with his Salsa band at El Rancho Grande Bar in Tijuana. They were loud and had the place goin' Rodolfo Gonzalez was there ,but I didn't see him. A fight broke out and I ducked for cover. When all the crazies decided to jump in the band broke into the Gillette Blue Blade song. (the commercial song of the Friday Night Fights on TV).I think the band saw that kind of stuff a lot when they were on the road.



El Rancho Grande Bar

[scartissue]

Rog, I just heard about this and immediately logged on here to commiserate with you. Man, when I think about Mantequilla I think of the first fight I saw of him, which was his second fight with Billy Backus at the Forum and how he very subtly just ruined Backus' face. I recall eagerly watching the first fight with Hedgemon Lewis and how at the time, I felt Napoles won a close decision. Upon seeing the fight again years later, I didn't have it so close. By this time I could see the nuances a little clearer and while Lewis was spreading a lot of flash, Napoles was doing a subtle body-battering. Oh, man, I was wincing while watching him roast those ribs. I saw his bouts with Clyde Gray, the second Lewis fight, the Monzon fight and the two Muniz fights. Armando was robbed in that first one but Napoles came in shape second time around. I saw in another website a question asked of your favorite Napoles fight. Hands-down I thought to myself, the second Adolph Pruitt fight. Pruitt was damn good and decided to attack Napoles. Bad move. Napoles liked to lay back for a few rounds and take it easy. But if you had the effrontery to go at him, well...….! And he tore through Pruitt's defenses like he was threading a needle and ended it In 2 rounds. The memories I will hold. RIP champ, and my condolences, Rog.

[dagosd2000]

Rog, I just heard about this and immediately logged on here to commiserate with you. Man, when I think about Mantequilla I think of the first fight I saw of him, which was his second fight with Billy Backus at the Forum and how he very subtly just ruined Backus' face. I recall eagerly watching the first fight with Hedgemon Lewis and how at the time, I felt Napoles won a close decision. Upon seeing the fight again years later, I didn't have it so close. By this time I could see the nuances a little clearer and while Lewis was spreading a lot of flash, Napoles was doing a subtle body-battering. Oh, man, I was wincing while watching him roast those ribs. I saw his bouts with Clyde Gray, the second Lewis fight, the Monzon fight and the two Muniz fights. Armando was robbed in that first one but Napoles came in shape second time around. I saw in another website a question asked of your favorite Napoles fight. Hands-down I thought to myself, the second Adolph Pruitt fight. Pruitt was damn good and decided to attack Napoles. Bad move. Napoles liked to lay back for a few rounds and take it easy. But if you had the effrontery to go at him, well...….! And he tore through Pruitt's defenses like he was threading a needle and ended it In 2 rounds. The memories I will hold. RIP champ, and my condolences, Rog.

Dan
I had seen Napoles fight on Mexican TV many times. This was before he made his way up to the States through the efforts of George Parnassus. He used to fight on his toes more like his countrymen Jose Legra and Luis Rodriguez. Just before debuting in LA he flattened out enabling him to get more power behind his punches.The first time I saw him live was in Tijuana. in 1968.He was knocking on the door of Curtis Cokes' title.Ernie Lopez and Hedgemon Lewis were the new stars on the block in the Southland,but I knew as soon as Napoles got his visa those guys would be brushed aside.

The first live action I saw with Mantequilla was at the downtown bullring in Tijuana against American journeyman Herbie Lee.As Napoles walked from his dressing room wearing his shorty green robe with bold white block letters with NAPOLES on the back you could sense a dangerous presence. He had on that tom cat poker face,strode confidently never breaking gait,looking like an nimble Fed Astaire going through the ropes..He scuffed his shoes in the rosin box still holding that impenetrable stare. Kid Rapidez was scrambling around him like a little worker ant .Lee was gazing at Napoles from his corner with watery eyes,his feet shifting weight. Napoles never acknowledged him. He didn't look at Lee in center ring when getting instructions from the referee.Lee was sneaking glances while his confidence was melting.

Now remember this was still before Jose had gotten his papers that would enable him to fight at The Forum. With the exception of Bud Furillo the U.S. scribes didn't know much about this fighter the Mexicans called "Mantequilla" They gave him that sobriquet because his fighting style was smooth as butter. The bullring that night was packed to the rafters. The mob was hungry for another Alamo. At the bell Napoles turned with those icy eyes and macho mustache and went to work probing,flicking an inviting jab,feinting and moving his head.He was totally within himself.Without Jose landing a telling blow the look on Lee's face was one of dire perplexity. Nearing the end of round one Jose unleashed some pretty combinations. It was an omen of what was to follow in the next, and last round. It wasn't much of a contest. it was one sided as hell,but it was enough of a taste to see what was on the horizon for Jose Napoles. His lopsided decision over Emile Griffith is in my opinion Napoles' high watermark.

Later there were some regrettable efforts. Armando Muniz beat him up pretty good in Acapulco before Jose Sulaiman gave is nephew,who was the referee, the wink to intervene and DQ the unfortunate Muniz. Napoles had this idea that he could take out Monzon in five so he trained for a five rounder. Jose was winning,being the aggressor for five,but at the bell for the 7th round a spent Jose stayed on his stool. John Stracey,after being dropped in round one by a signature Napoles left hook,slowly dismantled Jose the rest of the way.It was Jose's swan song. Never the less,if you wanted to show a group of amateur fighters a clip of what perfection looked like in a boxing match,roll the reel of Jose's fight with Emile Griffith. I don't think anyone could have beaten him that night.

[chrisjs1985]

Maybe in heaven they are gonna have that Jose Napoles and Luis Rodriguez mythical match soon.

[chrisjs1985]

Rog, I just heard about this and immediately logged on here to commiserate with you. Man, when I think about Mantequilla I think of the first fight I saw of him, which was his second fight with Billy Backus at the Forum and how he very subtly just ruined Backus' face. I recall eagerly watching the first fight with Hedgemon Lewis and how at the time, I felt Napoles won a close decision. Upon seeing the fight again years later, I didn't have it so close. By this time I could see the nuances a little clearer and while Lewis was spreading a lot of flash, Napoles was doing a subtle body-battering. Oh, man, I was wincing while watching him roast those ribs. I saw his bouts with Clyde Gray, the second Lewis fight, the Monzon fight and the two Muniz fights. Armando was robbed in that first one but Napoles came in shape second time around. I saw in another website a question asked of your favorite Napoles fight. Hands-down I thought to myself, the second Adolph Pruitt fight. Pruitt was damn good and decided to attack Napoles. Bad move. Napoles liked to lay back for a few rounds and take it easy. But if you had the effrontery to go at him, well...….! And he tore through Pruitt's defenses like he was threading a needle and ended it In 2 rounds. The memories I will hold. RIP champ, and my condolences, Rog.

Dan
I had seen Napoles fight on Mexican TV many times. This was before he made his way up to the States through the efforts of George Parnassus. He used to fight on his toes more like his countrymen Jose Legra and Luis Rodriguez. Just before debuting in LA he flattened out enabling him to get more power behind his punches.The first time I saw him live was in Tijuana. in 1968.He was knocking on the door of Curtis Cokes' title.Ernie Lopez and Hedgemon Lewis were the new stars on the block in the Southland,but I knew as soon as Napoles got his visa those guys would be brushed aside.

The first live action I saw with Mantequilla was at the downtown bullring in Tijuana against American journeyman Herbie Lee.As Napoles walked from his dressing room wearing his shorty green robe with bold white block letters with NAPOLES on the back you could sense a dangerous presence. He had on that tom cat poker face,strode confidently never breaking gait,looking like an nimble Fed Astaire going through the ropes..He scuffed his shoes in the rosin box still holding that impenetrable stare. Kid Rapidez was scrambling around him like a little worker ant .Lee was gazing at Napoles from his corner with watery eyes,his feet shifting weight. Napoles never acknowledged him. He didn't look at Lee in center ring when getting instructions from the referee.Lee was sneaking glances while his confidence was melting.

Now remember this was still before Jose had gotten his papers that would enable him to fight at The Forum. With the exception of Bud Furillo the U.S. scribes didn't know much about this fighter the Mexicans called "Mantequilla" They gave him that sobriquet because his fighting style was smooth as butter. The bullring that night was packed to the rafters. The mob was hungry for another Alamo. At the bell Napoles turned with those icy eyes and macho mustache and went to work probing,flicking an inviting jab,feinting and moving his head.He was totally within himself.Without Jose landing a telling blow the look on Lee's face was one of dire perplexity. Nearing the end of round one Jose unleashed some pretty combinations. It was an omen of what was to follow in the next, and last round. It wasn't much of a contest. it was one sided as hell,but it was enough of a taste to see what was on the horizon for Jose Napoles. His lopsided decision over Emile Griffith is in my opinion Napoles' high watermark.

Later there were some regrettable efforts. Armando Muniz beat him up pretty good in Acapulco before Jose Sulaiman gave is nephew,who was the referee, the wink to intervene and DQ the unfortunate Muniz. Napoles had this idea that he could take out Monzon in five so he trained for a five rounder. Jose was winning,being the aggressor for five,but at the bell for the 7th round a spent Jose stayed on his stool. John Stracey,after being dropped in round one by a signature Napoles left hook,slowly dismantled Jose the rest of the way.It was Jose's swan song. Never the less,if you wanted to show a group of amateur fighters a clip of what perfection looked like in a boxing match,roll the reel of Jose's fight with Emile Griffith. I don't think anyone could have beaten him that night.

I think the Napoles that beat Cokes twice is about as close to the perfect performance you can get.

[dagosd2000]

Chris
I see there's a thread that refers to fighters who just couldn't beat a certain opponent no matter what. I remember Curtis Cokes saying after the rematch with Napoles{sic}"I can't beat this guy.Jose Napoles is a better fighter than me." Indian Red made a similar comment after loss number two to Napoles.. That defeat set him on a downward spiral that he never recovered from.I guess Hedgemon Lewis could be added to that list,but I never heard him speak about his two losses to Jose.

I remember watching on Mexican TV Napoles' first loss in Mexico after leaving Cuba. He had conditioned himself for a year before debuting because he knew the breed of fighter in Mexico was very tough hombre.That loss was against one of those tough hombres,Tony Perez, Perez went after Napoles's midsection and earned a hard fought decision. Later,another tough hombre,Al Urbina,had similar success working down below on Jose walking away with a decision win. Napoles would avenge those losses with KO's over the two.

Jose Legra started off fighting in Mexico after leaving Castro's Cuba,but was enticed to go to Spain by countryman Kid Tunero. The rank and file competition in Latin America and especially Mexico was tougher and deeper than what Legra faced in Europe fighting those 8 round main events.But that's not to take anything from Legra.He was an all time great.But watching him get outgunned by Vicente Saldivar at the LA Forum made me think that Legra needed a few more bigger tests before he stepped into the ring with Saldivar.



The old champ

[scartissue]

One thing about Jose Napoles always stuck with me. I recall reading a Ring magazine piece on his bout with Roger Menetrey of France. And the writer observed that the fight went 15 one-sided rounds because Menetrey really never exercised any aggression with Napoles. It was as I said about his fight with Adolph Pruitt, he was content to just take it easy and grind you down at his own pace. The writer noted about his fight with Menetrey that Napoles only seemed to fight as hard as had to in order to win. He also noted that we may have never seen the absolute best of Napoles yet. But it was evident in the Pruitt fight once his ire was raised and also in his bout with Ralph Charles of England. It was in the 6th or 7th round that Charles hit Napoles with something that made the crowd go, "Ohhhhh!" And that was all it took. You could just see Napoles shift into the next gear and end the bout. A magnificent fighter.

[chrisjs1985]

Chris
I see there's a thread that refers to fighters who just couldn't beat a certain opponent no matter what. I remember Curtis Cokes saying after the rematch with Napoles{sic}"I can't beat this guy.Jose Napoles is a better fighter than me." Indian Red made a similar comment after loss number two to Napoles.. That defeat set him on a downward spiral that he never recovered from.I guess Hedgemon Lewis could be added to that list,but I never heard him speak about his two losses to Jose.

I remember watching on Mexican TV Napoles' first loss in Mexico after leaving Cuba. He had conditioned himself for a year before debuting because he knew the breed of fighter in Mexico was very tough hombre.That loss was against one of those tough hombres,Tony Perez, Perez went after Napoles's midsection and earned a hard fought decision. Later,another tough hombre,Al Urbina,had similar success working down below on Jose walking away with a decision win. Napoles would avenge those losses with KO's over the two.

Jose Legra started off fighting in Mexico after leaving Castro's Cuba,but was enticed to go to Spain by countryman Kid Tunero. The rank and file competition in Latin America and especially Mexico was tougher and deeper than what Legra faced in Europe fighting those 8 round main events.But that's not to take anything from Legra.He was an all time great.But watching him get outgunned by Vicente Saldivar at the LA Forum made me think that Legra needed a few more bigger tests before he stepped into the ring with Saldivar.



The old champ

For sure. In Spain the thing was to fight often but the competition was poor and for sure the fighters didn’t have that Mexican toughness and infighting ability. Legra was incredible at distance and could be a beautiful boxer but inside and when pressed he had issues. Napoles became a complete fighter.

[dagosd2000]

A Decade That Roared

Jack Dempsey's wife hated Doc Kearns, and it was reciprocated by Dempsey's guiding light instantaneously. The wife I'm referring to was Estelle Taylor,Dempsey's second bride to the altar,uninspiring actress who wouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as Mary Pickford,and had a penchant for spending Jack's hard earned dough.One of the first things she pointed out to her unassuming hubby was that Kearns was robbing him blind.She felt,being Dempsey's soulmate,that she had that privilege.

After winning the title from farm boy Jess Willard (with the help of a little concoction of plaster of Paris mixed by the wily Kearns.Now why would Doc make a side bet of 10 grand at ten to one that Dempsey the prefight underdog would win in one round against Willard who'd never been off his feet in a boxing match?)After Toledo, Jack put his title on the line only six times in seven years. Kearns and the testy wife figured they could make almost enough money putting Dempsey in front of a movie camera and quoting lines on the stage. Dempsey was the star,but his co star wife made sure she counted the money.Kearns filed lawsuits,tried to break up the marriage,and finally broke it off with his charge and vice versa..That was fine with Taylor.She hated boxing as much as she hated Doc.

By the time Dempsey squared off with Gene Tunney it had been a long three years since he had defended the title. The gate was huge(1,900,000 big ones) as was his take,but the fight was a dud.Rain (literally) fell on the boxing parade in Philly.a defensive exhibition by Tunney winning in a walk( mostly going backwards) to win the heavyweight championship.

Dempsey said he was through with fighting. He was feeling his age,32,and the inactivity didn't make him feel any sprier. His wife was nagging him to walk away,and she was building a yen to walk away from the marriage. It was Babe Ruth,the Sultan of Swat and a steady pal of Dempsey,who told him to quit feeling sorry for himself and get back in there. Besides, the handle of the rematch would double the first fight.

Tex Rickard made arrangements for the fight to take place in Chicago. Dempsey lost his license in New York because he welshed on Harry Wills so the fight was staged in Al Capone's backyard.Al wanted to talk to Jack about a pre arranged deal,even had a co operative ref on the line by the name of Davey Miller,but Jack tipped off Rickards and Miller was replaced at the last moment by Dave "Long Count" Barry.

Jack lost every round but the 7th,however Tunney back peddled his way out of harm's way to easily keep the title.Though Dempsey only won one round out of 20 in two fights with Tunney ,it was Dempsey who became the living legend. Estelle Taylor divorced him shortly after.Tex Rickard died of a ruptured appendicitis in 1929. Gene Tunney retired after defending against Tom Heeney and wasn't missed. And Doc Kearns marched along spinning his web around big names like Benny Leonard,Mickey Walker,Joey Maxim,and Archie Moore.

If only you could have only been there in Bob Johnston's back room in his bar next to the Hollywood Burlesque Theater and listen to Kearns tell the story of how he used to load up Dempsey's gloves.


Doc Kearns

[dagosd2000]

The Most Famous Athlete On The Rhine

A few years ago me and the wife went on one of these Viking Riverboat cruises. My wife left it up to me to which one we should take. I'm a nut for Western Europe so I got on the horn to Viking and signed us up for the Seven Day Rhine Journey. Now you can either depart from Basil,Switzerland and end in Amsterdam or leave from Amsterdam and finish in Basil. It didn't make any difference to me so I flipped a coin and we launched off from Switzerland.

These riverboat cruises are all right. You get a good rate on the airfare,three squares a day of real authentic good(if you can't get away from burgers or steak they always have that on the bill of fare) The native dishes correspond with where you're at at the time.For instance if you're cruising along Germany you'll see Saurebraten and Bratwurst on the day's menu.All the food is included in the bill except for the liquor..At every port they have a list of side trips you can sign up for. Me and the wife usually like going on our own. I don't like following some dude around holding a flag and have to decipher what he's saying through a pair of clunky earphones.But sometimes,like if there's a trip to a nice restaurant, me and the wife will join the pack.The boats(they call them longboats like the Vikings)are new and clean and they carry around 150 passengers. I don't care to go on one of these ocean liners that have 6 or 7 decks. with 5000 people aboard. They remind me of floating hotels.Not a lot of intimacy.

In the evening,usually after dinner,there's always something going on in the lounge.Maybe they'll bring aboard some local musicians or a chef that shows you how to make apple strudel. Sometimes they play a game like the one night the cruise director asked everyone to gather in teams of four and then she would ask ten questions.The team with the most common answers would win a bottle of champagne.You'd write the answers on a slip of paper and turn them in at the finish to be counted..Here's an example:"Name a popular city in the world." or"Name a famous president"(By the way,Viking ,when they put a cruise together, makes sure everyone on board is from the same country.Our boat was full of Yanks).

I don't remember all the questions nor do I recall which group won the booze. I know it wasn't our group. Now for starters all the passengers where more or less the same age:around 60 ish creaky bones and all. Here's the one question that was asked that stuck in my mind:"Name a famous athlete." The four of us at our table looked at each other with lowered brows.Now off hand the knee jerk response might be "Michael Jordan."Maybe "LeBron.""Tom Brady." I heard someone say at another table" Muhamad Ali." No one in my group wanted to submit a name I think because they didn't want to be wrong.(.Hell,it's only a stupisd game.Say anybody)

After some hemming and hawing I said,"Babe Ruth" and wrote it on the slip of paper.I didn't get any arguments.Well,like I said before,our group didn't win the bubbly,but "Babe Ruth" won hands down as "famous athlete." Imagine gong to to Malibu Beach on a July afternoon and asking people to name a famous athlete. How about taking a drive to South Central Los Angeles and asking that question. on the corner of West Washington Boulevard and South Grand.Babe Ruth?Didn't you mean to say Baby Ruth?You know that candy bar with all the nuts.



Babe Ruth

[goose 5]

I knew Jack Kearns jr. He told me his dad thought very highly of L.C. Morgan. He also insisted to me that Dempsey stood 6'3". Jack jr. also couldn't say enough good things about Kenny lane.

[dagosd2000]

Taking A Little Off The Top

Just Off The Top Of My Head:I see where BoxRec put out their list of the top P4P fighters of all time. Of course when someone does something like making a list of the top 100(or the bottom 100) the counter punching is relentless.I saw where one objector couldn't understand why Henry Armstrong was ranked so low.(I think he was No. 86 on the list)John Sheppard responded posting a BoxRec link that contained the formula that determined the determinations. Then he went on to say that any objections were so much Kentucky windage. I clicked on to the link and began reading. It was as clear as mud to me. Fighters' records were factored into a formula(I think the data was fed into a computer) and then the results were spit out. But if the paradigm was skewed then the results were bogus. But who's to say that the seed was a bad one? Lists never concerned me that much,especially when it comes to something subjective or hypothetical . I grew up liking classical music.I had an old LP of a recording of Von Karajan conducting the Philharmonia Orchestra of Brahms 1st Symphony.I played it often. Then I read a revue in Hi Fidelity Magazine of the "best" Brahms 1st renditions. Von Karajan's effort didn't make the list.The critic,R.D. Darrell,determined that Joseph Krips conducting the London Symphony was the "best" of all the Brahms 1 sts. I immediately rushed to the music store to buy it. When I got home and put it on the turntable I didn't like it. Maybe because I "grew Up" with the Karajan rendition.Maybe I should have been a music critic for magazine or a reporter for a boxing rag.

When Nat Fleischer was running the show in Manhattan with his "Ring Magazine"(he called it The Bible Of Boxing),every year he published his "Ring Record Book." It was a compilation of fighters' records past and present. He had all the past and current champs in there,but then the second half of his tome was the names of active fighters.Talk about a train wreck. The biggest blunder was the thousands of omissions. Then there were the typos,mispellings,erroneous results,and then to add insult to injury Fleischer would submit his own personal list of the top 10 fighters in history in each weight division. All said,what BoxRec has compiled with the results of boxing matches is mighty impressive. Sure there are mistakes,but no one is perfect. Pro boxing is scattered allover the globe. Fights are staged in every nook and cranny in the world.Some of the commissions in Mexico having been phoning in bogus results to BoxRec. This ain't good. BoxRec is the major source for records. Tiger Smalls ,who handles his featherweight son Prince, called me to clue in BoxRec that they had the wrong results on record for some of Tiger's fighters after they fought in Tijuana. Cheto Torres,who has a stable of fighters in Tijuana, also griped that BoxRec had similar phony decisions on the site.So BoxRec catches the flak and looks corruptible,but that ain't so. It's the corrupt commissions that have sold out to a fighter and been bribed that call up and relay bad info to BoxRec.

I see BoxBuzz commented that he's in a syndrome of writing condolences of more and more fighters that he followed when younger that are taking the final 10 count.Jose Napoles,the most recent. Buzz said at his age it comes with the territory. I guess funerals and the obituary page in the newspaper strikes closer to home as you grow older. I don't watch much TV. anymore.The programs and movies of today I can't get into. I watch mostly Nick At Nite and Turner Classic Movies. Most of the people in those flicks are either dead or older than dirt. I guess it comes with te territory.



Nat Fleischer

[dagosd2000]

I knew Jack Kearns jr. He told me his dad thought very highly of L.C. Morgan. He also insisted to me that Dempsey stood 6'3". Jack jr. also couldn't say enough good things about Kenny lane.

Kenny Lane-a great little southpaw who was underrated.

[dagosd2000]

Jolted

After Ken Norton fought Muhammad Ali in San Diego we didn't see much of him anymore,at least not down here in San Diego.(He did fight contender Larry Middleton at the Sports Arena in 1976),.But at the start of his pro career he sure was a familiar face. After his discharge from the Corps he made San Diego his home. He was a main fixture at the Coliseum fighting mostly opponents who were mediocre at best. I used to see him with Eddie Futch,mostly training at the Coliseum,but Futch was in need of better sparring partners for Norton so he kept him booked mostly in Los Angeles.Futch's prize cash cow at the time was Joltin' Joe Frazier who was undefeated at headed for an eventual showdown with the other undefeated guy in the division,Muhammad Ali.Both fighters had a title belt sittin' on their mantles so whenever Ali would get his draft staus squared away there would be that "Fight Of The Century."

Meanwhile, Futch wanted Norton and Frazier to spar with each other. But those sessions took place in Los Angeles. Norton would come down to San Diego to fight,but most of his quality prep work was in LA working with Joltin' Joe. Back then Norton had this curious malady of hitting the wall in a fight midway through. it didn't matter who was in there with. If his opponent could last into the 5th or 6th round ,he had a good chance of winning. Norton would suddenly tire so badly he looked like he was ripe for the pickins'.but the merits of his opponents were so second rate that Norton would prevail,barely. When Jose Luis Garcia knocked him out cold, the inevitable became a reality.

But Norton went back to work. He knew he was paying his dues in the gym.It was something between the ears that was wrong.He saw a local hypnotist,Dr. Dean Ezell,who was performing his putting you under act at an all you can eat joint near the Marine Base Recruit Depot. (Regis Philbin would announce the act)I'm talking 1970.This was Philbin's start in show biz.

Well,something fixed Norton's psychological dilemma.He had plenty of wind fighting in the ring after his sessions with Dr. Dean. Norton was a rejuvenate fighter. He was going through guys with the same style of attack ,but this time he could put forth all the way through to the last round. I thought referee Frank Rustich in the Ali fight was going to halt the action near the end of the 12 th round when Norton had Ali on the ropes hammering away without Muhammad returning fire..This fight was right after Frazier was blasted away by George Foreman to lose the unification title he had earned against Ali in that Fight Of The Century.

So now it was Frazier slipping and Norton gaining traction. But in Norton's next test he folded beneath the sledgehammer blows of Foreman in Caracas. it would have been interesting to see Frazier and Norton go at it,but they were in the same stable.Norton had to regroup again ,and he did. He got a bad 3rd strike call in Yankee Stadium against Ali and then against Larry Holmes he lost a very close split decision. After Joe got knocked in the air by Foreman he could only win three more fights in eight tries and called it a career.

But something I gleaned from watching Eddie Futch when he was with Norton in San Diego.. If he saw Norton holding his own with Frazier in the gym,then a little birdie would whisper in his ear that Joe was slippin'.He finally had them not spar together.

I saw Frazier just before he passed away. He was sitting ringside at a fight at Pechanga Indian Reservation located in the foothills of San Diego. He had been drinking pretty heavily. When they announced his name before the main event he stood up but fell back into his seat.To tell the truth,that was harder to watch than that fight with Foreman when Joltin' Joe got jolted up in the air in Jamaica.


Joe Frazier after the his fighting days were over.

[dagosd2000]

4 Headed Monster

The current stars of the heavyweight division have a compiled record of 125 wins against 2 losses.All four have ,and currently hold, some version of a "world title."Thinking along those lines you can compare those stats with something from the past. When Mike Spinks and Larry Holmes got together they were both undefeated:a compilation of 75 and zero.The "Fight Of The Century saw Muhammad Ali and Joe Frazier settling matters with together records of 57 on the plus side with a goose egg in the loss column. In the 90's Riddick Bowe and Evander Holyfield brought their 59 wins without blemish into the squared circle to decide who was No. ! heavyweight in the world. That's pretty impressive.Ali,Frazier,M. Spinks, Larry,Real Deal,and Bowe were nothing to sneeze at;all Hall Of Famers(or waiting to get in) that embodied boxing talent warranted of being a heavyweight champion.But if you want to throw in my face the Ali who almost got killed against Holmes or an Evander who didn't give us much of a deal when he fought James Toney, I won't duck.

The 4 Headed Monster that's out there today,Tyson Fury,Deontay Wilder,Anthony Joshus,and new ogre on the block,Andy Ruiz may have a lot of "w's" opposed to two teeny weeny losses,but they haven't made me forget about when the aforementioned retirees faced each other in their primes. The 4 Headed Monster are supposed to be on top of their games,but to see them fight makes me scratch my head. Picking out their flaws is a novice venture. Oh,they won't be strangers with each other. I suppose it'll go back and forth for awhile. The promoters will hype it all up. The Monster will talk about it like P.T. Barnum. I'll never pay to watch them on the screen. I won't even go to Tijuana where they'll have it live on the tube free of charge. YouTube will have it the next day. That'll be good enough for me.

I guess today teenage boys ,that have the potential goods, look towards running for a touchdown or slam dunking a basketball.Boxing?Well,that takes a more supreme effort to get to the top, or at least enter the rankings,than hitting a homerun.Call it comparing apples with oranges,but here's what irks me:a lot of the "top" fighters are either way past their primes or are winning titles(and main events) fighting like Sloppy Joes against tomato cans that empty their contents on the ring mat when unopened by a fighter who either doesn't possess much ability or left his talent in the ring in the last decade.

My interest with fighting is dwindling. I don't want to drive 60 miles on some mountain road in the dark to watch a fight at an Indian Reservation. The hell with Las Vegas. Look up the word "hyperbole" in the dictionary and you'll see a picture of the Sin City.

They play all the sports better today except boxing.It's gotten worse. There's a few noteworthy fellas out there,but they fight only twice a year and you have to welsh on a utility bill to watch them fight on the big flat screen. The millennials like cage fighting,MMA,Xstream fighting-whatever they call it. , A 40 second fight in a cage.The other guy goes to the ground and the guy on top starts punching him like a bitch and it's waved off and then the pyrotechnics shoot in the air and all the sirens blast away and strobe lights make you dizzy and you can't hear yourself think and it makes it sound like the Chinese army is attacking across the 38th parallel.

But who am I to argue,let alone convince a 21 year old kid ,that the 4 Headed Monster isn't worth honing a sword for for a good beheading. Too bad Wilt The Stilt isn't with us anymore. I'm sure his noggin' would be a proper fit on that monster's shoulders.



Muhammad Ali

[dagosd2000]

Marshall Dillon Was A Surfer

"Did you know that Marshall Dillon was a surfer?"I asked Burke Emery as he was opening a case of Scotch on the bar.
"You mean Marshall Dillon on Gunsmoke?"
"Yeah. James Arness.Marshall Dillon,"
Burke and Shirley had opened Champs that morning around 10..Shirley was sitting on a stool at the front end of the bar near the door.She was counting the receipts from the previous night..Burke was stocking the shelves behind the bar at the opposite end.. I was sitting there nursing a draft.The morning was hazy and warm.it was just me at the bar talking to Burke and Shirley counting the money at the other end.
"I used to see him all the time with his son Rolfe when they had the Ocean Beach surf contest,"I said.
"Is that so?"said Burke with his back to me.
"Jim Arness taught his son surfing after he got in an accident."
Burke turned around and started sliding open the beer coolers under the bar.
"They drank a lot of beer last night,"he said.
Burke went to the back room and brought out a case os of Budweiser bottles. With a box cutter he slit open the case and began putting the bottles in one of the coolers.
"Not many people knew that Marshall Dillon also had blond hair,"I exclaimed.
"Really?" remarked Burke with raised brows.
"He was some sort of Swede I think.They had to dye his hair black for the TV series."
Burke turned suddenly and started walking back to the stock room. He brought out another case of beer.
"I sell more light beer than I do the regular stuff,"he said.
"Yeah. Jim Arness was always with his son when the kid was surfing in contest."
"I remember when no one wanted to drink light beer. You were considered a sissy if you drank that stuff,said Burke looking down shoving the bottles in the cooler.
"His son Rolfe won the World Surfing Championship in !970."
"I didn't know that ,"said Burke as he was unloading the case into the cooler.
"The contest was in Australia."
"I got to go back and get another case of lights,"said Burke.
I waited while Burke came back with another case putting it on the bar.He grabbed the box cutter and started cutting open the top of the box.
"Yeah. When you see Marshall Dillon on the television you see a real hardnose lawman..You think he filled Boot Hill all by himself.But in real life Jim Arness was kind of a joker. Real loose. Didn't take life too seriously. That's how surfers are in general."
"They drink this stuff ,but I'll just stick to my beer,"said Burke in a low voice.. "Now these kids want alcohol in everything.I'll just stick with my beer."
"You know you look at these actors and wonder what they're like in real life. On the screen they're just acting. It's make believe. You wonder if a guy like Sylvester Stallone is really tough in real life."
"Well,"said Burke taking break."I was always a fighter and afterwards I stayed around training fighters and now Shirley and me have this place."
"I remember when you were bartending when this place was O'Rileys"
"I guess I could say I did plenty of work as a bartender."
"You never know what these actors are like in real life.Like John Wayne playing all these war heros.He was never in the service.It was all an act."
"Well when I was fighting in the ring life was tough enough for me.","said Burke.
I looked at the purplish scars around Burke's drooping eyes.
"it's funny to think that Marshall Dillon in real life was a real surfer and never a real lawman except when he was acting on TV,"I said.
Burke put the last bottle of beer in the cooler.
"Well.All you got to do is look at my face and see it was for real."
Burke took a little breath.
"Looks like I need to go back and get out a case of Tequila.I can't keep enough of that stuff around."
As Burke was headed to the back I thought of Marshall Dillon. James Arness might not have been a real marshall,but he was in the army in WW 2 and hit the beach at Anzio.Since he was the tallest soldier on the landing craft to go they wanted to go out first.to test how deep the water was. He got shot in the leg and they evacuated him to a MASH unit. When the war was done he came back to the States with a Bronze Star and a Purple Heart. Not too many know about that.You can say it's right up there with The Gunfight At The OK Corral.


A Bronze Star and a Purple Heart

[BoxBuzz]

Taking A Little Off The Top

Just Off The Top Of My Head:I see where BoxRec put out their list of the top P4P fighters of all time. Of course when someone does something like making a list of the top 100(or the bottom 100) the counter punching is relentless.I saw where one objector couldn't understand why Henry Armstrong was ranked so low.(I think he was No. 86 on the list)John Sheppard responded posting a BoxRec link that contained the formula that determined the determinations. Then he went on to say that any objections were so much Kentucky windage. I clicked on to the link and began reading. It was as clear as mud to me. Fighters' records were factored into a formula(I think the data was fed into a computer) and then the results were spit out. But if the paradigm was skewed then the results were bogus. But who's to say that the seed was a bad one? Lists never concerned me that much,especially when it comes to something subjective or hypothetical . I grew up liking classical music.I had an old LP of a recording of Von Karajan conducting the Philharmonia Orchestra of Brahms 1st Symphony.I played it often. Then I read a revue in Hi Fidelity Magazine of the "best" Brahms 1st renditions. Von Karajan's effort didn't make the list.The critic,R.D. Darrell,determined that Joseph Krips conducting the London Symphony was the "best" of all the Brahms 1 sts. I immediately rushed to the music store to buy it. When I got home and put it on the turntable I didn't like it. Maybe because I "grew Up" with the Karajan rendition.Maybe I should have been a music critic for magazine or a reporter for a boxing rag.

When Nat Fleischer was running the show in Manhattan with his "Ring Magazine"(he called it The Bible Of Boxing),every year he published his "Ring Record Book." It was a compilation of fighters' records past and present. He had all the past and current champs in there,but then the second half of his tome was the names of active fighters.Talk about a train wreck. The biggest blunder was the thousands of omissions. Then there were the typos,mispellings,erroneous results,and then to add insult to injury Fleischer would submit his own personal list of the top 10 fighters in history in each weight division. All said,what BoxRec has compiled with the results of boxing matches is mighty impressive. Sure there are mistakes,but no one is perfect. Pro boxing is scattered allover the globe. Fights are staged in every nook and cranny in the world.Some of the commissions in Mexico having been phoning in bogus results to BoxRec. This ain't good. BoxRec is the major source for records. Tiger Smalls ,who handles his featherweight son Prince, called me to clue in BoxRec that they had the wrong results on record for some of Tiger's fighters after they fought in Tijuana. Cheto Torres,who has a stable of fighters in Tijuana, also griped that BoxRec had similar phony decisions on the site.So BoxRec catches the flak and looks corruptible,but that ain't so. It's the corrupt commissions that have sold out to a fighter and been bribed that call up and relay bad info to BoxRec.

I see BoxBuzz commented that he's in a syndrome of writing condolences of more and more fighters that he followed when younger that are taking the final 10 count.Jose Napoles,the most recent. Buzz said at his age it comes with the territory. I guess funerals and the obituary page in the newspaper strikes closer to home as you grow older. I don't watch much TV. anymore.The programs and movies of today I can't get into. I watch mostly Nick At Nite and Turner Classic Movies. Most of the people in those flicks are either dead or older than dirt. I guess it comes with te territory.



Nat Fleischer

I'm reluctant to add anything here, though I'm often dropping in to read. Not wanting to disturb the pristine waters of remarkable writing.

But yep, it's getting mighty "territorial" these days.

With that said......I intend to savor every moment, and hopefully gracefully depart when it's my time. But the great gladiators that leave do take a piece of their followers with them. I think we all feel it....and if we're lucky we get to sit down in the arena a few more times for a few more generational "passings of the baton". Boxing is a bit like a big relay race.

My cognizance goes back to Archie Moore, Rocky Marciano, etc. With each passing decade, I enjoy the game more, even if I imagine that some of the dinosaurs were more than a match for the current crop of post primordial pugilists. I'm also gobsmacked on occasion when a Ruiz steps up and upsets the apple cart in such a glorious fashion. Could it POSSIBLY happen to a nicer guy? Lordy, may he and his family enjoy these days!

I'm in good shape, so I'm hopin I get to see how this unfolds for another 30 years or so. But if I'm called out tomorrow to the inter dimensional gym located in the Twilight zone, (where I guess I'll be watching "Battling Maxo"), I'll think back and consider myself pretty satisfied with what I've been privileged to take in right here on planet Earth up to this point.

[dagosd2000]

Before Going Home

I used to pass Archie Moore's Any Boy Can Club all the time just driving around. It's been such a long time ago since I last was there.. I want to say it was in National City;Paradise Hills. I can't remember the street it was on.Federal Bouleverd;8th Street in National City.A few years back I drove around looking for the place. Now I know it's been long gone,but I thought if I recognized if that little strip mall was still there it would be enough of a footprint for a memory flashback.. But I drove around and around and couldn't make heads nor tailsAfter passing 7 or 8 industrial complexes I gave up..I was lost in a dream.

It's when I went to work as a long term sub when I was just starting out teaching at that school for severely handicapped kids,Friendship Home, that I decided to drop by and see what ol' Arch had going on inside. The ABC Club was located on the same street that I would drive back on after finishing my day at Friendship Home.

Just about all the kids at Friendship Home had been stricken with Cerebral Palsy. Some had brain damage from almost drowning in the backyard pool. There were a few that suffered traumatic brain injuries from auto accidents of falling off swings. A lot of those kids were left at Friendship Home by their parents who didn't want them anymore.They said the kids there had IQ's of "one." I don't know how they concluded that score. All I know is that those kids had to be dressed(they were all in wheelchairs),fed by hand,change their diapers,and go to school. They couldn't talk. They could never learn to read or write. Their limbs would stiffen up during the day so I had to rub their arms and legs to keep the blood flowing.The lessons comprised mostly of them recognizing certain things. To tell the truth I don't know if they knew the difference. If I showed them a picture of an elephant and asked if it was an elephant and they smiled then they "knew' what an elephant was.I'd play music for them,sing to them goofy songs,and make funny faces. They would laugh and that was their school.It was wonderful.it was satisfying. I wouldn't have traded that experience for the world. You couldn't tell the difference between the people that worked there. The TA's,teachers,and the principal all shared the same responsibilities. The principal told me if I had had a masters in Special Ed. he would have hire me on the spot.

Maybe it was working at Friendship Home that inspired me to drop by the ABC Club to see what more I could do for someone that needed some help. Well,I've elaborated about Archie Moore's vision:a want to keep the neighborhood kids from falling under the spell of all the bad influences in the ghetto. Oh,he didn't have any "hot" prospect fighters when I was wrapping hands and adjusting headgears.I didn't see Archie break down the fundamentals of attack and defense. Those kids were just that:the elementary ilk coming from fragile homes or no homes at all. Little guys with template minds that were in the process of forming life long impressions.You can bet Archie Moore put in his two cents worth. So instead of emphasizing the jab,Archie's homilies were about KO ing the devil.;the temptations that bring destruction to one's family and community.;a Godless way of life where the law of the jungle is the faith you have to adhere to or perish in the gutter,or in jail.

Friendship Home has moved. It's in Imperial Beach near the high school. The ABC Club is long gone. Both left imprints with me. Both fellowships worked on the spirit more than the body. The life expectancy of the kids at Friendship Home were in the 20's. The law said that those kids had to go to school. So school was to make those little guys happy. If we could only teach that to others, and most importantly to ourselves. But you can't pass happiness along if your soul is echoing..I guess you could say that that "happiness" thing was also fundamental in Archie Moore's life's lesson plan. That, along with how to block a punch inside the ring and out in the street.


The Ol' Mongoose

[dagosd2000]

He Wore Those Stripes Proudly

When Dick Tiger wasn't fighting in the United States he was in Nigeria fighting on the side of the Biafran rebels who had broken away from Nigeria after England couldn't afford to keep their imperialistic invention in its empire. Tiger belonged to the Ibos,the elitists who were comprised of doctors,lawyers,teachers,and businessmen ,who felt they could govern on their own without being a part of their Muslim counterparts,the Hausas. The secession was met by force from the Hausas. Massacres were as common as what we see in the news today:car bombings,IED's exploding in bus terminals and outdoor markets,kidnappings and beheadings all under the guise that these atrocities are a religious experience that will get you to heaven ASAP(to bang those 80 some virgins.I guess that's part of what heaven is about with Muslims-screwing. But I've often wondered what awaits a Muslim woman when she goes to the public square and detonates the dynamite strapped to her chest? Does she get to frolic with a bunch of bare chested Arab boys?)Anyway,Dick Tiger joined the Biafran army and put himself on the front lines wanting to preserve his Christian heritage. Most of the money he made fighting went to the cause and his family who remained in Nigeria.

Tiger never fought for a big purse even though he was a two division champ.He lived a Spartan life when he was in New York training for a fight. He spent a minimal time living in the States.He trained.He fought. And then it was back on the plane to Nigeria to fight dirty. He could have assimilated with what we had to offer in the U.S. but Tiger was a true patriot. His manager,Lew Burston, and the East coast promoters knew they didn't have a guy like Ray Robinson that would finagle and threaten to walk out if the terms weren't to his liking. They didn't have to twist Tiger' tail.As fast as Tiger got paid he sent the money Western Union to Nigeria.

But what always struck me about Dick Tiger the fighter was his durability. He wasn't the fastest guy in the ring. He didn't pack sudden KO power in either hand. He plodded ahead and took what the other guy could throw at him and traded back. He fought some pretty rough boys, but their weapons bounced off Tiger's armor like ping pong balls.

Tiger won the middleweight title from the long time bully on the block Gene Fullmer. Now don't get me wrong. Gene was a nice guy sure enough,but his style was about as smooth as a Caterpillar tractor. It was the first time that I ever saw Fullmer get it taken to him(except for Sugar Ray's immortal left hook in Chicago).Fullmer had had enough of Dick Tiger and fighting after three go arounds with the rebel soldier. Sluggers like Henry Hank and Florentino Fernandez couldn't make a dent prior to Tiger's conquest of Fullmer.. Big punchers were waiting in line to unload on the slow moving target Dick Tiger the new champ. Hurricane Carter looked like he was hurting his hands whenever his gloves struck the African's torso.Joey Giardelo had to slip,move and counter to borrow the middleweight belt from Tiger,but had to give it back in the rematch.

Tiger was so damn strong that it wasn't moving mountains for him to go up to light heavyweight and challenge the very popular champ Jose Torres in front of all those Spanish Harlem fans in New York City. He wupped Don Peppino twice to cement his hold on the title.

Tiger did have problems with cuties;fighters that didn't come right at him,but were cautious which usually resulted in a boring fight. The great Emile Griffith won two decisions from Tiger in what has to be the two most boring fights between two of the greatest fighters who ever stepped into the ring. Tiger tried to bait Emile to come at him ,but Emile was content to hunt and peck his way to two forgettable decisions.

In 1968 when Tiger signed to risk his title against Bob Foster it was a bit of an oddity. Tiger was a compact 5 foot 8 and a short reach. Bob was a gangly tall 6 foot 3 and had wingspan like a 747.Foster had some bad showings against the top heavyweights of his day.Zora Folley,Eddie Machen,Joe Frazier,and even the Floating Butterfly had too much muscle for the piano legged Bob. It was concluded that Foster needed something (like what Holyfield did when he approached Mr, Olympia Lee Haney. Pass the needle and leap frog over evolution)if he was ever to be king of the heavies-a time when that ilk was riding the crest of a wave.

I thought Tiger would be in over his head with Foster. Foster could blast out guys in the light heavyweight division. Now he was fighting Tiger who had moved up from 160 to when he stepped on the scale for the morning weigh in balanced the bar at 168 pounds. Bob Foster was in a bigger league than Jose Torres. When Foster's run came to an end they'd be comparing him with Archie Moore.

But what shocked the boxing world was not Foster winning the title so much but how he did it-with a left hook that had more on it than Robby's left hand in Chicago when he knocked Fullmer into the Twilight Zone. After the loss Tiger had 4 more fights left in him-a Ring Magazine Fight Of The Year beating Frankie DePaula,decisions over two very good boys Nino Benvenuti and Andy Kendall,and then his last fight with Griffith.

Tiger was over 40 years of age after his fight with Emile.. His fighting days in the ring had taken a toll. But his will to fight back in Nigeria was as strong as ever. He wanted to live in Nigeria with his family. But he was still short of cash(as always)and had to take a job in The Apple In 1971 as a security guard.Around that time he was diagnosed with having cancer of the liver. He was granted by the Nigerian government to return to the country to be with his wife and children.

When they list the greatest of the middleweights Tiger's name is often omitted. BoxRec has Canelo as the No. 1 P4P in the world today.I sure wish I could get my hands on a Time Machine and put those two in the ring. Wasn't there a song by the name of "I've Got A Tiger By The Tail?"


Dick Tiger

[dagosd2000]

Hard To Figure

Every time I saw Archie Moore, the thought of his fight with Floyd Patterson for the heavyweight championship always popped into my mind.The two fought for the vacant title after Rocky Marciano had had enough of boxing and Al Weil. Marciano,in his last defense, had pummeled Moore into submission. The year was 1955. The following year Moore fought 11 times, winning all of them, prior to taking on Floyd in Chicago for that elusive title with.Pattersin in November of 1956.That same year Patterson fought 3 times winning all 3 including a split decision over Tommy "Hurricane" Jackson preceding the title match.

Looking at Floyd's resume before fighting Moore, his most significant opponent was former light heavyweight champ Joey Maxim who handed Floyd his first loss via a 6 round decision.Moore was over 40 years of age when he fought Patterson. Archie had traded punches with everyone in the world:all the names on that Black Murderers Row;heavyweights (of a higher caliber than "Hurricane" Jackson) Nino Valdes, Ezzard Charles(losing twice),and Rocky M. Moore had joined the club of the great light heavyweights who couldn't step up to the next division and win the most coveted prize in boxing. Floyd was half Archie's age when he entered the ring wanting to become the youngest fighter to win the heavyweight title.

I was sure Archie would get the monkey off his back and make boxing history.I remember seeing the fight on TV with my father.Moore was never in it. He looked confused.He was getting beat to the punch. His footwork was clumsy. He sure didn't look like the wily ol' Mongoose. it was Patterson who was striking like a mongoose with rapidity. Floyd showed much faster hands,worked combinations to the head and body,and was the aggressor. in the 5th round he caught Moore with a big left hook that dropped him like a dead weight. Moore got to his feet in a daze and was quickly floored again by a Floyd flurry. Referee Frank Sikora didn't let a dizzy Moore continue .

I always thought the fight was fixed. It was in Chicago where the Outfit and their boxing proxies ran the show. Moore had Doc Kearns in his corner but not necessarily watching his back. Cus D'Amato was pulling rabbits out of the hat to get the title fight on the OK from Jim Norris,International Boxing Club guru,,and his cohorts Wirtz,Gibson,and the silent racketeering partners with the vowels at the ends of their names.Archie had a couple of fast excuses:he had hurt in his hands in England fighting Yolande Pompey ,and the ring mat was too soft and he couldn't get his feet under him. The bookies had Moore slightly favored. Moore was residing in San Diego. Patterson was a growing favorite with the New York crowd with D'Amato blowing the bugle. Moore was on his way down cherry picking the opposition along with advice from an old Doc Kearns..Patterson was the emerging star. But D'Amato protected his fighter as much as Kearns did with Dempsey when Jack put his title on the line only five times in seven years against a fighter whose kidneys were failing;a light heavyweight with a suspect chin;a crude bull man from Argentina;and the bigger Gibbons brother who was in there to say he went the distance with The Manassa Mauler.

After Floyd was on top of the heap D'Amato signed deals with "Hurricane" Jackson who was beginning to show symptoms of storm damage between the ears;a fighter who had never fought a pro fight;a game but overmatched Brit;and a rootin' tootin' cowboy. The trio of Machen ,Folley ,and Liston was reminiscent of the black triumvirate of McVey,Jeanette,and Langford holding out their hats to a man they were sure familiar with-heavyweight champ Jack Johnson who now relegated his former opponents to his pay no mind list.

Getting back to Patterson/Moore. The boxing experts don't talk much about that fight,neither from Floyd's followers nor Archie's adulators.I say it was Floyd's best fight,Moore's worst(if there was no hanky panky). But it was always a fight that was hard to figure. I guess I was too wrapped up into Archie Moore at the time.Hell,I was only a hero worshipping kid.When I was lending a hand at his boys club many many years later,I thought about asking him about the Patterson fight,but what the hell was he going to tell me?i wanted to stick around.I would have looked stupid if I'd brought that up.He would have thought I sandbagged him.Besides,he was too busy showing those kids how to gain a little self respect,something that I wouldn't have displayed if I'd had gone ahead and got smart alecky.


Joey Maxim

[chrisjs1985]

He Wore Those Stripes Proudly

When Dick Tiger wasn't fighting in the United States he was in Nigeria fighting on the side of the Biafran rebels who had broken away from Nigeria after England couldn't afford to keep their imperialistic invention in its empire. Tiger belonged to the Ibos,the elitists who were comprised of doctors,lawyers,teachers,and businessmen ,who felt they could govern on their own without being a part of their Muslim counterparts,the Hausas. The secession was met by force from the Hausas. Massacres were as common as what we see in the news today:car bombings,IED's exploding in bus terminals and outdoor markets,kidnappings and beheadings all under the guise that these atrocities are a religious experience that will get you to heaven ASAP(to bang those 80 some virgins.I guess that's part of what heaven is about with Muslims-screwing. But I've often wondered what awaits a Muslim woman when she goes to the public square and detonates the dynamite strapped to her chest? Does she get to frolic with a bunch of bare chested Arab boys?)Anyway,Dick Tiger joined the Biafran army and put himself on the front lines wanting to preserve his Christian heritage. Most of the money he made fighting went to the cause and his family who remained in Nigeria.

Tiger never fought for a big purse even though he was a two division champ.He lived a Spartan life when he was in New York training for a fight. He spent a minimal time living in the States.He trained.He fought. And then it was back on the plane to Nigeria to fight dirty. He could have assimilated with what we had to offer in the U.S. but Tiger was a true patriot. His manager,Lew Burston, and the East coast promoters knew they didn't have a guy like Ray Robinson that would finagle and threaten to walk out if the terms weren't to his liking. They didn't have to twist Tiger' tail.As fast as Tiger got paid he sent the money Western Union to Nigeria.

But what always struck me about Dick Tiger the fighter was his durability. He wasn't the fastest guy in the ring. He didn't pack sudden KO power in either hand. He plodded ahead and took what the other guy could throw at him and traded back. He fought some pretty rough boys, but their weapons bounced off Tiger's armor like ping pong balls.

Tiger won the middleweight title from the long time bully on the block Gene Fullmer. Now don't get me wrong. Gene was a nice guy sure enough,but his style was about as smooth as a Caterpillar tractor. It was the first time that I ever saw Fullmer get it taken to him(except for Sugar Ray's immortal left hook in Chicago).Fullmer had had enough of Dick Tiger and fighting after three go arounds with the rebel soldier. Sluggers like Henry Hank and Florentino Fernandez couldn't make a dent prior to Tiger's conquest of Fullmer.. Big punchers were waiting in line to unload on the slow moving target Dick Tiger the new champ. Hurricane Carter looked like he was hurting his hands whenever his gloves struck the African's torso.Joey Giardelo had to slip,move and counter to borrow the middleweight belt from Tiger,but had to give it back in the rematch.

Tiger was so damn strong that it wasn't moving mountains for him to go up to light heavyweight and challenge the very popular champ Jose Torres in front of all those Spanish Harlem fans in New York City. He wupped Don Peppino twice to cement his hold on the title.

Tiger did have problems with cuties;fighters that didn't come right at him,but were cautious which usually resulted in a boring fight. The great Emile Griffith won two decisions from Tiger in what has to be the two most boring fights between two of the greatest fighters who ever stepped into the ring. Tiger tried to bait Emile to come at him ,but Emile was content to hunt and peck his way to two forgettable decisions.

In 1968 when Tiger signed to risk his title against Bob Foster it was a bit of an oddity. Tiger was a compact 5 foot 8 and a short reach. Bob was a gangly tall 6 foot 3 and had wingspan like a 747.Foster had some bad showings against the top heavyweights of his day.Zora Folley,Eddie Machen,Joe Frazier,and even the Floating Butterfly had too much muscle for the piano legged Bob. It was concluded that Foster needed something (like what Holyfield did when he approached Mr, Olympia Lee Haney. Pass the needle and leap frog over evolution)if he was ever to be king of the heavies-a time when that ilk was riding the crest of a wave.

I thought Tiger would be in over his head with Foster. Foster could blast out guys in the light heavyweight division. Now he was fighting Tiger who had moved up from 160 to when he stepped on the scale for the morning weigh in balanced the bar at 168 pounds. Bob Foster was in a bigger league than Jose Torres. When Foster's run came to an end they'd be comparing him with Archie Moore.

But what shocked the boxing world was not Foster winning the title so much but how he did it-with a left hook that had more on it than Robby's left hand in Chicago when he knocked Fullmer into the Twilight Zone. After the loss Tiger had 4 more fights left in him-a Ring Magazine Fight Of The Year beating Frankie DePaula,decisions over two very good boys Nino Benvenuti and Andy Kendall,and then his last fight with Griffith.

Tiger was over 40 years of age after his fight with Emile.. His fighting days in the ring had taken a toll. But his will to fight back in Nigeria was as strong as ever. He wanted to live in Nigeria with his family. But he was still short of cash(as always)and had to take a job in The Apple In 1971 as a security guard.Around that time he was diagnosed with having cancer of the liver. He was granted by the Nigerian government to return to the country to be with his wife and children.

When they list the greatest of the middleweights Tiger's name is often omitted. BoxRec has Canelo as the No. 1 P4P in the world today.I sure wish I could get my hands on a Time Machine and put those two in the ring. Wasn't there a song by the name of "I've Got A Tiger By The Tail?"


Dick Tiger

Tiger's story and career trajectory is among the most interesting. By the time he stopped fighting in England where he lived in Liverpool, his record was a modest 33-11-1. In England, he'd had a four fight losing streak to start his career there going 19-8-1 over there. He had a hard time with the British style of quick boxing and movement. As soon as he arrived in New York he was taking on and beating quality guys like Gene Armstrong, Holly Mims, Spider Webb, Joey Giardello, Henry Hank etc; guys that would look like world beaters in today's game and would be talked about as pound for pounders (I think Canelo is good but grossly overrated and not a pound for pound top five today but I digress).

The consistent level of quality operators he fought was astounding. I personally see him as a lock for a top 10 ranking in the middleweight division. He wasn't the slickest or cutest boxer but he was almost unbeatable in a fight fought at close quarters. That was his office.

The fact he arrived in England and struggled so badly with the climate and culture then lost four straight and stuck around tells you a lot about the man. Then he came to America and took them all and became a ticket seller and a legend. Fighter of the year twice, involved in a fight of the year and then he puts it all on the line to help his people. What a fighter. What a man.

Did you ever see his fight with Frankie DePaula? Alan Sugar is 100% convinced that ESPN have that fight and for whatever reason won't show or release it.

[dagosd2000]

He Wore Those Stripes Proudly

When Dick Tiger wasn't fighting in the United States he was in Nigeria fighting on the side of the Biafran rebels who had broken away from Nigeria after England couldn't afford to keep their imperialistic invention in its empire. Tiger belonged to the Ibos,the elitists who were comprised of doctors,lawyers,teachers,and businessmen ,who felt they could govern on their own without being a part of their Muslim counterparts,the Hausas. The secession was met by force from the Hausas. Massacres were as common as what we see in the news today:car bombings,IED's exploding in bus terminals and outdoor markets,kidnappings and beheadings all under the guise that these atrocities are a religious experience that will get you to heaven ASAP(to bang those 80 some virgins.I guess that's part of what heaven is about with Muslims-screwing. But I've often wondered what awaits a Muslim woman when she goes to the public square and detonates the dynamite strapped to her chest? Does she get to frolic with a bunch of bare chested Arab boys?)Anyway,Dick Tiger joined the Biafran army and put himself on the front lines wanting to preserve his Christian heritage. Most of the money he made fighting went to the cause and his family who remained in Nigeria.

Tiger never fought for a big purse even though he was a two division champ.He lived a Spartan life when he was in New York training for a fight. He spent a minimal time living in the States.He trained.He fought. And then it was back on the plane to Nigeria to fight dirty. He could have assimilated with what we had to offer in the U.S. but Tiger was a true patriot. His manager,Lew Burston, and the East coast promoters knew they didn't have a guy like Ray Robinson that would finagle and threaten to walk out if the terms weren't to his liking. They didn't have to twist Tiger' tail.As fast as Tiger got paid he sent the money Western Union to Nigeria.

But what always struck me about Dick Tiger the fighter was his durability. He wasn't the fastest guy in the ring. He didn't pack sudden KO power in either hand. He plodded ahead and took what the other guy could throw at him and traded back. He fought some pretty rough boys, but their weapons bounced off Tiger's armor like ping pong balls.

Tiger won the middleweight title from the long time bully on the block Gene Fullmer. Now don't get me wrong. Gene was a nice guy sure enough,but his style was about as smooth as a Caterpillar tractor. It was the first time that I ever saw Fullmer get it taken to him(except for Sugar Ray's immortal left hook in Chicago).Fullmer had had enough of Dick Tiger and fighting after three go arounds with the rebel soldier. Sluggers like Henry Hank and Florentino Fernandez couldn't make a dent prior to Tiger's conquest of Fullmer.. Big punchers were waiting in line to unload on the slow moving target Dick Tiger the new champ. Hurricane Carter looked like he was hurting his hands whenever his gloves struck the African's torso.Joey Giardelo had to slip,move and counter to borrow the middleweight belt from Tiger,but had to give it back in the rematch.

Tiger was so damn strong that it wasn't moving mountains for him to go up to light heavyweight and challenge the very popular champ Jose Torres in front of all those Spanish Harlem fans in New York City. He wupped Don Peppino twice to cement his hold on the title.

Tiger did have problems with cuties;fighters that didn't come right at him,but were cautious which usually resulted in a boring fight. The great Emile Griffith won two decisions from Tiger in what has to be the two most boring fights between two of the greatest fighters who ever stepped into the ring. Tiger tried to bait Emile to come at him ,but Emile was content to hunt and peck his way to two forgettable decisions.

In 1968 when Tiger signed to risk his title against Bob Foster it was a bit of an oddity. Tiger was a compact 5 foot 8 and a short reach. Bob was a gangly tall 6 foot 3 and had wingspan like a 747.Foster had some bad showings against the top heavyweights of his day.Zora Folley,Eddie Machen,Joe Frazier,and even the Floating Butterfly had too much muscle for the piano legged Bob. It was concluded that Foster needed something (like what Holyfield did when he approached Mr, Olympia Lee Haney. Pass the needle and leap frog over evolution)if he was ever to be king of the heavies-a time when that ilk was riding the crest of a wave.

I thought Tiger would be in over his head with Foster. Foster could blast out guys in the light heavyweight division. Now he was fighting Tiger who had moved up from 160 to when he stepped on the scale for the morning weigh in balanced the bar at 168 pounds. Bob Foster was in a bigger league than Jose Torres. When Foster's run came to an end they'd be comparing him with Archie Moore.

But what shocked the boxing world was not Foster winning the title so much but how he did it-with a left hook that had more on it than Robby's left hand in Chicago when he knocked Fullmer into the Twilight Zone. After the loss Tiger had 4 more fights left in him-a Ring Magazine Fight Of The Year beating Frankie DePaula,decisions over two very good boys Nino Benvenuti and Andy Kendall,and then his last fight with Griffith.

Tiger was over 40 years of age after his fight with Emile.. His fighting days in the ring had taken a toll. But his will to fight back in Nigeria was as strong as ever. He wanted to live in Nigeria with his family. But he was still short of cash(as always)and had to take a job in The Apple In 1971 as a security guard.Around that time he was diagnosed with having cancer of the liver. He was granted by the Nigerian government to return to the country to be with his wife and children.

When they list the greatest of the middleweights Tiger's name is often omitted. BoxRec has Canelo as the No. 1 P4P in the world today.I sure wish I could get my hands on a Time Machine and put those two in the ring. Wasn't there a song by the name of "I've Got A Tiger By The Tail?"


Dick Tiger

Tiger's story and career trajectory is among the most interesting. By the time he stopped fighting in England where he lived in Liverpool, his record was a modest 33-11-1. In England, he'd had a four fight losing streak to start his career there going 19-8-1 over there. He had a hard time with the British style of quick boxing and movement. As soon as he arrived in New York he was taking on and beating quality guys like Gene Armstrong, Holly Mims, Spider Webb, Joey Giardello, Henry Hank etc; guys that would look like world beaters in today's game and would be talked about as pound for pounders (I think Canelo is good but grossly overrated and not a pound for pound top five today but I digress).

The consistent level of quality operators he fought was astounding. I personally see him as a lock for a top 10 ranking in the middleweight division. He wasn't the slickest or cutest boxer but he was almost unbeatable in a fight fought at close quarters. That was his office.

The fact he arrived in England and struggled so badly with the climate and culture then lost four straight and stuck around tells you a lot about the man. Then he came to America and took them all and became a ticket seller and a legend. Fighter of the year twice, involved in a fight of the year and then he puts it all on the line to help his people. What a fighter. What a man.

Did you ever see his fight with Frankie DePaula? Alan Sugar is 100% convinced that ESPN have that fight and for whatever reason won't show or release it.

Chris
I remember watching Tiger's fight with DePaula on TV.That was quite some time ago. It was one of the most exciting fights ever. Tiger was dropped early,but came back to knockdown DePaula.Both boys hammered away at each other the entire fight.. I wouldn't know why ESPN wouldn't want to release it.

[chrisjs1985]

Yeah, it sounds like a classic. No idea the benefit of withholding that bout. Odd that I wrote R0n L1pt0n and it comes out as "Alan Sugar" when I post the message. How bizarre. At least this site let's you type Dick Tiger. Other sites show as D*** Tiger.

[dagosd2000]

A Sure Bet

I was just a little kid when Rocky Marciano fought Jersey Joe Walcott at the Chicago stadium the second time around . The fight was the talk of Little Italy on the Southwest Side. When Marciano mustered up his Suzy Q in the hard luck round in Philly to win the heavyweight championship from Jersey Joe Walcott,the dagos on Taylor Street thought that the Savior had returned to earth in the guise of Rocco Francis Marchegiano .Oh, those wops weren't worried. Rocky was just taking his time,setting hinm up That right hand, smashing and distorting Walcott's pan (captured in that iconic, photo),was more powerful than the A bomb.
"Rocky was wearing him down to throw the right."
"Walcott didn't know what hit him."
"No one can beat the Rock."
But no matter how you slice it,Rocky was hurt by Jersey Joe and was behind on the cards going into the 13th. I remember when the rematch was set to be held at the Chicago Stadium. My father,being connected with The Outfit,was in line for front row seats. All the Chicago mob would be attending. My father and his brother Anthony would dress up in their best sharkskin suits glad handing all the" boys "at ringside-"Mooney" ,Harry "The Barber",Paul "The Waiter",Frankie LaPort,Jackie "The Lackey","Handsome Johnny, It would be like a scene out of "Goodfellas." I knew I wouldn't be invited.i was too young to hangout with those guys. The night of the fight the "boys" were congregating in the living room at my grandfather's(Diamond Joe) house on the corner of Polk and Oakley Boulevards. I was in the parlor playing with my cousins Frankie and Joey craning my neck trying to glean to what the "suits" had to say about the fight.
"Did you get your money down?The books are going to take bath on this one."
"It wasn't hard to get Bocchi to go along."
"It'll be Walcott's last fight."
None of this banter made any sense to me.All I wanted was Rocky Marciano to win. I can't remember if the fight was on TV. I didn't watch it.When the "boys" came tumbling back later it wasn't hard to discern that Marciano's title was safe.
"The moulinyan didn't know what hit him."
"Rocky almost knocked him out of the ring.Did you see his legs fly up in the air>"
"There's not a fighter around that can beat Rocky.Look what he did to Joe Louis."
I remember they interviewed Walcott after the fight and he was upset because he thought he beat the count.Years later I saw the replay.It's always been a bone of contention whether Jersey Joe was on his feet at "9."He seemed like he was OK,a little dazed maybe.His manager, Felix Bocchicchio with Jersey Joe at his side, approached referee Frank Sikora pleading their case more puzzled than pissed off. They could have used Martin Scorsese to direct them to be a little more convincing-maybe throwing a chair or taking a swing at someone in Rocky's corner. Between the fight and the protest the whole thing stunk up the joint.. The fight might have been scripted but their wee no Oscars handed out for that performance.


Jersey Joe Walcott


My grandfather,Diamond Joe Esposito's house on the corner of Polk and Oakley.