Cotto weight controversy

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 07 Jun 2006, 04:50

the weigh in for the Mouthlignaggi fight will take place at 1pm friday. much earlier - a few hrs in fact (nomrally around 5pm) -than is the norm.

DavidPayne · Post by **DavidPayne** » 07 Jun 2006, 05:29

His performances are suffering though.

I hate mentioning Cotto and Scott Harrison in the same sentence, but Cotto has lost much of his zip in the last year or so, in the same way the efficient, ruthless box-puncher that beat Chacon got lost along the way and became the one-dimensional plodder that fought Medina et al.

I think the weight issue plays its part.

They were saying two years ago Cotto would move up very soon.

It's not like he's facing the glitterati at 140 either is it?

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 07 Jun 2006, 05:31

Cotto has looked very blunt. A real depressing dip in form

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 07 Jun 2006, 05:34

Terence wrote:
viciousmaussa wrote:Cotto has looked very blunt. A real depressing dip in form
On the other hand it does produce exciting fights for the fans.

true, but i liked the sharp, clean punching cotto than the sloppy looking guy that turns up these days

jimcook · Post by **jimcook** » 07 Jun 2006, 06:34

i think you are all too critical.he keeps fighting and he keeps winning,by stoppage.hes still young ,and has fought decent quality opponents.lots of fighters take advantage of their ability to make lighter weights .they are not breaking any rules.compare cottos career to hattons and youve gotta say hes being moved along faster.hes down to fight castillo if he beats malignaggi,and castillo is top quality...so wheres the problem?

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 07 Jun 2006, 07:29

jimcook wrote:i think you are all too critical.he keeps fighting and he keeps winning,by stoppage.hes still young ,and has fought decent quality opponents.lots of fighters take advantage of their ability to make lighter weights .they are not breaking any rules.compare cottos career to hattons and youve gotta say hes being moved along faster.hes down to fight castillo if he beats malignaggi,and castillo is top quality...so wheres the problem?

what do you mean, castillo will never fight again on a big stage

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 07 Jun 2006, 08:01

I think that Cotto's physical condition is responsible for his decline, he's shipping a lot of punishment in his fights, and is I think doing so because his reflexes are suffering from the effects of cutting weight. As per our discussion before Terrence, extreme weight loss affects reflexes adversely for up to 20 weeks after reducing calorie intake, which Cotto must be doing to make weight.

The only problem is, Cotto isn't going to have the physical advantages he currently enjoys fighting at Welterweight, where there are a lot of big rangy guys.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 07 Jun 2006, 10:29

Cotto will face some bigger hitters at Welterweight though, even if he isn't weight drained, I think he will struggle, much as Hatton did recently. Although it's only 7 lbs north, you do find that there are some HUGE welterweights out there. Remember Vernon Forrest, look what he did to a small welterweight like Mosley, he was really hurting him with every shot he landed. Admittedly, Cotto and Hatton are naturally bigger men than Mosley, but compared to some of the monsters at Welterweight, they aren't as potent.

TerribleTerry · Post by **TerribleTerry** » 07 Jun 2006, 10:40

Weight drained or not I feel Cotto is a bit over-rated to be honest. Fairly stationery with lovely combination punching, there are plenty out there who have the style to beat him IMO, especially up at 10st 7

I know he was only a baby at the time, but at the Olympics Abduallev spanked him. Cotto got the revenge in the pro ranks, but ever since watching him at the Olympics I have been cautious in heaping too much praise on him.

With regards to the weigh in Paulie is gonna have to suck it up and accept the champ's camp can inforce these sort of things with a bit of politic'ing, as they say.

If Paulie can spring the upset (not outside the realms of possibility but I reckon Cotto will wear him down) he will get to call the shots Re: weigh in times.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 07 Jun 2006, 10:53

Yes, I've never been convinced about Cotto, he's pretty one paced. He has a solid technique, a decent defence, and can fight in the trenches, but he's pretty slow of foot, though he does use the ring when he needs to.

I always thought Hatton would smash him to pieces, because Cotto doesn't like being forced to fight at his opponent's pace, which is Hatton's forte. Think Cotto would get ground down late in the fight.

He's a tough cookie, but he's getting easier to hit, and easier to hurt as time goes on.

jimcook · Post by **jimcook** » 07 Jun 2006, 10:58

jamesmcdonnell wrote:I think that Cotto's physical condition is responsible for his decline, he's shipping a lot of punishment in his fights, and is I think doing so because his reflexes are suffering from the effects of cutting weight. As per our discussion before Terrence, extreme weight loss affects reflexes adversely for up to 20 weeks after reducing calorie intake, which Cotto must be doing to make weight.

The only problem is, Cotto isn't going to have the physical advantages he currently enjoys fighting at Welterweight, where there are a lot of big rangy guys.

i would be interested in reading any material you have on this subject( weight loss affecting reflexes) and if possible how weight loss effects punch resistance

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 07 Jun 2006, 11:07

I had heard this a few times in the past, and just did a google search with the terms "weight loss reflexes" and "dieting reflexes." Turned up a few papers on the subject.

I'd heard from a trainer before that weight drained fighters tended to lose their reflexes, and had read before that dehydration over long periods or recurring often, could lead to permanent nerve damage.

I've not heard anything which suggests it affects the ability to take a shot, in terms of being knocked out, though of course, if you feel shit from weight draining, you are going to be more likely to go down and stay down when taking punishment.

One thing I do suspect however, is that dehydration would affect the internal organs and the protective layers of fat around them, which might explain why fighters tight at the weight react badly to body shots.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 07 Jun 2006, 11:47

Cotto is going to be ruined by the constant battles with the weight he is having... if he sails too close to the wind he will end up getting hurt...

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 07 Jun 2006, 13:01

Its madness they are keeping him at 140, its not like he's fighting the top level guys either. He'd be far better off treading water at 147 surely.

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 07 Jun 2006, 13:43

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com ... ysw101.jpg

Cotto yesterday (Tuesday). Starving.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 07 Jun 2006, 14:08

bennie wrote:http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com ... ysw101.jpg

Cotto yesterday (Tuesday). Starving.

He looks sick, ...some will call me a hand wringing liberal for saying this but Cotto is not only possibly being allowed to ruin his career but his health as well, both in the short term but also in the long term... to take the punishment he is taking in recent fights when his body is sapped of its strength is just fool hardy and those around him should know better...
He should probably be at 154...

KO Artist · Post by **KO Artist** » 07 Jun 2006, 16:29

bennie wrote:http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com ... ysw101.jpg

Cotto yesterday (Tuesday). Starving.

Christ,

He looks like a prisoner of war at what 140 - 142.

His natrual weight when fully fit must at least 150.

This guys fighting way below their natrual weight will only contribute to further ring injuries and death, of fghters and eventually, the sport.

Why not weigh in on the afternoon or evening of the fight.

Cotto is a light middleweight, in fantasy matchups he should be paired with Mugabi and Norris, not Pryor and Arguello.

His eyes look hollow, look for an upset Malligalli iis very sharp and a fast puncher and comfy at the weight.

Shades of Honeyghan - Curry here.

Such a great talent being wasted by wanker promoters, sanctioning bodies etc.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 07 Jun 2006, 16:37

Apparently, on a canadian boxing show - Angelo Dundee and several other "insiders" have been saying - bet Malignaggi.

This is because of how much Cotto has been struggling with the weight.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 07 Jun 2006, 17:02

I think this whole situation of having the fighters weigh in so long before fight time is a dangerous farce. We have Featherweights who are really welterweights and Welterweights who are really middleweights...etc... I know the rule was brought in to enhance safety but it has long been abused, and is in my opinon a far more dangerous activity than what it replaced.... also the fact that we have men fighting for titles that they have to starve themselves to make the weight for makes the titles themselves just a joke...

kerrminator · Post by **kerrminator** » 07 Jun 2006, 17:32

In Cotto's defence I have to say" he is winning his fights" (but that photo is scary)

On the other hand I dont think I have ever seen a fighter looking healthy when trying to make the weight (not a well known one anyway)

Also, call Cotto what you want, but he is the one at the end of the day with the best Light Welter record and if I had a quid for every time I have heard him called out I would have about £0

He is the dark horse that no-one wants (including PBF by the way, but you cant blame Floyd as Cotto put away a few of Floyds opponents better than he did , thats for sure) and seems to have the tools to win the type of fights that even the most fight educated pundits think he will lose( Im talking about being mid fight and getting his ass kicked but coming back to win by KO when his chips were down )

He has the tools to go all the way but if Hatton and PBF keep playing the " only talk about fighting each other but never do it game" then he will be left out and it will not be his fault.

He is the only fighter at that weight that seems to be prepared to fight anyone and given the chance he will beat them all.

Cotto v Hatton at light welter would be a cracking fight,(Cotto by late KO imo) but Cotto v Hatton at Welter would be an easy scalp for Miguel (imo)

And that comes from an avid Hatton fan.

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 07 Jun 2006, 20:55

Hatton would kill him at Light Welter looking that drained!

So would Witter.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 08 Jun 2006, 02:55

When Cotto fought Abdullaev I thought he looked a little Egyptian. Now he looks like a mummy without the bandages.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 08 Jun 2006, 09:08

http://www.fightnews.com/cot_mal.jpg

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 08 Jun 2006, 09:27

People seem to be underestimating Cotto, a battle hardened warrior already, at a very young age.
I reckon Torres looked a genuine knockout artist, rather than Cotto have any chin problems. I'm not sure Ricky Hatton would have taken those bombs so well...

He looks far too weight drained have to admit, and he better move up fast if he knows what's good for him, but he should have far too much for this over hyped American, who hasn't fought anyone remotely as good or as hard hitting as Cotto.

Cotto is going to give Malligalli the shock of his life.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 09 Jun 2006, 05:02

Nobody is underestimating Cotto, he's a good (though far from a great) fighter. However, he looks like hell, and it's got to be worth a bet on a win for his opponent.