Hindsight Ratings

[margaret thatcher]

How do we treat a situation where let's say fighter A beats unproven fighter B. No one rates it as a good win. But then the following year fighter B scores nice wins. Does fighter A now get a resume upgrade?

Is 'win by proxy' an actual thing we should give credit for? When a guy I beat scores a nice win, it gives me some extra credit?

Like, look at Bivol. Pascal was considered shot going into their fight, and Joe Smith not much, But since then Pascal has beat Browne and Jack, and Smith just daddied Jess Harrt. Has Bivol's resume got stronger without him even fighting?

[Boxerbeetle]

Yes I don’t see why not.

[Delta Jay]

Mayweather Canelo biggest by-proxy of recent years. Really boxed his ears off and people are saying canelo is the fighte rod the decade now

[keirw]

Yes, it happens all the time.

Burns' close win over Relikh wasn't thought of as much, but since that defeat Relikh has proved himself a very good fighter is now one of the best names on Burns' record.

It works the other way too, though.

Calzaghe was seen by many as a lamb to the slaughter going into the fight against the highly regarded Jeff Lacy, but put on the performance of his career and won convincingly.

However, Lacy went on to do nothing of note after that and Calzaghe doesn't seem to get the credit he deserves for a masterful performance against a (at the time) very dangerous opponent.

[Coco]

Talking about Calzaghe, he didn't get a lot of credit for beating old man Hopkins but the old man went on to have some of his best victories.

[Boxerbeetle]

And Burns’ loss to Crawford looks better in retrospect, considering how easily Crawford has been demolishing his opposition since.

[Boxerbeetle]

The Lacy one is a hard one - in retrospect, he obviously wasn’t the force he was made out to be. But it’s hard to know how much Calzaghe’s total beating took out of him and what he might have gone on to achieve if their paths never crossed.

[keirw]

The Lacy one is a hard one - in retrospect, he obviously wasn’t the force he was made out to be. But it’s hard to know how much Calzaghe’s total beating took out of him and what he might have gone on to achieve if their paths never crossed.

That is entirely possible, I can see how a schooling like that can destroy a fighters confidence.

I'm not a big Canelo fan but I give him credit for the fact that he took the beating from Mayweather in his stride and improved from it.
He could well have went the same way as Lacy.

[Coco]

The Lacy one is a hard one - in retrospect, he obviously wasn’t the force he was made out to be. But it’s hard to know how much Calzaghe’s total beating took out of him and what he might have gone on to achieve if their paths never crossed.

That is entirely possible, I can see how a schooling like that can destroy a fighters confidence.

I'm not a big Canelo fan but I give him credit for the fact that he took the beating from Mayweather in his stride and improved from it.
He could well have went the same way as Lacy.

While Canelo was well beaten, he wasn't beaten up.
Lacy took a proper life changing, brain damaging beating.

[lillywhite14]

Pascal is a win for Froch that looks better every year. Pascal was relatively unknown when they fought. Cracking fight that too

[Ruthless-RKO]

Pascal is a win for Froch that looks better every year. Pascal was relatively unknown when they fought. Cracking fight that too

He wasn’t known you’re right and he moved up straight after and started smashing it.

Did Froch annihilate Pascal or something.

[Ruthless-RKO]

What about Marquez’s win over Salido? Has that gotten better after what Salido has accomplished?

Or any other of Salido’s early losses.

[margaret thatcher]

Thing with Lacy is that he didnt do anything notable after, would've been much easier for that win to gain value if he had. I never rated him well tbh, he struggled a number of times with limited opposition before Joe, and going into JC people seemed to forget everything in his career except for the Reid fight

Popkins though looks better, totally schooling Pavlik after and then getting numerous good wins for years after

Funnily, bOXrec's ratings have no way to capture what happens after, so sometimes you can even have one guy beat the other, yet if the other guy gets a good win right after, instead of them both going up the guy who lost the initial fight now moves ahead the guy who beat him

[Noxy]

And Burns’ loss to Crawford looks better in retrospect, considering how easily Crawford has been demolishing his opposition since.

Aye

[lillywhite14]

Pascal is a win for Froch that looks better every year. Pascal was relatively unknown when they fought. Cracking fight that too

He wasn’t known you’re right and he moved up straight after and started smashing it.

Did Froch annihilate Pascal or something.

Nah, it was a very competitive fight. Froch won by 3/4 rounds, plenty of action and they both left it in the ring.

[margaret thatcher]

Pascal was an Olmypian and was on ESPN in the states a number of times early in his career, he wasn't an unknown outside the UK at least

[Ruthless-RKO]

Pascal was an Olmypian and was on ESPN in the states a number of times early in his career, he wasn't an unknown outside the UK at least

That’s it. He came to the UK to fight Froch didn’t he? He wasn’t really known in the UK. Although they could have easily built him up.

[Boxerbeetle]

The Pascal fight was free on ITV (4?) at prime time. Fvcking awesome fight, proper war.

[Ruthless-RKO]

The Pascal fight was free on ITV (4?) at prime time. Fvcking awesome fight, proper war.

Yeh. His early fights where on channel 5 mostly. Fat Mick had a stable!

[Heretic]

There are shit loads of examples of this.

Usyks win over Hunter seem like pretty good win now. At the time I thought that he had surprisingly much trouble from the unknown yank.

AJ's win over Whyte carries lot more weight now days.

Parkers hometown win over Ruiz looks lot better now than it did at the time.

Personally I don't give full credit to Mayweather for beating drained Canelo.

Works the other way around too.

Ortiz win over Jennings was seen as great win at the time. In retrospect it means pretty much nothing.

[skanksta]

Hindsight ratings should definitely be included in boxer ratings - they are in mine.