Onetimeonly wrote: ↑28 Apr 2020, 00:30
He got screwed worse against corrales than he did against Floyd. He knocked that piece of chit out!
I thought he got screwed in both cases. Considering the ramifications it would've had on his career I'd say getting screwed against Floyd was the bigger detriment for him, but yeah I was pissed at the conclusion of the JLC-Corrales fight.
Always taints it a little for me. Everybody always talks about how it's one of the greatest fights ever, and it is, but man it pisses me off.
Least he beat that ass in the rematch. People always try to take that away from him over the 4 extra pounds thing, but hey...considering Corrales got extra recovery time twice in the 1st fight in a crucial moment. F*ck him.
Duran1970 wrote: ↑27 Apr 2020, 21:50
The topic is weakest hof inductees..so I was surprised to see Cuevas name even mentioned considering who's in..I'm not trying to come across saying he's a first ballot all time great or anything like that..just surprised at the lack of respect he got..just my opinion
Tbf, you can still be among the weakest group without being the absolute weakest. You can have a better case than Vit and co but still be pretty weak yourself (not speaking specifically about Cuevas, but I don't think the fact that weaker guys are in means a guy isn't still weak himself)
I agree..hence what I said..
I think pipinos case is solid..it's a matter of opinion and I think I have two legs to o stand on in this discussion.lol...
Nobodys right and nobodys wrong..I will say that the older historians I mingle with all agree on the mark Cuevas left..
Onetimeonly wrote: ↑28 Apr 2020, 00:30
He got screwed worse against corrales than he did against Floyd. He knocked that piece of chit out!
I thought he got screwed in both cases. Considering the ramifications it would've had on his career I'd say getting screwed against Floyd was the bigger detriment for him, but yeah I was pissed at the conclusion of the JLC-Corrales fight.
Always taints it a little for me. Everybody always talks about how it's one of the greatest fights ever, and it is, but man it pisses me off.
Least he beat that ass in the rematch. People always try to take that away from him over the 4 extra pounds thing, but hey...considering Corrales got extra recovery time twice in the 1st fight in a crucial moment. F*ck him.
Do you think the ref should've took more points or stopped that fight?..
I thought he got screwed in both cases. Considering the ramifications it would've had on his career I'd say getting screwed against Floyd was the bigger detriment for him, but yeah I was pissed at the conclusion of the JLC-Corrales fight.
Always taints it a little for me. Everybody always talks about how it's one of the greatest fights ever, and it is, but man it pisses me off.
Least he beat that ass in the rematch. People always try to take that away from him over the 4 extra pounds thing, but hey...considering Corrales got extra recovery time twice in the 1st fight in a crucial moment. F*ck him.
Do you think the ref should've took more points or stopped that fight?..
After the 2nd knockdown, and the 2nd mouthpiece spit to buy time, it should've been stopped. He was out on his feet after that 1st knockdown, didn't take much of anything to put him down that 2nd time. He looked finished.
Then proceeded to get a lot of extra recovery time, due to them having to put the mouthpiece back in, Tony to hold his arm, and deduct the point from him to all 3 judges.
It's what costs Corrales the fight. Very crafty on Corrales' part to be able to think of a way to buy time though I'll give him that. I always wondered if he did that intentionally to buy time or if he did it so he could breathe better because he was obviously all but spent.
I agree he did it on purpose to buy time but I disagree he was out on his feet after the first knockdown..Corrales went down alot without being "out" (see Mayweather) just to buy time..it is a tough loss for Castillo to accept but in my eyes there was no loser in that fight..an extraordinary effort by both to say the least..
Duran1970 wrote: ↑28 Apr 2020, 01:07
I agree he did it on purpose to buy time but I disagree he was out on his feet after the first knockdown..Corrales went down alot without being "out" (see Mayweather) just to buy time..it is a tough loss for Castillo to accept but in my eyes there was no loser in that fight..an extraordinary effort by both to say the least..
There was damn sure a loser in the 2nd fight
Damn shame we never got that 3rd one. Castillo tried to pull that coming in overweight sh*t again, and Corrales and them was like "Oh hell no"
Don't blame him.
Wish they would've just scheduled the 3rd bout at 140 instead of trying to force it as a Lightweight Championship bout when it was clear JLC just couldn't (or wouldn't) make 135 anymore.
Onetimeonly wrote: ↑28 Apr 2020, 00:30
He got screwed worse against corrales than he did against Floyd. He knocked that piece of chit out!
I thought he got screwed in both cases. Considering the ramifications it would've had on his career I'd say getting screwed against Floyd was the bigger detriment for him, but yeah I was pissed at the conclusion of the JLC-Corrales fight.
Always taints it a little for me. Everybody always talks about how it's one of the greatest fights ever, and it is, but man it pisses me off.
Least he beat that ass in the rematch. People always try to take that away from him over the 4 extra pounds thing, but hey...considering Corrales got extra recovery time twice in the 1st fight in a crucial moment. F*ck him.
Corrales was a piece of shit, he was also beloved. First freitas spits out his mouthpiece and he's a bitch. Chico copies it and he's a bad ass.
Castillo missed weight and he's a monster. Chico misses weight, crickets.
Not sure I agree about which of those cost him more. Obviously now, the Floyd win would be much bigger, then he loses the rematch and things go the same route. Corrales and weeks don't cheat him, he wouldn't even have gotten as much heat for missing weight. Then that hatton fight is much bigger.
I thought he got screwed in both cases. Considering the ramifications it would've had on his career I'd say getting screwed against Floyd was the bigger detriment for him, but yeah I was pissed at the conclusion of the JLC-Corrales fight.
Always taints it a little for me. Everybody always talks about how it's one of the greatest fights ever, and it is, but man it pisses me off.
Least he beat that ass in the rematch. People always try to take that away from him over the 4 extra pounds thing, but hey...considering Corrales got extra recovery time twice in the 1st fight in a crucial moment. F*ck him.
Corrales was a piece of poo, he was also beloved. First freitas spits out his mouthpiece and he's a bitch. Chico copies it and he's a bad ass.
Castillo missed weight and he's a monster. Chico misses weight, crickets.
Not sure I agree about which of those cost him more. Obviously now, the Floyd win would be much bigger, then he loses the rematch and things go the same route. Corrales and weeks don't cheat him, he wouldn't even have gotten as much heat for missing weight. Then that hatton fight is much bigger.
If Floyd had lost that fight though I don't think he ever could've possibly become the superstar he became. A big part of his drawing power and mystique to the general public is the unbeaten record, and so many people just wanting to see him lose. If he had lost way back in 2002, does he ever even get to fight Oscar De La Hoya? Hard to say.
Duran1970 wrote: ↑28 Apr 2020, 01:07
I agree he did it on purpose to buy time but I disagree he was out on his feet after the first knockdown..Corrales went down alot without being "out" (see Mayweather) just to buy time..it is a tough loss for Castillo to accept but in my eyes there was no loser in that fight..an extraordinary effort by both to say the least..
He didn't even get touched for the second kd and went down like he got shot. He was complete toast. Weeks should have waved it off, he's most to blame for that horrific robbery.
Corrales had nothing left after that first fight..and understandably so...but taking nothing away from Castillo in saying that..
Do you think weeks should've taken a point after the first mouthpiece incident? And if he would've , he probably stops it after he does it again the second time..
Back in the ol' days spitting out your gumshield meant youve had enough and fights were stopped
Corrales was a piece of poo, he was also beloved. First freitas spits out his mouthpiece and he's a bitch. Chico copies it and he's a bad ass.
Castillo missed weight and he's a monster. Chico misses weight, crickets.
Not sure I agree about which of those cost him more. Obviously now, the Floyd win would be much bigger, then he loses the rematch and things go the same route. Corrales and weeks don't cheat him, he wouldn't even have gotten as much heat for missing weight. Then that hatton fight is much bigger.
If Floyd had lost that fight though I don't think he ever could've possibly become the superstar he became. A big part of his drawing power and mystique to the general public is the unbeaten record, and so many people just wanting to see him lose. If he had lost way back in 2002, does he ever even get to fight Oscar De La Hoya? Hard to say.
I don't know that he makes quite as much money, but fighting the top guys for 15 years will get you plenty of rep.
Anyway, are you agreeing the corrales robbery cost him more? Lol
Tbf, you can still be among the weakest group without being the absolute weakest. You can have a better case than Vit and co but still be pretty weak yourself (not speaking specifically about Cuevas, but I don't think the fact that weaker guys are in means a guy isn't still weak himself)
I agree..hence what I said..
I think pipinos case is solid..it's a matter of opinion and I think I have two legs to o stand on in this discussion.lol...
Nobodys right and nobodys wrong..I will say that the older historians I mingle with all agree on the mark Cuevas left..
More like no legs. Just a number of defenses. Might as well be talking about Omar narvaez. On one leg you'd at least be talking up somebody he beat.
If Floyd had lost that fight though I don't think he ever could've possibly become the superstar he became. A big part of his drawing power and mystique to the general public is the unbeaten record, and so many people just wanting to see him lose. If he had lost way back in 2002, does he ever even get to fight Oscar De La Hoya? Hard to say.
I don't know that he makes quite as much money, but fighting the top guys for 15 years will get you plenty of rep.
Anyway, are you agreeing the corrales robbery cost him more? Lol
No, because if Floyd gets even half as noteworthy as he eventually got then a win over him just means more than a win over Corrales would've.
Obviously being the winner in one of the all time great fights probably automatically makes you a Hall of Famer too, or at least would damn sure help.
Both fights cost him his Lightweight title, and both had their controversies. I'd say the bogus decision in the 1st Floyd fight ultimately costs him more, but either of those fights as win on his ledger instead of losses, and he gets a lot more of the respect he deserves.
Duran1970 wrote: ↑28 Apr 2020, 01:07
I agree he did it on purpose to buy time but I disagree he was out on his feet after the first knockdown..Corrales went down alot without being "out" (see Mayweather) just to buy time..it is a tough loss for Castillo to accept but in my eyes there was no loser in that fight..an extraordinary effort by both to say the least..
He didn't even get touched for the second kd and went down like he got shot. He was complete toast. Weeks should have waved it off, he's most to blame for that horrific robbery.
He was definitely hurt after the second knockdown and barely beat the count
I don't know that he makes quite as much money, but fighting the top guys for 15 years will get you plenty of rep.
Anyway, are you agreeing the corrales robbery cost him more? Lol
No, because if Floyd gets even half as noteworthy as he eventually got then a win over him just means more than a win over Corrales would've.
Obviously being the winner in one of the all time great fights probably automatically makes you a Hall of Famer too, or at least would damn sure help.
Both fights cost him his Lightweight title, and both had their controversies. I'd say the bogus decision in the 1st Floyd fight ultimately costs him more, but either of those fights as win on his ledger instead of losses, and he gets a lot more of the respect he deserves.
Beating Floyd means more than beating Corrales. Floyd had already dominated the f*ck out of Corrales. Therefore beating Floyd would've meant more even in 2002.
If Floyd had gone on to be anywhere near the star he became, and JLC had that win to his credit. He's a Hall of Famer without a 2nd thought.
gilgamesh wrote: ↑28 Apr 2020, 01:23
Slightly off topic, but this thread has just made me wanna say one more time for the record F*CK TONY WEEKS!
One of the shittiest referees of the last 20 years.
Yeah he’s garbage. I’m still amazed at his handling of Ward-Kovalev II. Even more amazed by the people who didn’t see the low blow and refuse to believe it happened.
I liked Corrales but it was a bit crappy how he and his fans were irate at Freitas spitting the mouth piece then went nuts at Castillo missing weight but tried to do it vs. Casamayor as Mark said.
The thing is, the cheating benefitted him because he probably goes 0-2 vs. Castillo in fair fights and of course the Freitas and Casamayor fights the right man won. Castillo was the big loser in all of it financially and legacy wise.
gilgamesh wrote: ↑28 Apr 2020, 01:29
What's not to understand?
Beating Floyd means more than beating Corrales. Floyd had already dominated the f*ck out of Corrales. Therefore beating Floyd would've meant more even in 2002.
If Floyd had gone on to be anywhere near the star he became, and JLC had that win to his credit. He's a Hall of Famer without a 2nd thought.
gilgamesh wrote: ↑28 Apr 2020, 01:29
What's not to understand?
Beating Floyd means more than beating Corrales. Floyd had already dominated the f*ck out of Corrales. Therefore beating Floyd would've meant more even in 2002.
If Floyd had gone on to be anywhere near the star he became, and JLC had that win to his credit. He's a Hall of Famer without a 2nd thought.
OK, you're talking in circles. No big deal.
No, I'm just repeating something that you apparently couldn't grasp the first f*cking time I said it
chrisjs1985 wrote: ↑28 Apr 2020, 01:34
I liked Corrales but it was a bit crappy how he and his fans were irate at Freitas spitting the mouth piece then went nuts at Castillo missing weight but tried to do it vs. Casamayor as Mark said.
The thing is, the cheating benefitted him because he probably goes 0-2 vs. Castillo in fair fights and of course the Freitas and Casamayor fights the right man won. Castillo was the big loser in all of it financially and legacy wise.
Speaking of the Casamayor-Corrales fights. I always found it mystifying that the Showtime commentary crew acted as if Corrales was putting on some kinda boxing clinic in that fight (their 2nd one). I always wondered what the hell fight they were watching.
chrisjs1985 wrote: ↑28 Apr 2020, 01:34
I liked Corrales but it was a bit crappy how he and his fans were irate at Freitas spitting the mouth piece then went nuts at Castillo missing weight but tried to do it vs. Casamayor as Mark said.
The thing is, the cheating benefitted him because he probably goes 0-2 vs. Castillo in fair fights and of course the Freitas and Casamayor fights the right man won. Castillo was the big loser in all of it financially and legacy wise.
Speaking of the Casamayor-Corrales fights. I always found it mystifying that the Showtime commentary crew acted as if Corrales was putting on some kinda boxing clinic in that fight (their 2nd one). I always wondered what the hell fight they were watching.
IMO Casamayor is 3-0 against him.
I agree. I felt Casamayor shaded it probably on account of his knockdown. I also felt Casamayor beat Freitas and drawn with Castillo.
Speaking of the Casamayor-Corrales fights. I always found it mystifying that the Showtime commentary crew acted as if Corrales was putting on some kinda boxing clinic in that fight (their 2nd one). I always wondered what the hell fight they were watching.
IMO Casamayor is 3-0 against him.
I agree. I felt Casamayor shaded it probably on account of his knockdown. I also felt Casamayor beat Freitas and drawn with Castillo.
X3
Ironically, if any of the 3 ever make the hof it will be corrales. I'd say fairly soon but changing it to 3 years will make it tougher.
