Anthony Joshua out protesting today. Will the board take action?

[gilgamesh]

I don't feel any white guilt, it's one thing to acknowledge the past injustices, but I had 0 involvment in them and didnt support them

That type of thinking is messed up and overly broad. Ascribing something like that to all people of one colour is a similar process to racism itself

Yeah it's definitely not the right idea to try to battle racism with racism. It just keeps it going in a vicious never ending cycle.

[Counter-puncher]

I don't feel any white guilt, it's one thing to acknowledge the past injustices, but I had 0 involvment in them and didnt support them

That type of thinking is messed up and overly broad. Ascribing something like that to all people of one colour is a similar process to racism itself

Agreed, I’m not sure how many sensible people would disagree. A justified grievance on one ‘side’ doesn’t automatically imply guilt over slavery to those now living on the the other ‘side’ of the grievance

[smiling assassin]

I don't feel any white guilt, it's one thing to acknowledge the past injustices, but I had 0 involvment in them and didnt support them

That type of thinking is messed up and overly broad. Ascribing something like that to all people of one colour is a similar process to racism itself

Couldn’t agree more

[BigDoofus]

A trend began after the transatlantic slave trade introduced the idea of large scale slave trading, which was basically absent in African society (on that scale) before that point,yes. I mean, it’s almost as though the European trade gave them the idea and infrastructure where none existed previously. Well, not ‘almost’, that’s what happened

"Figures on the Arab slave trade in Africa are hard to come by, but the historian Paul Lovejoy estimates that some 9.85 million Africans were shipped out as slaves to Arabia and, in small numbers, to the Indian subcontinent. Lovejoy breaks his figures down as follows:

Between AD 650 and 1600, an average of 5,000 Africans were shipped out by the Arabs. This makes a rough total of 7.25 million.

Then, between 1600 and 1800, another 1.4 million Africans were shipped out by the Arabs. The 19th century represented the highest point of the Arabian trade where 12,000 Africans were shipped out every year. The total figure for the 19th century alone was 1.2 million slaves to Arabia."

[Counter-puncher]

Who had it best? That's the more important question, and the answer isn't squabbling with Dave down the road about who's had it easier, it's working with Dave against the rich white bastards who've exploited you both.

[Counter-puncher]

A trend began after the transatlantic slave trade introduced the idea of large scale slave trading, which was basically absent in African society (on that scale) before that point,yes. I mean, it’s almost as though the European trade gave them the idea and infrastructure where none existed previously. Well, not ‘almost’, that’s what happened

"Figures on the Arab slave trade in Africa are hard to come by, but the historian Paul Lovejoy estimates that some 9.85 million Africans were shipped out as slaves to Arabia and, in small numbers, to the Indian subcontinent. Lovejoy breaks his figures down as follows:

Between AD 650 and 1600, an average of 5,000 Africans were shipped out by the Arabs. This makes a rough total of 7.25 million.

Then, between 1600 and 1800, another 1.4 million Africans were shipped out by the Arabs. The 19th century represented the highest point of the Arabian trade where 12,000 Africans were shipped out every year. The total figure for the 19th century alone was 1.2 million slaves to Arabia."

Absolutely true thanks because it highlights a key point of geography

Africa is pretty big, right?

Transatlantic slave trade took slaves from WEST Africa

Arabia is to the EAST of Africa

So the west African slave market was indeed perpetuated by Europeans and the Translatlantic slave trade

Which logic would suggest even if a bit of research didn’t ( google ‘Arab slave trade Africa’ and you’ll quickly find where they were getting their slaves), because Africa is way too big and inhospitable in the middle for people to the East to harvest slaves thousands of miles to the west

So your quote about the Arab slaving- which I’ve already alluded to- doesn’t somehow equivocate the western trade, or imply that the west Africans would have been enslaved by Arabs for years anyway. they weren’t, they were too far away from the Arabs. So my point that industrial levels of slavery were first perpetuated in WEST Africa by the Transatlantic slave trade stands.


Edit, ah I see I said absent in African society earlier when I should have specified I meant West African, apologies

[slapbangwhallop]

Not sure that is exactly correct, I thought it was that there was no Unionist majority as opposed to a Nationalist majority. There are those that are 'non alligned' including Alliance, Greens and People Before Profit.

Dup(unionist) 8.
Sinn Fein (republican) 7. SDLP( nationalist)2
Alliance ( affiliated to neither particularly)1
That's 9 seats to the nationalists and 8 to unionists with the alliance holding 1 seat. Greens and PVP no seats. It's a nationalist majority for the first time in stormont and has been moving that way for quite some time

That's not the results for the Assembly though, that's the results for the General Election.

[Counter-puncher]

And of course means that the Arabs were every bit as bad as the transatlantic trade. However none of the Arab countries have millions of slave ancestors living there today as far as I know, so the subject comes up more in the west in relation to the Transatlantic trade

Other than in conversations like this when Arab slaving, as I’ve already alluded to, is a guaranteed mention every time. Yes, they were bad too, no that doesn’t make ‘our lot’ any better, no I’m not talking about the Arab slave trade because I’m not an Arab and it isn’t Arabic towns with monuments to slavery that we’re talking about

[Gnome]

That's not how it works ffs.

The majority of China thinks that Hong Kong and Taiwan should be absorbed into the country as a whole. So its OK?

I'm sure your aware then for the first time since the end of gerrymandering and since the start of power sharing in the 6 counties of N ireland that the nationalists have a majority in stormont. That's is the NI assembly. And in the Ireland latest election Sinn Fein the republican party won the most seats. Also fianna fail, fianna Gael and labour that's all 4 major southern parties all have always striven for Irish unity in different degrees. Now I know you love to pick at anything I say on this board regarding either Irish unity or socialism you miserable little fuk. Like when I said at the end of a post once "tiocfaidh ar la". Your response even tho it (the post) wasn't aimed at you as you weren't involved in the conversation was that I was spouting sectarian poo you fukin moron. So what is sectarian poo about that phrase you cap doffing imperialist renter. So to sum it up situation in China hk very different to Ireland where in the north of Ireland we now in parliament have a nationalist majority you miserable snidey little bumboy

I'll ignore the insults, your ranting has made you look like a tit so they'd be gilding the lily.

Unionist parties won far more votes than nationalist parties on the last assembly election, and the polls in the North consistently point to no desire for Reunification. Its not going to happen any time soon so suck it up, big boy.

[Grilling Machine]

It's pretty obvious what this Corbynista is all about.

It's true — I really liked Labour's last two manifestos. Could've been Frosty the Snowman leading and I'd still have voted for 'em, though.

Poor guy

Bit off-topic, but I've always wondered why Ham was picked out at such a young age when loads of his equally gifted peers weren't, because an unpleasant surmisation is that Dennis was a now-then, now-then. Which would be on-topic if true.

Why do the far left think it’s ok though

It's not guilt for what Great Uncle Tosspot did, because like you say that'd be daft. It's — and I don't think guilt's the right word for it — the desire to remedy those wrongs not because they happened back then, but because they're still happening today. Seeing racism and turning away makes us complicit.

But I don't feel white guilt, I just look at a lot of rich white dudes and wish they weren't giving the rest of us a bad name. Because 99% of 'em are white, and their wealth was and is created by hard-working men and women of all races. These elites deny us the money we create for them, and we should be united against being used as the makers of our own inequality, not playing at Four Yorkshiremen.

[Steveh583]

I thought Douglas Murray made some valid points during this debate a few years back

[margaret thatcher]

Is Doug Murray flaming gay? Or does he just talk like he's fabulous?

[Grilling Machine]

That's an exceptionalist trying to rally other whites to secure his elevated position from universal attack, giving not one shit about foreigners of any race who've suffered any kind of injustice, nor the lower-class whites he plays to.

Is he mates with Mogg?

[BigDoofus]

So your quote about the Arab slaving- which I’ve already alluded to- doesn’t somehow equivocate the western trade, or imply that the west Africans would have been enslaved by Arabs for years anyway. they weren’t, they were too far away from the Arabs. So my point that industrial levels of slavery were first perpetuated in WEST Africa by the Transatlantic slave trade stands.


Edit, ah I see I said absent in African society earlier when I should have specified I meant West African, apologies

"Slavery in historical Africa was practiced in many different forms: Debt slavery, enslavement of war captives, military slavery, slavery for prostitution, and criminal slavery were all practiced in various parts of Africa.[2] Slavery for domestic and court purposes was widespread throughout Africa. Plantation slavery also occurred, primarily on the eastern coast of Africa and in parts of West Africa."

"Military slavery.......most significant in the Nile valley (primarily in Sudan and Uganda), with slave military units organized by various Islamic authorities,[13] and with the war chiefs of Western Africa."

"Human sacrifice was common in West African states up to and during the 19th century"...."The Annual customs of Dahomey was the most notorious example of the human sacrifice of slaves, where 500 prisoners would be sacrificed. Sacrifices were carried out all along the West African coast and further inland. Sacrifices were common in the Benin Empire, in what is now Ghana, and in the small independent states in what is now southern Nigeria. In the Ashanti Region, human sacrifice was often combined with capital punishment"

"Various forms of slavery were practiced in diverse ways in different communities of West Africa prior to European trade"

" Henry Louis Gates, the Harvard Chair of African and African American Studies, has stated that "without complex business partnerships between African elites and European traders and commercial agents, the slave trade to the New World would have been impossible, at least on the scale it occurred"

[Gnome]

That's an exceptionalist trying to rally other whites to secure his elevated position from universal attack, giving not one poo about foreigners of any race who've suffered any kind of injustice, nor the lower-class whites he plays to.

Is he mates with Mogg?

Wrong. Why don't you counter his argument instead of making an ad hominem attack?

[Gnome]

So your quote about the Arab slaving- which I’ve already alluded to- doesn’t somehow equivocate the western trade, or imply that the west Africans would have been enslaved by Arabs for years anyway. they weren’t, they were too far away from the Arabs. So my point that industrial levels of slavery were first perpetuated in WEST Africa by the Transatlantic slave trade stands.


Edit, ah I see I said absent in African society earlier when I should have specified I meant West African, apologies

"Slavery in historical Africa was practiced in many different forms: Debt slavery, enslavement of war captives, military slavery, slavery for prostitution, and criminal slavery were all practiced in various parts of Africa.[2] Slavery for domestic and court purposes was widespread throughout Africa. Plantation slavery also occurred, primarily on the eastern coast of Africa and in parts of West Africa."

"Military slavery.......most significant in the Nile valley (primarily in Sudan and Uganda), with slave military units organized by various Islamic authorities,[13] and with the war chiefs of Western Africa."

"Human sacrifice was common in West African states up to and during the 19th century"...."The Annual customs of Dahomey was the most notorious example of the human sacrifice of slaves, where 500 prisoners would be sacrificed. Sacrifices were carried out all along the West African coast and further inland. Sacrifices were common in the Benin Empire, in what is now Ghana, and in the small independent states in what is now southern Nigeria. In the Ashanti Region, human sacrifice was often combined with capital punishment"

"Various forms of slavery were practiced in diverse ways in different communities of West Africa prior to European trade"

" Henry Louis Gates, the Harvard Chair of African and African American Studies, has stated that "without complex business partnerships between African elites and European traders and commercial agents, the slave trade to the New World would have been impossible, at least on the scale it occurred"

Right.

And don't forget slavery still exists, why don't people make a fuss of that instead of centuries old statues.

[Coco]

You need to remember that most of the slavery takes place in countries like Saudi, he gave them a pass for 9/11 so we are hardly going to make a stand against slavery.

[Steveh583]

I've just learned th at BLM isn't a charity, yet it doesn't pay any taxes. Fishy.

[Grilling Machine]

Wrong. Why don't you counter his argument instead of making an ad hominem attack?

Because when I see a man engaging in populism for his own ends, any criticism is naturally an ad hominem.

We're not arguing to apologise for things that happened before we were born, but to look at how much more progress could've and should've been made between then and now for the good of all. And that goes beyond race because it's ultimately down to the greed of elites, it's just that race comes into it because the overwhelming majority of those elites are white.

We can't do anything about white injustices from decades back, no, but we've Blair now making millions from speeches after bombing Iraq for his own ego; Clegg now earns millions from Facebook; and then what about Branson, O'Leary, Sugar, Green, Musk, Dorsey, Buffett, Gates, Jobs, Zuckerberg, Arnault, Ellison, Bezos... How many of those are advertised as philanthropists, and what do they all have in common...

[Gnome]

Wrong. Why don't you counter his argument instead of making an ad hominem attack?

Because when I see a man engaging in populism for his own ends, any criticism is naturally an ad hominem.

We're not arguing to apologise for things that happened before we were born, but to look at how much more progress could've and should've been made between then and now for the good of all. And that goes beyond race because it's ultimately down to the greed of elites, it's just that race comes into it because the overwhelming majority of those elites are white.

We can't do anything about white injustices from decades back, no, but we've Blair now making millions from speeches after bombing Iraq for his own ego; Clegg now earns millions from Facebook; and then what about Branson, O'Leary, Sugar, Green, Musk, Dorsey, Buffett, Gates, Jobs, Zuckerberg, Arnault, Ellison, Bezos... How many of those are advertised as philanthropists, and what do they all have in common...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Giving_Pledge

Gates and others have pledged to give over a trillion dollars to charity, here's a list of those who have pledged to give at least half their net worth to charitable causes after their death. That has to be worth something. Its more than I will be doing, I imagine.

[rd350lc]

Because when I see a man engaging in populism for his own ends, any criticism is naturally an ad hominem.

We're not arguing to apologise for things that happened before we were born, but to look at how much more progress could've and should've been made between then and now for the good of all. And that goes beyond race because it's ultimately down to the greed of elites, it's just that race comes into it because the overwhelming majority of those elites are white.

We can't do anything about white injustices from decades back, no, but we've Blair now making millions from speeches after bombing Iraq for his own ego; Clegg now earns millions from Facebook; and then what about Branson, O'Leary, Sugar, Green, Musk, Dorsey, Buffett, Gates, Jobs, Zuckerberg, Arnault, Ellison, Bezos... How many of those are advertised as philanthropists, and what do they all have in common...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Giving_Pledge

Gates and others have pledged to give over a trillion dollars to charity, here's a list of those who have pledged to give at least half their net worth to charitable causes after their death. That has to be worth something. Its more than I will be doing, I imagine.

Don't get that , do they need the zillions of dollars they have now to live a comfortable life now ?
If it was me I'd hand it over now so I could see what good it was doing .

[jamesmcdonnell]

I've just learned th at BLM isn't a charity, yet it doesn't pay any taxes. Fishy.

It's a nonprofit. Why is that fishy?

[jamesmcdonnell]

It's pretty obvious what this Corbynista is all about.

It's true — I really liked Labour's last two manifestos. Could've been Frosty the Snowman leading and I'd still have voted for 'em, though.

Poor guy

Bit off-topic, but I've always wondered why Ham was picked out at such a young age when loads of his equally gifted peers weren't, because an unpleasant surmisation is that Dennis was a now-then, now-then. Which would be on-topic if true.

Why do the far left think it’s ok though

It's not guilt for what Great Uncle Tosspot did, because like you say that'd be daft. It's — and I don't think guilt's the right word for it — the desire to remedy those wrongs not because they happened back then, but because they're still happening today. Seeing racism and turning away makes us complicit.

But I don't feel white guilt, I just look at a lot of rich white dudes and wish they weren't giving the rest of us a bad name. Because 99% of 'em are white, and their wealth was and is created by hard-working men and women of all races. These elites deny us the money we create for them, and we should be united against being used as the makers of our own inequality, not playing at Four Yorkshiremen.

Exactly, it's not about guilt, I've nothing to feel guilty about, it's about redressing past acts and creating a level playing field.

[jamesmcdonnell]

It's a nonprofit. Why is that fishy?

It’s funded by well known illluminati King George soros (ex nazi btw)

I'm really hoping this is a joke.

[jamesmcdonnell]

This bullshit's been doing the rounds for years.

It's simply not true.

Soros worked for 2 whole days for the Jewish council in Hungary, as a 13 year old boy. His father stopped him when he realised that the messages he carried were assisting the deporation of jews.

You'll have to try harder.

Black lives matter receives zero money from the Soros foundation I'm afraid either.

There's plenty of people claiming that they do, but without a shred of, well, you know.....evidence.