Watching older fights

[jas80s]

Thought I would throw out some random observations on fights I have watched. I am very interested in the views of many others who post here, so if anyone wants to add any thoughts on the fighters or fights mentioned here, please feel free.

Robinson - Lamotta VI

Like so many other fighters from the past, it seems that Robinson liked to keep his hands a little lower. I can think of a few reasons for this I suppose: Lamotta no doubt had a reputation for body punching, and I suppose the hand position could have helped Robinson to counter effectively as well.

However, in this fight, the combination of having his hands down and offering not a whole lot of head movement really allowed Lamotta to have pretty good success with his jab. In fact, in this bout, Robinson's defense was almost exclusively using his legs to create distance and turn Lamotta. Of course, this is grading Robinson on a pretty steep curve since the fight obviously went well, so what he was doing was 1000 percent right.

It's easy to see why Robinson captivated fight fans. His hands are incredibly fast, and he threw fluid combinations with very bad intentions, he's fun to watch. With all due respect to the many great fighters that preceded him, he seemed kind of ahead of his time as an offensive fighter.

Finally, I think 15 round fights really change the nature of fights. The additional time makes ring IQ that much more important. A fighter has more time to take in what his opponent is doing and make adjustments. And of course, the additional time makes conditioning that much more of a factor. In this fight, I could see Robinson taking his time to see what he was getting from Lamotta early on, but as the fight wore on, he became much more aggressive and ended up putting a savage beating on Lamotta. Nobody wants to see anyone get hurt, but I wonder if some of the cat and mouse of boxing is lost when you take away rounds.

[Ambling Alp II]

Robinson was obviously great and fun to watch. His hand speed, accuracy, and combinations were amazing. As for handing his hands low, there are a small % of fighters who could away with it. (such as Ali, Holmes, and Jones. To a lesser extent Tunney.) It worked for them.

LaMotta was a very tough fighter who gave it a great effort. Amazing that they fought six times.

[margaret thatcher]

One of the first things , maybe the first thing usually taught, is to put the hands up. And it's really an instinctive fighting reaction

Yet so so many great fighters hardly did it, and it's been almost the norm for a while

[Ambling Alp II]

If you have that rare ability to not have to, you probably shouldn't. Those fighters should what works best for them. For the vast majority of fighters, they should keep their gloves up.

[oogiebe]

Make a sandwich is what I learned.

[margaret thatcher]

What type do u reccomend

[oogiebe]

What type do u reccomend

Head sandwich on this topic. Italian with the works for eatin'!

[margaret thatcher]

Something like this then?

[banjo]

Robinson was a special fighter indeed.

I watched this fight recently myself and I forgot how short LaMotta was for a middleweight, he seemed to be a fighter blessed with an iron jaw but cursed with short height and reach, I believe he had problems with his hands too.

[oogiebe]

Something like this then?

[Ghost Town Ghost]

Nobody wants to see anyone get hurt, but I wonder if some of the cat and mouse of boxing is lost when you take away rounds.

Excellent observations, agree with everything stated in this post! I get the feeling that fighters were generally more intelligent, alert and aware in the 15 rd days, knowing that long distance possibility.

That makes me wonder, if fighters are supposedly so much better nowadays due to modern advantages (according to the fact/numbers type folks), then surely the fact that fights are much shorter now must adversely affect the modern boxer when in comparison?

[JC]

Robinson was a special fighter indeed.

I watched this fight recently myself and I forgot how short LaMotta was for a middleweight, he seemed to be a fighter blessed with an iron jaw but cursed with short height and reach, I believe he had problems with his hands too.

Made great use of the jab despite that.

[margaret thatcher]

It's the short guys who really need the jab the most tbh, work their way in much better

[jas80s]

This morning it was the second fight between Charles and Marciano. I had hoped to watch the first, but I couldn't find the whole fight, so I took another look at the second fight between the two.

Marciano might be the single best example of a fighter knowing himself and developing a style that worked for him. The absolute key to his success was that everything he did was geared toward what he did well. It was not pretty to look at, but it was incredibly efficient.

He had incredibly short arms, so every bit of movement he used in the ring appeared to be designed toward getting as close to his opponent as he could. The whole fight was fought in a phone booth, this couldn't be what Charles wanted, but it was what happened. Once inside, every one of Marciano's vices become virtues. His short arms allow his punches to get there first, his perfect leverage put maximum power on his shots, and he appeared to be able to launch his punches with very little coming back from Charles on the inside exchanges. Over and over again, get inside, and rip shots, with a level of conditioning that meant he never tired while his heavy punches inexorably sapped all of his opponents strength.

Time and again, he would load up on often wide punches even squaring himself up and yet miraculously, little if anything would ever be coming back at him?? Could it be simply that his opponents all sucked? I find it hard to believe since this particular fight was with Ezzard Charles, so rather there must be another reason that he wasn't routinely getting countered amidst his repeated flurries of punches.

It's ironic that a master class in controlling distance to create punching opportunities while limiting your opponents ability to find space to counter effectively would take place in such an awkward, often visually unappealing exhibition. But, that's what I take away from Marciano in the ring.

An ugly style, but just brutally efficient. Would it work on everybody? I'm sure it wouldn't, would it work on a surprising number of fighters? I have to believe it would.