Floyd Mayweather lashes out after being ranked behind Sugar Ray Leonard in list of best welterweights

[Paci]

This thread is an endless cycle

[gilgamesh]

Just to kinda switch it up, I'll add a bit of a hypothetical question. For those of us who have Floyd over Leonard...which I think is more of us than it's not. Do you think if Floyd were to come back and get say 1 or 2 more big wins somehow or even pretty good ones it could be him over Leonard?

Discuss

[Paci]

Boring chessmatch. Who wins? The one how makes the least mistakes during the fight. Ray is quick and sneaky with Floyd beign tactical and also having some tricks that he haven't pulled out yet.

[oogiebe]

Just to kinda switch it up, I'll add a bit of a hypothetical question. For those of us who have Floyd over Leonard...which I think is more of us than it's not. Do you think if Floyd were to come back and get say 1 or 2 more big wins somehow or even pretty good ones it could be him over Leonard?

Discuss

Nah. Leonard's record is still more meaty than Floyd's.

[gilgamesh]

Just to kinda switch it up, I'll add a bit of a hypothetical question. For those of us who have Floyd over Leonard...which I think is more of us than it's not. Do you think if Floyd were to come back and get say 1 or 2 more big wins somehow or even pretty good ones it could be him over Leonard?

Discuss

Nah. Leonard's record is still more meaty than Floyd's.

Let's say he came back to defeat Pac and Canelo again. Would that do it?

I mean, he won't. I'm just throwing it out there as a hypothetical

Now if he came back and beat say a Terence Crawford or something. That might do it, but that'd be truly surprising.

[oogiebe]

Just to kinda switch it up, I'll add a bit of a hypothetical question. For those of us who have Floyd over Leonard...which I think is more of us than it's not. Do you think if Floyd were to come back and get say 1 or 2 more big wins somehow or even pretty good ones it could be him over Leonard?

Discuss

Nah. Leonard's record is still more meaty than Floyd's.

Let's say he came back to defeat Pac and Canelo again. Would that do it?

I mean, he won't. I'm just throwing it out there as a hypothetical

Now if he came back and beat say a Terence Crawford or something. That might do it, but that'd be truly surprising.

I dunno. If Craw beats Spence it'll mean more. Problem is there are no Haglers; Hearns; Durans; etc for Floyd to have beaten.

[Beattiebeats]

Looking back at FMJ's resume I could see why he is having this argue. He fought very good fighters in multiple divisions.

Castillo, Gatti, Baldomir, ODLH, Hatton, Marquez, Mosley, Cotto, Alvarez , Maidana and Pacquiao.

Very few of them, if any are better than Duran, Hearns, and Hagler. In fact, NONE of them would even beat even the past it Hagler that Leonard fought.

Yes. The best chance would be for a peak Pacquiao, but I doubt it.

Taking it further I would argue that although the cleverest matchmaker was Leonard, the fact that all four fought each other is quite impressive in itself.

I wouldn't even want to mention Mayweather in the same breath. For sure he may be the greatest matchmaker and puller of strings we've ever seen, but that's it. Most of his interesting fights were the ones he should have lost (Castillo, DLH, Hatton and Maidana). etc.

If ever there was a protected boxer with an enormous chip on his shoulder...

i agree mate, Floyd cherry picked too often & not facing pacquiao in his prime was his biggest let down.

[world ranked]

Very few of them, if any are better than Duran, Hearns, and Hagler. In fact, NONE of them would even beat even the past it Hagler that Leonard fought.

Yes. The best chance would be for a peak Pacquiao, but I doubt it.

Taking it further I would argue that although the cleverest matchmaker was Leonard, the fact that all four fought each other is quite impressive in itself.

I wouldn't even want to mention Mayweather in the same breath. For sure he may be the greatest matchmaker and puller of strings we've ever seen, but that's it. Most of his interesting fights were the ones he should have lost (Castillo, DLH, Hatton and Maidana). etc.

If ever there was a protected boxer with an enormous chip on his shoulder...

i agree mate, Floyd cherry picked too often & not facing pacquiao in his prime was his biggest let down.

Or Pacquaio facing floyd in his prime. I bet for you there would be no disapointment had Pacquaio won there would be convo of Pacquaio not beating Floyd in his prime.

[Enlightened-One]

Funny that you think everything that comes out of promoters mouths is gospel..

So you didn’t read the interview transcripts or watch the YouTube videos I provided?

Manny ADMITTED to not wanted to be tested! It’s on video.

Even Manny’s OWN promoters ADMITTED it.

And I provided proof of ALL my claims.

It happened! No conspiracy theories.

Pacquiao ducked Mayweather in 2010.

If you think I’m lying, perform some research and provide evidence to refute my claims.

I’ll be waiting an eternity for your counter argument, because you’ll definitely be unable to disprove anything I’ve claimed.

[The Gratest]

If playing by your own definitive, every statistic and point must be overwhelming correct with no room for error, you haven't actually provided evidence that Manny Pac was a dirty drugs cheat. You've just provided speculation and conjecture.

[IKSRTFO]

Just to kinda switch it up, I'll add a bit of a hypothetical question. For those of us who have Floyd over Leonard...which I think is more of us than it's not. Do you think if Floyd were to come back and get say 1 or 2 more big wins somehow or even pretty good ones it could be him over Leonard?

Discuss

He'd have to beat Spence or Crawford. And even then, neither of them is Hearns or Hagler, but it helps.

[IKSRTFO]

Yes. The best chance would be for a peak Pacquiao, but I doubt it.

Taking it further I would argue that although the cleverest matchmaker was Leonard, the fact that all four fought each other is quite impressive in itself.

I wouldn't even want to mention Mayweather in the same breath. For sure he may be the greatest matchmaker and puller of strings we've ever seen, but that's it. Most of his interesting fights were the ones he should have lost (Castillo, DLH, Hatton and Maidana). etc.

If ever there was a protected boxer with an enormous chip on his shoulder...

i agree mate, Floyd cherry picked too often & not facing pacquiao in his prime was his biggest let down.

Or Pacquaio facing floyd in his prime. I bet for you there would be no disapointment had Pacquaio won there would be convo of Pacquaio not beating Floyd in his prime.

The difference is Pac could care less if you rate Leonard over him. He'll be happy where he's at. Floyd gets all agitated when ATGs are listed above him pointing to his record. He's an ATG for sure and earned his position, but his insecurity is irritating and very woman diva like.

[gilgamesh]

Just to kinda switch it up, I'll add a bit of a hypothetical question. For those of us who have Floyd over Leonard...which I think is more of us than it's not. Do you think if Floyd were to come back and get say 1 or 2 more big wins somehow or even pretty good ones it could be him over Leonard?

Discuss

He'd have to beat Spence or Crawford. And even then, neither of them is Hearns or Hagler, but it helps.

Beating a guy of that level at over 40 years of age would be huge though.

[Onetimeonly]

i agree mate, Floyd cherry picked too often & not facing pacquiao in his prime was his biggest let down.

Or Pacquaio facing floyd in his prime. I bet for you there would be no disapointment had Pacquaio won there would be convo of Pacquaio not beating Floyd in his prime.

The difference is Pac could care less if you rate Leonard over him. He'll be happy where he's at. Floyd gets all agitated when ATGs are listed above him pointing to his record. He's an ATG for sure and earned his position, but his insecurity is irritating and very woman diva like.

Manny knows he rates below Floyd.

[world ranked]

i agree mate, Floyd cherry picked too often & not facing pacquiao in his prime was his biggest let down.

Or Pacquaio facing floyd in his prime. I bet for you there would be no disapointment had Pacquaio won there would be convo of Pacquaio not beating Floyd in his prime.

The difference is Pac could care less if you rate Leonard over him. He'll be happy where he's at. Floyd gets all agitated when ATGs are listed above him pointing to his record. He's an ATG for sure and earned his position, but his insecurity is irritating and very woman diva like.

He might not be rated or better than Leonard but point even women diva-ish is a reasonable how can someone lose to a lightweight a be better than him. Though I do not agree with him I can see from a perspective of an ATG who never loss his diva-ish ways allows him the reasonable thought as wrong as we think he might be.

[Enlightened-One]

If playing by your own definitive, every statistic and point must be overwhelming correct with no room for error, you haven't actually provided evidence that Manny Pac was a dirty drugs cheat. You've just provided speculation and conjecture.

I've provided proof (interview transcripts from people employed by the promoters from both teams), coupled with an admission from Manny that was caught on video.

I am only arguing that Pacquiao rejected a career-high payday, because he didn't want to be tested, which resulted in him ducking Floyd Mayweather Jr. in 2010, despite the financials, the venue and the fight-date already agreed by both sides.

So why don't you be honest and stick to challenging my main point?

I guess it's because you can't?

Are you looking to employ red herrings, diversionary tactics intended to change the topic, in order to avoid discussing an inconvenient real-world truth that you find impossible to refute?

Are you that desperate to prevent people from being informed about Manny's embarrassing ducking of Floyd Mayweather Jr. in 2010?

Come on kid, do better!

This is so damn funny!

[gilgamesh]

I don't know how funny it is. The conversation you guys are having got well beyond old somewhere around 2012.

[Enlightened-One]

I don't know how funny it is. The conversation you guys are having got well beyond old somewhere around 2012.

You’re absolutely right!

Everything I’ve stated is old news that ALL knowledgable fight fans already knew about.

However, there are die-hard Pactards seriously upset about historical real-world facts!

They live in constant denial of Manny Pacquiao’s blatant ducking of Floyd Mayweather Jr. in 2010, because he was too damn scared to be tested for PED’s.

They like to pretend it didn’t happen, when it f#cking well did!

[IKSRTFO]

Or Pacquaio facing floyd in his prime. I bet for you there would be no disapointment had Pacquaio won there would be convo of Pacquaio not beating Floyd in his prime.

The difference is Pac could care less if you rate Leonard over him. He'll be happy where he's at. Floyd gets all agitated when ATGs are listed above him pointing to his record. He's an ATG for sure and earned his position, but his insecurity is irritating and very woman diva like.

Manny knows he rates below Floyd.

The thing is, Manny doesn't really care.

Floyd would probably get mad if you rate Sugar Ray Robinson over him. "You mean the Sugar Ray with 19 losses?"

[IKSRTFO]

Or Pacquaio facing floyd in his prime. I bet for you there would be no disapointment had Pacquaio won there would be convo of Pacquaio not beating Floyd in his prime.

The difference is Pac could care less if you rate Leonard over him. He'll be happy where he's at. Floyd gets all agitated when ATGs are listed above him pointing to his record. He's an ATG for sure and earned his position, but his insecurity is irritating and very woman diva like.

He might not be rated or better than Leonard but point even women diva-ish is a reasonable how can someone lose to a lightweight a be better than him. Though I do not agree with him I can see from a perspective of an ATG who never loss his diva-ish ways allows him the reasonable thought as wrong as we think he might be.

Duran wasn't a lightweight when he fought Leonard though. He was 2 years and 8 fights at welterweight. He had more fights at welterweight than Maidana did when he fought Floyd. So was Maidana, a fringe contender who gave Floyd all he could handle, a blown up lightweight?

[gilgamesh]

The difference is Pac could care less if you rate Leonard over him. He'll be happy where he's at. Floyd gets all agitated when ATGs are listed above him pointing to his record. He's an ATG for sure and earned his position, but his insecurity is irritating and very woman diva like.

He might not be rated or better than Leonard but point even women diva-ish is a reasonable how can someone lose to a lightweight a be better than him. Though I do not agree with him I can see from a perspective of an ATG who never loss his diva-ish ways allows him the reasonable thought as wrong as we think he might be.

Duran wasn't a lightweight when he fought Leonard though. He was 2 years and 8 fights at welterweight. He had more fights at welterweight than Maidana did when he fought Floyd. So was Maidana, a fringe contender who gave Floyd all he could handle, a blown up lightweight?

Maidana wasn't a fringe contender. He was a contender.

[Onetimeonly]

The difference is Pac could care less if you rate Leonard over him. He'll be happy where he's at. Floyd gets all agitated when ATGs are listed above him pointing to his record. He's an ATG for sure and earned his position, but his insecurity is irritating and very woman diva like.

Manny knows he rates below Floyd.

The thing is, Manny doesn't really care.

Floyd would probably get mad if you rate Sugar Ray Robinson over him. "You mean the Sugar Ray with 19 losses?"

So? Floyd should think he's the goat.

[The Gratest]

If playing by your own definitive, every statistic and point must be overwhelming correct with no room for error, you haven't actually provided evidence that Manny Pac was a dirty drugs cheat. You've just provided speculation and conjecture.

I've provided proof (interview transcripts from people employed by the promoters from both teams), coupled with an admission from Manny that was caught on video.

I am only arguing that Pacquiao rejected a career-high payday, because he didn't want to be tested, which resulted in him ducking Floyd Mayweather Jr. in 2010, despite the financials, the venue and the fight-date already agreed by both sides.

So why don't you be honest and stick to challenging my main point?

I guess it's because you can't?

Are you looking to employ red herrings, diversionary tactics intended to change the topic, in order to avoid discussing an inconvenient real-world truth that you find impossible to refute?

Are you that desperate to prevent people from being informed about Manny's embarrassing ducking of Floyd Mayweather Jr. in 2010?

Come on kid, do better!

This is so damn funny!

You're a very strange one aren't you?
You appear to think by referring to anyone who challenges you as 'a kid' that it somehow puts you in a position of superiority. It does the opposite, it shows up your obvious insecurity. However, as you wish to assume the status of others, i'll do the same to you.

Hi little girl
On the previous page your words were "Pacquiao ducked Mayweather Jr. during 2010, because he was a dirty drug cheat".
You then went on to challenge one and all to prove you wrong with anything you've written.

I've just pointed out that, all your videos and research and additional waffle has not actually provided any absolute concrete proof that Manny Pac was "a dirty drug cheat".
You've merely provided evidence that he refused a drugs test. There's nothing that actually shows him guilty of using drugs. You've just filled in the blanks yourself. Conjecture and speculation, as i've already pointed out.

Now over to you, little girl. Please provide the exact piece of concrete evidence to back up your claim that, without any doubt whatsoever, Manny Pac was "a dirty drugs cheat".

Oh, this is so much fun!

[Enlightened-One]

If playing by your own definitive, every statistic and point must be overwhelming correct with no room for error, you haven't actually provided evidence that Manny Pac was a dirty drugs cheat. You've just provided speculation and conjecture.

I've provided proof (interview transcripts from people employed by the promoters from both teams), coupled with an admission from Manny that was caught on video.

I am only arguing that Pacquiao rejected a career-high payday, because he didn't want to be tested, which resulted in him ducking Floyd Mayweather Jr. in 2010, despite the financials, the venue and the fight-date already agreed by both sides.

So why don't you be honest and stick to challenging my main point?

I guess it's because you can't?

Are you looking to employ red herrings, diversionary tactics intended to change the topic, in order to avoid discussing an inconvenient real-world truth that you find impossible to refute?

Are you that desperate to prevent people from being informed about Manny's embarrassing ducking of Floyd Mayweather Jr. in 2010?

Come on kid, do better!

This is so damn funny!

You're a very strange one aren't you?
You appear to think by referring to anyone who challenges you as 'a kid' that it somehow puts you in a position of superiority. It does the opposite, it shows up your obvious insecurity. However, as you wish to assume the status of others, i'll do the same to you.

Hi little girl
On the previous page your words were "Pacquiao ducked Mayweather Jr. during 2010, because he was a dirty drug cheat".
You then went on to challenge one and all to prove you wrong with anything you've written.

I've just pointed out that, all your videos and research and additional waffle has not actually provided any absolute concrete proof that Manny Pac was "a dirty drug cheat".
You've merely provided evidence that he refused a drugs test. There's nothing that actually shows him guilty of using drugs. You've just filled in the blanks yourself. Conjecture and speculation, as i've already pointed out.

Now over to you, little girl. Please provide the exact piece of concrete evidence to back up your claim that, without any doubt whatsoever, Manny Pac was "a dirty drugs cheat".

Oh, this is so much fun!

That’s a lot of words, intended to undermine minutae rather than my main argument.

You’re hoping that finding one tiny flaw, or highlighting something minor, will undermine my credibility and consequently my entire argument.

But your tactics will fail, because I’ve claimed at least twenty times in this thread that Pacquiao ducked Mayweather in 2010, because he was too damn scared to take the test!

No one can prove Pacquiao’s guilt of using PED’s because he has regularly refuses to be tested.

In fact, he even refused to provide his medical records during a lawsuit to prove he hadn’t used PED’s when he sued Mayweather.

He clearly has something to hide, but no one knows what that “something” is.

Regardless, Pacquiao ducked Mayweather Jr. in 2010, because he refused to take the damn test!

That is my entire argument!

Manny ducked Mayweather!

It happened. No human being can possibly claim otherwise.

I’m not willing to change the topic and discuss something else,

I will only defend the real-world facts relating to Pacquiao ducking Mayweather.

[margaret thatcher]

Pacquiao ducked Mayweather Jr. in 2010.

It happened. There’s nothing anybody can do about it.

Yet Pactards fanboys keep insisting Floyd kept running from Manny, whilst choosing to ignore real world facts no one can dispute.

Are you seriously claiming Pacquiao didn’t duck Mayweather in 2010?

I don't think regardless of what ever proof you have i refused to believe that a guy ducked someone only later to fight them in any case. It defeats the definition of ducking.

Pacquiao ducked Mayweather Jr. during 2010, because he was a dirty drug cheat

oh , no! manny the dirty cheat, i can no longer be a fan of the fraud