Why Vitali Klitschko is Great

[vitalyjohnson]

He was a dominant champion who made the hall of fame in his first year of eligibility and lead his class with the most votes. What more can you ask for? A great for sure and one that would be a tough night for any heavyweight champion

You got it.

Vitali Klitschko had an outstanding career. Held the WBC belt while his brother had the other two. Fought the same level of competition as Wlad.

WBC Champ 5 years
9 title defenses
45-2 41 KOs
Never down
Dominated fights, won almost every round on score cards
Was ahead on cards for two losses
Both losses stoppage due to injury
Fought highest level of competition
Boxing HOF

Also he inspired a one guy to create 4 accounts on this forum and to praise him there.

I have one account but BoxRec has a notorious bad rep for banning people for expressing their opinion. Google it.

[oogiebe]

He was a dominant champion who made the hall of fame in his first year of eligibility and lead his class with the most votes. What more can you ask for? A great for sure and one that would be a tough night for any heavyweight champion

You got it.

Vitali Klitschko had an outstanding career. Held the WBC belt while his brother had the other two. Fought the same level of competition as Wlad.

WBC Champ 5 years
9 title defenses
45-2 41 KOs
Never down
Dominated fights, won almost every round on score cards
Was ahead on cards for two losses
Both losses stoppage due to injury
Fought highest level of competition
Boxing HOF

Also he inspired a one guy to create 4 accounts on this forum and to praise him there.

LMFAO!!!

[vitalyjohnson]

You got it.

Vitali Klitschko had an outstanding career. Held the WBC belt while his brother had the other two. Fought the same level of competition as Wlad.

WBC Champ 5 years
9 title defenses
45-2 41 KOs
Never down
Dominated fights, won almost every round on score cards
Was ahead on cards for two losses
Both losses stoppage due to injury
Fought highest level of competition
Boxing HOF

Also he inspired a one guy to create 4 accounts on this forum and to praise him there.

LMFAO!!!

Can anyone back the claim that Wlad was a much better heavy than Vit?

Looks like they have competive resumes.

Vlad fought the best fighter Lennox Lewis between the two and made a good showing of himself.

[vitalyjohnson]

Also he inspired a one guy to create 4 accounts on this forum and to praise him there.

LMFAO!!!

Can anyone back the claim that Wlad was a much better heavy than Vit?

Looks like they have competive resumes.

Vit fought the best fighter Lennox Lewis between the two and made a good showing of himself.

[BroughtonRulesRefuge]

- Tried my best to let this thread die a natural death, but just the mention of Vitali or Wlad enough gather the Saad Sacks, Poots, and other likewise emasculated males in a venomous group hugfest.

Here were the Boxrec rankings as of September 5th, 2010 while Vitali, Wlad, and David Haye were all putting together their fights. Keep in mind that Boxrec is the largest of the few ranking orgs that rank more than 10 or 15 fighters in a division. This a typical ranking in the Ks active years together clearly demonstrable of their literally clearing out most all top fighters more than any other era.

The (notes) are mine of course:

1. Wlad

2. Vitali

3. Haye (already backed out of one signed and sealed contract and refused recent 50/50 offer by the Klitschkos, signing to defend against Audley Harrison in spite of repeated denials that he was even in negotiations)
4. Adamek (pending to allow cuts to heal, but apparently fighting Maddalone in Dec)
5. Chagaev (beat badly by Wlad and currently Haye’s mandatory)
6. Povetkin (refused to sign negotiated agreement to challenge in Wlad’s last defense, thus losing his 2 yr long mandatory ranking, not to mention his trainer, Teddy Atlas, says Povetkin is not yet ready to challenge for the title.)
7. Valuev (interesting deal was almost put together against Vitali, but out into next year with left shoulder/wrist surgery)
8. Peter (beat badly by Wlad 2x/Vitali 1x)
9. Thompson (beat badly by Wlad with no following)
10. Chambers (beat badly by Wlad and still rebuilding)
11. Arreola (beat badly by Vitali and still rebuilding)
12. Dimitrenko (new EBU champ, but turned down Klitschko offers, maybe building into a much bigger promotion in the next year of two)
13. JCGomez (beat badly by Vitali and a last ditch opponent for now)
14. Sexton (busy being knocked out by Chisora)
15. Boytsov (maybe in the future, but only 24 and shaking off the rust after coming back from hand surgery, now is not his time, maybe a year or two in a bigger promotion)
16. Austin (beat badly by Wlad with no following)
17. Helenius (very promising prospect recently breaking into fringe contender. Maybe a year or two away in a much bigger promotion)
18. Solis (chubby growing into a blimp with promoter problems looking like he’s moving to challenge for the WBA cheese belt, not the Klitschkos)
19. Pianeta (Pinata? Who dat?)
20. T Ibragimov (The lesser talented of the Russian Iggys, his cousin already lost a shutout against Wlad)
21. Sosnowski (beat badly by Vitali and rebuilding against Dimitrenko)
22. Ustinov (undefeated Russian Bigfoot monster promoted by Ks and wants a Kbro. I’m guessing Vitali’s retirement fight if he makes it past Briggs and can’t sign Haye or Valuev)
23. Holyfield (Oh, brother, where art thou buried? Jeez…..)
24. Platov (who? See Pinata!)
25. Johnson (beat worse than badly by Vitali……..please, watching Vitali try to stuff a giant squash into a blender would be better stuffing for a Saturday night turkey……..nevermore…….nevermore…….)

So, thusly informed, now say HELLO to one Shannon The Cannon Briggs, lifelong asthmaholic, part time wastrel, yet all while breaking the all time first round KO record first officially recorded by Jack Dempsey in his all time tear through the heavy division. Briggs has 31 first round KOs(now at 37,) + another but for failing a post fight drug test, probably a positive test result for ganja. Briggs is unabashedly Jamaican after all.

Briggs a strange one alright. He was a dynamic, charismatic young personality who won the 'Dream' “Lineal” heavyweight title with a dubious decision over the nearing 50 yr old Big George Foreman, then was knocked out in a ferocious slugfest against WBC champ Lennox Lewis in his very next bout(not exactly knocked out but rather corkscrewing himself to the canvas after missing a haymaker.) Instead of rebuilding, he partied hardy and let his training and weight go, thus was written off as a wasted talent.

In spite of all the above shortcomings, many years later he managed to renew "The Dream" when Briggs lifted the WBO title from the then highly regarded Siarhei Liakhovich with a Hail Mary last second knockout in the 12th round, a title that Briggs promptly dropped in his first defense to the Sulton "Iggy" that Wlad knocked off. He then retired to hit the all you can eat buffets for 2 yrs before coming back hard with 4 straight 1st rd Kos.

Now Briggs finds himself square in the middle in his 3rd opportune "Dream " when Haye, Adamek, and Povetkin all shut down and beat strategic retreats rather than to fight the brothers in a losing cause. As the “2x” champ with an established name, Briggs should bring in the business once the promotion starts touting his KO record.

Poor Briggs ended up in the hospital for at least a week or two looking like Billy Collins with broken orbital as I recall adding to his misery, the poster child of your own miseries

[vitalyjohnson]

- Tried my best to let this thread die a natural death, but just the mention of Vitali or Wlad enough gather the Saad Sacks, Poots, and other likewise emasculated males in a venomous group hugfest.

Here were the Boxrec rankings as of September 5th, 2010 while Vitali, Wlad, and David Haye were all putting together their fights. Keep in mind that Boxrec is the largest of the few ranking orgs that rank more than 10 or 15 fighters in a division. This a typical ranking in the Ks active years together clearly demonstrable of their literally clearing out most all top fighters more than any other era.

The (notes) are mine of course:

1. Wlad

2. Vitali

3. Haye (already backed out of one signed and sealed contract and refused recent 50/50 offer by the Klitschkos, signing to defend against Audley Harrison in spite of repeated denials that he was even in negotiations)
4. Adamek (pending to allow cuts to heal, but apparently fighting Maddalone in Dec)
5. Chagaev (beat badly by Wlad and currently Haye’s mandatory)
6. Povetkin (refused to sign negotiated agreement to challenge in Wlad’s last defense, thus losing his 2 yr long mandatory ranking, not to mention his trainer, Teddy Atlas, says Povetkin is not yet ready to challenge for the title.)
7. Valuev (interesting deal was almost put together against Vitali, but out into next year with left shoulder/wrist surgery)
8. Peter (beat badly by Wlad 2x/Vitali 1x)
9. Thompson (beat badly by Wlad with no following)
10. Chambers (beat badly by Wlad and still rebuilding)
11. Arreola (beat badly by Vitali and still rebuilding)
12. Dimitrenko (new EBU champ, but turned down Klitschko offers, maybe building into a much bigger promotion in the next year of two)
13. JCGomez (beat badly by Vitali and a last ditch opponent for now)
14. Sexton (busy being knocked out by Chisora)
15. Boytsov (maybe in the future, but only 24 and shaking off the rust after coming back from hand surgery, now is not his time, maybe a year or two in a bigger promotion)
16. Austin (beat badly by Wlad with no following)
17. Helenius (very promising prospect recently breaking into fringe contender. Maybe a year or two away in a much bigger promotion)
18. Solis (chubby growing into a blimp with promoter problems looking like he’s moving to challenge for the WBA cheese belt, not the Klitschkos)
19. Pianeta (Pinata? Who dat?)
20. T Ibragimov (The lesser talented of the Russian Iggys, his cousin already lost a shutout against Wlad)
21. Sosnowski (beat badly by Vitali and rebuilding against Dimitrenko)
22. Ustinov (undefeated Russian Bigfoot monster promoted by Ks and wants a Kbro. I’m guessing Vitali’s retirement fight if he makes it past Briggs and can’t sign Haye or Valuev)
23. Holyfield (Oh, brother, where art thou buried? Jeez…..)
24. Platov (who? See Pinata!)
25. Johnson (beat worse than badly by Vitali……..please, watching Vitali try to stuff a giant squash into a blender would be better stuffing for a Saturday night turkey……..nevermore…….nevermore…….)

So, thusly informed, now say HELLO to one Shannon The Cannon Briggs, lifelong asthmaholic, part time wastrel, yet all while breaking the all time first round KO record first officially recorded by Jack Dempsey in his all time tear through the heavy division. Briggs has 31 first round KOs(now at 37,) + another but for failing a post fight drug test, probably a positive test result for ganja. Briggs is unabashedly Jamaican after all.

Briggs a strange one alright. He was a dynamic, charismatic young personality who won the 'Dream' “Lineal” heavyweight title with a dubious decision over the nearing 50 yr old Big George Foreman, then was knocked out in a ferocious slugfest against WBC champ Lennox Lewis in his very next bout(not exactly knocked out but rather corkscrewing himself to the canvas after missing a haymaker.) Instead of rebuilding, he partied hardy and let his training and weight go, thus was written off as a wasted talent.

In spite of all the above shortcomings, many years later he managed to renew "The Dream" when Briggs lifted the WBO title from the then highly regarded Siarhei Liakhovich with a Hail Mary last second knockout in the 12th round, a title that Briggs promptly dropped in his first defense to the Sulton "Iggy" that Wlad knocked off. He then retired to hit the all you can eat buffets for 2 yrs before coming back hard with 4 straight 1st rd Kos.

Now Briggs finds himself square in the middle in his 3rd opportune "Dream " when Haye, Adamek, and Povetkin all shut down and beat strategic retreats rather than to fight the brothers in a losing cause. As the “2x” champ with an established name, Briggs should bring in the business once the promotion starts touting his KO record.

Poor Briggs ended up in the hospital for at least a week or two looking like Billy Collins with broken orbital as I recall adding to his misery, the poster child of your own miseries

Irgo, Vit was a badass deserving recognition as a great heavy?

[gilgamesh]

Also he inspired a one guy to create 4 accounts on this forum and to praise him there.

LMFAO!!!

Can anyone back the claim that Wlad was a much better heavy than Vit?

Looks like they have competive resumes.

Vlad fought the best fighter Lennox Lewis between the two and made a good showing of himself.

Can't spell the name right. Can't even mention the right brother who fought Lennox. I'm beginning to think you're not a real smart guy.

[vitalyjohnson]

LMFAO!!!

Can anyone back the claim that Wlad was a much better heavy than Vit?

Looks like they have competive resumes.

Vlad fought the best fighter Lennox Lewis between the two and made a good showing of himself.

Can't spell the name right. Can't even mention the right brother who fought Lennox. I'm beginning to think you're not a real smart guy.

Smart enough to know Vitali is an awesome heavy.

[Cojimar 1946]

Actually, Dempsey and Jeffries fought most of the top guys from their eras. Jeffries fought a draw with and beat Choynski, Sharkey (2x), Fitzsimmons (2x), Corbett (2x), and Ruhlin (2x). Sure he could have fought others but it dwarfs what Klitschko did.

Take a look at who Dempsey beat before he even fought for the title: Fulton, Morris, Miske, Brennan. Beat Willard, and Firpo. Should have fought Wills, but he certainly beat several serious contenders.

Corrie Sanders was a fringe contender at best. He was not highly regarded at all. Only thing he has is the KO over Glassjaw.
Samuel Peter is really the best Klitschko ever beat? wow.

You can nitpick anyone. You have to grasp at straws for anything that Klitschko did.

With all due respect to Dempsey I don't think the likes of Morris, Fulton, Firpo were very good. I'm not sure I would pick them over the likes of Larry Donald H2H

The three best of Dempsey's era were Wills, Greb, and Tunney in my opinion. He didn't fight two of them and Tunney beat him twice

If he would have fought Greb, you (and many others) would have looked at Greb's weight and gave Dempsey zero credit. If we are throwing size out the window, then give Dempsey credit for beating Gibbons, Carpentier, and Levinsky. Miske was a very good fighter; is even in the HOF which people like to use when it suits their argument. Morris was big, which automatically makes him good. Same with Willard.
Bottom line is that Dempsey beat most of the best of his era. As did Jeffries. Klitschko did not.

Had Dempsey fought Greb I think he would lose so no I probably wouldn't give him credit for losing because fighters aren't generally given much credit for their losses. Dempsey gets some credit for beating Gibbons at least because he was somewhat proven against heavyweights despite being a smaller man. But he wasn't as good as Greb. Morris and Willard were pretty average, probably worse than most of Vitali's opponents.
Like Vitali, Dempsey didn't beat any of what I consider his eras big 3-Greb, Tunney, Wills
He also missed out on numerous other guys such as Weinart, Norfolk, Renault, etc. So no, he didn't clean out his era even if we exclude his most formidable rivals. And he lost to Willie Meehan.

The best 3 guys of Vitali's era aside from Vitali were probably Lewis, Wladimir Klitschko, and Povetkin but after that it gets extremely subjective because the top fighters generally didn't face each other. So, we don't really know how good they were relative to each other.

[Ambling Alp II]

Had Dempsey defended the title against Greb, he would have beaten him. And you have given him no credit. Greb was not one of the big 3 heavyweights of the era. Not sure where in the world you are getting this.

Byrd was a better fighter than Povetkin and beat klitschko. He was 0-2 in the only big fights of his career. Didn't even go the distance in either. That doesn't happen to great fighters.
We also have film and can see that Klitschko was clearly not a special fighter. Byrd was a better fighter than Povetkin and guess what? He beat Klitschko,

[DrDuke]

Had Dempsey defended the title against Greb, he would have beaten him. And you have given him no credit. Greb was not one of the big 3 heavyweights of the era. Not sure where in the world you are getting this.

Byrd was a better fighter than Povetkin and beat klitschko. He was 0-2 in the only big fights of his career. Didn't even go the distance in either. That doesn't happen to great fighters.
We also have film and can see that Klitschko was clearly not a special fighter. Byrd was a better fighter than Povetkin and guess what? He beat Klitschko,

Lol, Alpy keeps fireing. Byrd was whooped by Povetkin and both Klitschkos, bruh.

[Tuan_Jim]

Had Dempsey defended the title against Greb, he would have beaten him. And you have given him no credit. Greb was not one of the big 3 heavyweights of the era. Not sure where in the world you are getting this.

Byrd was a better fighter than Povetkin and beat klitschko. He was 0-2 in the only big fights of his career. Didn't even go the distance in either. That doesn't happen to great fighters.
We also have film and can see that Klitschko was clearly not a special fighter. Byrd was a better fighter than Povetkin and guess what? He beat Klitschko,

Lol, Alpy keeps fireing. Byrd was whooped by Povetkin and both Klitschkos, bruh.

Chris Byrd was nearly 40 years old when he lost to Povetkin. His speed and reflexes had been in decline for several years.

To say he was whooped by Vitali is so dishonest as to be unworthy of serious discussion.

[DrDuke]

Had Dempsey defended the title against Greb, he would have beaten him. And you have given him no credit. Greb was not one of the big 3 heavyweights of the era. Not sure where in the world you are getting this.

Byrd was a better fighter than Povetkin and beat klitschko. He was 0-2 in the only big fights of his career. Didn't even go the distance in either. That doesn't happen to great fighters.
We also have film and can see that Klitschko was clearly not a special fighter. Byrd was a better fighter than Povetkin and guess what? He beat Klitschko,

Lol, Alpy keeps fireing. Byrd was whooped by Povetkin and both Klitschkos, bruh.

Chris Byrd was nearly 40 years old when he lost to Povetkin. His speed and reflexes had been in decline for several years.

To say he was whooped by Vitali is so dishonest as to be unworthy of serious discussion.

To describe with a verb "to beat" that situation, when a fighter loses the vast majority of rounds and eventually wins because of an opponent's injury, is even more dishonest, if not just stupid.

[Tuan_Jim]

Lol, Alpy keeps fireing. Byrd was whooped by Povetkin and both Klitschkos, bruh.

Chris Byrd was nearly 40 years old when he lost to Povetkin. His speed and reflexes had been in decline for several years.

To say he was whooped by Vitali is so dishonest as to be unworthy of serious discussion.

To describe with a verb "to beat" that situation, when a fighter loses the vast majority of rounds and eventually wins because of an opponent's injury, is even more dishonest, if not just stupid.

No it isn't, it's factual. Byrd caused the injury with his punches, as Vitali himself admitted. Vitali punched Byrd, Byrd kept fighting; Byrd punched Vitali, Vitali quit.

To be unable to accept this over some childish man-love for Vitali Klitachko is worse than stupid.

[Onetimeonly]

Vitali knew he should have finished out Byrd. Thats why he was so desperate to continue with Lewis with his face torn off.

[DrDuke]

Chris Byrd was nearly 40 years old when he lost to Povetkin. His speed and reflexes had been in decline for several years.

To say he was whooped by Vitali is so dishonest as to be unworthy of serious discussion.

To describe with a verb "to beat" that situation, when a fighter loses the vast majority of rounds and eventually wins because of an opponent's injury, is even more dishonest, if not just stupid.

No it isn't, it's factual. Byrd caused the injury with his punches, as Vitali himself admitted. Vitali punched Byrd, Byrd kept fighting; Byrd punched Vitali, Vitali quit.

To be unable to accept this over some childish man-love for Vitali Klitachko is worse than stupid.

I'm telling that without any love towards Vitali and I've never had a one.

I'm just going with the sound logic that being significantly outworked, outscored and bossed can't be equaled to beating somebody. It's closer to being beaten. This logic is plain as f*ck.

[Onetimeonly]

It isn't the same as being dominated but it's also not the same as a bad decision. Serious injury, he could have saw it through.

[Ambling Alp II]

It was a terrible fight.
Klitschko quit. He simply wasn't tough enough.
That's a loss. That is being honest.
It's dishonest when people try to blow it off and/or bring up the judges scoring.
This is boxing. If you quit or get stopped, the scorecards are irrelevant. We could go on forever listing fights where a guy lost when he was ahead on the scorecards. Nobody cares about those situations. But with Klitschko, people keep trying to excuse him. It's BS.

[DrDuke]

It was a terrible fight.
Klitschko quit. He simply wasn't tough enough.
That's a loss. That is being honest.
It's dishonest when people try to blow it off and/or bring up the judges scoring.
This is boxing. If you quit or get stopped, the scorecards are irrelevant. We could go on forever listing fights where a guy lost when he was ahead on the scorecards. Nobody cares about those situations. But with Klitschko, people keep trying to excuse him. It's BS.

Here comes the most honest truepenny.

As if someone was excusing him and trying to present it as a win. The point was, that he wasn't literally beaten, while it was Byrd who was getting whooped.

[Ambling Alp II]

you and others from time to time have tried to sugarcoat this. He was "literally beaten". That is a fact.

[gilgamesh]

It isn't the same as being dominated but it's also not the same as a bad decision. Serious injury, he could have saw it through.

Jesus Chavez for instance. Had the same injury basically from like the 2nd round on against Erik Morales, and he still fought the entire fight basically with only his left arm, and made it competitive.

[DrDuke]

you and others from time to time have tried to sugarcoat this. He was "literally beaten". That is a fact.

Almost no word from you is a fact. You talk about honesty, while you crook other people's words all time. Like you just did in another thread - after you were accused in not giving a credit to modern fighters on example of Bonavena and Haye, you claimed that you had been called biased for calling Bonavena's era better than Haye's one. Not even close to reality. The same with Klitschkos. You will never give them credit and you'll deny all the good of them and you will call other people excusing them, when other people are just being objective and not willing to excuse Klitschkos at all. You know what, f*ck such "facts".

[littlepug]

It isn't the same as being dominated but it's also not the same as a bad decision. Serious injury, he could have saw it through.

Jesus Chavez for instance. Had the same injury basically from like the 2nd round on against Erik Morales, and he still fought the entire fight basically with only his left arm, and made it competitive.

Yep, basically it’s the fighters that set the bar for what’s possible in the ring and fans judge them accordingly, so if a fighter retires in his corner with a broken jaw then he will be judged harshly as we’ve seen many overcome that injury and win so that’s where the bar is set, same goes for any injury or obstacle put in a fighters way, if it’s been overcome by just one boxer then that’s the standard we judge them by.

[oogiebe]

Vit wasn't great. Period. This post topic should be banned. This is iteration no. 1,051.

[Onetimeonly]

It isn't the same as being dominated but it's also not the same as a bad decision. Serious injury, he could have saw it through.

Jesus Chavez for instance. Had the same injury basically from like the 2nd round on against Erik Morales, and he still fought the entire fight basically with only his left arm, and made it competitive.

Yep, basically it’s the fighters that set the bar for what’s possible in the ring and fans judge them accordingly, so if a fighter retires in his corner with a broken jaw then he will be judged harshly as we’ve seen many overcome that injury and win so that’s where the bar is set, same goes for any injury or obstacle put in a fighters way, if it’s been overcome by just one boxer then that’s the standard we judge them by.

Nobody should ever judge a fighter for saying enough, but you can't pretend it's a win when you do. Byrd would have.

Heck, Paul George played half a season with both rotators jacked.