So if Spence not a HOF. Crawford can't be either right?

[gregregegg]

I also think Crawford is probably better than Spence, I accept he has 100 percent got more “achievements” on paper than Spence, I do not however belive he has had a better career than Spence. Especially since moving to 147...,

look at what they have both done since Crawford finnished at 140, and then remember that Spence nearly fornicating killed himself in a car crash in the middle of that...

[Enlightened-One]

I have no idea if Top Rank has submitted any offers to Team Spence. This is not a fair question since obviously this isn't purchasing a car at a lot so one doesn't just submit and offer. Negotiations have to take place first and I'm sure that Top Rank has asked the pbc to negotiate with them for this fight.

It's not the pbc's role to promote top rank fighters. Maybe that part of my statement was a bit silly.

Then you’ve just admitted that Top Rank hasn’t submitted any offers to Team Spence.

And you’ve also admitted that it wasn’t the PBC’s duty to promoter a Top Rank fighter like Terence Crawford.

Then why in earth have you claimed Errol Spence Jr. has ducked Terence Crawford?

Perhaps I’ve misunderstood you, but what do you believe constitutes “ducking”?

The world isn't black and white. Come on. You can read very well what I am saying.

Let's assume that fighter A wants to fight fighter B yes? Ok team A contacts team B and asks them for a meeting to discuss the potential matchup. The request is refused. Team A then sends an inquiry asking when would fighter B be available, would his team like to copromote the event, what sorta purse is required, are there any other special conditions that need to be met in order for the fight to be made. No response is sent. Representative of team A calls a member of team B three weeks later and asks if the email was received and gets a "we'll get back to you". So no offer was made but unless you are completely retarded then you can see bright as day what took place here.

What you've just written would be a compelling argument if you could provide proof of all your claims sourced by both sides of the proverbial street, but you can't.

No one can!

In fact, I'm pretty sure that even Bob Arum hasn't claimed most of the things you're asserting.

If you want a decent counter-argument, based on facts that can easily be verified from the proverbial horse's mouth, is that Crawford wanted 60% of the purse split to face Spence Jr., even though Bud is the commercially smaller name.

There are videos of him saying this

We also know for certain that Crawford appreciated the consequences of his actions when he extended his contract with Top Rank (due to the $4m guarantee) in preference to aligning himself with the PBC to engage in legacy fights.

For Crawford, the pay cheque was more important to him than legacy.

This is easily verifiable too, because both the media and this forum anticipated the consequences of Bud's decision nine months prior to him putting pen to paper!

We also know that Crawford has expressed his disinterest in facing other PBC fighters like Shawn Porter. He previously only said that he wanted to fight Pacquiao.

There are videos and interview transcripts of him (and members of his entourage) confirming this.

And let's not forget Arum's annual promises to deliver the Crawford-Pacquiao bout every single year since 2015. Nothing more needs to be said on this point, does it?

I could go on-and-on-and-on...

Unlike your claims, everything I've written is exceptionally easy to verify!

I'll look forward to reading your JK Rowling fictional/fantasy reply, but please make it more interesting next time by mentioning wizards, goblins, giants and witches.

[H8Usernames]

You and your nonsense. Terrence Crawford was desperate to make this fight. He even went so far that he personally called Errol Spence. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes ... -says/amp/

If you want to be blind then be blind, fine by me. Either Errol didn't want that fight or his team didn't and he decided not to take charge of his team since keeping the 0 in the loss column etc would be more profitable and he knew that he couldn't win.

[gregregegg]

You and your nonsense. Terrence Crawford was desperate to make this fight. He even went so far that he personally called Errol Spence. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes ... -says/amp/

If you want to be blind then be blind, fine by me. Either Errol didn't want that fight or his team didn't and he decided not to take charge of his team since keeping the 0 in the loss column etc would be more profitable and he knew that he couldn't win.

Commercially that should be a 70-30 ish split in spences favour, craw was asking for 60 percent.... I don’t give a fornicate I’d he called 5 times a day, if he is asking for reverse splits he isn’t desperate for it. If he is signing with bob he isn’t desperate for it, if he is doing anything but sending a contract with a heavy lean to Spence he is not desperate for it.

[Enlightened-One]

You and your nonsense.

Were any of my claims factually inaccurate or difficult to verify?

If the answer is no, then please remain silent.

[world ranked]

I'd say that the best win between the two was against Yuriorkis Gamboa. Perhaps the entry requirements for that HOF are pretty low but I'd say neither man deserves to be in any such hall. With Crawford though he isn't just his own victim but also Spence's who ducked him and the pbc's that wouldn't let him fight their guys as well as Arum's who really isn't much of a promoter any more.

Bottom line though neither is HOF worthy.

Gamboa is the best win on Crawford's resume yes.

Porter and Danny Garcia are bigger wins than that.

They both have KO victories over Kell Brook to their credit, and Crawford got it done faster so he gets a slight edge there.

Is there any consideration into beating a better version of Kell Brook?

[world ranked]

Are you aware of Crawford’s accomplishments during his time competing below 147lbs (i.e. prior to September 2017)?

If not, then you should ask for this thread to be locked and also ask for your account to be permanently closed.

You can’t be a legitimate boxing fan and ask those sort of questions or perform bizarre comparisons.

Crawford's achievements as a Lightweight are the best of his career. Those are the best opponents he beat. Even though he became Undisputed at 140 it was a bigger accomplishment on paper than it was in actuality as he really had nobody particularly meaningful standing in his way to take a title from.

Josh Taylor who just accomplished the same feat had a harder road to travel to do so, and his accomplishment is more impressive because of it.

Crawford is a three-weight world champion and also unified all the belts at 140lbs.

Crawford has also faced more world champions and also engaged in more world title fights.

And if Crawford and Taylor fought tomorrow, you’d probably adhere to the mainstream masses by favouring the American to beat the Scot.

No one from this forum has criticised Crawford more than I have, but even I realise he’s already a dead-cert first-ballot Hall-of-Famer, regardless whatever happens during the remainder of his career.

Your perception of who would win is irrelevant. Josh Taylor 140 run of unification is better regardless of who we think would win H2H.

[world ranked]

I'd say that the best win between the two was against Yuriorkis Gamboa. Perhaps the entry requirements for that HOF are pretty low but I'd say neither man deserves to be in any such hall. With Crawford though he isn't just his own victim but also Spence's who ducked him and the pbc's that wouldn't let him fight their guys as well as Arum's who really isn't much of a promoter any more.

Bottom line though neither is HOF worthy.

Gamboa moving up is the best win out of both resume. You need to stop.

Maybe not. Gamboa was something really special though.

Who do you think is the best win? It's a pretty slim talent pool in my opinion.

Postol has Gamboa ever been good above 130.

[Bandog]

Iv said this befor, being multi weight champ only realy means anything to me if you move up and be the smaller man. If you just weight bully low then grow up divs then it means nothing to me.

Has Crawford ever been significantly lighter than an opponent in the ring? Mabey he was slightly outweighed vs Brook and horn, has Crawford been significantly bigger in the ring, every 135lb fight and most 140lb fights...

Should Crawford get extra credit for spending half his career as a welter beating up lightweights?

I'm not gonna discount his achievements at 140 or below, but he definitely hasnt' tested himself against the more dangerous bigger guys that he could fight.

Spence or the guys at 154 would be legit challenges for him.

Now for the record, I think Crawford is very talented, and I'd favor him to beat all the same people Spence has beaten probably in more impressive fashion, but unless you do it, and all we can ever do is guess how good you could've been, then it doesn't amount to much.

That's really the biggest shame. I DO think he's better than Spence. I DO think he'd beat Spence. But meanwhile he's just sitting around, and letting Spence pass him by, and have a more meaningful career than him.

Although I think the fight is 50-50, the purse split should be 60/40 in favor of Spence. His PPV numbers show he deserves that. Not being a 50/50 split is what is holding Crawford to agreeing. Crawford needs Spence more than the other way around.

[gilgamesh]

I'd say that the best win between the two was against Yuriorkis Gamboa. Perhaps the entry requirements for that HOF are pretty low but I'd say neither man deserves to be in any such hall. With Crawford though he isn't just his own victim but also Spence's who ducked him and the pbc's that wouldn't let him fight their guys as well as Arum's who really isn't much of a promoter any more.

Bottom line though neither is HOF worthy.

Gamboa is the best win on Crawford's resume yes.

Porter and Danny Garcia are bigger wins than that.

They both have KO victories over Kell Brook to their credit, and Crawford got it done faster so he gets a slight edge there.

Is there any consideration into beating a better version of Kell Brook?

Some, but I think it's debatable just how much better the version that Spence was as opposed to Crawford. Everyone acted as if he was just shot based on 2 losses going into the Crawford bout. I don't think he was. I think he was as ready as he'd ever been pretty much.