Do you know what, lads?

[handsofstone]

Don't let the Internet ruin you. Still plenty of good, competitive fights at every level.

[ironbeard]

Don't let the Internet ruin you. Still plenty of good, competitive fights at every level.

Precisely.

How about we focus on the great fight and card less than 60 hours away?

[Muttley]

Same tbh,was reading about some unbeaten UK prospect recently and realised that I`d never heard of him,I`d have know his inside leg measurement a decade ago.
Still appreciate the skill and courage but the mismatches and predictability have worn me out.

[THEBUTCH]

Taylor v Ramirez for the undisputed world championship ????

That fight must have restored some faith the game mickey1975 ?

[mickey1975]

Taylor v Ramirez for the undisputed world championship ????

That fight must have restored some faith the game mickey1975 ?

Yes, but that IFL interview knocked a bit out again today. It's a complete mess.

[THEBUTCH]

Haven't seen it and probably won't. Don't need those plonkers at IFL taking any edge of a tumultuous and historic occasion.

That fight could sit with many of the great world title fights of years gone by.

[Ruthless-RKO]

Taylor v Ramirez for the undisputed world championship ????

That fight must have restored some faith the game mickey1975 ?

Wasn't even broadcast in the UK. (apart from FITE)

[THEBUTCH]

Disgraceful

It was still an excellent fight and us boxing fans have that rarest of things...an undisputed world champion

[stujones]

I think British boxing is going through a transition / lull - Matchroom are really boring me - its all about Eddie these days - press conferences / interviews to promote press conferences / announcements and the announcements aren't really eye catching. Think he has too many fingers in too many pies and is not pushing the British boys enough.

Olympic level fighters should be fighting for a world title within a 4 year cycle - okay Josh Kelly got found out - but what about the likes of Cordina, Buatsi, Joyce etc - It shouldn't still be the likes of Selby getting the world title eliminator it should be Cordina. Cordina vs Selby in an all Welsh affair after Selby beat Burns would have been a lovely fight. How has Robert Krasniki got an interim world title ahead of Buatsi - Krasniki was considered a limited opponent for Cleverley years ago.

Everything is moving too slow in the UK and we are churning out the same old faces - Chisora etc and not really testing the talent.

Not just matchroom but Warren is the same, but with Warren he needs to promote his fights - half to time I forget they are on.

[Ruthless-RKO]

I think British boxing is going through a transition / lull - Matchroom are really boring me - its all about Eddie these days - press conferences / interviews to promote press conferences / announcements and the announcements aren't really eye catching. Think he has too many fingers in too many pies and is not pushing the British boys enough.

Olympic level fighters should be fighting for a world title within a 4 year cycle - okay Josh Kelly got found out - but what about the likes of Cordina, Buatsi, Joyce etc - It shouldn't still be the likes of Selby getting the world title eliminator it should be Cordina. Cordina vs Selby in an all Welsh affair after Selby beat Burns would have been a lovely fight. How has Robert Krasniki got an interim world title ahead of Buatsi - Krasniki was considered a limited opponent for Cleverley years ago.

Everything is moving too slow in the UK and we are churning out the same old faces - Chisora etc and not really testing the talent.

Not just matchroom but Warren is the same, but with Warren he needs to promote his fights - half to time I forget they are on.

In 2015/16, UK had around 12 World champions, some Regualar or interim, but majority WORLD champions.

Most them chamoions are actually now retired, or nearly retired.

As I said earlier, it is a transitional period, but I agree the 2016 boys should be in world title contention.

Level of opponents are not good enough and then when the boys are stepping up, they get found out.

[stujones]

Yes I agree Ruthless KO - with the transition period there was some great fights out there and the "changing of the guard" should have been done in a more ruthless way.

We should have had Taylor vs Burns after Taylor beat O Hara Davies. Crolla shouldn't have lost to Linares, he should have lost to Luke Campbell (and now likewise it should be Campbell vs Cordina) - but instead we generally keep the names of the old guard a loft by putting them on shows around the world and keeping them "in contention". E.g. Stephen Smith basically retired through lack of activity and just not getting opportunity - why wasn't Cordina fighting him 18 months ago.

The Uk amateurs are not like the amateurs of previous generations - they are highly experienced, semi professional fighters.

Without sounding horrible - in generations gone by ex world champions would have either retired on a high or retired either face first for a count of 10 or after a losing effort in a war where they say "sod this game" - but we've have Ricky Burns still "knocking on the door" "one fight away from a world title", same for the likes of Derick Chisora, Crolla a couple of years back while was realistically never going to win a world title again was still being hyped as "one fight away from a title" - Selby etc. Without trying to sound horrible - our fighters should be going out more like how Bellew did.

At welter / Light middle - it shouldn't be Khan, Brook and Liam Smith in the top 3 now - it should be the class of 2016.

Whilst in four years time I should be Frazier Clarke vs the current world champion - i can still imagine Derick Chisora would be in the pathway and closer to a world title!

[maverick23]

I think British boxing is going through a transition / lull - Matchroom are really boring me - its all about Eddie these days - press conferences / interviews to promote press conferences / announcements and the announcements aren't really eye catching. Think he has too many fingers in too many pies and is not pushing the British boys enough.

Olympic level fighters should be fighting for a world title within a 4 year cycle - okay Josh Kelly got found out - but what about the likes of Cordina, Buatsi, Joyce etc - It shouldn't still be the likes of Selby getting the world title eliminator it should be Cordina. Cordina vs Selby in an all Welsh affair after Selby beat Burns would have been a lovely fight. How has Robert Krasniki got an interim world title ahead of Buatsi - Krasniki was considered a limited opponent for Cleverley years ago.

Everything is moving too slow in the UK and we are churning out the same old faces - Chisora etc and not really testing the talent.

Not just matchroom but Warren is the same, but with Warren he needs to promote his fights - half to time I forget they are on.

I agree with a lot of what you’re saying but don’t necessarily agree that the Olympians should be fighting for world titles inside of 4 years.

Khan took 5 years (and took a loss) whilst having the support/backing to bring big names and average world champions over to the U.K.

Degale, Billy Joe, Gavin took 7 years each to fight for a world title. Billy Joe in particular had really good matchmaking on his way to a title shot. AJ took 4 years but was against a poor world champ. Similar with Okolie although he fought for a vacant title but he was matched well up to then going through the titles.

Not all Olympians are have the ability to ever fight for a world title and some need more time (like a Billy Joe).

From the most recent crop of Olympians Kelly and Fowler have lost already and are in deep divisions, Joyce has been built well except his recent inactivity, Okolie, after some dodgy performances, has been built almost perfectly, Cordina/Buatsi haven’t boxed enough (although I think Cordina will really suffer with a lack of pop in his punches) whilst the others (Muhammad Ali and Ashfaq) haven’t done much.

[stujones]

I know what you are saying Maverick but if you look at it historically....US Olympic prospects often do it within a 4 year cycle.

Now Khan was 17, just a boy and he did it in 5. ...and even then there were complaints about his opponents. Terry Marsh was truly knocking on the door at 5 years and it was much harder to win a world title in those days

Yes some might need to be built slower....I would argue that Saunders and DeGale especially were ready well before they got their title fights....others well if they arent at least tested....then time to let them go. Not every great amateur will make it as a pro...but if you havent found out in 4 years....then something has gone wrong. I honestly believe Ricky Hatton, with his fast lane lifestyle was in decline before he fought for a proper world title. He could have easily fought for a proper version as early as 2001. He might not have beaten Kostya Tszyu in 2001, but Shamba Mitchell?

When I think of great amateurs like Errol Christie and Tom Stalker....got found out in the pros, no shame but I dont think any amount of nurturing would have helped really. Some of ours arent even close and now they have so much experience prior to turning over. Anthony Fowler should not be talked about as a novicy prospect when you look at his amateur experience...he shouldn't be talked about in the same breath as Sam Eggington now, he really should have already fought Liam Smith for the #1 in the division, but he is miles of that. Joyce fought a very solid debutant from Lewinson he should have moved quicker really.

History usually shows a world champion is usually made following a 4-5 year professional apprenticeship....Look at the last golden era of Heavyweights....Lewis, Tyson, Holyfield, Bowe (if you want to be pedantic you can throw Ray Mercer in there also). We are way off that and I dont know why we step them up quicker

[Loftgroov]

The last time I went to a small hall show to support a friend it cost about hundred quid all in for us both. The opponent didn't try. It was crap. Then she hit me with "we could have gone away this weekend with that".

You can go away for the weekend for £100? A romantic evening in a Travelodge?

[margaret thatcher]

aj won a title 2.5 years after turning pro, has to be the fastest brit to do it in a while

[mickey1975]

The last time I went to a small hall show to support a friend it cost about hundred quid all in for us both. The opponent didn't try. It was crap. Then she hit me with "we could have gone away this weekend with that".

You can go away for the weekend for £100? A romantic evening in a Travelodge?

Amsterdam. Two nights on the ferry and a day of her chonging in Dam. £80.

[maverick23]

I know what you are saying Maverick but if you look at it historically....US Olympic prospects often do it within a 4 year cycle.

Now Khan was 17, just a boy and he did it in 5. ...and even then there were complaints about his opponents. Terry Marsh was truly knocking on the door at 5 years and it was much harder to win a world title in those days

Yes some might need to be built slower....I would argue that Saunders and DeGale especially were ready well before they got their title fights....others well if they arent at least tested....then time to let them go. Not every great amateur will make it as a pro...but if you havent found out in 4 years....then something has gone wrong. I honestly believe Ricky Hatton, with his fast lane lifestyle was in decline before he fought for a proper world title. He could have easily fought for a proper version as early as 2001. He might not have beaten Kostya Tszyu in 2001, but Shamba Mitchell?

When I think of great amateurs like Errol Christie and Tom Stalker....got found out in the pros, no shame but I dont think any amount of nurturing would have helped really. Some of ours arent even close and now they have so much experience prior to turning over. Anthony Fowler should not be talked about as a novicy prospect when you look at his amateur experience...he shouldn't be talked about in the same breath as Sam Eggington now, he really should have already fought Liam Smith for the #1 in the division, but he is miles of that. Joyce fought a very solid debutant from Lewinson he should have moved quicker really.

History usually shows a world champion is usually made following a 4-5 year professional apprenticeship....Look at the last golden era of Heavyweights....Lewis, Tyson, Holyfield, Bowe (if you want to be pedantic you can throw Ray Mercer in there also). We are way off that and I dont know why we step them up quicker

It’s only the very elite amateurs that are fighting for world titles inside of 4 years. There’s probably only a handful that do it each cycle. I may be in the minority that think this way but I don’t remember a time where there’s been as much depth in the world champions (in the 4 belt era). There are very poor world champs nowadays whilst 10/15/20 years ago there were always a good few that could be beaten.

Khan was a terrific fighter hence reaching the Olympics at 17. Bar the stupid matchmaking with Prescott (which I’m still bitter about as it was PPV) he was matched fairly well. Although I would have preferred it if he’d gone down the British title route.

The one thing that strikes me is that too amateurs turning pro often fought a lot more. Mayweather fought 18 times in 2 years post Olympics before winning his first title, Wlad had fought over 30 times in his first 4 years.

I don’t think new pros need that kind of activity but they need to keep them more active than they have been. Buatsi at 14 fights in 5 years simply isn’t enough and similar with Cordina. Kelly would have benefitted from being more active too.

Re: Degale and Saunders I think Degale was ready earlier but not so sure on Billy Joe. He had good close learning fights against Ryder, Eubank which served him well against Lee.

Hatton may well have beaten Sharmba Mitchell but he was a very average world champ. I’m not sure whether Hatton was on the decline when he fought Kostya but the fact he was being kept active before then would have helped his profile and kept him out of trouble. He ballooned up far more in weight when he became world champ and was just fighting twice a year.

I agree with what you’re saying on Christie/Stalker and Fowler. I think if Fowler hadn’t been beaten by Fitzgerald then he’d be fighting Smith about now (only with a crowd though). Again he needs to be more active.

[coghaugen11]

Christie was never the same after going to Kronk to spar for six weeks. He more than held his own in gym wars with the best in the world there, but came back and punch resistance had completely gone!

[coghaugen11]

Manny Steward said in 83 that Christie and Mark Breland were the two most talented fighters he’d ever seen.

(By the end of his coaching time he was saying McClellan was the most talented he’d ever worked with.)

[coghaugen11]

As Calzaghe was adapting against Kessler, Steward said on commentary ‘You look at the guys he’s beaten, this might be the greatest fighter of all-time right here.’

[coghaugen11]

The last time I went to a small hall show to support a friend it cost about hundred quid all in for us both. The opponent didn't try. It was crap. Then she hit me with "we could have gone away this weekend with that".

You can go away for the weekend for £100? A romantic evening in a Travelodge?

What I was thinking. Probably right as well.

[KiwiRider]

I know what you are saying Maverick but if you look at it historically....US Olympic prospects often do it within a 4 year cycle.

Now Khan was 17, just a boy and he did it in 5. ...and even then there were complaints about his opponents. Terry Marsh was truly knocking on the door at 5 years and it was much harder to win a world title in those days

Yes some might need to be built slower....I would argue that Saunders and DeGale especially were ready well before they got their title fights....others well if they arent at least tested....then time to let them go. Not every great amateur will make it as a pro...but if you havent found out in 4 years....then something has gone wrong. I honestly believe Ricky Hatton, with his fast lane lifestyle was in decline before he fought for a proper world title. He could have easily fought for a proper version as early as 2001. He might not have beaten Kostya Tszyu in 2001, but Shamba Mitchell?

When I think of great amateurs like Errol Christie and Tom Stalker....got found out in the pros, no shame but I dont think any amount of nurturing would have helped really. Some of ours arent even close and now they have so much experience prior to turning over. Anthony Fowler should not be talked about as a novicy prospect when you look at his amateur experience...he shouldn't be talked about in the same breath as Sam Eggington now, he really should have already fought Liam Smith for the #1 in the division, but he is miles of that. Joyce fought a very solid debutant from Lewinson he should have moved quicker really.

History usually shows a world champion is usually made following a 4-5 year professional apprenticeship....Look at the last golden era of Heavyweights....Lewis, Tyson, Holyfield, Bowe (if you want to be pedantic you can throw Ray Mercer in there also). We are way off that and I dont know why we step them up quicker

It’s only the very elite amateurs that are fighting for world titles inside of 4 years. There’s probably only a handful that do it each cycle. I may be in the minority that think this way but I don’t remember a time where there’s been as much depth in the world champions (in the 4 belt era). There are very poor world champs nowadays whilst 10/15/20 years ago there were always a good few that could be beaten.

Khan was a terrific fighter hence reaching the Olympics at 17. Bar the stupid matchmaking with Prescott (which I’m still bitter about as it was PPV) he was matched fairly well. Although I would have preferred it if he’d gone down the British title route.

The one thing that strikes me is that too amateurs turning pro often fought a lot more. Mayweather fought 18 times in 2 years post Olympics before winning his first title, Wlad had fought over 30 times in his first 4 years.

I don’t think new pros need that kind of activity but they need to keep them more active than they have been. Buatsi at 14 fights in 5 years simply isn’t enough and similar with Cordina. Kelly would have benefitted from being more active too.

Re: Degale and Saunders I think Degale was ready earlier but not so sure on Billy Joe. He had good close learning fights against Ryder, Eubank which served him well against Lee.

Hatton may well have beaten Sharmba Mitchell but he was a very average world champ. I’m not sure whether Hatton was on the decline when he fought Kostya but the fact he was being kept active before then would have helped his profile and kept him out of trouble. He ballooned up far more in weight when he became world champ and was just fighting twice a year.

I agree with what you’re saying on Christie/Stalker and Fowler. I think if Fowler hadn’t been beaten by Fitzgerald then he’d be fighting Smith about now (only with a crowd though). Again he needs to be more active.

Nice posts Stu & Mav.

[Glass Joe]

The last time I went to a small hall show to support a friend it cost about hundred quid all in for us both. The opponent didn't try. It was crap. Then she hit me with "we could have gone away this weekend with that".

You can go away for the weekend for £100? A romantic evening in a Travelodge?

What I was thinking. Probably right as well.

Small hall boxing isn't really for the hard core fans, it's more to support your mate/family member against someone who is there to most likely just cover up for 4-6 rounds. Goodwin put on some decent upper card fights on their regular york hall shows, but they never have tv there so its a behind closed door thing, unless you want to pay eric for his footage.

[margaret thatcher]

ya, there are the small hall lovers who act like it is for the hardcore fan and somehow tops the bigger stuff, but ive never really been into it. it's basically mismatch city with unambitious opponents and few kos

[stujones]

Thought I would re bring this post back up to mention another thing that seems to be annoying me with Boxing presently, and especially British boxing.

The length of time it seems to take to get fights over the line..... Obviously we had the Fury vs Joshua debarcle - I mean this was "agreed" over a year ago and still no date was finalised..... okay we can maybe state that the fans might not have been clued up on everything re the arbitration but it lost a lot of momentum and the anticipation of "its close, its close, its close" talk.

But there is surely "no excuses" why Joshua vs Usyk hasn't dotted the I's and crossed the t's - why is there still no confirmed date - just likely dates and very likely venue. When / if it does cross the line - it then becomes less of an event. I am already less enthused by it - just "fight" already is my view. I could add - why the eff is it happening in September - both are overdue a fight - why couldn't have been in Dubai when the Fury vs Joshua fight was scheduled - but fair enough it needed to be in London - but less of the details about what Usyk's manager had for dinner and how longer it took him after dinner to crap it out - just let us know when its signed and then promote it like crazy when it has been signed. I'm already fatigued by it. None of this "Usyk will be Joshua's next opponent, its so close to be announced, just waiting to confirm a date and finalising minor terms etc" - Just don't mention that it is close to being signed until it IS signed.

It was the same with Saunders vs Canelo - we were getting like 70%, following week - 80%, then 90%.... then agreed in principal, then signed but awaiting site fee..... by the time it was signed I was bored. The only thing that sparked it then was the ring size saga. I was much more buzzed for the build up to Smith vs Canelo cos it was quite a short thing before it was signed. Likewise the ill fated Fury vs Wilder 3 was better promoted for boxing it was like - negotiations, signed, tv appearance, press conference all in the space of a couple of weeks - with social media that's how big fights should be promoted.

Now we have the dull Parker vs Chisora 2 - "its on" but no clear date, unclear on the venue etc - lets to sign it. don't announce it as "on" untill it is signed. Announce it as on, following week see the fighters in their first face to face conference.

When I think of some of the true biggest fights of all time - yes there were talk, but it was really only "rumours". We had Mayweather and Pacquiao meeting in a basketball match, but then we heard next to NOTHING from either camp (yes journo's were debating amongst themselves) and there were whispers off course there was - but there was nothing from TMT or Team Pac that "its close" or "waiting site fee" etc - UNTILL the I's were dotted and t's crossed. Yes they had a long build up, but at least we knew it was ON with a clear venue and clear date - in Britain we are getting the build up to a build up!

McGregor vs Mayweather the same and that had so many barriers. Yes journo's were reporting it was on, we even heard from Nevada about the sanctioning etc - but still TMT were very very quiet until it was signed. Yes I think McGregor might have said a few words but there was a mystique there until Mayweather confirmed it was signed. There wasn't that "its going to be soon", "announcement of an announcement" type crap. Eddie is the worse culprit, but Warren is similar.