Brit's that made the best debut in the US

[Menty]

Khan had a good run stateside starting with Malignaggi up to and including Judah

[KiwiRider]

This was an amazing result that Laing didn't capitalise on. But in retrospect, given Kirkland's unique style, was it as big an upset as they said at the time?

Nobody in the States had even heard of Laing prior to his 10-rounder with Duran in 1982, whereas Duran had defined himself as one of the greatest fighters of all time (and certainly one of the most savage). Nevertheless, Duran was going through a sticky patch after his shocking surrender to Sugar Ray Leonard in New Orleans, moving up to light-middleweight and kidding his way through a 15-rounder with Wilfred Benitez, who essentially outclassed him. Promoter Don King looked around for another 'name' opponent and sealed a mouthwatering showdown between Duran and San Antonio's unbeaten Tony Ayala. Laing was merely a sharpener for Duran prior to Ayala but Laing's manager, Mickey Duff, worked out that Duran struggled against movers (as Sugar Ray Leonard worked it out) and Laing possessed the movement and boxing ability to pull off an unbelievable win and scuttle the Ayala decider.

Interesting
As a non Brit I hadn't heard of Kirkland either. Duran was "the man" even way down here in New Zealand.
Boxing coverage back then was scetchy. You kinda got televised what you got. We relied on the Beeb mostly through our national broadcaster.
Saw plenty of Duran after that fight, never saw Kirkland on our screens again
I just remember it as an entertaining fight, and I watched it again when the clip I posted found its way onto YouTube.

[bennie]

This was an amazing result that Laing didn't capitalise on. But in retrospect, given Kirkland's unique style, was it as big an upset as they said at the time?

Nobody in the States had even heard of Laing prior to his 10-rounder with Duran in 1982, whereas Duran had defined himself as one of the greatest fighters of all time (and certainly one of the most savage). Nevertheless, Duran was going through a sticky patch after his shocking surrender to Sugar Ray Leonard in New Orleans, moving up to light-middleweight and kidding his way through a 15-rounder with Wilfred Benitez, who essentially outclassed him. Promoter Don King looked around for another 'name' opponent and sealed a mouthwatering showdown between Duran and San Antonio's unbeaten Tony Ayala. Laing was merely a sharpener for Duran prior to Ayala but Laing's manager, Mickey Duff, worked out that Duran struggled against movers (as Sugar Ray Leonard worked it out) and Laing possessed the movement and boxing ability to pull off an unbelievable win and scuttle the Ayala decider.

Thanks for that. What a shame we never got to see Ayala Duran though….

Yes, Duran-Ayala would have been ferocious and there's no doubt in my mind that Duran slowly chews up Ayala, much as he did Davey Moore. Duran loved the fighters who came to him. I should have mentioned in my earlier post that Laing, despite his obvious boxing ability, was given no chance in the States and in this country. Boxing News editor Harry Mullan laid into Mickey Duff in his column when the match was made and readers also barracked Duff in their letters, with some forecasting another Johnny Owen disaster. Duff must have enjoyed proving everyone wrong.

[JamesPhilips]

Nobody in the States had even heard of Laing prior to his 10-rounder with Duran in 1982, whereas Duran had defined himself as one of the greatest fighters of all time (and certainly one of the most savage). Nevertheless, Duran was going through a sticky patch after his shocking surrender to Sugar Ray Leonard in New Orleans, moving up to light-middleweight and kidding his way through a 15-rounder with Wilfred Benitez, who essentially outclassed him. Promoter Don King looked around for another 'name' opponent and sealed a mouthwatering showdown between Duran and San Antonio's unbeaten Tony Ayala. Laing was merely a sharpener for Duran prior to Ayala but Laing's manager, Mickey Duff, worked out that Duran struggled against movers (as Sugar Ray Leonard worked it out) and Laing possessed the movement and boxing ability to pull off an unbelievable win and scuttle the Ayala decider.

Thanks for that. What a shame we never got to see Ayala Duran though….

Yes, Duran-Ayala would have been ferocious and there's no doubt in my mind that Duran slowly chews up Ayala, much as he did Davey Moore. Duran loved the fighters who came to him. I should have mentioned in my earlier post that Laing, despite his obvious boxing ability, was given no chance in the States and in this country. Boxing News editor Harry Mullan laid into Mickey Duff in his column when the match was made and readers also barracked Duff in their letters, with some forecasting another Johnny Owen disaster. Duff must have enjoyed proving everyone wrong.

Really? It's funny how publications and fans get all upset and emotional about a decent high level match, even if it's reckoned to be a mismatch, yet week after week after week no one pipes up about prospects battering totallly outclassed,, journeymen. Recently, look at the hiding Bennett got from Babic..... and for what kind of purse? Also Laing was hardly a face first brawler, he didn't get hit much, his most dangerous opponents were Stella and Greens....

Bennie, you obviously know your onions very well - the Duran fight was before my time - speaking honestly what did you think of the match at the time? Also do you consider it contextually a bigger upset than Honeyghan - Curry? Many thanks

[bennie]

Thanks for that. What a shame we never got to see Ayala Duran though….

Yes, Duran-Ayala would have been ferocious and there's no doubt in my mind that Duran slowly chews up Ayala, much as he did Davey Moore. Duran loved the fighters who came to him. I should have mentioned in my earlier post that Laing, despite his obvious boxing ability, was given no chance in the States and in this country. Boxing News editor Harry Mullan laid into Mickey Duff in his column when the match was made and readers also barracked Duff in their letters, with some forecasting another Johnny Owen disaster. Duff must have enjoyed proving everyone wrong.

Really? It's funny how publications and fans get all upset and emotional about a decent high level match, even if it's reckoned to be a mismatch, yet week after week after week no one pipes up about prospects battering totallly outclassed,, journeymen. Recently, look at the hiding Bennett got from Babic..... and for what kind of purse? Also Laing was hardly a face first brawler, he didn't get hit much, his most dangerous opponents were Stella and Greens....

Bennie, you obviously know your onions very well - the Duran fight was before my time - speaking honestly what did you think of the match at the time? Also do you consider it contextually a bigger upset than Honeyghan - Curry? Many thanks

I thought that Duran was through after his loss to Wilfred Benitez in January 1982 in Las Vegas. The old drive deserted him and he was easily outboxed by Benitez over 15 rounds, even though the scorecards were ludicrously close at the finish. Duran then sat on the sidelines, piling on the weight and feeling sorry for himself as his manager, his co-trainers and even his interpreter turned their backs and walked away after Benitez - at the age of 31, Duran was an 'old' fighter with a long, hard career behind him.
The Laing fight followed in September 1982 and while I thought that Duran would win, I expected Laing to go the full 10 rounds. (There was a time when fighters celebrated just doing that against Duran.) I read the result on Ceefax and felt sadness that a once great fighter now looked completely dead and buried, although one of the judges somehow voted for Duran. Don King dumped Duran afterwards, saying he had no time for losers. Duran was forced to beg Bob Arum for a last chance and a couple of months later, Arum stuck him on the undercard to the thrilling Aaron Pryor-Alexis Arguello fight in Miami in November 1982. Arum stuck him on last. Duran laboured to outpoint our own Jimmy Batten in front of a few hundred supporters.
Duran found some of his old form when he stopped Pipino Cuevas before a huge crowd in Los Angeles in January 1983 but few people expected him to beat Davey Moore six months later in Madison Square Garden for the WBA light-middleweight title. (Graham Houston wrote in Boxing News that Moore would win "emphatically".) The legend lived on.

PS: I don't regard Laing's win over Duran as a bigger upset than Honeyghan-Curry because of Duran's display in the earlier Benitez fight and because there was nothing at stake on the night.

[JamesPhilips]

Yes, Duran-Ayala would have been ferocious and there's no doubt in my mind that Duran slowly chews up Ayala, much as he did Davey Moore. Duran loved the fighters who came to him. I should have mentioned in my earlier post that Laing, despite his obvious boxing ability, was given no chance in the States and in this country. Boxing News editor Harry Mullan laid into Mickey Duff in his column when the match was made and readers also barracked Duff in their letters, with some forecasting another Johnny Owen disaster. Duff must have enjoyed proving everyone wrong.

Really? It's funny how publications and fans get all upset and emotional about a decent high level match, even if it's reckoned to be a mismatch, yet week after week after week no one pipes up about prospects battering totallly outclassed,, journeymen. Recently, look at the hiding Bennett got from Babic..... and for what kind of purse? Also Laing was hardly a face first brawler, he didn't get hit much, his most dangerous opponents were Stella and Greens....

Bennie, you obviously know your onions very well - the Duran fight was before my time - speaking honestly what did you think of the match at the time? Also do you consider it contextually a bigger upset than Honeyghan - Curry? Many thanks

I thought that Duran was through after his loss to Wilfred Benitez in January 1982 in Las Vegas. The old drive deserted him and he was easily outboxed by Benitez over 15 rounds, even though the scorecards were ludicrously close at the finish. Duran then sat on the sidelines, piling on the weight and feeling sorry for himself as his manager, his co-trainers and even his interpreter turned their backs and walked away after Benitez - at the age of 31, Duran was an 'old' fighter with a long, hard career behind him.
The Laing fight followed in September 1982 and while I thought that Duran would win, I expected Laing to go the full 10 rounds. (There was a time when fighters celebrated just doing that against Duran.) I read the result on Ceefax and felt sadness that a once great fighter now looked completely dead and buried, although one of the judges somehow voted for Duran. Don King dumped Duran afterwards, saying he had no time for losers. Duran was forced to beg Bob Arum for a last chance and a couple of months later, Arum stuck him on the undercard to the thrilling Aaron Pryor-Alexis Arguello fight in Miami in November 1982. Arum stuck him on last. Duran laboured to outpoint our own Jimmy Batten in front of a few hundred supporters.
Duran found some of his old form when he stopped Pipino Cuevas before a huge crowd in Los Angeles in January 1983 but few people expected him to beat Davey Moore six months later in Madison Square Garden for the WBA light-middleweight title. (Graham Houston wrote in Boxing News that Moore would win "emphatically".) The legend lived on.

PS: I don't regard Laing's win over Duran as a bigger upset than Honeyghan-Curry because of Duran's display in the earlier Benitez fight and because there was nothing at stake on the night.

thanks great feedback. My first big fight Duran experience was the Iran Barkley match. I was of course well aware of Roberto's history, but he was considered shot by then. Then again he was considered shot when he went in against Davey Moore as you say. I remember a prediction saying that Barkley will be able to say he knocked out legends Duran and Hearns in the same year. But it was a vintage Duran performance. He looked so much smaller and undefined in muscle compared to the very big muscled Barkley.... what a fight. Its amazing that Duran would have to beg anyone for a fight especially when compared to today's boxing landscape when promitors will get any half known name a fight. Boxing was much more of a closed shop and controlled by promoters in those days.

I had totally forgotten that Batten boxed Duran and went the distance as well..... cheers for the info

[coghaugen11]

And guess what two 16 year old individuals were in attendance that incredible night at MSG?

Yep, you got it.

Michael Gerard Tyson
Christopher Livingstone Eubank

Cus D’Amato and Adonis Torres had got them in for free.

Moore was supposed to steamroll Duran.

[coghaugen11]

Really? It's funny how publications and fans get all upset and emotional about a decent high level match, even if it's reckoned to be a mismatch, yet week after week after week no one pipes up about prospects battering totallly outclassed,, journeymen. Recently, look at the hiding Bennett got from Babic..... and for what kind of purse? Also Laing was hardly a face first brawler, he didn't get hit much, his most dangerous opponents were Stella and Greens....

Bennie, you obviously know your onions very well - the Duran fight was before my time - speaking honestly what did you think of the match at the time? Also do you consider it contextually a bigger upset than Honeyghan - Curry? Many thanks

I thought that Duran was through after his loss to Wilfred Benitez in January 1982 in Las Vegas. The old drive deserted him and he was easily outboxed by Benitez over 15 rounds, even though the scorecards were ludicrously close at the finish. Duran then sat on the sidelines, piling on the weight and feeling sorry for himself as his manager, his co-trainers and even his interpreter turned their backs and walked away after Benitez - at the age of 31, Duran was an 'old' fighter with a long, hard career behind him.
The Laing fight followed in September 1982 and while I thought that Duran would win, I expected Laing to go the full 10 rounds. (There was a time when fighters celebrated just doing that against Duran.) I read the result on Ceefax and felt sadness that a once great fighter now looked completely dead and buried, although one of the judges somehow voted for Duran. Don King dumped Duran afterwards, saying he had no time for losers. Duran was forced to beg Bob Arum for a last chance and a couple of months later, Arum stuck him on the undercard to the thrilling Aaron Pryor-Alexis Arguello fight in Miami in November 1982. Arum stuck him on last. Duran laboured to outpoint our own Jimmy Batten in front of a few hundred supporters.
Duran found some of his old form when he stopped Pipino Cuevas before a huge crowd in Los Angeles in January 1983 but few people expected him to beat Davey Moore six months later in Madison Square Garden for the WBA light-middleweight title. (Graham Houston wrote in Boxing News that Moore would win "emphatically".) The legend lived on.

PS: I don't regard Laing's win over Duran as a bigger upset than Honeyghan-Curry because of Duran's display in the earlier Benitez fight and because there was nothing at stake on the night.

thanks great feedback. My first big fight Duran experience was the Iran Barkley match. I was of course well aware of Roberto's history, but he was considered shot by then. Then again he was considered shot when he went in against Davey Moore as you say. I remember a prediction saying that Barkley will be able to say he knocked out legends Duran and Hearns in the same year. But it was a vintage Duran performance. He looked so much smaller and undefined in muscle compared to the very big muscled Barkley.... what a fight. Its amazing that Duran would have to beg anyone for a fight especially when compared to today's boxing landscape when promitors will get any half known name a fight. Boxing was much more of a closed shop and controlled by promoters in those days.

I had totally forgotten that Batten boxed Duran and went the distance as well..... cheers for the info

There is no structure in boxing anymore.

[JamesPhilips]

I thought that Duran was through after his loss to Wilfred Benitez in January 1982 in Las Vegas. The old drive deserted him and he was easily outboxed by Benitez over 15 rounds, even though the scorecards were ludicrously close at the finish. Duran then sat on the sidelines, piling on the weight and feeling sorry for himself as his manager, his co-trainers and even his interpreter turned their backs and walked away after Benitez - at the age of 31, Duran was an 'old' fighter with a long, hard career behind him.
The Laing fight followed in September 1982 and while I thought that Duran would win, I expected Laing to go the full 10 rounds. (There was a time when fighters celebrated just doing that against Duran.) I read the result on Ceefax and felt sadness that a once great fighter now looked completely dead and buried, although one of the judges somehow voted for Duran. Don King dumped Duran afterwards, saying he had no time for losers. Duran was forced to beg Bob Arum for a last chance and a couple of months later, Arum stuck him on the undercard to the thrilling Aaron Pryor-Alexis Arguello fight in Miami in November 1982. Arum stuck him on last. Duran laboured to outpoint our own Jimmy Batten in front of a few hundred supporters.
Duran found some of his old form when he stopped Pipino Cuevas before a huge crowd in Los Angeles in January 1983 but few people expected him to beat Davey Moore six months later in Madison Square Garden for the WBA light-middleweight title. (Graham Houston wrote in Boxing News that Moore would win "emphatically".) The legend lived on.

PS: I don't regard Laing's win over Duran as a bigger upset than Honeyghan-Curry because of Duran's display in the earlier Benitez fight and because there was nothing at stake on the night.

thanks great feedback. My first big fight Duran experience was the Iran Barkley match. I was of course well aware of Roberto's history, but he was considered shot by then. Then again he was considered shot when he went in against Davey Moore as you say. I remember a prediction saying that Barkley will be able to say he knocked out legends Duran and Hearns in the same year. But it was a vintage Duran performance. He looked so much smaller and undefined in muscle compared to the very big muscled Barkley.... what a fight. Its amazing that Duran would have to beg anyone for a fight especially when compared to today's boxing landscape when promitors will get any half known name a fight. Boxing was much more of a closed shop and controlled by promoters in those days.

I had totally forgotten that Batten boxed Duran and went the distance as well..... cheers for the info

There is no structure in boxing anymore.

True but I belive its fairer on the fighters and they're getting paid better than ever.

[jameswilson]

Naz.

Had to be the biggest hyped British fighter making his debut,remember the ad where naz Don the flip off the ship and landed on the docks with his gym bag lol it was the Adidas advert.

The fight wasn't that bad either lol had my heart in mouth a few times cause I didn't want naz to lose(probably the only fight I didn't want him to lose lol)

Wasn't bad? Jesus wept your hard to please.

[TheGman]

Naz.

Had to be the biggest hyped British fighter making his debut,remember the ad where naz Don the flip off the ship and landed on the docks with his gym bag lol it was the Adidas advert.

The fight wasn't that bad either lol had my heart in mouth a few times cause I didn't want naz to lose(probably the only fight I didn't want him to lose lol)

Wasn't bad? Jesus wept your hard to please.

Hahaha I said that with tongue in cheek hence the 'lol',it was a brilliant fight mate

[olij999]

Has this thread been ruined by eubank comments yet? If not, it’s in the post.

For me, froch.

Froch's US debut was a low key outing against Henry Porras in 2005. Were you thinking of the Jermain Taylor fight in 2009?

[Ruthless-RKO]

Has this thread been ruined by eubank comments yet? If not, it’s in the post.

For me, froch.

Froch's US debut was a low key outing against Henry Porras in 2005. Were you thinking of the Jermain Taylor fight in 2009?

I did mention at the start of the thread, can use world title debuts

[Steveh583]

Has this thread been ruined by eubank comments yet? If not, it’s in the post.

For me, froch.

Froch's US debut was a low key outing against Henry Porras in 2005. Were you thinking of the Jermain Taylor fight in 2009?

ah yeah right you are. i watched that fight as well

[coghaugen11]

That Porras fight was in Hollywood and made him an international superstar.

[kp13]

Best debut win would be Calzaghe over Hopkins in terms of calibre of opponent.

[D4v3]

I imagine its already been said but Taylor unifying the belts against an unbeaten opponent takes some beating

[margaret thatcher]

josh's pro debut was in the us and he fought there a couple other times earlier in his career, one of them was a good challenge from a mexican dude.....olfonso alvera. that mightve been his toughest fight until he faced postol

[My Name Is Earl]

Best debut win would be Calzaghe over Hopkins in terms of calibre of opponent.

Has to be the oldest debutant too.

[Ruthless-RKO]

I imagine its already been said but Taylor unifying the belts against an unbeaten opponent takes some beating

That was in London.

Edit. You meant Ramirez.

[JamesPhilips]

That Porras fight was in Hollywood and made him an international superstar.

Right. He closed the show with a Hollywood punch against a fighter who could put a glass eye to sleep

[coghaugen11]

He did become a big name on ITV1 though with the Pascal fight - viewing figures in the region of 2million. Fat Mick claimed 2.9m but that was an exaggeration.

[Ruthless-RKO]

Naz was garbage against a shot Kelley. Pernell Whitaker was there and actually laughed at how poor Naz was.

Definitely an exorcising fight.

It was good exercise for Hamed, flipping from a leaping back bend after being hit

25 years ago today!

Hamed-Kelley

[a force]

Jamie McDonnell.

Went over to fight the unbeaten Kameda as an underdog. His own trainer didn’t come as he’s scared of flying & he won well on points.

Brilliant performance.

[Ruthless-RKO]

Jamie McDonnell.

Went over to fight the unbeaten Kameda as an underdog. His own trainer didn’t come as he’s scared of flying & he won well on points.

Brilliant performance.

Who was his trainer at the time?