Sad To See

[harrygreb]

i think allerdyce would easily see off every other british manager in a 10 rounder except maybe spurs martin jol.

[mickeybeard]

i think allerdyce would easily see off every other british manager in a 10 rounder except maybe spurs martin jol.

Premiership managers, maybe. I reckon 'Mad Dog' Martin Allen would be the one to watch out for.

[jamesmcdonnell]

i think allerdyce would easily see off every other british manager in a 10 rounder except maybe spurs martin jol.

I'm not sure, Jol has a big chin to aim at. I'd go for Mark Hughes over anyone of them, he has a big chin himself but those fans could generate some power.

I bet Mourhino is a shit-house.

Mouhrinho would probably get his minders to hold you and then kick you in the bollocks and bite your nipples off.

Sam Allerdyce has a MASSIVE head, he looks like a mastiff. Bet that big old gourd could take some licks.

[jamesmcdonnell]

I'd favour Stewart Pearce to batter any of them with the refrain.

"have some deep pan pizza."

[Autobarn]

Anyone else think that Baldomir looks like and Argentinian Sam Allardyce?

Benicio Del Torro could play Gatti in a movie of his life as well.;

the del toro of THE HUNTED would beat the fu_ck out of gatti

[Phenomenal-Nutrition]

The welterweight division is turning into a pile of steaming shite. Floyd won't take on the best, he'd rather hammer Gatti, then fight a guy who lost to Baldomir, and now he'll try and fight Baldomir, what's the friggin' point? I hope if they do fight that Baldomir somehow pulls off the upset and beats him, because Floyd is just milking the sport dry now, and getting money for old rope. It's Roy Jones syndrome all over again, except that Jones did plenty in his early career and did enough at light heavy to at least make a strong argument for him being the dominant fighter in that division.

Since leaving the lower weights behind, all Floyd has done is belt hop and take on the weaker links to pick up those belts, a scandalous waste of his talent. I get the feeling that despite his immense talent, Floyd's greatest talent is making money for the least risk.

Yet your happy with Hattons comp?

PBF fought Gatti instead of Harris (more money), he was supposed to fight Tyszu-Hatton winner - Hatton turned down an immediate unifaction and 2 other times, PBF has recently offered Hatton a fight in November but has been turned down again. PBF offered Cotto a fight - Cotto wasn't ready according to Arrum - Therefore no big fights at 140 at all.

He jumps to 147 fights Mitchell and Judah back to back, Tyszus best wins. The Judah fight was planned pre Baldomir and PBF talked to Baldomir but wasn't he then offered Margarito Judahs spot but Margarito decided to fight Gomez instead. If Marg doesnt take the fight when hes offered he can have little complaints, Arrum has also screwed PBF around over this trying to call the shots.

PBF then has been chasing a fight with DLH until DLH pulled out a few weeks ago. He then gunned for Mosley who didn't want to make the fight.

So in conclusion PBF has wanted to make fights with: DLH, Mosley, Hatton, Cotto and none of them wanted to make those fights. Now who from 140-154 has fought better comp than PBF in there last 5?

The only guys you can accuse PBF of not trying to make fights with thatwere on the table are : Harris/Witter/Margarito - and those are on par with his last 5 wins anyway. Who really will be impressed if PBF beats those fighters?

[jamesmcdonnell]

Where did I say anythign about Hatton. Collazo is however probably better than Gatti and Baldomir, and Hatton did at least beat Tszyu relatively recently, a far better fighter than anyone on Mayweather's resume, even if in decline. Tszyu ANNIHILATED younger and fresher versions of Judah and Mitchell.

That post is just so full of holes I don't know where to begin. Just to begin with as an example, at what point was there actually any contract negotiations or a proper offer on the table for a Hatton fight. Talk is very cheap, and it's very easy to say that everyone else is to blame, but the truth is Mayweather has faced shit opponents.

So what if he arranged the Judah fight before Judah lost, what, he couldn't change his mind, most people were flabberghasted that they sold that load of old shite to the public. Now he's talking about fighting Baldomir who beat Gatti who he already beat, and Judah he already beat.

The division stinks, and will continue to do so until someone sticks around long enough to tie up the loose ends. That is unlikely to be Mayweather, and I don't think Hatton has the goods to do so. Margarito cannot get a shot at anyone, Cotto will probably not be able to cope with the bigger hitters at 147 either.

The 147 lb division has been in trouble a long time despite a wealth of talent. Mosley lost to Forrest, Forrest to Mayorga, Mayorga to Spinks, Spinks to Judah, Judah to Baldomir, and now Baldomir will probably lose to Mayweather, who will then vacate and chase a fight at 154 and get beat or pick up a trashcan title against someone the sanctioning bodies deem to be challenger for a vacant title as a foil to mayweather.

[Phenomenal-Nutrition]

Where did I say anythign about Hatton. Collazo is however probably better than Gatti and Baldomir, and Hatton did at least beat Tszyu relatively recently, a far better fighter than anyone on Mayweather's resume, even if in decline. Tszyu ANNIHILATED younger and fresher versions of Judah and Mitchell.

That post is just so full of holes I don't know where to begin. Just to begin with as an example, at what point was there actually any contract negotiations or a proper offer on the table for a Hatton fight. Talk is very cheap, and it's very easy to say that everyone else is to blame, but the truth is Mayweather has faced shit opponents.

So what if he arranged the Judah fight before Judah lost, what, he couldn't change his mind, most people were flabberghasted that they sold that load of old shite to the public. Now he's talking about fighting Baldomir who beat Gatti who he already beat, and Judah he already beat.

The division stinks, and will continue to do so until someone sticks around long enough to tie up the loose ends. That is unlikely to be Mayweather, and I don't think Hatton has the goods to do so. Margarito cannot get a shot at anyone, Cotto will probably not be able to cope with the bigger hitters at 147 either.

The 147 lb division has been in trouble a long time despite a wealth of talent. Mosley lost to Forrest, Forrest to Mayorga, Mayorga to Spinks, Spinks to Judah, Judah to Baldomir, and now Baldomir will probably lose to Mayweather, who will then vacate and chase a fight at 154 and get beat or pick up a trashcan title against someone the sanctioning bodies deem to be challenger for a vacant title as a foil to mayweather.

If Hattons father flat out turns down the possibility of the fight 3-4 times over 2 years (his father did say this in an interview) PBF is hard to negotiate with but the fact is Team Hatton didn't want the fight. At least PBF was trying to make the fight, which is 1 of the most important of recent times.

A couple of years ago the rankings at 140 looked something like this:

1.Tyszu
2. Judah
3. Mitchell
4. Gatti
5. PBF
6. Hatton
7. Cotto
8. Witter

PBF beat 2-3-4 and Hatton beat no1. Its clear which fight should be next. Judah also went onto be 147lb linear champ, PBFs comp is very good, but is missing a defining fight. Ie Hatton/DLH/Mosley - all turned him down flat without getting into negotiations.

Is Collazo better than Baldomir and Gatti? I told you he was good, you said Hatton would annilate him, which is probably what his management thought - a soft touch. He took hatton to the wire all the same, and yes may beat Gatti/Baldomir

Margarito will not get a shot at anyone: Mitchell & Williams have offered him fights, I'm sure Quintana/Julio/Collazo would all fight Margarito in a heart beat, whos lost to some pretty average fighters in his time and certainly is far from the second coming - simply put hes not worth PBFs time and if you believe Arrum made a no strings $8million offer I have a bridge to sell you. Baldomir/Spinks mean more to legacy than Margarito unless Margarito beats some top10 fighters.

Cottos chin should be better at 147. Hopefully PBF stays at 147 (or at least goes back there after fighting Spinks/DLH)

[jamesmcdonnell]

I don't think Cotto will succeed at 147, whlist he won't be so weight drained, he will be in against bigger and taller men just like Hatton, and will be taking some bigger shots. Cotto tends to get hit a fair bit, and I don't think his vulnerability can be attributed entirely to being weight drained, though time will tell.

I admit to being wrong about Collazo, however, we had little information to go on at the time, and there wasn't a lot in his record to suggest he was as good as he turned out to be against Hatton, who is after all an elite level fighter, although one campaigning out of his proper division.

Let's get this straight, mayweather is a PHENOMENALLY talented fighter, as good technically as anyone I've ever watched, he's got the potential to be as good if not better than Ray Leonard, but he's already 29, and hasn't had a really top notch opponent since Castillo. He's pissing away his priime, and with his style, his prime could be over in 2 years.

There's only a few fights truly worth of his talent, DLH, (might be a very one sided win for Mayweather though), Hatton, Margarito (though as you say, Antonio needs to make a case for himself instead of Arum trying to land the big shot. Margarito has only actually lost one fight in the last 10 years , and that was to Santos, a big hitting 154 lber. I don't know about his earlier career, but losses that long ago often don't mean much, just ask Judah....

I want to see the best of Mayweather, and we are possibly not going to see that. I remain unconvinced about DLH, at his age and with his lack of preparation, I think we could see him suddenly look very old and rusty against Mayweather, and something tells me that a fight with Hatton may never materliase, and who knows what will happen with the likes of Margarito and Cotto. That would be a travesty if Mayweather's peak came and went and he never had the truly defining fight. Earlier in his career was taking on all the badasses, but his late career is turning out, like RJJ's to be a dissapointment.

[Phenomenal-Nutrition]

I'd agree PBF needs to be getting in with the best. I don't know if a Hatton fight will materialise ever, which is a shame as Hatton has 1 of the best chances to beat PBF. DLH/Mosley/Cotto isn't happening. Sadly Spinks/Baldomir/Margarito are the best fights out there at the mo.

I think PBF may actually have a long prime with his style and dedication.

[lvlarc]

He jumps to 147 fights Mitchell and Judah back to back, Tyszus best wins.

Mitchel wasn't that good, Kostya made light work of him, twice. Sharmba had a nice little run at 140, yet yo major wins.

Chavez was a much better win on Kostya's resumee than Mitchell, so was Gonzalez, who's only loss came to Oscar & held good wins, one being over Leavander Johnson, who was coming off a win over Mitchell.

[Phenomenal-Nutrition]

He jumps to 147 fights Mitchell and Judah back to back, Tyszus best wins.

Mitchel wasn't that good, Kostya made light work of him, twice. Sharmba had a nice little run at 140, yet yo major wins.

Chavez was a much better win on Kostya's resumee than Mitchell, so was Gonzalez, who's only loss came to Oscar & held good wins, one being over Leavander Johnson, who was coming off a win over Mitchell.

Shamba was winning the first fight and ahead on points until the knee injury forced his stoppage. hardly making light work of him, why do you think there was a re-match?

Chavez was shot to pieces and Gonzalez was good but only about on Shambas level imo.

Hurtado was a great win 4 Kostya imo, not sure if he was damaged goods though after Whitaker was allowed to hit him 20times while he was unconscious.

[stujones]

Baldomir's confidence is at a high, really surprised at the difference in strength between Gatti and Baldomir. It looked like a geniune 147 lbs (walk around weight) vs a geniune 160 lbs'er.

That was the fundamental difference between the two. Gatti was getting hurt and he couldn't budge Baldomir. I was really impressed.

I think Mayweather will be too quick and smooth for Baldomir, but I think Baldomir will smash Hatton. Think Hatton is tailer made for him. Hatton didn't look strong vs Collazo - and I think Baldomir's stength is what has given him these two big wins.

Gatti looked a finished fighter, indeed I thought there were warning signs vs Dammguard that maybe 147 lber's are going to be two strong for a former Super Featherweight champion.

If Gatti does wish to return to fight for a title, the only fighter I would like him to face is Hatton - someone of similar size.

[Phenomenal-Nutrition]

Baldomir's confidence is at a high, really surprised at the difference in strength between Gatti and Baldomir. It looked like a geniune 147 lbs (walk around weight) vs a geniune 160 lbs'er.

That was the fundamental difference between the two. Gatti was getting hurt and he couldn't budge Baldomir. I was really impressed.

I think Mayweather will be too quick and smooth for Baldomir, but I think Baldomir will smash Hatton. Think Hatton is tailer made for him. Hatton didn't look strong vs Collazo - and I think Baldomir's stength is what has given him these two big wins.

Gatti looked a finished fighter, indeed I thought there were warning signs vs Dammguard that maybe 147 lber's are going to be two strong for a former Super Featherweight champion.

If Gatti does wish to return to fight for a title, the only fighter I would like him to face is Hatton - someone of similar size.

Baldomir won because Gatti was so open to right hand after right hand - if he kept up a tight defense (which hes never done) it owuld be different. Hattons a diferent animal to Gatti and would beat Baldomir in a 8-4 clear decision imo. I think Baldomir is made for Hatton - Hattons faster, has a higher workrate, Hattons as strong, has the chin to take anything Baldomir throws, Has the boxing abilityto outbox Baldomir too. I think Hatton looses to Judah/PBF and maybe Margarito but not Baldomir.

[jamesmcdonnell]

He jumps to 147 fights Mitchell and Judah back to back, Tyszus best wins.

Mitchel wasn't that good, Kostya made light work of him, twice. Sharmba had a nice little run at 140, yet yo major wins.

Chavez was a much better win on Kostya's resumee than Mitchell, so was Gonzalez, who's only loss came to Oscar & held good wins, one being over Leavander Johnson, who was coming off a win over Mitchell.

Shamba was winning the first fight and ahead on points until the knee injury forced his stoppage. hardly making light work of him, why do you think there was a re-match?

Chavez was shot to pieces and Gonzalez was good but only about on Shambas level imo.

Hurtado was a great win 4 Kostya imo, not sure if he was damaged goods though after Whitaker was allowed to hit him 20times while he was unconscious.

Mitchell wasn't ahead on points at the time. You really should check your facts before saying these things. The first scores are Sharmba's. From what I hear as well, Kostya was starting to hurt him repeatedly when the knee blew out.

Referee: Joe Cortez | Judge: Keith MacDonald 66-66 | Judge: Daniel Van de Wiele 65-68 | Judge: Chuck Giampa 64-68 ~

however, you're right about Chavez, he was quite some way past his best, and wasn't anything like a match for Tszyu physically.

[stujones]

Baldomir's confidence is at a high, really surprised at the difference in strength between Gatti and Baldomir. It looked like a geniune 147 lbs (walk around weight) vs a geniune 160 lbs'er.

That was the fundamental difference between the two. Gatti was getting hurt and he couldn't budge Baldomir. I was really impressed.

I think Mayweather will be too quick and smooth for Baldomir, but I think Baldomir will smash Hatton. Think Hatton is tailer made for him. Hatton didn't look strong vs Collazo - and I think Baldomir's stength is what has given him these two big wins.

Gatti looked a finished fighter, indeed I thought there were warning signs vs Dammguard that maybe 147 lber's are going to be two strong for a former Super Featherweight champion.

If Gatti does wish to return to fight for a title, the only fighter I would like him to face is Hatton - someone of similar size.

Baldomir won because Gatti was so open to right hand after right hand - if he kept up a tight defense (which hes never done) it owuld be different. Hattons a diferent animal to Gatti and would beat Baldomir in a 8-4 clear decision imo. I think Baldomir is made for Hatton - Hattons faster, has a higher workrate, Hattons as strong, has the chin to take anything Baldomir throws, Has the boxing abilityto outbox Baldomir too. I think Hatton looses to Judah/PBF and maybe Margarito but not Baldomir.

Where I have bolded is where I disagree. Baldomir is stronger (if less skilled) than Collazo - who was stronger than Hatton.

Yes, Hatton looked like he could walk through nuclear bombs vs Tszyu - but vs Collazo he was getting pushed back and he was the one getting hurt. Appart from a very flash KD, Hatton hardly worried Collazo physically - and lets not forget, Collazo is a skillful back foot fighter who never reallies on strength.

Hatton is a come forward fighter, it is playing to Baldomir's strength, it is also playing too Margarito's strength. Based on his last fight at a Welterweight, I don't think he will outstrength two massively strong Welter's - when he cannot do it to a back foot Welter.

Lets not underate Baldomir's ability to cut the ring off, if Gatti/Judah cannot keep a box and move tactics for 12 rounds - then neither will Hatton.

Baldomir KO 10.

[stujones]

Anyone know if there was any rematch clause for the Gatti vs Baldomir fight.... cause it was a good fight and I just watched it again and I don't think its beyond imagination that Gatti cannot beat him in a rematch.

He did the same mistake as vs Ward 1, if Gatti sticks to a jab and move tactics - I think he can beat Baldomir. He has the speed and the power to do it.

Its all about styles, but I think Gatti stands a better chance vs Baldomir than Hatton, but would favour Hatton to beat Gatti.

[Hardhitters11]

Gatti could have and should have beaten Baldomir, IMO Hatton would beat Baldomir in a hard fought match up.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Baldomir's confidence is at a high, really surprised at the difference in strength between Gatti and Baldomir. It looked like a geniune 147 lbs (walk around weight) vs a geniune 160 lbs'er.

That was the fundamental difference between the two. Gatti was getting hurt and he couldn't budge Baldomir. I was really impressed.

I think Mayweather will be too quick and smooth for Baldomir, but I think Baldomir will smash Hatton. Think Hatton is tailer made for him. Hatton didn't look strong vs Collazo - and I think Baldomir's stength is what has given him these two big wins.

Gatti looked a finished fighter, indeed I thought there were warning signs vs Dammguard that maybe 147 lber's are going to be two strong for a former Super Featherweight champion.

If Gatti does wish to return to fight for a title, the only fighter I would like him to face is Hatton - someone of similar size.

Baldomir won because Gatti was so open to right hand after right hand - if he kept up a tight defense (which hes never done) it owuld be different. Hattons a diferent animal to Gatti and would beat Baldomir in a 8-4 clear decision imo. I think Baldomir is made for Hatton - Hattons faster, has a higher workrate, Hattons as strong, has the chin to take anything Baldomir throws, Has the boxing abilityto outbox Baldomir too. I think Hatton looses to Judah/PBF and maybe Margarito but not Baldomir.

Where I have bolded is where I disagree. Baldomir is stronger (if less skilled) than Collazo - who was stronger than Hatton.

Yes, Hatton looked like he could walk through nuclear bombs vs Tszyu - but vs Collazo he was getting pushed back and he was the one getting hurt. Appart from a very flash KD, Hatton hardly worried Collazo physically - and lets not forget, Collazo is a skillful back foot fighter who never reallies on strength.

Hatton is a come forward fighter, it is playing to Baldomir's strength, it is also playing too Margarito's strength. Based on his last fight at a Welterweight, I don't think he will outstrength two massively strong Welter's - when he cannot do it to a back foot Welter.

Lets not underate Baldomir's ability to cut the ring off, if Gatti/Judah cannot keep a box and move tactics for 12 rounds - then neither will Hatton.

Baldomir KO 10.

Collazo has better skills than Baldomir, and Hatton is a better fighter than Gatti. Hatton wins a bruising 12 rounder against Baldomir with his workrate. Collazo prospered by catching Hatton on the way in, Baldomir wouldn't be able to prevent him closing the gap and landing to the body.

[harrygreb]

hatton scrapes past baldomir ....just... but he will not make an impression against pbf unless there is some factor in his favour ie the match is made at 140. if it is at 147 hatton becomes an entirely different proposition for every good fighter in the division. pbf will continue his winning ways until he decides to quit...unless a match with mosley is made, mosley and mosley alone beats floyd imo, but it has to be soon. im not sure floyd is too worried about having a defining fight. business being business.

[jamesmcdonnell]

I'm surprised at how many people think Mosley can beat Floyd, battering a used up Vargas is an entirely different proposition to facing a guy as fast as floyd, don't forget that Mosley was at his best at lightweight. He had the right style to give Oscar fits, but Floyd is technically better than Oscar, has better movement and defence. Oscar couldn't stay away from Floyd, and got drawn into a stand and trade fight which favoured Mosley, the harder hitting and stronger man at the weight.

I think Mayweather could fight in the pocket and move before Mosley got set with his punches.