The Bolo Punch

[-KOKid-]

It certainly was not Gavilan who invented it, he merely popularized it.
Ceferino Garcia was throwing the bolo punch way before him, and from what I've understood, he was the first one to do so.
In any case, it was either "invented" by Flores or Garcia, not Gavilan.

-KOKid-

[ferocity]

I know that Gavillan invented the bolo punch, at least he says he did and could it be that sombody else named the same punch? Probably. But i've always heard it was Gavilan and heard him say in a video how he invinted the bolo punch.

I've havn't seen enough Gavilan to see how he used the bolo punch. I've only seen a few video clips of him delivering his punch and from what i seen he throws it from a distance.

[ferocity]

It certainly was not Gavilan who invented it, he merely popularized it.
Ceferino Garcia was throwing the bolo punch way before him, and from what I've understood, he was the first one to do so.
In any case, it was either "invented" by Flores or Garcia, not Gavilan.

-KOKid-

Cheers, I had that part right then. My understanding of the punch is that it is a right uppercut pure and simple preceded by a hand whirl. As punches go it is a made-up one of the Texas Tommy variety in that it is a traditional move, a turn and punch, given a daft name to excite the fans, for me it is up there with the Cosmic punch and the punches Ali invented all the time late in his career to excite the fans (didn't he invent one called the ghetto blaster?!).

As far as I know there are six punches in boxing, the rest is a variety on them. A dip of the knees, a feint, a roll and then one of the six punches. That is how I was taught to box anyway.

Even Delahoya used to have his half hook/half uppercut, i belive it was called colt 45 or somthing like that.

[Ezzard]

given a daft name to excite the fans

Could be right... As a kid I remember the commentators going on about Pedroza'd bolo punch when he fought McGuigan. I'd never heard of it before. It sounded like some sort of vicious secret weapon, part ancient wisdom, part black magic... Every time harry Carpenter mentioned it we expected top see Barry slump t the canvas.

Me any my mate argued about what it was for weeks and eventually (after much rewinding of our old betamax VCR) between us decided that it was an uppercut to the body - ahhh great memories...

[Ezzard]

Cheers, but our thoughts (as two kids with little insight constantly bickering over every aspect of the sport) were really based on what Harry was saying. When he said "bolo" we rewound the tape to see what it could have been.

As I remember Pedroza threw it quite compactly but I'm not sure how much power he could have got into it. I still here the commentary, "Pedroza's bolo to the heart." puching someone to the heart sounded 'king scary to me...

[silkov]

The thing is Leonard only used it really as a taunt, he seldom used it as a serious punch. From my fights of Gavilan he did use it quite a bit and it was a legitamate punch when he used it... the fact that he never koed anyone with it (as far as I know) is neither here nor there as Gavilan was not a big puncher at all, but he had very fast hands and used to throw lost of punches from different angles and it is often within a flurry such as this that he would put in a bolo or two.
Gavilan didnt invent the bolo but popularized it... Cerferino Garcia used the bolo a lot... and was most likely the first top flight fighter to use it... its said that he took it up from the action used in cutting suger cane....

[silkov]

Cheers, but our thoughts (as two kids with little insight constantly bickering over every aspect of the sport) were really based on what Harry was saying. When he said "bolo" we rewound the tape to see what it could have been.

As I remember Pedroza through it quite compactly but I'm not sure how much power he could have got into it. I still here the commentary, "Pedroza's bolo to the heart." puching someone to the heart sounded 'king scary to me...

I've got quite a few Pedrosa fights and he did use the bolo quite frequently and to good effect, usually as a body punch, which quite often would stray a little low... 8)

[Ezzard]

So the bolo is an uppercut? With a twirl? In other words it is a feint or showboat then a punch. It is also credited as a right cross cum uppercut. Does anyone see how crazy that description is?

It is another boxing myth. An uppercut in hypes clothing.

I don't remember Pedroza feinting with it. It is a bit of a Hollywood punch

[silkov]

Its not a myth, Gavilan and Garcia used it as a serious punch, as did Pedrosa... as a punch it can vary depending how wide the circular motion is and also where it is delivered. Gavilan generally used it as a uppercut to the head while Pedrosa used it as a body punch, (I think Garcia used it as a body shot too) ...used right it is delivered in a whipping like fashion so is not really telegraphed as such and is hard to defend against as it is not clear where the punch will land.
Like I said earlier Leonard really made a negative impact with his bolos as he mainly used them to taunt his opponents... Gavilan and Pedrosas Bolos were in a different league...
The bolo was the name of the knife used in cutting sugar cane.

[silkov]

The way Gavilan used the bolo is imagine a fighter going to throw a straight punch, pulling back then whipping the hand/arm downwards in a circular motion and then bringing the punch up underneath as an uppercut. Done properly with precision it is a very good punch as it can totally throw off an opponent... I have several Gavilan fights (vs basilo, Turner, Jones, Womba etc) and he did use it quite a bit as a serious punch... but its not a punch that you'd throw 30 times a round.

[silkov]

So the bolo is an uppercut? With a twirl? In other words it is a feint or showboat then a punch. It is also credited as a right cross cum uppercut. Does anyone see how crazy that description is?

It is another boxing myth. An uppercut in hypes clothing.

I don't remember Pedroza feinting with it. It is a bit of a Hollywood punch

Pedrosa certainly never showboated with it, he used to whip bolos to the body and they were very solid shots... in fact his 'body bolo's' are probably the best use of the bolo punch that I have seen...

[silkov]

There are problems there Silkov, my footage of Gavilan shows him throwing uppercuts with a wide arc but upercuts nonetheless. You could give it any name you want but it is still an uppercut.

If he was going to throw a straight punch, by this I presume you mean he physically feinted the blow or you mentally read his mind, your feinting gesture, if correct which Gavilan's should be, will mean you turn your shoulder a little and your palm of the punching hand faces to the floor. You then need to turn the shot, and your shoulders incidently, right back and shifty the balance to get your right hand going through the wide arc in order to connect with your palm pretty much facing you when the uppercut lands.

You cannot feint, no matter how good you think a fighter is, a straight right then turn it into an uppercut without wasting seconds of time. If you are fast enough it is still not one movement, it is a feint (right cross) and then an uppercut from the right hand. Two seperate components, strictly speaking the feint is the 'bolo' and the punch itself is merely a right uppercut with a wide arc.

There are only six punches in boxing, everything else is a variation, you can the variations silly labels but they will be modified versions of the six shots open to a fighter.

I mean was Suzy Q a new punch? Or a right hand?

Well Gavilans Bolo's are certainly distinguishable from a normal uppercut... I dont know how much footage you have of Gavilan but if its just highlights then it may not be a bolo. But ofcourse basically Gavilans bolo was an uppercut in essence just as Pedrosa's was a body punch, but they were both delivered with the bolo arc. Its worth saying also that no bolo is exactly the same and some are more effective than others... in the distance fights I have of Gavilan he throws about half a dozen effective bolo's.... as for Marcinaos Suzy Q that wasnt a punch delivered with any different technique it was just the name that he gave his right hand just as Ingemar Johnanson named his punch the hammer of thor....

[Ezzard]

From a technical POV you may be right but it sounds exotic and deadly...

[Ezzard]

From a technical POV you may be right but it sounds exotic and deadly...

Fair enough When I'm at a show and Peter Buckley comes on I wish someone would lean over and say: "He has invented a new punch, the 'prospect buster'." It would cheer me up no end, even though I don't mind his fights. My only quibble is why don't fighters name their jabs? 'The Stick', 'The Bitch-Buster', 'Larry Holmes' Big, Bitching, Baby-Boomstick.'

C'mon fighters, name your jab

You're taking marketing to a whole new level. Maybe all their punches should be named??? The name could pop up on screen for a split second as the puch landed a bit like the old batman series...

Ooooh, over excited, feeling giddy, better lie down...

[HomicideHenry]

I remember Foreman using the "bolo punch" when he faced off against the Toronto Five in 1975, but he more or less did that showing off how easy it was for him to tear these men apart one after the other.

[silkov]

I watched distance fights and all I saw was an uppercut. A right uppercut should be thrown with a wide up and under arc when possible, otherwise it is barely an uppercut. You see lots of uppercuts thrown with wide-arcs, you are supposed to swing a punch as you swning a golf-club so it makes sense they go right around and through the target.

For me the 'bolo' is the show, the blow is the punch. The Marciano comparison is just to make clear how ludicrous it is. Lewis KO'd Rahman with a right hook, are we to give that a new name due to its trajectory.

Show a boxing coach a bolo punch and ask him what it is and he'll tell you it is a right uppercut. There are six punches in boxing: the jab, the cross, the left hook, the right hook, the uppercuts. The bolo punch is a right uppercut for my money. If you see it as a new punch of any kind it complicates things as the best advice I was given for tightening a defence is to bear in mind that there are only six punches so coupled with blody positioning and an understanding of balance it is not rocket science when anticipating the next shot.

Going back to the original post the same guy balked when I said there are six punches, he wanted to include the back-hand with the non-knuckle part of the glove.

Either way this thread probably tells us we have too much time on our hands!

No the Bolo is a real punch, I dont know what fights you have of Gavilan but he definately throws a bolo punch as it is supposed to be thrown and it is not the 'bolo' that Leonard used simply to tease and frustrate opponents... same with Pedrosa... those are solid bolos to the body which he throws... its silly to just dismiss the bolo as show, its a definate punch in its own right but very few fighters can execute it correctly... but Gavilan was certainly one of them....

[Chuck1052]

In an article in a 1925 edition of the Bakersfield Californian,
there was a description of a bolo-type punch thrown by
Young Nationalista, a very popular Filipino fighter who was
based in California during the 1920s. But Hap Navarro,
who saw Nationalista in action, told me that the Filipino
fighter didn't throw real bolo punch. Of course, Young
Nationalista was known as a fighter who threw punches
from all angles.

There also was a description of Billy Papke throwing a
punch similar to a bolo, which was called "loop-the-loop"
(as I recall).

- Chuck Johnston

[silkov]

I watched distance fights and all I saw was an uppercut. A right uppercut should be thrown with a wide up and under arc when possible, otherwise it is barely an uppercut. You see lots of uppercuts thrown with wide-arcs, you are supposed to swing a punch as you swning a golf-club so it makes sense they go right around and through the target.

For me the 'bolo' is the show, the blow is the punch. The Marciano comparison is just to make clear how ludicrous it is. Lewis KO'd Rahman with a right hook, are we to give that a new name due to its trajectory.

Show a boxing coach a bolo punch and ask him what it is and he'll tell you it is a right uppercut. There are six punches in boxing: the jab, the cross, the left hook, the right hook, the uppercuts. The bolo punch is a right uppercut for my money. If you see it as a new punch of any kind it complicates things as the best advice I was given for tightening a defence is to bear in mind that there are only six punches so coupled with blody positioning and an understanding of balance it is not rocket science when anticipating the next shot.

Going back to the original post the same guy balked when I said there are six punches, he wanted to include the back-hand with the non-knuckle part of the glove.

Either way this thread probably tells us we have too much time on our hands!

No the Bolo is a real punch, I dont know what fights you have of Gavilan but he definately throws a bolo punch as it is supposed to be thrown and it is not the 'bolo' that Leonard used simply to tease and frustrate opponents... same with Pedrosa... those are solid bolos to the body which he throws... its silly to just dismiss the bolo as show, its a definate punch in its own right but very few fighters can execute it correctly... but Gavilan was certainly one of them....

It is a 'real' punch, it is an uppercut. No offence Silkov but have you ever been in a boxing gym and learned the shots? Just a question as you seem to know a lot of stuff but you cannot see that the punch itself is an uppercut. It is an uppercut delivered with a full arc. It is not a tweaked uppercut, or a super-duper uppercut, it is an uppercut. I am very good on the technical aspects of boxing.

There are six punches in boxing, I have yet to see that disputed adequately. Fancy names or not things like the 'bolo', the 'colt' or likewise are orthodox punches given silly names.

Well Terry, I'm sure you feel yourself better qualified than all the boxing historians of the last 60+ years that have talked about the Bolo punch but I have to disagree yet again with you... perhaps you're not watching your fight films closely enough... its one thing to watch fights, another to actually see whats going on, ...thats if you really do have the fights...
if you had seen Gavilan or Pedrosa throw their bolo's I doubt that you would be arguing about it being simply an uppercut... you could always buy the fights from me if you're interested and willing to pay the right cash.... comparing the bolo with Oscars 'colt' is basically ridiculous...

[Ric]

"Bolo punch" (From Boxrec Boxing Encyclopedia):

Kid Gavilan is often given credit for inventing this punch--a combination of a wide uppercut/right cross/swing that was delivered seemingly from the floor--by popularizing it in the late 1940s and 1950s.

But during the 1930s Ceferino Garcia was effectively using what reporters and broadcasters then called the "bolo punch" -- based upon the bolo knife Filipinos used for chopping difficult vegetation.

Filipino boxer Macario Flores is the earliest-known practitioner of the bolo punch. According to the March 27, 1924 Tacoma News Tribune (Tacoma, WA, USA): "Flores lets his right hand go just as his country men throw a bolo knife. The blow is not only hard, but it is as fast as a streak of lightning, being almost impossible to follow with the human eye."

http://www.boxrec.com/media/index.php/Bolo_punch

[silkov]

It is a 'real' punch, it is an uppercut. No offence Silkov but have you ever been in a boxing gym and learned the shots? Just a question as you seem to know a lot of stuff but you cannot see that the punch itself is an uppercut. It is an uppercut delivered with a full arc. It is not a tweaked uppercut, or a super-duper uppercut, it is an uppercut. I am very good on the technical aspects of boxing.

There are six punches in boxing, I have yet to see that disputed adequately. Fancy names or not things like the 'bolo', the 'colt' or likewise are orthodox punches given silly names.

Well Terry, I'm sure you feel yourself better qualified than all the boxing historians of the last 60+ years that have talked about the Bolo punch but I have to disagree yet again with you... perhaps you're not watching your fight films closely enough... its one thing to watch fights, another to actually see whats going on, ...thats if you really do have the fights...
if you had seen Gavilan or Pedrosa throw their bolo's I doubt that you would be arguing about it being simply an uppercut... you could always buy the fights from me if you're interested and willing to pay the right cash.... comparing the bolo with Oscars 'colt' is basically ridiculous...

Silkov, I'm not denying historians talk about it, historians will talk they also talk about phantom punches and fighters lying with their backs slightly off the sun-baked canvas. What I am saying is that it is thrown as an uppercut.

Look, in boxing there are six punches and six punches alone. The jab, the cross, the left and right hooks and ditto for uppercuts. For example, the left hook to the body is not a seventh punch, it is a dip of the knees or a slip and then a left hook.

The reason I asked you if you had boxed is I wanted to know if on your first day your trainer said "Here are the punches. You have the jab, the cross, the hooks, the uppercuts...the Bolo punch, the Spinning top punch, the Coly .45, the Tommy Turner, the corksrew." Because if he did you suddenly have lots of punches to look out for and learn. If you know you have six punches then it is not rocket science to be a good defensive boxer. A bolo 'punch' is thrown with the same shoulder movement as an uppercut, it is an uppercut, there are numerous ticks when a fight punches but the primary one is the movement of the shoulder. A guy can wind-up a bolo but keep your eyes on him and watch his shoulders, then you will know what is he is really going to throw, same for the punch aspect. Stand-up right now and throw an uppercut, then a bolo 'punch' and you will see it is the same shoulder movement. It is an uppercut, it is one thing watching the fights (some of which I do have thanks, James McDonnell has my highlights and my grandfather owns full fights, fights which I watched with him when young, when he taught me to box), it is quite another knowing the physical mechanics of throwing a punch.

If you don't know these mechanics drop me a line, we'll watch some Gavilan and I'll take you to hit the bags, don't worry they don't hit back

I was ridiculed a while ago on Boxrec for being a 'gym-rat', for (a boxing fan, in a boxing gym, heaven forbid!) watching boxers in the gym and sparring. Last night I did the same thing and when they threw the uppercut asked them what it was, they replied 'an uppercut', I then threw a 'bolo' punch and asked what I had thrown, they replied 'an uppercut, with a bigger swing.' You have watched a lot of fights, these guys have fought many times between them. Therein lies the difference of this debate. You cannot see that the bolo is a variation of a single shot, as is a roundhouse right hand, same shoulder motion, different trajectory and curve.

Bear in mind that in boxing you hit with the knuckle so if you throw a sweeping shot through the middle of the guard you have to connect with the knuckle part of the glove, your palm must be turned inward, feign an uppercut, see the way your knuckle position sets your shoulder? Now feign an uppercut with the knuckles positioned wrongly, say towards you, you can feel the tension in your muscles and the change in your shoulder. Any punch with the trajectory you describe will be an uppercut. Joe Calzaghe throws punches with cuffing technique so they come from crazy areas, many could be given new names, they are just punches thrown unusually.

I have talked about the mechanics of the punch, in response to your brief description, you have told me how many fights you watch. Our relationship looks set in stone to me

I've nothing against gym rats unless they have the idea that being in a boxing gym all day makes them an expert on everything to do with boxing. Unfortunately you seem to fall into this catagory... trying to make yourself an expert when you clearly dont know what you're talking about. Dont talk to me about mechanics, few boxing trainers today know how to teach a boy to throw a decent jab let alone defend himself. I've actually spent plenty of time in boxing gyms over the years but have found very few really knowledgable people within them. Its quite obvious to me that you have not watched any significant amount of either Gavilan or Pedrosa 8) and you're waffling does little to disguise this fact!. .. pm me if you really want to own some Gavilan/Pedrosa fights and I'll be more than happy to sort you out for the right money!