Ike Ibeabuchi vs. Lennox lewis

billythekid · Post by **billythekid** » 02 Aug 2006, 15:11

Same Tua. Lewis was just that good at nuetralizing him. He did that to many heavies that is he is one of the best ever and Ike is in prison.

Nomadic Miscreant · Post by **Nomadic Miscreant** » 02 Aug 2006, 15:22

The Tua/Ike fight could have gone either way. It really was a coin toss.

I think more people think Ike won just because it was shocking and no one expected anyone to be able to trade toe to toe with Tua.

I personally think Tua edged him out because some of his punches hurt Ike. But make no mistake, it was a true shelling for all 12 rounds.

HeadBasher · Post by **HeadBasher** » 02 Aug 2006, 16:14

ike ibakochee KO1 eesy he wood domanat lweis

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 02 Aug 2006, 16:30

HeadBasher wrote:ike ibakochee KO1 eesy he wood domanat lweis

Chief troll reappears!

Jaybee From The Castle · Post by **Jaybee From The Castle** » 02 Aug 2006, 17:35

Prime Ibeabuchi vs Prime Lewis...Ibeabuchi by late TKO, although it'd be a barnburner for the duration.

Lewis seemed like he had multiple personality disorder in the ring, you couldn't quite tell whether he would fight like a cornered tiger, or Ally Mcbeal. I never saw Ike in a bad fight. The cornered tiger may have stretched the fight to a points loss, but a loss nonetheless.

My rationale? Each mans chin. Given their roughly even workrate/skillset/handspeed, the fight would be decided not on who can land the hardest punches most often, but who can take them. Ike could take Lewis', but the reverse is not also true.

Jaybee.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 02 Aug 2006, 18:14

Lewis only lost when he took opponents lightly. He would not have taken Ibeabuchi lightly that is for sure. Look at how he dealt with Golota who most had picked to beat him.

This is a pointless argument, but Lewis is an alltime great and Ibeabuchi is rotting in prison when push comes to shove.

dizneyfist · Post by **dizneyfist** » 02 Aug 2006, 23:10

viciousmaussa wrote:Ike is no longer around because he is a head case. if he can't cut it in life how could he continue to do so in the ring? look how many ppl lost their cool - and even their mind - vs the massive, physically intimidating Lewis. MCcall, Golota. Tyson at that presser. Even Holyfield had to lose himself in a "I'll easily KO him in three" fantasy after Lewis riled him, 'The Real Deal' ending up totally deflated from not coring the KO and fading miserably out of the fight.

Ike was an awesome specimen. But let's not forget, not everyone believes he even beat Tua. So what is his reputation really based on? Breaking punch stat #s vs Tua or the fact that he TKO'd Chris Byrd. Very good accomplishments. Bu tlet's not go overboard. That's two fights only.

Let's give Lewis the credit for the things he did. He overcame cumbersome technique and two bad KO losses to go after everyone who ducked him, develop a calculating and intelligent approach to combat, & beat every guy he faced. He had the discipline and control that was absent from Ibeabuchi, so I don't see the reason for these Ike fantasies. Don't give the guy credit for things that he didn't do.

(...always amused me, Tommy hearns never seems to get much stick for his vulnerability, this vulnerability seems to enhance his 'humanness' & make him more popular; but with lewis, dropped by two flush heavyweight shots, it's often used as ammunition to mock him...)

There are flaws in Ibeabuchi anyways. I question his ability to adapt to situations. I mean, he let the shorter, harder hitting Tua on the inside. Yes he showed awesome durability and stamina, but Tua gave him life & death & Ike neglected that jab.

In all, Ike was potentially great. But that means nothing if you can't even go about your life without all the abuse, kidnapping, weirdness, violence that get you locked away.

dizneyfist · Post by **dizneyfist** » 02 Aug 2006, 23:22

viciousmaussa wrote:Ike is no longer around because he is a head case. if he can't cut it in life how could he continue to do so in the ring? look how many ppl lost their cool - and even their mind - vs the massive, physically intimidating Lewis. MCcall, Golota. Tyson at that presser. Even Holyfield had to lose himself in a "I'll easily KO him in three" fantasy after Lewis riled him, 'The Real Deal' ending up totally deflated from not coring the KO and fading miserably out of the fight.

Ike was an awesome specimen. But let's not forget, not everyone believes he even beat Tua. So what is his reputation really based on? Breaking punch stat #s vs Tua or the fact that he TKO'd Chris Byrd. Very good accomplishments. Bu tlet's not go overboard. That's two fights only.

Let's give Lewis the credit for the things he did. He overcame cumbersome technique and two bad KO losses to go after everyone who ducked him, develop a calculating and intelligent approach to combat, & beat every guy he faced. He had the discipline and control that was absent from Ibeabuchi, so I don't see the reason for these Ike fantasies. Don't give the guy credit for things that he didn't do.

(...always amused me, Tommy hearns never seems to get much stick for his vulnerability, this vulnerability seems to enhance his 'humanness' & make him more popular; but with lewis, dropped by two flush heavyweight shots, it's often used as ammunition to mock him...)

There are flaws in Ibeabuchi anyways. I question his ability to adapt to situations. I mean, he let the shorter, harder hitting Tua on the inside. Yes he showed awesome durability and stamina, but Tua gave him life & death & Ike neglected that jab.

In all, Ike was potentially great. But that means nothing if you can't even go about your life without all the abuse, kidnapping, weirdness, violence that get you locked away.

Imagine you were blamed for severe crime you didn't do and you didn't have any way of justifying that wouldn't that be a possible reason for breaking down. We know Tyson through the Media and know that he has had a violent past so it would be easy for us to assume that he could well likely be accused of such an act. Just b/c someone is convicted of a crime doesn't mean it was clear cut justification in a ruling.there is alot of loop holes in our court system and w/o actual footage on video presented there is no definite proof. I don't think Tyson nor Ibeabuchi raped those girls. Ike so irrational like that he seemed cool headed throughout his professional career but that was just my impression of him in the presence of the public. I think when your accused of something wrongfully so and are incarcerated it can wound the mental state of a person and turn them psychologically.

billythekid · Post by **billythekid** » 02 Aug 2006, 23:50

nickd wrote:Lewis only lost when he took opponents lightly. He would not have taken Ibeabuchi lightly that is for sure. Look at how he dealt with Golota who most had picked to beat him.

This is a pointless argument, but Lewis is an alltime great and Ibeabuchi is rotting in prison when push comes to shove.

Thank you Nick'd. You have proven there is some common sense on this board.

wouter · Post by **wouter** » 03 Aug 2006, 07:24

Ike v. some of the all-time greats

TKO1 Joe Frazier, see Foreman-Frazier, only quicker
W12 Larry Holmes, Holmes gets knocked down a few times but his chin sees him through
TKO4 Sonny Liston, Liston doesn't come out after taking 3 rounds of Ike's punches.
KO3 Joe Louis, Joe can't get up this time.
W12 David Tua, close but Ike nicks it.
KO9 Rocky Marciano, Rocky never faced a puncher like the President.
W12 Muhammad Ali, see Tua

The Great John L · Post by **The Great John L** » 03 Aug 2006, 07:53

wouter wrote:Ike v. some of the all-time greats

TKO1 Joe Frazier, see Foreman-Frazier, only quicker
W12 Larry Holmes, Holmes gets knocked down a few times but his chin sees him through
TKO4 Sonny Liston, Liston doesn't come out after taking 3 rounds of Ike's punches.
KO3 Joe Louis, Joe can't get up this time.
W12 David Tua, close but Ike nicks it.
KO9 Rocky Marciano, Rocky never faced a puncher like the President.
W12 Muhammad Ali, see Tua

Pretty good list, except I can't see that itty bitty Marciano lasting past the first.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 03 Aug 2006, 07:55

Ike was something special. He would walk through today's heavies.

But just going off two fights, that's nowhere near enough to say he would've beaten someone as proven as Lewis.

Jaybee From The Castle · Post by **Jaybee From The Castle** » 03 Aug 2006, 11:45

billythekid wrote:
nickd wrote:Lewis only lost when he took opponents lightly. He would not have taken Ibeabuchi lightly that is for sure. Look at how he dealt with Golota who most had picked to beat him.

This is a pointless argument, but Lewis is an alltime great and Ibeabuchi is rotting in prison when push comes to shove.
Thank you Nick'd. You have proven there is some common sense on this board.

Very common.

Jaybee.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 03 Aug 2006, 12:12

Being a good/great fighter is as much mental as physical. Ibeabuchi clearly had the physical tools but he certainly didn't have the mentality required which is why he's a convicted kidnapper and rapist and is behind bars.

Who's to say he wouldn't have capitulated in the big fights like a certain Andrew Golota?

dizneyfist · Post by **dizneyfist** » 03 Aug 2006, 18:11

shoutout2u wrote:
Roars Like Me wrote:Lewis mugs The president over the distance.
It'll be a re-run of the Tua fight for Lewis.
In fact didn't Ike and Tua draw? Nuff said.
your memory failed you there, amigo!! actually ike won a competitive but CLEARCUT UNANIMOUS decision over tua in 1997, when tua was a much better conditioned fighter than he was from late 1990s on, after he INEXPLICABLY added about 20 pounds and became even more one-dimensional than he was before the extra weight. remember tua fought at 200 pounds in 1992 olympics and moving up to 220-225 as young pro gave him a solid mix of punching power and stamina...both he and ibeabuchi threw OVER 1,000 PUNCHES EACH in their 1997 war!! ibeabuchi alternated between outboxing tua from the outside and GOING TOE-TO-TOE in the trenches with tua...something nobody has done before or since!!

after adding the extra 20-25 pounds towards end of 1990s, his stamina and punch output dropped significantly without a corresponding increase in punching power! his best wins (KO1=ruiz, late KOs of maskaev, izon & rahman) ALL came in mid-1990s before his conditioning deteriorated...he never beat anyone of their caliber after putting on the extra weight. i'm not saying he would have beaten lewis even in his 1995-98 prime, but he wouldnt have been so thoroughly HUMILIATED like he was as a butterball...

Well put I was just going to say something similar but that is right on point shoutout

BoxingFan84 · Post by **BoxingFan84** » 03 Aug 2006, 18:53

dizneyfist wrote:
viciousmaussa wrote:Ike is no longer around because he is a head case. if he can't cut it in life how could he continue to do so in the ring? look how many ppl lost their cool - and even their mind - vs the massive, physically intimidating Lewis. MCcall, Golota. Tyson at that presser. Even Holyfield had to lose himself in a "I'll easily KO him in three" fantasy after Lewis riled him, 'The Real Deal' ending up totally deflated from not coring the KO and fading miserably out of the fight.

Ike was an awesome specimen. But let's not forget, not everyone believes he even beat Tua. So what is his reputation really based on? Breaking punch stat #s vs Tua or the fact that he TKO'd Chris Byrd. Very good accomplishments. Bu tlet's not go overboard. That's two fights only.

Let's give Lewis the credit for the things he did. He overcame cumbersome technique and two bad KO losses to go after everyone who ducked him, develop a calculating and intelligent approach to combat, & beat every guy he faced. He had the discipline and control that was absent from Ibeabuchi, so I don't see the reason for these Ike fantasies. Don't give the guy credit for things that he didn't do.

(...always amused me, Tommy hearns never seems to get much stick for his vulnerability, this vulnerability seems to enhance his 'humanness' & make him more popular; but with lewis, dropped by two flush heavyweight shots, it's often used as ammunition to mock him...)

There are flaws in Ibeabuchi anyways. I question his ability to adapt to situations. I mean, he let the shorter, harder hitting Tua on the inside. Yes he showed awesome durability and stamina, but Tua gave him life & death & Ike neglected that jab.

In all, Ike was potentially great. But that means nothing if you can't even go about your life without all the abuse, kidnapping, weirdness, violence that get you locked away.
Imagine you were blamed for severe crime you didn't do and you didn't have any way of justifying that wouldn't that be a possible reason for breaking down. We know Tyson through the Media and know that he has had a violent past so it would be easy for us to assume that he could well likely be accused of such an act. Just b/c someone is convicted of a crime doesn't mean it was clear cut justification in a ruling.there is alot of loop holes in our court system and w/o actual footage on video presented there is no definite proof. I don't think Tyson nor Ibeabuchi raped those girls. Ike so irrational like that he seemed cool headed throughout his professional career but that was just my impression of him in the presence of the public. I think when your accused of something wrongfully so and are incarcerated it can wound the mental state of a person and turn them psychologically.

The only one to blame for Ike's downfall is Ike himself.

Are you gonna blame Don King for Ike kidnapping his ex's son and with whom he drove his car into a concrete wall to try to kill himself?

I guess innocent rapists try to hide from the cops in a bathroom huh?

The guy was a suicidal nut case. He was obviously self-destructive and it isn't surprising where that eventually led him.

Don King might be boxing's devil but Ike had major personal problems.

As for Ike beating Lennox. I don't think so only if Lennox took this guy lightly like someone else said. But Ike would have been Lennox's greatest opposition. Beating Ike would have shut many of Lennox's historical detractors up. Ike probably would have destroyed today's HWs. The guy is arguably the greatest HW prospect to get nowhere.

BoxingFan84 · Post by **BoxingFan84** » 03 Aug 2006, 18:58

billythekid wrote:I wish all threads and topics of Ike were BANNED. I am so sick and tired of people talking about this guy as if he was some sort of god. He barely beat Tua who was shutout by Lewis that should at least tell you something.

Yes Ike is overrated because his legacy is made up of potential "what ifs".

It's like Len Bias. Some people swear he could have been as good as MJ.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 03 Aug 2006, 20:33

IKE vs Hercules......IKE KO 2

IKE vs Samson IKE KO 3

IKE vs the vicious BloodBladder beast from Herculon 9....IKE 15 RD one sided decision.

IKE vs T.Rex....IKE KO 5

IKE vs Two Mastadons and 5 saber tooth's. IKE ends up owning the Zoo.

JAHamilton77 · Post by **JAHamilton77** » 03 Aug 2006, 20:47

BoxBuzz wrote:IKE vs Hercules......IKE KO 2

IKE vs Samson IKE KO 3

IKE vs the vicious BloodBladder beast from Herculon 9....IKE 15 RD one sided decision.

IKE vs T.Rex....IKE KO 5

IKE vs Two Mastadons and 5 saber tooth's. IKE ends up owning the Zoo.

You forgot a few

Ike

vs

http://slam.canoe.ca/WrestlingImagesB/bushwackers2.jpg

The BushWackers

Ike

vs

http://guide.supereva.com/wrestling/myimg/172069_1.jpg

Steiner Brothers

and

Ike

vs

http://guide.supereva.com/wrestling/myimg/172463_1.jpg

Akeem

billythekid · Post by **billythekid** » 03 Aug 2006, 21:21

BoxingFan84 wrote:
billythekid wrote:I wish all threads and topics of Ike were BANNED. I am so sick and tired of people talking about this guy as if he was some sort of god. He barely beat Tua who was shutout by Lewis that should at least tell you something.
Yes Ike is overrated because his legacy is made up of potential "what ifs".

It's like Len Bias. Some people swear he could have been as good as MJ.

I agree with that wholeheartidly.

billythekid · Post by **billythekid** » 03 Aug 2006, 21:22

JAHamilton77 wrote:
BoxBuzz wrote:IKE vs Hercules......IKE KO 2

IKE vs Samson IKE KO 3

IKE vs the vicious BloodBladder beast from Herculon 9....IKE 15 RD one sided decision.

IKE vs T.Rex....IKE KO 5

IKE vs Two Mastadons and 5 saber tooth's. IKE ends up owning the Zoo.
You forgot a few

Ike

vs

http://slam.canoe.ca/WrestlingImagesB/bushwackers2.jpg

The BushWackers

Ike

vs

http://guide.supereva.com/wrestling/myimg/172069_1.jpg

Steiner Brothers

and

Ike

vs

http://guide.supereva.com/wrestling/myimg/172463_1.jpg

Akeem

Great post!!

I forgot all about AKEEM!!

thatsnotabanana · Post by **thatsnotabanana** » 03 Aug 2006, 21:56

Lennox ducked the following guys while he was still active:

Chris Byrd (he was afraid of being boxed silly)
John Ruiz (his clinching would have frustrated the hell out of him)
Wladimir Klitschko (had Lennox not have bitched out of boxing, he would have been forced to fight either Vitali (again) or Wladimir. Funny, you spar with a guy in Ocean's 11, but you won't face him for real. LOL)

Lennox would have ducked the following guys today.
Sam Peter (he hits to hard for him, he would have bitched out)
Nikolay Valuev (he's too tall, he would have bitched out)
Brian Minto (he's horrible and he still would have bitched out)

RIP Lennox- the best guy you beat was an ancient Iron Mike

IBEABUCHI RULES- he actually stood in there and fought David Tua instead of grappling all night. Lennox ain't got the nutsac for something that size.

lvlarc · Post by **lvlarc** » 03 Aug 2006, 22:04

thatsnotabanana wrote:Lennox ducked the following guys while he was still active:

Chris Byrd (he was afraid of being boxed silly)
John Ruiz (his clinching would have frustrated the hell out of him)
Wladimir Klitschko (had Lennox not have bitched out of boxing, he would have been forced to fight either Vitali (again) or Wladimir. Funny, you spar with a guy in Ocean's 11, but you won't face him for real. LOL)

Lennox would have ducked the following guys today.
Sam Peter (he hits to hard for him, he would have bitched out)
Nikolay Valuev (he's too tall, he would have bitched out)
Brian Minto (he's horrible and he still would have bitched out)

RIP Lennox- the best guy you beat was an ancient Iron Mike

So many retards on this forum today.

So your saying he wouldn't fight Peter, but fought (and schooled) big hitting Tua. (Peter is a poor mans Tua) Lewis would of easily beat every guy on that list. Funny thing is, had Lewis not fought Rahman,Tyson Vitali then there would still be trolls saying he ducked those too.

Lennox Lewis is an ATG, deal with it.

billythekid · Post by **billythekid** » 03 Aug 2006, 22:12

thatsnotabanana wrote:Lennox ducked the following guys while he was still active:

Chris Byrd (he was afraid of being boxed silly)
John Ruiz (his clinching would have frustrated the hell out of him)
Wladimir Klitschko (had Lennox not have bitched out of boxing, he would have been forced to fight either Vitali (again) or Wladimir. Funny, you spar with a guy in Ocean's 11, but you won't face him for real. LOL)

Lennox would have ducked the following guys today.
Sam Peter (he hits to hard for him, he would have bitched out)
Nikolay Valuev (he's too tall, he would have bitched out)
Brian Minto (he's horrible and he still would have bitched out)

RIP Lennox- the best guy you beat was an ancient Iron Mike

IBEABUCHI RULES- he actually stood in there and fought David Tua instead of grappling all night. Lennox ain't got the nutsac for something that size.

Lennox dominated Tua you moron. Put on a HW boxing clinic.

billythekid · Post by **billythekid** » 03 Aug 2006, 22:14

lvlarc_uk wrote:
thatsnotabanana wrote:Lennox ducked the following guys while he was still active:

Chris Byrd (he was afraid of being boxed silly)
John Ruiz (his clinching would have frustrated the hell out of him)
Wladimir Klitschko (had Lennox not have bitched out of boxing, he would have been forced to fight either Vitali (again) or Wladimir. Funny, you spar with a guy in Ocean's 11, but you won't face him for real. LOL)

Lennox would have ducked the following guys today.
Sam Peter (he hits to hard for him, he would have bitched out)
Nikolay Valuev (he's too tall, he would have bitched out)
Brian Minto (he's horrible and he still would have bitched out)

RIP Lennox- the best guy you beat was an ancient Iron Mike

So many retards on this forum today.

So your saying he wouldn't fight Peter, but fought (and schooled) big hitting Tua. (Peter is a poor mans Tua) Lewis would of easily beat every guy on that list. Funny thing is, had Lewis not fought Rahman,Tyson Vitali then there would still be trolls saying he ducked those too.

Lennox Lewis is an ATG, deal with it.

Why the hatred for Lewis? Because he was not American. Is that where all this HW apathy started? With the domination of Euro heavies.