Taylor Vs Catterall: Who paid the judges?

[Wee Tommy]

Ben Shalom isn’t just upset, he’s embarrassed and disgusted and asked for an inquest.

So let’s assume it wasn’t him who paid off the judges.

Who did?

The decision was certainly wrong and so far the only person I know scoring for Taylor is Andre Ward.

[margaret thatcher]

and ward of course is employed by espn, which has a huge deal with josh's promoter

[Wee Tommy]

and ward of course is employed by espn, which has a huge deal with josh's promoter

I know.

Who paid the judges? I just want to see peoples opinions on the question.

[jimmystone]

The judges aren't paid a bung. It doesn't work like that. They are in the position they are for the same reason burly coppers in riot gear lift eight stone women off the streets for protesting about war. They are lickspittles.

[Boxerbeetle]

I doubt anyone paid them off specifically, they just know the way the sport works. Taylor was the hometown hero, he’s got big money fights on the horizon, and he’s undisputed. Whereas Catterall is hardly known and (imo) is a worse boxer overall despite definitely performing better tonight, so - had he got the decision- might well have ended up losing the belts to some random guy in his very next fight. The judges just took the easy route and went for the better overall result for boxing.

It’s the same way the big Premier League team almost always get dodgy decisions go in their favour - no-one is paying off the referees, because they don’t need to bother. The corruption is institutionalised.

[Ned Stark]

When Macklin was saying his scores I remember thinking the judges would probably give some of those early tight rounds to Taylor. They always favour the champion, it’s bullshit but happens and no fault of Catterall.

I’ve said for years the whole scoring system is shite and needs totally revamping. 10-9 rounds when they are almost even and then a 10-9 round for a round that is clearly won but not dominated is just crap. And just one point advantage for a knockdown is also crap

[Ned Stark]

I doubt anyone paid them off specifically, they just know the way the sport works. Taylor was the hometown hero, he’s got big money fights on the horizon, and he’s undisputed. Whereas Catterall is hardly known and (imo) is a worse boxer overall despite definitely performing better tonight, so - had he got the decision- might well have ended up losing the belts to some random guy in his very next fight. The judges just took the easy route and went for the better overall result for boxing.

It’s the same way the big Premier League team almost always get dodgy decisions go in their favour - no-one is paying off the referees, because they don’t need to bother. The corruption is institutionalised.

Yep, be better bringing in foreign judges who don’t know the fighters as well. Unconscious bias due to reputation that will just judge what they see

[Boxerbeetle]

I’d like to see a 10 point system retained, but you just give marks out of ten to each guy per round.
Whoever has the higher total at the end wins. Give the judges an Excel spreadsheet instead of a notepad, job done.

[Coco]

I’d like to see a 10 point system retained, but you just give marks out of ten to each guy per round.
Whoever has the higher total at the end wins. Give the judges an Excel spreadsheet instead of a notepad, job done.

Would that stop inept or corrupt judging?

[high tower 1]

In many industries you have to pay to get business done eg construction industry notorious for it.

So is it really that far fetched that boxing , the industry in the sewer , doesn’t have the same thing going on ?

[Boxerbeetle]

I’d like to see a 10 point system retained, but you just give marks out of ten to each guy per round.
Whoever has the higher total at the end wins. Give the judges an Excel spreadsheet instead of a notepad, job done.

Would that stop inept or corrupt judging?

Well nothing will really stop that, except the complete structural overhaul which everyone knows is needed but will never come. But a system with an opportunity for much wider ranges of score distributions might put a better focus on exactly how judges are coming to these conclusions.

[Wee Tommy]

In many industries you have to pay to get business done eg construction industry notorious for it.

So is it really that far fetched that boxing , the industry in the sewer , doesn’t have the same thing going on ?

I work In construction and had to pay lots of backhanders to get good contracts. It’s just the accepted way.

So I fail to see how judges in boxing just score on who is the ‘bigger name’ or ‘better for boxing’ as some seem to think. I’m fact I think it’s absurd.

They either get paid to blacken their names or they don’t. Nobody does shît for nothing.

[Boxerbeetle]

It’s not for nothing though, it means they’re keeping the big names and big promoters happy, meaning they get booked again as judges for the next fight. Simple.

[margaret thatcher]

why do the crap decisions so hugely go towards the house fighters? rather than being split roughly equally between a side and b side?

imagine josh taylor putting on a boxing lesson and dropping his opponent in glascow, only to lose the decision. that type of thing would be far less common than what we saw tonight

[Wee Tommy]

Personally I feel it’s got to be the A sides promotors who pay either the judges or the board under the table.

[coneye]

Only way to slow it down , don't hink you will ever eradicate it , but hold the judges accountable they get rid of the old boys club mentality and just simply hold them accountable The one judge especielly should be brought in made to watch the fight and explain how and why he got the ridiculous scores , then downgraded to novice fights .

But the worst thing about it all is we or at least I have come to expect it ,, Think i posted around the 8th rnd that Catt better stop messing about and get a move on , by not dominating the last few rnds he was giving bad judges the excuse they needed , too much wrestling and holding , where ass a few good straight clean and clear down the middle punches would of stood out and made it difficult for them to justify there discision ,,, has my old trainer used to say and would off said ,,, Taylor did'nt win that Catt lost it and he lost it the rnd he started holding and stopped throwing .

Because to be honest Taylor looked absolute shite , thinking about it he was there ready to take a bad beating of Catt if Catt had threw more leather

[jimmystone]

These men are ringside week in week out, including at the biggest fights in the world. The best seat in the house and they are given expenses for the privilege. They are also empowered. This is payment. The alternative for them is to be sat at home like the rest of us, or digging deep for ticket money. If they do not, overwhelmingly, make sure the 'right' man wins, they'll be out on their ear. Like I said above, they are lickspittles. Leaders don't have to order jack-booted troops to stamp on a dissident's heads, it goes unsaid and happens anyway.

People like Bunce don't see this as corruption because he's in the same boat. There are plenty who are better at writing and talking than him but he's in the club and, therefore, can't see the wood for the trees.

[Ned Stark]

It’s not for nothing though, it means they’re keeping the big names and big promoters happy, meaning they get booked again as judges for the next fight. Simple.

In one. They’re booking their next job

[mickey1975]

The worrying thing is, nobody except Josh and two judges thought he won. Nobody. Frampton is a friend of his and said it was disgusting. He just didn't win that fight.

[dan28uk]

I’d like to see a 10 point system retained, but you just give marks out of ten to each guy per round.
Whoever has the higher total at the end wins. Give the judges an Excel spreadsheet instead of a notepad, job done.

you would get a lot more dodgy decisions that way

[mickey1975]

I’d like to see a 10 point system retained, but you just give marks out of ten to each guy per round.
Whoever has the higher total at the end wins. Give the judges an Excel spreadsheet instead of a notepad, job done.

you would get a lot more dodgy decisions that way

But it's not a 10 point system is it? It's a 10 point must.

[BroughtonRulesRefuge]

- MTK

Surprised you Brits ain't sussed this out yet. Josh signed in 2020 for two excellent fights before this. JC Ramirez another, but don't know if he was signed at the time of their fight, and since boxrec don't list them, don't know if he's still signed.

Eddie the only promoter of note with youth that I can think of. Arum, King, Haymon, Fwank, they ain't long for this world or boxing, so MTK having gone international has a lot of room for expansion which is what they seem to be doing, and the red light sport of boxing that nobody but the dwindling fan base care for with it's sordid history of corruption and lack of unifying organization and cogent, transparent rules of open scoring, yo, Baby, yeah, gimmee some!

I'm not commenting on this fight as I didn't see it, and since most folks don't score fights and the few that do generally lack coherency and tend to go for "their guy," robberies weekly from time immemorial with no end in sight. Then the betting angle when your guy is the one getting stiffed, well, that's like getting personally stiffed. Could be arguing over boxing is just as important as watching for some. Lot's of different backgrounds and personalities on boxrec, so whether honestly or ethically arrived at, always gonna be disagreements weekly.

Your ball sports have less of these disagreements involving scoring because they are coherent organizations who know there has to be a level of officiating to match the excellence of the highly trained athletes competing. Usually disputes or over single incidences rather than a cumulative score, thus the team winner of ball sports is seldom questioned because the fans have access to the scoring via the scoreboard.

Boxing has Punch Monkey stats that ain't even sanctioned as officially part of any fight nor trained and licensed Monkeys to punch out their Wizards of the Universe game consoles.

?MTK, so who knows what? Headquarters somewhere, Dubai maybe? Public Relations department? I know the reputed head originateskicked) out of your sunny isles, and?

[Boxerbeetle]

Using Brook-Khan as a recent example, Brook basically beat the shit out of Khan for the whole of round 5, battered him from pillar to post. It’s just not right that it would be scored 10-9, or 10-8 at best, under the current system. If you were marking each guy out of 10 using the full range, that round would be like 9-4, something like that. Much more reflective of the “story of the fight” (hate that phrase ) than the 10 point must system.

You’ll never eradicate corruption, but it would at least be something different and might somewhat reduce the amount of marginal decisions we keep getting, all somehow miraculously in favour of the A side guy.

[Ezzard]

I doubt anyone paid them off specifically, they just know the way the sport works. Taylor was the hometown hero, he’s got big money fights on the horizon, and he’s undisputed. Whereas Catterall is hardly known and (imo) is a worse boxer overall despite definitely performing better tonight, so - had he got the decision- might well have ended up losing the belts to some random guy in his very next fight. The judges just took the easy route and went for the better overall result for boxing.

It’s the same way the big Premier League team almost always get dodgy decisions go in their favour - no-one is paying off the referees, because they don’t need to bother. The corruption is institutionalised.

Sounds about right to me.

[Coco]

I don't reckon any of the judges have big houses and flash cars.

If someone was genuinely bent, the money which would change hands would be enormous to fix a fight.

It's more like they know what side there bread is buttered on, and it keeps them working regular.

The other thing is that this isn't new and I don't think it's any worse, it's just between more live tv, more comment, more social media, things are much more obv.