I remember reading this a couple of years ago and have stumbled across it again... very debatable.
In 2003, Ring Magazine published a list of 100 greatest punchers of all time in boxing, as voted by the magazine's writers.
Various criteria were used for the voting: what percentage of fights by each boxer resulted as knockout wins, how many knockouts and knockout streaks each boxer had, what important rivals he knocked out during his career, and who he couldn't knock out.
List of boxing's all time greatest punchers, as deemed by Ring's writers:
1 Joe Louis
2 Sam Langford
3 Jimmy Wilde
4 Archie Moore
5 Sandy Saddler
6 Stanley Ketchel
7 Jack Dempsey
8 Bob Fitzsimmons
9 George Foreman
10 Earnie Shavers
11 Sugar Ray Robinson
12 Ruben Olivares
13 Wilfredo Gómez
14 Rocky Marciano
15 Sonny Liston
16 Mike Tyson
17 Bob Foster
18 Thomas Hearns
19 Khaosai Galaxy
20 Alexis Arguello
21 Carlos Zarate
22 Max Baer
23 Rocky Graziano
24 Matthew Saad Muhammad
25 Julian Jackson
26 Danny Lopez
27 Gerald McClellan
28 Roberto Duran
29 Rodrigo Valdez
30 Félix Trinidad
31 Jose Cuevas
32 Jim Jeffries
33 Lennox Lewis
34 Bennie Briscoe
35 Marvin Hagler
36 Edwin Rosario
37 Tommy Ryan
38 John Mugabi
39 Joe Frazier
40 Carlos Monzon
41 Tony Zale
42 Michael Spinks
43 Joe Gans
44 Elmer Ray
45 George Godfrey
46 Naseem Hamed
47 Alfonso Zamora
48 David Tua
49 Cleveland Williams
50 Julio Cesar Chavez
51 Tiger Jack Fox
52 Joe Walcott
53 Gerry Cooney
54 Al Bummy Davis
55 Max Schmeling
56 Jesse Vincent Florentino
57 Henry Armstrong
58 Bob Satterfield
59 Al Hostak
60 Jesus Pimentel
61 Eugene Hart
62 Lew Jenkins
63 Harry Wills
64 Tom Sharkey
65 Terry McGovern
66 Jersey Joe Walcott
67 Kostya Tszyu
68 Leotis Martin
69 Buddy Baer
70 Donovan Ruddock
71 Jose Luis Ramirez
72 Tommy Gómez
73 Jose Napoles
74 Kid McCoy
75 Antonio Esparragoza
76 Ricardo Moreno
77 Evander Holyfield
78 Ike Williams
79 Luis Firpo
80 Ricardo Lopez
81 Humberto Gonzalez
82 Bobby Chacon
83 Jock McAvoy
84 Eduardo Lause
85 Eder Jofre
86 Charley Burley
87 Mike McCallum
88 Salvador Sánchez
89 Roy Jones Jr.
90 Rodolfo Gato Gonzalez
91 Nigel Benn
92 Irish Bob Murphy
93 Paul Berlenbach
94 Battling Torres
95 Chalky Wright
96 George Chaney
97 Andy Ganigan
98 Fred Fulton
99 Ingemar Johansson
100 Charley White
As usual, some debate rose among fans concerning this list: many wondered, for example, why wasn't Aaron Pryor, who scored 35 knockouts in 40 fights and beat #20 Alexis Arguello twice by knockout, included. Others wondered why were Edwin Rosario (#36) and Danny Lopez (#26), placed higher than some of their conquerors, in Rosario's case, Julio Cesar Chavez (#50) and Jose Luis Ramirez (#71). In Lopez's case, Bobby Chacon (#82) and Salvador Sánchez (#88).
Top 100 Punchers Of All Time
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SticknMove
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 5987
- Joined: 04 Aug 2006, 09:02
There will always be debate about all time lists. I remember seeing a few of Pryors fights including Arguello-Pryor 1 and 2. I think the reason Pryor is not included on the list is because he did not have the one punch punching power that other guys on this list have. He was a swarming non stop puncher that wore most of his opponents down. Whereas Arguello had natural punching power at the lighter weights. Edwin Rosario was another big one punch hitter who deserves his place IMO. JC Chavez had good one punch power at the lighter weights, but tended to wear opponents down as he moved up. The list has been compiled on a fighters raw punching power, not on who they beat or lost to.
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Lefthookhappy19
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 968
- Joined: 16 Apr 2004, 19:15
Roy Jones at 89 is ridiculusly low. Roy had an amazing punch at middle and supermiddle, he had good power as a lightheavy. He even stung Ruiz at heavyweight. Roy Jones has a ton of pure one punch KO's. Some amazing ones.
That list is totally stupid, to many to name. Archie Moore was a great fighter. Sure, he holds the record for ko's. But he wasn't the number 4 p4p puncher of all time. No way. He was a good puncher, but not the colossal one that ranking suggests.
That list is totally stupid, to many to name. Archie Moore was a great fighter. Sure, he holds the record for ko's. But he wasn't the number 4 p4p puncher of all time. No way. He was a good puncher, but not the colossal one that ranking suggests.
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TerribleTerry
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 5272
- Joined: 29 Aug 2003, 12:30
Lists like these will always create some debate.... Not sure why Holyfield is on the list at all. Personally I think 16 is a little low for Tyson, whose shots made a different noise to most other fighters.
If they are too include non elite fighters (like David Tua) then where is Ensley Bingham.
Thomas Hearns a little low also and I thought Don Curry might have warranted a low position on the list.
If they are too include non elite fighters (like David Tua) then where is Ensley Bingham.
Thomas Hearns a little low also and I thought Don Curry might have warranted a low position on the list.
Tyson is an interesting one to rank on lists like this. While Tyson was undeniably a big puncher his KO's came more from the way his handspeed and great combination punching allowed him to unload multiple accurate shots on his opponents. I feel Tyson is often ranked above harder punchers who could not set up the OK's as well as him.
For example Julian Jackson is 9 places below Tyson at 25, while Tyson was a far better fighter he never starched people the way Jackson did even early in his career. Had tyson had the kind of power Jackson did he would have been perhaps the most terrorfying fighter ever.
For example Julian Jackson is 9 places below Tyson at 25, while Tyson was a far better fighter he never starched people the way Jackson did even early in his career. Had tyson had the kind of power Jackson did he would have been perhaps the most terrorfying fighter ever.
I do agree that Jackson should be very close to Tyson - both should be higher. I still think Tyson should be higher though, but I suppose its all opinion.J-C wrote:Tyson is an interesting one to rank on lists like this. While Tyson was undeniably a big puncher his KO's came more from the way his handspeed and great combination punching allowed him to unload multiple accurate shots on his opponents. I feel Tyson is often ranked above harder punchers who could not set up the OK's as well as him.
For example Julian Jackson is 9 places below Tyson at 25, while Tyson was a far better fighter he never starched people the way Jackson did even early in his career. Had tyson had the kind of power Jackson did he would have been perhaps the most terrorfying fighter ever.
I can see what your saying, but he one punched KO'd many of his fighters also. Carl Williams, Trevor Berbick, Frans Botha etc. For all the criticisms of Big Frank out of three big punchers - Lewis, McCall and Tyson he only tasted the canvas with Mike. Sure the likes of Biggs (done on purpose), Holmes and Thomas were more a culmative effect, but its still an indicator of his power - how resiliant champions like Thomas and Holmes were absolutely gone physically and mentally by the shear volume AND power of Tyson's punches - all before the half way stage.
As for your last like, for 2 years I think he was. For two years Tyson was the closest I think we have ever been to the perfect fighting machine.
Yes, I don't mind having Louis at number 1 - but disagree with Lewis over Tyson.Terence wrote:You cannot dispute Louis at #1. He could crack, combos and single shots. I'd have Lewis right up there, he could KO any fighter with his shots if he went for it, aside from the concrete chin types. I'd put him higher from Tyson, at a high level, could only KO guys who were afraid and bowed before they got in the ring, if you stood up to him suddenly his mythical power went for a burton as he was too scared to commit. Lewis was better with the one shots also.
So Holmes, Biggs, Thomas, Carl Williams etc all crapped themselves before the fight?
I'm not stating that Tyson should be ranked higher than Lewis - but that for those breif two years Tyson was absolutely fantastic. He was mentally shot by Douglas and physically shot when he returned from Jail.
Yes, Bonecrush and Tucker held their way to decisions loses, but then so did Mavrovic vs Lewis. He also struggled to hurt Bruno untill Frank gassed and had as much difficulty nailing Akinwande as Tyson did Bonecrusher.
If you look at a comparison of opponents - Botha KO 2 Lewis, Botha KO 5 Tyson - both spectacular KO's.
Holyfield TKO 11 and WDQ 3 Tyson
Holyfield D 12 and L PTS 12 Lewis
- However, Tyson hurt Holyfield in the opener in bout 1 and in the 3rd in bout 3. Lewis didn't hurt Holyfield untill late on in both fights.
Lewis TKO 7 Bruno
Tyson TKO 5 and TKO 3 Bruno. - Tyson floors Bruno, Lewis only hurts Bruno in 7th.
Razor Ruddock - Yep Fair cop, Lewis did him well - although of course Tyson might have worn his chin.
Biggs - Both pretty distructive, again he was older and not necessarily wiser vs Lewis.
Just ask Frank Bruno who hit the harder.
The reasn Bruno was 'scared' going into fight 2 was because his eye was gone and he basically knew he had no chance once he got hit round about the eye....Terence wrote:For two brief years he was amazing. Yes, and for a short while Adam and Eve lived in the garden of Eden and everything was rosy, Tyson's perfection years are just as hard to swallow.stujones wrote:Yes, I don't mind having Louis at number 1 - but disagree with Lewis over Tyson.Terence wrote:You cannot dispute Louis at #1. He could crack, combos and single shots. I'd have Lewis right up there, he could KO any fighter with his shots if he went for it, aside from the concrete chin types. I'd put him higher from Tyson, at a high level, could only KO guys who were afraid and bowed before they got in the ring, if you stood up to him suddenly his mythical power went for a burton as he was too scared to commit. Lewis was better with the one shots also.
So Holmes, Biggs, Thomas, Carl Williams etc all crapped themselves before the fight?
I'm not stating that Tyson should be ranked higher than Lewis - but that for those breif two years Tyson was absolutely fantastic. He was mentally shot by Douglas and physically shot when he returned from Jail.
Yes, Bonecrush and Tucker held their way to decisions loses, but then so did Mavrovic vs Lewis. He also struggled to hurt Bruno untill Frank gassed and had as much difficulty nailing Akinwande as Tyson did Bonecrusher.
If you look at a comparison of opponents - Botha KO 2 Lewis, Botha KO 5 Tyson - both spectacular KO's.
Holyfield TKO 11 and WDQ 3 Tyson
Holyfield D 12 and L PTS 12 Lewis
- However, Tyson hurt Holyfield in the opener in bout 1 and in the 3rd in bout 3. Lewis didn't hurt Holyfield untill late on in both fights.
Lewis TKO 7 Bruno
Tyson TKO 5 and TKO 3 Bruno. - Tyson floors Bruno, Lewis only hurts Bruno in 7th.
Razor Ruddock - Yep Fair cop, Lewis did him well - although of course Tyson might have worn his chin.
Biggs - Both pretty distructive, again he was older and not necessarily wiser vs Lewis.
Just ask Frank Bruno who hit the harder.
Pinklon Thomas was knackered between rounds, never stopped sure, yet Tyson had to nail him with shot after shot before the legs crumbled, they were not blown out from under him.
Biggs also took a lot of cutting before the job was done and Holmes was in no real state, when he fought like Larry Holmes, however briefly, Tyson looked pedestrian. Like I say Tyson could look awesome if you was cowed and he could throw those shots at you but if you fired back he would not throw the shots with anything like full fury. If Lewis caught a guy clean with a single shot he could flatten him. Most of Tyson's shots that people trot out with the sound and impact were in his younger days against men of less calibre.
Didn't Lewis drop Tucker?
You could ask Bruno who hit the harder, he may say Tyson but Frank was terrified going into fight two, if you are scared a small spider can look huge. You could ask Ruddock who hit the harder and he'll say Tyson, afterall it was the cold nip in the air that Ko'd Razor. What Lewis-Ruddock and there is no doubt who hit harder. Tyson's power never carried beyond a point where the other guy was not afraid or in some way complacent. Lewis carried his throughout a career and scored two of his most spectacular KO's late-on and at a decent level (Tyson & Rahman). Ettiene is the best Tyson can produce late-on and he was shitting himself.
It is pretty relative though, probably a question of what type of finish you look for.
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Hardhitters11
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 942
- Joined: 02 Sep 2003, 13:20
Think we might have another long debate here!Terence wrote:[
For two brief years he was amazing. Yes, and for a short while Adam and Eve lived in the garden of Eden and everything was rosy, Tyson's perfection years are just as hard to swallow.
Pinklon Thomas was knackered between rounds, never stopped sure, yet Tyson had to nail him with shot after shot before the legs crumbled, they were not blown out from under him.
Biggs also took a lot of cutting before the job was done and Holmes was in no real state, when he fought like Larry Holmes, however briefly, Tyson looked pedestrian. Like I say Tyson could look awesome if you was cowed and he could throw those shots at you but if you fired back he would not throw the shots with anything like full fury. If Lewis caught a guy clean with a single shot he could flatten him. Most of Tyson's shots that people trot out with the sound and impact were in his younger days against men of less calibre.
Didn't Lewis drop Tucker?
You could ask Bruno who hit the harder, he may say Tyson but Frank was terrified going into fight two, if you are scared a small spider can look huge. You could ask Ruddock who hit the harder and he'll say Tyson, afterall it was the cold nip in the air that Ko'd Razor. What Lewis-Ruddock and there is no doubt who hit harder. Tyson's power never carried beyond a point where the other guy was not afraid or in some way complacent. Lewis carried his throughout a career and scored two of his most spectacular KO's late-on and at a decent level (Tyson & Rahman). Ettiene is the best Tyson can produce late-on and he was shitting himself.
It is pretty relative though, probably a question of what type of finish you look for.
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First of all simple maths - Tyson has a Win to KO percentage of 88% Lewis = a poultry (lol) 78%. Tyson has had more KO's than Lewis has had fights.
Anyway, as with your debate on world class I'm finding you contradicting yourself. Its all very well to say that it wasn't a one punch KO but a systematic beating that Tyson got to Pinklon Thomas and Tyrrel Biggs - but then of course Lewis's KO over Tyson wasn't. Lewis gave Tyson the beating of all beatings for 7 rounds and yet Tyson still stood and he was hopelessly knackered after round 1. Whilst the final blow was destructive - that fact that it took Lewis that long is indicative of his power.
I don't think we should be debating power of longevity of career when discussing KO power. The fact is that Tyson was a shot fighter in his 30's and the reason why people still crave for a Lewis return because appart from his final fight - he looked very good at 38. He was more proffesional, only twice got out of shape (one defeat, one average display) and definately a better fighter than Tyson in their 30's.
Besides - with regards to Tyson, how to we define late on? Does the 5 times KD of Julius Francis = late on? Does the 30 second destruction of Lou Savarese = late on? Does the single punch KO over Frans Botha when spent and heading to defeat = late on? Also, much of the reason why you cannot think of a clear Tyson KO late on is because he didn't fight much late in his career =10 fights between 1997 and 2005. Year long gaps between Golota and Neilson, Etteine and Willians and Williams and McBride.
However, that is not the debate - the debate is who has the most destructive KO power. Marvin Hagler went 23 out of 24 rounds in his last two fights - does that mean he couldn't punch for tofee? Thomas Hearns hasn't scored an early KO in 8 years - do we doubt his power in his peak?
The fact is Lewis had MUCH better longevity than Tyson. If Lewis came back and didn't score any KD - know one would dispute his power. Indeed, Foreman was still considered a fearsome puncher during his second career - but his KO percentage was actually distinctly average vs mainly second class fighters.
Carl Williams was a very good fighter with a well respected chin at the time of their fight. If you have seen this bout then you will know he didn't shit himself and was having a good minute when bang - out like a light. Lets not forget Williams ran a Champion Larry Holmes very very close. Two fights later he lose a split decision to the powerful Tim Witherspoon.
Tony Tubbs, again might not have looked much but was a damn underated fighter - this can be seen by the relative success he has today. This fighter went the distance with the likes of Bonecrusher Smith, Greg Page, Time Witherspoon etc. Tyson did him in two. Did he crap himself? No - he won the first round in the opinion of most people at the time. The way he tottered about after one punch from Tyson (on the back foot) was quite frightening.
As bad as these fighters were compared to the 70's - they were both much better than the 2001 version of Tyson and Hassim Rahman.
The one thing that I think people should consider when making lists like this is bringing up the shots when really under the cosh. You say that when people stood up to Tyson he folded, true in most cases - but still I have to mention Frans Botha and James Douglas. He was getting a systematic beating and he KO'd Botha and floored Douglas when all but out. That is true power, that is what I admired about Julien Jackson - look how one punch saved him from certain defeat vs Graham.
Lewis, to his credit - never got the opportunity to do this. Some might say the Bruno fight but it wasn't to the same extent as Tyson was vs Botha.
The reason why Bruno shat himself IMO was because he was facing the guy who kicked the shit out of him in his prime. Perhaps he would have done the same in a Lewis rematch, but Lennox never had the opportunity.
Perhaps there is a reason why all these people shat themselves vs Tyson and not so much (according to you) vs Lewis, although I don't really buy that they did untill his actual defeat (Tillman and Stewart did) and his return (Seldon, Bruno, McNelley etc).
Spinks, Holmes, Williams, Tubbs, Biggs, Thomas, Berbick, Tucker, all went in against Tyson with the belief they would win... Fair enough, Bonecrusher didn't.
Last edited by stujones on 05 Aug 2006, 16:45, edited 1 time in total.
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MightyWarrior
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 13284
- Joined: 23 Jan 2003, 14:01
Thats true and the Evander Holyfield one also baffles me. I have to say Tua's power has been overated also.MightyWarrior wrote:It's a crap list anyway. High ratings for Duran & Hagler - all time greats yes, but never know for having huge KO power were they?
Just a brief look shows Duran rated above P4P jaw breakers like Cuevas & Trinidad - bizzare...put together by a drunken hack by the looks of it
Its such a hard list to even do and I wouldn't contimplate thinking of doing it. I'm not sure Bob Foster is top 5 for that reason alone (i.e. how to omit) but I agree with expug he should be right up there.
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Lefthookhappy19
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 968
- Joined: 16 Apr 2004, 19:15
This post is funny. If anything it backs up Lewis as being the bigger puncher. I don't understand the Bruno points. He was going down had the ref not stepped in. Also, the Bruno that fought Tyson was scared stiff. He was really fired up for the Lewis fights and refused to go down. Bruno also said Bonecrusher Smith hit harder than Tyson. I don't really think fighters opinions can be trusted here on the punching issue, they always put their own spin on it when asked the "who hits the hardest" question.stujones wrote:Yes, I don't mind having Louis at number 1 - but disagree with Lewis over Tyson.Terence wrote:You cannot dispute Louis at #1. He could crack, combos and single shots. I'd have Lewis right up there, he could KO any fighter with his shots if he went for it, aside from the concrete chin types. I'd put him higher from Tyson, at a high level, could only KO guys who were afraid and bowed before they got in the ring, if you stood up to him suddenly his mythical power went for a burton as he was too scared to commit. Lewis was better with the one shots also.
So Holmes, Biggs, Thomas, Carl Williams etc all crapped themselves before the fight?
I'm not stating that Tyson should be ranked higher than Lewis - but that for those breif two years Tyson was absolutely fantastic. He was mentally shot by Douglas and physically shot when he returned from Jail.
Yes, Bonecrush and Tucker held their way to decisions loses, but then so did Mavrovic vs Lewis. He also struggled to hurt Bruno untill Frank gassed and had as much difficulty nailing Akinwande as Tyson did Bonecrusher.
If you look at a comparison of opponents - Botha KO 2 Lewis, Botha KO 5 Tyson - both spectacular KO's.
Holyfield TKO 11 and WDQ 3 Tyson
Holyfield D 12 and L PTS 12 Lewis
- However, Tyson hurt Holyfield in the opener in bout 1 and in the 3rd in bout 3. Lewis didn't hurt Holyfield untill late on in both fights.
Lewis TKO 7 Bruno
Tyson TKO 5 and TKO 3 Bruno. - Tyson floors Bruno, Lewis only hurts Bruno in 7th.
Razor Ruddock - Yep Fair cop, Lewis did him well - although of course Tyson might have worn his chin.
Biggs - Both pretty distructive, again he was older and not necessarily wiser vs Lewis.
Just ask Frank Bruno who hit the harder.
If Lennox Lewis landed that right hand it was over. You saw Tyson mainly overwealm guys with multiple really fast, hard punches.
This is a matter of opinion. Imo, Lewis's right hand is better than any punch Tyson could throw.
I will repeat, Carl Williams, Tony Tubbs, Michael Spinks, Trevor Berbick, Frans Botha - were were these multiple punches.Lefthookhappy19 wrote:
If Lennox Lewis landed that right hand it was over. You saw Tyson mainly overwealm guys with multiple really fast, hard punches.
This is a matter of opinion. Imo, Lewis's right hand is better than any punch Tyson could throw.
Also, have I mentioned the second Tyson vs Bruno fight? Tyson had Bruno down with the first punch landed in the first fight between the two. Bruno was stopped on his feet vs Tyson also and was equally fired up in fight 1. However, Tyson hurt and floored Bruno early - Bruno only got hurt when he was gassed vs Lewis.
I'm not disputing Lewis' right hand wasn't a crisp shot, but give Tyson his dues he scored many a one shot KO of equally distructive measure as Lewis did.
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Old bones Ian
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 11805
- Joined: 13 Jul 2004, 07:33
good to see wilde nice and high, but i think atleast number 2 or definitely a case for the top spot is reserved for the ghost with the hammer in his hand. Also Foreman wants to be a bit higher imo. Probably a couple more holes i could pick in this but i only glanced at it, and it is a VERY good list to me.
The list is from 2003 so maybe that's why Manny isn't in there. I would also think there is a case for McClellan to be ranked higher. Had never been beyond eight rounds prior to the Benn fight and had the quickest title KO in middleweight history with a twenty second KO of Jay Bell. Out of his 31 wins, 20 of them came in the first round.topper123 wrote:is it only boxers who have retired on the list, because if it isn't shouldn't Manny Pacquiao get a look in?
Great puncher, and has stopped quality boxers
Surely Valero could also make it in here eventually. To have either stopped or knocked down every opponent he has faced in the first round is incredible, but he'd have to do it against better opponents (and Mosquera is a start) before being ranked with the greats.