Tony Tubbs vs Luis Ortiz

[Cojimar 1946]

Who wins over 12.

[Vlad]

Ortiz UD close

[DrDuke]

It would be intriguing. Both were skillful and technical. I can see it going either way. Ortiz has more power, so him stopping Tubbs at some point seems possible.

[scorpio83]

Prime Tubbs by out-boxing Ortiz behind his left jabs and combinations on the outside to take a decision without engaging too much on the inside against the Cuban.

[Ambling Alp II]

Tubbs had a good chin, so he would be able to take anything Ortiz landed. Tubbs in a decision, in a boring fight.

[Cojimar 1946]

It's too bad we didn't see Ortiz in with better opponents as that might give us a better gauge of how good he is.

I was inspired to make the threat based on wondering how this era compares with the 1990s and Ortiz basically seems like this eras equivalent of tubbs in the 1990s. Both are leftovers from the prior era but hung around for a while.

I thought the following were other good 90s vs Fury/Usyk era matchups
Fury vs Lewis
Bowe vs Joshua
Holyfield vs Usyk
Moorer vs Parker
Bruno vs Whyte
Povetkin vs Withersdpoon
Pulev vs Tucker
Norris vs Ruiz

[Ambling Alp II]

Guys from the 90s would have gone 7-1. Some pretty clear differences here. Guess Orlin Norris would have lost.

[Vlad]

It's too bad we didn't see Ortiz in with better opponents as that might give us a better gauge of how good he is.

I was inspired to make the threat based on wondering how this era compares with the 1990s and Ortiz basically seems like this eras equivalent of tubbs in the 1990s. Both are leftovers from the prior era but hung around for a while.

I thought the following were other good 90s vs Fury/Usyk era matchups
Fury vs Lewis
Bowe vs Joshua
Holyfield vs Usyk
Moorer vs Parker
Bruno vs Whyte
Povetkin vs Withersdpoon
Pulev vs Tucker
Norris vs Ruiz

Morrison vs Ruiz or Mercer vs Ruiz would be a better than Norris vs Ruiz)

[margaret thatcher]

Guys from the 90s would have gone 7-1. Some pretty clear differences here. Guess Orlin Norris would have lost.

maybe if we got some more '10 round fighters' for usyk to face, he'd have a chance

[Ambling Alp II]

Wow. After all this time you still don't get it.

Most of the time, when a fighter starts out, he isn't fighting 10-round fights. He is fighting 4 or 6 round fights against low level fighters on the undercard. If he does well enough, he usually moves up to fighting in 8 round and eventually 10-round fights.

Look at almost every fight card. The best fighters are fighting 10-round fighters and the lower level and/or inexperienced fighters fight 4 and 6 round fights.

Usually, (certainly not always) a guy fighting in 10-round fight is better than a guy fighting in a 6 round fight.

This is pretty much how it has been in boxing for more than 80 years.

Unbelievable that you don't understand this.

[Cojimar 1946]

Guys from the 90s would have gone 7-1. Some pretty clear differences here. Guess Orlin Norris would have lost.

I would think Usyk would have a good shot against Holyfield based on work rate. He throws 700+ punches per fight and could beat Holyfield by out working him.

I think Moorer, Lewis, and Bruno could be favored to win their matches though.

[margaret thatcher]

usyk simply doesnt have enough bouts vs '10 round fighters'. alp says that makes usyk a lesser cruiser than james toney was

[margaret thatcher]

Wow. After all this time you still don't get it.

Most of the time, when a fighter starts out, he isn't fighting 10-round fights. He is fighting 4 or 6 round fights against low level fighters on the undercard. If he does well enough, he usually moves up to fighting in 8 round and eventually 10-round fights.

Look at almost every fight card. The best fighters are fighting 10-round fighters and the lower level and/or inexperienced fighters fight 4 and 6 round fights.

Usually, (certainly not always) a guy fighting in 10-round fight is better than a guy fighting in a 6 round fight.

This is pretty much how it has been in boxing for more than 80 years.

Unbelievable that you don't understand this.

usyk was already boxing 8 rounders in his third fight and 10 rounders in his 5th fight, why the f@ck are you even on about 4 and 6 round fights

cant truly be great without beating the likes of mike rush and jason robinson!!lolol

[Ambling Alp II]

In post a few years ago, Usyk was being portrayed as some sort of legend. I pointed out that he had only 16 or 17 fights, and the first few were against stiffs in preliminary fights. (You didn't even know what it meant to call someone a 10-round fighter, which is unbelievable for anyone following the sport for any length of time. )
Thought it was a little too early to be calling him a legend. Then later, there was some comparison between him and Toney at cruiserweight; and somebody were saying Toney had not fought much at cruiserweight. I pointed out his fights compared to Usyk. That was about it.

(For the record, I think Usyk is a very good fighter. Just don't think he is the same class as someone like Holyfield.)

But you once are obsessed with this and bring it up constantly.
Sort of like when I made a comment in passing about Cleveland Williams once. You got obsessed with him then started 5 or 6 posts about him and always mock him with some carefully worded phrases. I don't think I have ever started a thread about Cleveland Williams.

you are the one bringing the same thing up over and over. Give it a frikkin rest.

[Ambling Alp II]

Guys from the 90s would have gone 7-1. Some pretty clear differences here. Guess Orlin Norris would have lost.

I would think Usyk would have a good shot against Holyfield based on work rate. He throws 700+ punches per fight and could beat Holyfield by out working him.

I think Moorer, Lewis, and Bruno could be favored to win their matches though.

If he tried to do that against Holyfield he would get eaten alive. He would take far more punishment that he ever has. This isn't Anthony Joshua here. Holyfield was very talented and tough as nails.

[DrDuke]

In post a few years ago, Usyk was being portrayed as some sort of legend. I pointed out that he had only 16 or 17 fights, and the first few were against stiffs in preliminary fights. (You didn't even know what it meant to call someone a 10-round fighter, which is unbelievable for anyone following the sport for any length of time. )
Thought it was a little too early to be calling him a legend. Then later, there was some comparison between him and Toney at cruiserweight; and somebody were saying Toney had not fought much at cruiserweight. I pointed out his fights compared to Usyk. That was about it.

(For the record, I think Usyk is a very good fighter. Just don't think he is the same class as someone like Holyfield.)

But you once are obsessed with this and bring it up constantly.
Sort of like when I made a comment in passing about Cleveland Williams once. You got obsessed with him then started 5 or 6 posts about him and always mock him with some carefully worded phrases. I don't think I have ever started a thread about Cleveland Williams.

you are the one bringing the same thing up over and over. Give it a frikkin rest.

You're delusional to claim that Usyk isn't in the same class with Holyfield. Actually, Usyk is way more technical than Evander, more polished and better defensively. His opposition in cruiserweight is better overall. Among the scalps of the two, Qawi can be the best, but the likes of Briedis, Gassiev follow easily. Head-to-head Usyk vs Holy is an even matchup majorly because Holy's terminator-like toughness, huge steel balls.

[margaret thatcher]

holyfield had a brief cruiser career, not enough 10 round fighters on his record there to be sure of it

[Cojimar 1946]

In post a few years ago, Usyk was being portrayed as some sort of legend. I pointed out that he had only 16 or 17 fights, and the first few were against stiffs in preliminary fights. (You didn't even know what it meant to call someone a 10-round fighter, which is unbelievable for anyone following the sport for any length of time. )
Thought it was a little too early to be calling him a legend. Then later, there was some comparison between him and Toney at cruiserweight; and somebody were saying Toney had not fought much at cruiserweight. I pointed out his fights compared to Usyk. That was about it.

(For the record, I think Usyk is a very good fighter. Just don't think he is the same class as someone like Holyfield.)

But you once are obsessed with this and bring it up constantly.
Sort of like when I made a comment in passing about Cleveland Williams once. You got obsessed with him then started 5 or 6 posts about him and always mock him with some carefully worded phrases. I don't think I have ever started a thread about Cleveland Williams.

you are the one bringing the same thing up over and over. Give it a frikkin rest.

You don't have to be especially high on Usyk to put him above Toney at cruiserweight who did very little at the weight aside from beating jirov. He seems to have better top wins and better depth.

Usyks top 6 wins might be
Breidis
Gassiev
Bellew
Hunter
Glowacki
Huck

I don't think Toney has a comparable top 6

[margaret thatcher]

toney only beat 1 top 10 cruiser, hell probably only 1 top 20 cruiser............jirov was good but comparable to briedis, gass, etc. you cant point to anything he did to be considered a league above them to the point where he basically overrides usyk's whole cw resume. what was his best win?

but but..........needs more 10 round fighters!!