PBC

[maverick23]

I was thinking earlier of PBC. I know that they’re sometimes criticised for not keeping their fighters active but they seem to be struggling more than ever now and that’s coupled with them seemingly being unable to deliver the big fights.

I could understand not having fighters active during covid but there’s no excuse now. I went through the roster on their site and picked out the bigger names (I’m sure I’ve missed some as their roster is well out of date). Few of them are fighting more than once this year and only a handful have had good fights this year.

What’s the issue?!?

David Benevidez - fought once this year against a long past their best David Lemieux. Lined up to fight Uzcategui early next year. Another uninspiring fight.

Jermall Charlo - no fight this year and nothing confirmed. 2 fights in the 2 years before then. Great talent but really disappointing he’s not active.

Jermell Charlo - amazing fighter. Great win earlier on this year but just 3 fights in 3 years. The Tszyu fight lined up should be good.

Gervonta Davis - one fight this year and they’re seemingly struggling to get a big fight over the line for him against the likes of Garcia and co. Unlikely to fight again this year. Really exciting fighter. Does relatively well on PPV.

Stephen Fulton - really well matched but just one fight this year. Seemingly nothing lined up.

Danny Garcia - one fight this year, nothing last year.

Caleb Plant - one fight this year against an over the hill Dirrell.

Andy Ruiz - I started writing about him being out twice this year. I can’t believe the Arreola fight was 18 months ago so just out once which apparently sold poorly on PPV.

The Russells - I think they’ve done well with Antuanne but GR Jr has wasted his career in the last few years with how inactive he’s been.

Leo Santa Cruz - one poor fight in 2 years and nothing confirmed lined up.

Frank Sanchez - a couple of ok fights this year. Neither as good as the Ajagba win from last year though.

Errol Spence - terrific win against in-house fighter Ugas. Not been able to deliver the big fight though in Crawford.

Keith Thurman - one fight in 3 1/2 years against a smaller Barrios. Nothing confirmed going forward.

Rey Vargas - a good win this year after being inactive. Should be fighting Foster next but not confirmed.

Deontay Wilder - one soft fight this year against Helenius which apparently sold poorly on PPV.

[Mexi-Box]

Possibly finally running out of money. Horrible business decision for the idiots that invested in Al Haymon. Crawford/Spence Jr. was an easy fight to make, but they both have huge egos and don't understand they aren't draws. To make, it'd be a huge monetary loss, and I think the investors are finally waking up and not fronting money to give people free tickets and PPV passwords to try and pad drawing power.

[maverick23]

Possibly finally running out of money. Horrible business decision for the idiots that invested in Al Haymon. Crawford/Spence Jr. was an easy fight to make, but they both have huge egos and don't understand they aren't draws. To make, it'd be a huge monetary loss, and I think the investors are finally waking up and not fronting money to give people free tickets and PPV passwords to try and pad drawing power.

You may well be right. Perhaps there aren’t the funds to give the main fighters their contractual minimums multiple times a year.

So Fox have gone just with PPV this year. Does that mean no Fox at all in 2023?

[daz74]

Whilst not the most credible, Adrien Broner says it’s all gone tits up for them. Ring IQ (whom I really rate) is convinced Fox is pulling out of Boxing (he says the last few PBC shows Fox have just been paying for the broadcast not the production). Apparently Haymon’s contracts make it real hard for fighters to break free.

[Ruthless-RKO]

Possibly finally running out of money. Horrible business decision for the idiots that invested in Al Haymon. Crawford/Spence Jr. was an easy fight to make, but they both have huge egos and don't understand they aren't draws. To make, it'd be a huge monetary loss, and I think the investors are finally waking up and not fronting money to give people free tickets and PPV passwords to try and pad drawing power.

You may well be right. Perhaps there aren’t the funds to give the main fighters their contractual minimums multiple times a year.

So Fox have gone just with PPV this year. Does that mean no Fox at all in 2023?

Yeh. They had a 2 year deal with PBC. This year (2022) was the 3rd optional year. They just about did the extra one.

But all FOX cards as you said have been PPV.

It’s just Showtime now.

[maverick23]

Whilst not the most credible, Adrien Broner says it’s all gone tits up for them. Ring IQ (whom I really rate) is convinced Fox is pulling out of Boxing (he says the last few PBC shows Fox have just been paying for the broadcast not the production). Apparently Haymon’s contracts make it real hard for fighters to break free.

Yeah - I think you’re right with Fox pulling out. Just PPV this year and they haven’t performed well reportedly.

So if it leaves just Showtime it’ll either be more of the same (i.E. not enough activity for their main fighters) or even less activity given they’d not be able to supplement the Showtime shows with the handful of PPVs that were on Fox.

I wonder if they’re in discussions with other channels/networks?! Boxing can, if the fighters are paid what they’re worth and not massively overpaid, be good value for money for networks.

[Ruthless-RKO]

They’ve already been with a lot of them.

Spike, Bounce, CBS, FOX, unsure about ABC, doubt they’ve used USA Network.

Apart from FOX and Showtime, non of the others did PPV.

They did great numbers.

Thurman-Garcia averaged over 3m and peaked at 5m..

They were constantly doing 1m plus. Most nearly hitting 2m viewers.

[margaret thatcher]

how is it that this thread's been up for a couple hours, an pbc's whiteknight, sir eo, hasnt appeared to defend big al's honour

[Ruthless-RKO]

how is it that this thread's been up for a couple hours, an pbc's whiteknight, sir eo, hasnt appeared to defend big al's honour

He’s probably resting. Recharging.

[watsupdoc87]

how is it that this thread's been up for a couple hours, an pbc's whiteknight, sir eo, hasnt appeared to defend big al's honour

Hes bumming homo henry while kronk rocks up in the corner haveing a miniscule masturbation session

[margaret thatcher]

[Mexi-Box]

They’ve already been with a lot of them.

Spike, Bounce, CBS, FOX, unsure about ABC, doubt they’ve used USA Network.

Apart from FOX and Showtime, non of the others did PPV.

They did great numbers.

Thurman-Garcia averaged over 3m and peaked at 5m..

They were constantly doing 1m plus. Most nearly hitting 2m viewers.

The purses they were paying fighters made it non-viable, likely. We've not seen a free card on prime time in forever. In addition, everyone's drawing power is woeful. Who is the biggest draw for PBC, Tank or Wilder? Looks like they've burned a lot of bridges maybe. I don't know how or why Showtime is still putting up with their crap. They've been having shitty cards.

[Mexi-Box]

Whilst not the most credible, Adrien Broner says it’s all gone tits up for them. Ring IQ (whom I really rate) is convinced Fox is pulling out of Boxing (he says the last few PBC shows Fox have just been paying for the broadcast not the production). Apparently Haymon’s contracts make it real hard for fighters to break free.

Makes sense given that FOX just signed a huge deal with BIG10 and are partnering with ESPN for the BIG12. I'd imagine they're starting to cut out low performers, and PBCs fights barely draw nowadays.

[maverick23]

They’ve already been with a lot of them.

Spike, Bounce, CBS, FOX, unsure about ABC, doubt they’ve used USA Network.

Apart from FOX and Showtime, non of the others did PPV.

They did great numbers.

Thurman-Garcia averaged over 3m and peaked at 5m..

They were constantly doing 1m plus. Most nearly hitting 2m viewers.

The purses they were paying fighters made it non-viable, likely. We've not seen a free card on prime time in forever. In addition, everyone's drawing power is woeful. Who is the biggest draw for PBC, Tank or Wilder? Looks like they've burned a lot of bridges maybe. I don't know how or why Showtime is still putting up with their crap. They've been having shitty cards.

If you look at their roster it’s strong. Loads of really good fighters. Surely though they’d be better to narrow the roster and get guys out more frequently to make them draws. It’s hard for people to get excited about guys who fight once a year.

I wonder how much Showtime are paying for a show. If they’re paying $2-3m for a show that does 700k-1m viewers then they could make that work but on a lot of cases with Showtime it’s not even half that.

[Mexi-Box]

They’ve already been with a lot of them.

Spike, Bounce, CBS, FOX, unsure about ABC, doubt they’ve used USA Network.

Apart from FOX and Showtime, non of the others did PPV.

They did great numbers.

Thurman-Garcia averaged over 3m and peaked at 5m..

They were constantly doing 1m plus. Most nearly hitting 2m viewers.

The purses they were paying fighters made it non-viable, likely. We've not seen a free card on prime time in forever. In addition, everyone's drawing power is woeful. Who is the biggest draw for PBC, Tank or Wilder? Looks like they've burned a lot of bridges maybe. I don't know how or why Showtime is still putting up with their crap. They've been having shitty cards.

If you look at their roster it’s strong. Loads of really good fighters. Surely though they’d be better to narrow the roster and get guys out more frequently to make them draws. It’s hard for people to get excited about guys who fight once a year.

I wonder how much Showtime are paying for a show. If they’re paying $2-3m for a show that does 700k-1m viewers then they could make that work but on a lot of cases with Showtime it’s not even half that.

They have good fighters, but not good draws. They also have a lot of aged fighters. Wilder's last PPV did horrific numbers. Everyone on their roster's drawing power has diminished exponentially.

They dug themselves into a hole making their fighters irrelevant. I mean Danny couldn't even break 500K in his last fight. Dude used to do solid numbers.

[Ruthless-RKO]

The purses they were paying fighters made it non-viable, likely. We've not seen a free card on prime time in forever. In addition, everyone's drawing power is woeful. Who is the biggest draw for PBC, Tank or Wilder? Looks like they've burned a lot of bridges maybe. I don't know how or why Showtime is still putting up with their crap. They've been having shitty cards.

If you look at their roster it’s strong. Loads of really good fighters. Surely though they’d be better to narrow the roster and get guys out more frequently to make them draws. It’s hard for people to get excited about guys who fight once a year.

I wonder how much Showtime are paying for a show. If they’re paying $2-3m for a show that does 700k-1m viewers then they could make that work but on a lot of cases with Showtime it’s not even half that.

They have good fighters, but not good draws. They also have a lot of aged fighters. Wilder's last PPV did horrific numbers. Everyone on their roster's drawing power has diminished exponentially.

They dug themselves into a hole making their fighters irrelevant. I mean Danny couldn't even break 500K in his last fight. Dude used to do solid numbers.

Let’s not forget as well, less people in general are subscribed to Showtime now than let’s say 3-4 years ago. Especially since HBO bowed out.

But you’re not wrong. Heck even ESPN cards are just about hitting the 1m mark.

[maverick23]

If you look at their roster it’s strong. Loads of really good fighters. Surely though they’d be better to narrow the roster and get guys out more frequently to make them draws. It’s hard for people to get excited about guys who fight once a year.

I wonder how much Showtime are paying for a show. If they’re paying $2-3m for a show that does 700k-1m viewers then they could make that work but on a lot of cases with Showtime it’s not even half that.

They have good fighters, but not good draws. They also have a lot of aged fighters. Wilder's last PPV did horrific numbers. Everyone on their roster's drawing power has diminished exponentially.

They dug themselves into a hole making their fighters irrelevant. I mean Danny couldn't even break 500K in his last fight. Dude used to do solid numbers.

Let’s not forget as well, less people in general are subscribed to Showtime now than let’s say 3-4 years ago. Especially since HBO bowed out.

But you’re not wrong. Heck even ESPN cards are just about hitting the 1m mark.

The ESPN numbers will be excluding those through ESPN+ and the Spanish channel too. It depends how much ESPN are paying for the shows. If it’s $2-3m then they can make 1m viewers work. If it’s $6-7m then they’d be overpaying a fair bit.

[Ruthless-RKO]

They have good fighters, but not good draws. They also have a lot of aged fighters. Wilder's last PPV did horrific numbers. Everyone on their roster's drawing power has diminished exponentially.

They dug themselves into a hole making their fighters irrelevant. I mean Danny couldn't even break 500K in his last fight. Dude used to do solid numbers.

Let’s not forget as well, less people in general are subscribed to Showtime now than let’s say 3-4 years ago. Especially since HBO bowed out.

But you’re not wrong. Heck even ESPN cards are just about hitting the 1m mark.

The ESPN numbers will be excluding those through ESPN+ and the Spanish channel too. It depends how much ESPN are paying for the shows. If it’s $2-3m then they can make 1m viewers work. If it’s $6-7m then they’d be overpaying a fair bit.

Yeh that’s true.

The prelims start on ESPN+ and then the main card is ESPN+ and ESPN and Deportes.

Those that start on ESPN+ are not gonna switch over to ESPN when they can continue watching their stream.