Joe Bugner in care home

[evrenb]

So sad to read that Joe is suffering badly from dementia and is in a care home in Australia. From Colin Harts report, it seems very advanced.

[Ambling Alp II]

That kind of thing is always sad to see.

[writehooks]

George Chuvalo is in the same situation in a Toronto nursing home. The Canadian icon, who turned 85 last September, has no recollection of who he is or what he accomplished. While no longer able to walk more than a few steps at a time, he's relatively content in a facility where he's well cared for and the staff absolutely adores him.

[evrenb]

George Chuvalo is in the same situation in a Toronto nursing home. The Canadian icon, who turned 85 last September, has no recollection of who he is or what he accomplished. While no longer able to walk more than a few steps at a time, he's relatively content in a facility where he's well cared for and the staff absolutely adores him.

Thanks for this update on George. I know that there was a dispute between his family and wife. My own mother has dementia and never laced on gloves. It is a very tiring , painful and sad experience.

[Controversial]

That’s sad, he’s only 72. It’s an awful disease

[Bodyshot3]

Sounds horrible and Big Joe did not always get the rub of the green when he went to Oz....I think he got a lot of stress when a wine business did not work out and he had some tax problems too....that ages a guy.

I thought he was excellent when I last saw him in the Aussie Jungle doing the ITV show.....still seemed sharp mentally and physically in better shape than people three decades younger.

Hopefully, he's being well cared for.

[p4p1]

Things like this do make it hard to stay a boxing fan IMO. Knowing the long term damage that is happening to these guys, even the ones who we see as defensive genius' will still feel some of these types of effects. We can only hope that it isn't too bad and they aren't too young when it happens.

[Controversial]

Things like this do make it hard to stay a boxing fan IMO. Knowing the long term damage that is happening to these guys, even the ones who we see as defensive genius' will still feel some of these types of effects. We can only hope that it isn't too bad and they aren't too young when it happens.

I’ve said this a few times over the years, people should read Damage by Tris Dixon which covers the effects of boxing and links to CTE and dementia. So many fighters mentioned in that book who ended up in a bad way. I wouldn’t want my loved ones boxing, as a fitness thing it’s good but not having fights. So now I’m in this weird position of not blaming fighters taking the easy money route instead of the hard graft old school way but then I’m not happy when they do it

[Bodyshot3]

Things like this do make it hard to stay a boxing fan IMO. Knowing the long term damage that is happening to these guys, even the ones who we see as defensive genius' will still feel some of these types of effects. We can only hope that it isn't too bad and they aren't too young when it happens.

Fair comment mate and hard not to disagree.

I kind of wish Joe had not extended his career for so very long.......but he had financial worries and as a very marketable fighter right-up until the end he understood it was the quickest way to put some proper money back in the bank.

[margaret thatcher]

no doubt boxing is awful for the brain, but in the 70s dementia isnt that uncommon

[Controversial]

no doubt boxing is awful for the brain, but in the 70s dementia isnt that uncommon

It isn’t but I imagine he’s been showing signs for some time, he’s 72 but thinks he’s 38 so quite far down that road

[Joson]

no doubt boxing is awful for the brain, but in the 70s dementia isnt that uncommon

It isn’t but I imagine he’s been showing signs for some time, he’s 72 but thinks he’s 38 so quite far down that road

As recently as 2018 he was giving interviews and appearing in public. So Joe's symptoms couldn't have shown before 2019.

[Controversial]

no doubt boxing is awful for the brain, but in the 70s dementia isnt that uncommon

It isn’t but I imagine he’s been showing signs for some time, he’s 72 but thinks he’s 38 so quite far down that road

As recently as 2018 he was giving interviews and appearing in public. So Joe's symptoms couldn't have shown before 2019.

I guess it depends what the symptoms first were and when they started. It often starts off quite small and not always picked up on except by the people closest to them who will notice the little things they start getting wrong, often discounting them at the start. They might seem fine to others. Long term memory is normally good even when they are at their worst, they can remember things in their childhood but not what they said 5 minutes ago. So it's the short term memory and day to day things that often people start to forget at the beginning. It can take several years before things get really bad that they can’t remember people or care for themselves anymore.

[Joson]

Outside of George Chuvalo, Bugner may have been the most durable heavyweight of his era. Definitely one of four or five guys on the short list for 'best chin.'

Better yet, Bugner had airtight defense. Rarely did he get hit with power shots. Joe could go ten, 12, or 15 rounds with anyone and and emerge unscathed.

So, it's ironic that Bugner got CTE.

[Controversial]

Outside of George Chuvalo, Bugner may have been the most durable heavyweight of his era. Definitely one of four or five guys on the short list for 'best chin.'

Better yet, Bugner had airtight defense. Rarely did he get hit with power shots. Joe could go ten, 12, or 15 rounds with anyone and and emerge unscathed.

So, it's ironic that Bugner got CTE.

I guess you could say Herol Graham was as elusive as they come and rarely took flush punches, apart from the obvious KO loss to Jackson, but he’s had issues for a while and only 63

[Joson]

Outside of George Chuvalo, Bugner may have been the most durable heavyweight of his era. Definitely one of four or five guys on the short list for 'best chin.'

Better yet, Bugner had airtight defense. Rarely did he get hit with power shots. Joe could go ten, 12, or 15 rounds with anyone and and emerge unscathed.

So, it's ironic that Bugner got CTE.

I guess you could say Herol Graham was as elusive as they come and rarely took flush punches, apart from the obvious KO loss to Jackson, but he’s had issues for a while and only 63

I'd add Wilfredo Benitez, one of the most unhittable boxers of his era. That's why they called him "Radar." But Wilfredo's damage showed by the time he was in his 40's.

Someday medical science will probably discover that, among boxers with CTE, a genetic predisposition toward Alzheimer's is the trigger which leads to dementia.

Think about it: some fighters absorb heavy punishment for years, yet never show signs of damage later in life. Others don't get hit much during their careers, but still develop CTE. Genes must have something to with the problem.

[Controversial]

Outside of George Chuvalo, Bugner may have been the most durable heavyweight of his era. Definitely one of four or five guys on the short list for 'best chin.'

Better yet, Bugner had airtight defense. Rarely did he get hit with power shots. Joe could go ten, 12, or 15 rounds with anyone and and emerge unscathed.

So, it's ironic that Bugner got CTE.

I guess you could say Herol Graham was as elusive as they come and rarely took flush punches, apart from the obvious KO loss to Jackson, but he’s had issues for a while and only 63

I'd add Wilfredo Benitez, one of the most unhittable boxers of his era. That's why they called him "Radar." But Wilfredo's damage showed by the time he was in his 40's.

Someday medical science will probably discover that, among boxers with CTE, a genetic predisposition toward Alzheimer's is the trigger which leads to dementia.

Think about it: some fighters absorb heavy punishment for years, yet never show signs of damage later in life. Others don't get hit much during their careers, but still develop CTE. Genes must have something to with the problem.

I don’t know why some end up worse than others but being punched in the head isn’t great for anyone. Other sports like NFL, rugby and football are taking head blows more serious now. I’ve mentioned it before but there’s an ex-pro from the U.K. called Tony Jeffries, he now resides in the US and is doing very well on social media as a trainer in the fitness industry. He spoke about a brain study he took part in years ago in America and although he felt fit and well a head scan showed he had a split down the middle of his brain. The clinic found the same split in 50% of fighters they tested which isn’t great. It’s not always dementia type symptoms either, several sportsmen in impact sports have gone off the rails, either with mental health issues, substance abuse, committed crime or killed themselves which many experts think is also linked to brain trauma.

[Joson]

I guess you could say Herol Graham was as elusive as they come and rarely took flush punches, apart from the obvious KO loss to Jackson, but he’s had issues for a while and only 63

I'd add Wilfredo Benitez, one of the most unhittable boxers of his era. That's why they called him "Radar." But Wilfredo's damage showed by the time he was in his 40's.

Someday medical science will probably discover that, among boxers with CTE, a genetic predisposition toward Alzheimer's is the trigger which leads to dementia.

Think about it: some fighters absorb heavy punishment for years, yet never show signs of damage later in life. Others don't get hit much during their careers, but still develop CTE. Genes must have something to with the problem.

I don’t know why some end up worse than others but being punched in the head isn’t great for anyone. Other sports like NFL, rugby and football are taking head blows more serious now. I’ve mentioned it before but there’s an ex-pro from the U.K. called Tony Jeffries, he now resides in the US and is doing very well on social media as a trainer in the fitness industry. He spoke about a brain study he took part in years ago in America and although he felt fit and well a head scan showed he had a split down the middle of his brain. The clinic found the same split in 50% of fighters they tested which isn’t great. It’s not always dementia type symptoms either, several sportsmen in impact sports have gone off the rails, either with mental health issues, substance abuse, committed crime or killed themselves which many experts think is also linked to brain trauma.

Genetic testing will someday be mandatory for anyone who wants to box amateur or pro. That's my hunch. Scientists will eventually identify genes linked to late life diseases such as Alzheimer's. Aspiring fighters will be denied licenses for this reason, before they have a single fight.

IMO, this will be for the better. CTE rates among athletes in head-trauma sports will plummet as a result.

[Controversial]

I'd add Wilfredo Benitez, one of the most unhittable boxers of his era. That's why they called him "Radar." But Wilfredo's damage showed by the time he was in his 40's.

Someday medical science will probably discover that, among boxers with CTE, a genetic predisposition toward Alzheimer's is the trigger which leads to dementia.

Think about it: some fighters absorb heavy punishment for years, yet never show signs of damage later in life. Others don't get hit much during their careers, but still develop CTE. Genes must have something to with the problem.

I don’t know why some end up worse than others but being punched in the head isn’t great for anyone. Other sports like NFL, rugby and football are taking head blows more serious now. I’ve mentioned it before but there’s an ex-pro from the U.K. called Tony Jeffries, he now resides in the US and is doing very well on social media as a trainer in the fitness industry. He spoke about a brain study he took part in years ago in America and although he felt fit and well a head scan showed he had a split down the middle of his brain. The clinic found the same split in 50% of fighters they tested which isn’t great. It’s not always dementia type symptoms either, several sportsmen in impact sports have gone off the rails, either with mental health issues, substance abuse, committed crime or killed themselves which many experts think is also linked to brain trauma.

Genetic testing will someday be mandatory for anyone who wants to box amateur or pro. That's my hunch. Scientists will eventually identify genes linked to late life diseases such as Alzheimer's. Aspiring fighters will be denied licenses for this reason, before they have a single fight.

IMO, this will be for the better. CTE rates among athletes in head-trauma sports will plummet as a result.

So you’re saying head trauma doesn’t cause any issues you are just born with a predisposition to getting CTE??

[Tony1244]

The British Bug, as the American boxing mags called him, had a great chin. I always thought on the right night in the 1970s, Bugner could have done with Foreman what Jimmy Young did.

[Joson]

I don’t know why some end up worse than others but being punched in the head isn’t great for anyone. Other sports like NFL, rugby and football are taking head blows more serious now. I’ve mentioned it before but there’s an ex-pro from the U.K. called Tony Jeffries, he now resides in the US and is doing very well on social media as a trainer in the fitness industry. He spoke about a brain study he took part in years ago in America and although he felt fit and well a head scan showed he had a split down the middle of his brain. The clinic found the same split in 50% of fighters they tested which isn’t great. It’s not always dementia type symptoms either, several sportsmen in impact sports have gone off the rails, either with mental health issues, substance abuse, committed crime or killed themselves which many experts think is also linked to brain trauma.

Genetic testing will someday be mandatory for anyone who wants to box amateur or pro. That's my hunch. Scientists will eventually identify genes linked to late life diseases such as Alzheimer's. Aspiring fighters will be denied licenses for this reason, before they have a single fight.

IMO, this will be for the better. CTE rates among athletes in head-trauma sports will plummet as a result.

So you’re saying head trauma doesn’t cause any issues you are just born with a predisposition to getting CTE??

No, I'm saying the exact opposite.

According to scientists, guys who've got the Alzheimer's gene, and who box for years and eventually develop CTE, may end up that way because of the combination of head trauma plus the Alzheimer's gene.

Be aware that having a genetic predisposition to Alzheimer's doesn't necessarily mean someone will develop that disease. It only means that person's likelihood of getting dementia in old age is that much greater than for people who don't carry that gene.

[Joson]

The British Bug, as the American boxing mags called him, had a great chin. I always thought on the right night in the 1970s, Bugner could have done with Foreman what Jimmy Young did.

I agree. Bugner - if he fought his best - would have had a great outside chance of upsetting Foreman.

[Controversial]

Genetic testing will someday be mandatory for anyone who wants to box amateur or pro. That's my hunch. Scientists will eventually identify genes linked to late life diseases such as Alzheimer's. Aspiring fighters will be denied licenses for this reason, before they have a single fight.

IMO, this will be for the better. CTE rates among athletes in head-trauma sports will plummet as a result.

So you’re saying head trauma doesn’t cause any issues you are just born with a predisposition to getting CTE??

No, I'm saying the exact opposite.

According to scientists, guys who've got the Alzheimer's gene, and who box for years and eventually develop CTE, may end up that way because of the combination of head trauma plus the Alzheimer's gene.

Be aware that having a genetic predisposition to Alzheimer's doesn't necessarily mean someone will develop that disease. It only means that person's likelihood of getting dementia in old age is that much greater than for people who don't carry that gene.

Yes but not having the 'gene' also doesn't stop someone developing CTE issues or Alzheimers so really it's irrelevant whether they have the 'gene' or not. Plenty of fighters are developing speech problems or other issues likely linked to head trauma and at far younger ages than most people get dementia etc.

[Joson]

Yes but not having the 'gene' also doesn't stop someone developing CTE issues or Alzheimers so really it's irrelevant whether they have the 'gene' or not. Plenty of fighters are developing speech problems or other issues likely linked to head trauma and at far younger ages than most people get dementia etc.

Bottom line, the emerging evidence is pointing toward this:

1) Boxing + no Alzheimer's gene = greatly decreased chance of getting CTE
2) Boxing + Alzheimer's gene = greatly increased chance of getting CTE

So, I think it's clear where the wind is blowing with science and it's future impact on boxers' lisencure.

[Controversial]

Yes but not having the 'gene' also doesn't stop someone developing CTE issues or Alzheimers so really it's irrelevant whether they have the 'gene' or not. Plenty of fighters are developing speech problems or other issues likely linked to head trauma and at far younger ages than most people get dementia etc.

Bottom line, the emerging evidence is pointing toward this:

1) Boxing + no Alzheimer's gene = greatly decreased chance of getting CTE
2) Boxing + Alzheimer's gene = greatly increased chance of getting CTE

So, I think it's clear where the wind is blowing with science and it's future impact on boxers' lisencure.

Of course anyone with any gene or predisposition for getting any serious medical issue is at a greater risk than those without it. It still doesn’t rule it out for the others and it’s not just Alzheimer’s that is the issue, links to mental health issues, suicide etc is also linked to brain trauma.