oogiebe wrote: ↑17 Apr 2023, 21:14If they rematch. I'd still favor Joe. He's a second half stopper. With his eye he didn't get a chance to get there. Kudos to Zhang, but again, I'd bet JJ.
Same.
In a 55/45 way in Joyce's favour.
Zhang has a 4 round engine, Joyce has a 12 round one.
My only problem is the eye, guys hurt like that tend to swell faster in their subsequent fights. Plus Zhang now knows he can pop that straight left or left hook at will right on the same spot.
I'm reminded of Joe Louis when he lost to Max Schmeling. Every time he threw a jab when he brought back his hand he dropped it below his chin. Easy thing to fix. I imagine it will be a simple fix for Joyce to block the right side of his face.
unless zhang is mandated to do an immediate rematch, i dont know why he'd pursue that, he now has a bigger chance than ever to land a big fight, joe joyce 2 isnt really that
margaret thatcher wrote: ↑19 Apr 2023, 00:38
zhang was still lighting him up in the 6th tbf
unless zhang is mandated to do an immediate rematch, i dont know why he'd pursue that, he now has a bigger chance than ever to land a big fight, joe joyce 2 isnt really that
He had a burst in the 6th when it looked like he could get it stopped.
But realistically his work rate fell significantly after the 4th.
If joyce takes the rematch i'd just like to see hime come in heavier and sit on Zzs chest more. Close the gap right up so he's not on the end of them lefts, i just cant see a way the JJ ever wins fighting at that distance. He's 37, if he cant move his head off the line now, he wont in his next fight.
Bigdogsnose wrote: ↑19 Apr 2023, 03:13
If joyce takes the rematch i'd just like to see hime come in heavier and sit on Zzs chest more. Close the gap right up so he's not on the end of them lefts, i just cant see a way the JJ ever wins fighting at that distance. He's 37, if he cant move his head off the line now, he wont in his next fight.
Against a southpaw you need to move away from the left hand, so you always want your left foot outside his right.
JJ just wasn't doing it so his feet led him to continually walk on to the left hand.
oogiebe wrote: ↑17 Apr 2023, 21:14If they rematch. I'd still favor Joe. He's a second half stopper. With his eye he didn't get a chance to get there. Kudos to Zhang, but again, I'd bet JJ.
Same.
In a 55/45 way in Joyce's favour.
Zhang has a 4 round engine, Joyce has a 12 round one.
My only problem is the eye, guys hurt like that tend to swell faster in their subsequent fights. Plus Zhang now knows he can pop that straight left or left hook at will right on the same spot.
Saying he didn’t get the chance because of his eye, is like saying he didn’t get the chance because he got knocked out.
It wasn’t some freak injury. Zhang was banging it all night - that’s why his eye packed in.
Joyce has a good chin, that’s why he didn’t go down, so his eye went instead.
Exactly the same thing would happen again unless Joyce changes something - and learns how to move his feet against a southpaw.
This wasn’t a clash of heads or a freak cut. It was the result of sustained good work.
oogiebe wrote: ↑17 Apr 2023, 21:14If they rematch. I'd still favor Joe. He's a second half stopper. With his eye he didn't get a chance to get there. Kudos to Zhang, but again, I'd bet JJ.
Same.
In a 55/45 way in Joyce's favour.
Zhang has a 4 round engine, Joyce has a 12 round one.
My only problem is the eye, guys hurt like that tend to swell faster in their subsequent fights. Plus Zhang now knows he can pop that straight left or left hook at will right on the same spot.
Saying he didn’t get the chance because of his eye, is like saying he didn’t get the chance because he got knocked out.
It wasn’t some freak injury. Zhang was banging it all night - that’s why his eye packed in.
Joyce has a good chin, that’s why he didn’t go down, so his eye went instead.
Exactly the same thing would happen again unless Joyce changes something - and learns how to move his feet against a southpaw.
This wasn’t a clash of heads or a freak cut. It was the result of sustained good work.
Absolutely, I think I commented on the round by round thread during the first round that Joyce was eating that left too easy, he looked clueless.
HomicideHenry wrote: ↑19 Apr 2023, 00:11
I'm reminded of Joe Louis when he lost to Max Schmeling. Every time he threw a jab when he brought back his hand he dropped it below his chin. Easy thing to fix. I imagine it will be a simple fix for Joyce to block the right side of his face.
Not so sure , tell you now if i had an ameteur having his first fight against a southpaw , you can bet your life i would know wether or not he can block any side of his face , if he could'nt he would'nt be going in with one until he could . These guys are highly paid profesionals , they should of known if Joe is gonna block , slip , that left hand , they should of known he's stagnant and gonna have trouble , its not rocket science its just boxing , coaches are there to pick it up and correct it , thats what they do for a lot of money , Jeez i'm back in a gym doing it for nothing with ameteurs its just BASICS
Bigdogsnose wrote: ↑19 Apr 2023, 03:13
If joyce takes the rematch i'd just like to see hime come in heavier and sit on Zzs chest more. Close the gap right up so he's not on the end of them lefts, i just cant see a way the JJ ever wins fighting at that distance. He's 37, if he cant move his head off the line now, he wont in his next fight.
Against a southpaw you need to move away from the left hand, so you always want your left foot outside his right.
JJ just wasn't doing it so his feet led him to continually walk on to the left hand.
Cheers. You'd have thought he would have been drilled for this, cornered for this and be experienced enough to deal with it anyway. Wonder if he and his team believed the hype, he could just plough forward and walk through people.
Bigdogsnose wrote: ↑19 Apr 2023, 03:13
If joyce takes the rematch i'd just like to see hime come in heavier and sit on Zzs chest more. Close the gap right up so he's not on the end of them lefts, i just cant see a way the JJ ever wins fighting at that distance. He's 37, if he cant move his head off the line now, he wont in his next fight.
Against a southpaw you need to move away from the left hand, so you always want your left foot outside his right.
JJ just wasn't doing it so his feet led him to continually walk on to the left hand.
Cheers. You'd have thought he would have been drilled for this, cornered for this and be experienced enough to deal with it anyway. Wonder if he and his team believed the hype, he could just plough forward and walk through people.
Doing it is harder than saying it of course, I'm sure Zhang was making every effort to keep his right foot outside of JJs left!
Joyce has slow feet and just wasn't able to bully Big Bang or walk through his shots.
watch zhang's 2 fights he didnt win - forrest and hrg have the same shocked, 'jesus f@cking hell what hit me' look when they are dropped and hurt early. the chinese power is serious, and to just come out eating shots like that is totally irresponsible. parker, jenn, takam........all far more consistent than zhang, but nowhere near the the power. dubois a big hitter, but joe boxed much smarter and didnt just eat punches
it wasn't just a left hand either, zhang's right hook worked him over too. and zhang also hurt joe and had him looking worried before the eye blew up.. sure joe could turn it around in a rematch, zz has plenty of flaws and joe was coming into it a bit, but that will alwayys be a match from hell for joyce if he turns up eating those heavy chinese hands for breakfast
The narrative after the Hrgovic - Zhang fight was that Hrgovic was exposed & the narrative after the Joyce - Parker fight was that Joyce is a wrecking ball who belongs alongside Usyk, Fury, Wilder & Joshua at the top of the division.
They probably thought Zhang was decent enough but not special & that as the rounds went on Joyce’s engine would take over & he’d grind him down. Makes you wonder if they got any proper southpaw sparring in or not. Or maybe Zhang is that good? Hasn’t he got a new team around him recently? Maybe Joyce just lost to a very good heavyweight.
oogiebe wrote: ↑17 Apr 2023, 21:14If they rematch. I'd still favor Joe. He's a second half stopper. With his eye he didn't get a chance to get there. Kudos to Zhang, but again, I'd bet JJ.
Same.
In a 55/45 way in Joyce's favour.
Zhang has a 4 round engine, Joyce has a 12 round one.
My only problem is the eye, guys hurt like that tend to swell faster in their subsequent fights. Plus Zhang now knows he can pop that straight left or left hook at will right on the same spot.
Saying he didn’t get the chance because of his eye, is like saying he didn’t get the chance because he got knocked out.
It wasn’t some freak injury. Zhang was banging it all night - that’s why his eye packed in.
Joyce has a good chin, that’s why he didn’t go down, so his eye went instead.
Exactly the same thing would happen again unless Joyce changes something - and learns how to move his feet against a southpaw.
This wasn’t a clash of heads or a freak cut. It was the result of sustained good work.
Agree, but at the same time - I think if the eye would have held out for even a couple more rounds I think Joyce would have got to Zhang - he was looking pretty exhausted. But I think Zhang stylistically wise will give Joyce problems until he gasses. He is surely in his late 40s (looking at him).
Same.
In a 55/45 way in Joyce's favour.
Zhang has a 4 round engine, Joyce has a 12 round one.
My only problem is the eye, guys hurt like that tend to swell faster in their subsequent fights. Plus Zhang now knows he can pop that straight left or left hook at will right on the same spot.
Saying he didn’t get the chance because of his eye, is like saying he didn’t get the chance because he got knocked out.
It wasn’t some freak injury. Zhang was banging it all night - that’s why his eye packed in.
Joyce has a good chin, that’s why he didn’t go down, so his eye went instead.
Exactly the same thing would happen again unless Joyce changes something - and learns how to move his feet against a southpaw.
This wasn’t a clash of heads or a freak cut. It was the result of sustained good work.
Agree, but at the same time - I think if the eye would have held out for even a couple more rounds I think Joyce would have got to Zhang - he was looking pretty exhausted. But I think Zhang stylistically wise will give Joyce problems until he gasses. He is surely in his late 40s (looking at him).
I thought that too. He’s likely much older than 39. He should come clean and try and beat Foreman’s age record!
Same.
In a 55/45 way in Joyce's favour.
Zhang has a 4 round engine, Joyce has a 12 round one.
My only problem is the eye, guys hurt like that tend to swell faster in their subsequent fights. Plus Zhang now knows he can pop that straight left or left hook at will right on the same spot.
Saying he didn’t get the chance because of his eye, is like saying he didn’t get the chance because he got knocked out.
It wasn’t some freak injury. Zhang was banging it all night - that’s why his eye packed in.
Joyce has a good chin, that’s why he didn’t go down, so his eye went instead.
Exactly the same thing would happen again unless Joyce changes something - and learns how to move his feet against a southpaw.
This wasn’t a clash of heads or a freak cut. It was the result of sustained good work.
Agree, but at the same time - I think if the eye would have held out for even a couple more rounds I think Joyce would have got to Zhang - he was looking pretty exhausted. But I think Zhang stylistically wise will give Joyce problems until he gasses. He is surely in his late 40s (looking at him).
I just think that’s like saying if his chin had held out and he didn’t get knocked out - he might have turned the fight round.
I’m not even sure Zhang was fading that badly. Joyce was still taking solid shots to an already damaged eye.
If he doesn’t change anything, exactly the same will happen again….
