The world's #1 super-middleweight outboxing the #2 or 3

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 25 Aug 2006, 10:54

..... in what has undoubtedly been the by far the most significant fight at 168 ps in recent years.

Here are parts of round 4 - enjoy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpBMMnZ7HyU

P

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 25 Aug 2006, 11:12

Why don't you watch JC/Lacy again, then realistically ( I know, but try ) tell me there's another supermiddle in the world that could have done that to Lacy? Bossed every minute of every round??

I don't think so buddy!

Kessler has a nice jab, but until they meet, and after, your boy is definitely No#2. .......or 3.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 25 Aug 2006, 11:14

You could say that now, Mundine is not far off #3. But that was before the Green win. Beyer is better than Mundine. I can accept Kessler-Beyer as a match between #s 2 and 3.

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 25 Aug 2006, 11:22

viciousmaussa wrote:You could say that now, Mundine is not far off #3. But that was before the Green win. Beyer is better than Mundine. I can accept Kessler-Beyer as a match between #s 2 and 3.

Well, I had Mundine at #3 before the Green win.

Twinkle Toes · Post by **Twinkle Toes** » 25 Aug 2006, 11:36

Amazing clip!

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 25 Aug 2006, 12:16

Calzaghe couldn't score a try like this either!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oN6cOrRdizE

Taki... · Post by **Taki...** » 25 Aug 2006, 13:24

We get the idea Pundit; you have a hard-on for Kessler...

pasty_spud · Post by **pasty_spud** » 25 Aug 2006, 14:00

Goz wrote:Calzaghe couldn't score a try like this either!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oN6cOrRdizE

i wish he still played rugby..a far better stand off than a super middle in imo

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 25 Aug 2006, 14:06

pundit wrote:
viciousmaussa wrote:You could say that now, Mundine is not far off #3. But that was before the Green win. Beyer is better than Mundine. I can accept Kessler-Beyer as a match between #s 2 and 3.
Well, I had Mundine at #3 before the Green win.

fair enough, as you rated mundine higher and lacy lower prior to their recent 'exposure' - which was a good judgement cal.

I still think Beyer is better than Mundine

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 25 Aug 2006, 16:16

Goz wrote:Calzaghe couldn't score a try like this either!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oN6cOrRdizE

Nice one!

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 25 Aug 2006, 17:29

Whats Pundit drinking tonight?

Calzaghe will dance around that sucka.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oN6cOrRdizE

Check his KO on that bunch on Highlights(don't care if it's Pudwill a KO is a KO.)

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 26 Aug 2006, 04:07

Mundine is quality. A terrific athlete. Imagine if he'd been boxing all of his life. Just been watching his fight with Ottke. I've never seen anyone make prime Ottke look like that. Mundine was probably 2 or 3 rounds aheah, had Ottke ready to be KOd, then Ottke masterfully turned it around.

Both those guys are badly underrated.

I hope Mundine doesn't end up fighting for a 'regular' title

Anyone who says super middleweight is poor should be shot -Calzaghe, Kessler, Beyer, Mundine, D Green, Lacy...and then some of the most promising young fighters I've come across Bute, Bika & I suppose Froch and Andrade

jimcook · Post by **jimcook** » 26 Aug 2006, 11:39

pundit wrote:
viciousmaussa wrote:You could say that now, Mundine is not far off #3. But that was before the Green win. Beyer is better than Mundine. I can accept Kessler-Beyer as a match between #s 2 and 3.
Well, I had Mundine at #3 before the Green win.

how can you rate mundine ahead of calzaghe,mundine has already been ko d ,and has three losses,and still hasnt fought at the same level as calzaghe. calzaghe may not be straining at the leash to fight the best,but he would toy with mundine.

MkoG-r11 · Post by **MkoG-r11** » 27 Aug 2006, 06:23

There is no one on Calzaghe record that Mundine would not beat.

lvlarc · Post by **lvlarc** » 27 Aug 2006, 09:08

Mundine would of been KO'd by Lacy, Mitchell and beat by Reid, Woodhall and maybee even Starie. We are talking about a guy here that got KO'd by featherfisted Ottke. Infact Mundine got beat by Siaca who himself got KO'd, beat twice by Mitchell...

dumdane · Post by **dumdane** » 27 Aug 2006, 09:32

lvlarc_uk wrote:Mundine would of been KO'd by Lacy, Mitchell and beat by Reid, Woodhall and maybee even Starie. We are talking about a guy here that got KO'd by featherfisted Ottke. Infact Mundine got beat by Siaca who himself got KO'd, beat twice by Mitchell...

Mundine COULD have been KO'ed by pretty much anyone on Calzaghe's resume. But i also think he has the talent to give anyone on same resume - as well as Calzaghe himself - heaps of trouble.
Consistency just doesn't appear to be Mundine's strongpoint

Smit · Post by **Smit** » 27 Aug 2006, 10:16

Also Ottke wasn't featherfisted, he just chose a different style which was alot less of a risk

lvlarc · Post by **lvlarc** » 27 Aug 2006, 10:45

Aye he was a cautious defensive fighter abit like Lewis, but then again Lennox had more than 6 KO's

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 28 Aug 2006, 11:47

jimcook wrote:
pundit wrote:
viciousmaussa wrote:You could say that now, Mundine is not far off #3. But that was before the Green win. Beyer is better than Mundine. I can accept Kessler-Beyer as a match between #s 2 and 3.
Well, I had Mundine at #3 before the Green win.
how can you rate mundine ahead of calzaghe,mundine has already been ko d ,and has three losses,and still hasnt fought at the same level as calzaghe. calzaghe may not be straining at the leash to fight the best,but he would toy with mundine.

I'm not rating Mundine ahead of Calzaghe. "#2 or 3" was only to draw you in -- but I have Calzaghe and Kessler as #1/2 and Mundine at #3.

I disagree though that Calzaghe could toy with Mundine. Stylewise the evasive, slick Mundine is an unpleasant match-up for Calzaghe, who prefers immobile opponents (which is, in turn, the core reason I presume why this fight hasn't and won't happen).

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 28 Aug 2006, 11:48

lvlarc_uk wrote:Mundine would of been KO'd by Lacy, Mitchell and beat by Reid, Woodhall and maybee even Starie. We are talking about a guy here that got KO'd by featherfisted Ottke. Infact Mundine got beat by Siaca who himself got KO'd, beat twice by Mitchell...

Complete bullocks.

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 28 Aug 2006, 11:50

Max Molyneux wrote:Whats Pundit drinking tonight?

"Deer park" bottled water.

Calzaghe will dance around that sucka.

The dancer between Mundine and Calzaghe is Mundine.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 28 Aug 2006, 12:21

pundit wrote:
jimcook wrote:
pundit wrote: Well, I had Mundine at #3 before the Green win.
how can you rate mundine ahead of calzaghe,mundine has already been ko d ,and has three losses,and still hasnt fought at the same level as calzaghe. calzaghe may not be straining at the leash to fight the best,but he would toy with mundine.
I'm not rating Mundine ahead of Calzaghe. "#2 or 3" was only to draw you in -- but I have Calzaghe and Kessler as #1/2 and Mundine at #3.

I disagree though that Calzaghe could toy with Mundine. Stylewise the evasive, slick Mundine is an unpleasant match-up for Calzaghe, who prefers immobile opponents (which is, in turn, the core reason I presume why this fight hasn't and won't happen).

I think Mundine is tricky for Calzaghe. Mudinine's a hell of a fighter. His only drawback is his lack of fire. That seems to stop him reaching his potential.

It's funny, that Calzaghe doesn't like counter punchers but is great at beating strong/powerful straight ahead boxers (beat Mitchell & Brewer more emphatically than Ottke). Whereas Ottke would out counter any counter puncher just about (much better than Calzaghe vs Starie), but would struggle somewhat with strength.

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 28 Aug 2006, 12:40

viciousmaussa wrote:
pundit wrote:
jimcook wrote: how can you rate mundine ahead of calzaghe,mundine has already been ko d ,and has three losses,and still hasnt fought at the same level as calzaghe. calzaghe may not be straining at the leash to fight the best,but he would toy with mundine.
I'm not rating Mundine ahead of Calzaghe. "#2 or 3" was only to draw you in -- but I have Calzaghe and Kessler as #1/2 and Mundine at #3.

I disagree though that Calzaghe could toy with Mundine. Stylewise the evasive, slick Mundine is an unpleasant match-up for Calzaghe, who prefers immobile opponents (which is, in turn, the core reason I presume why this fight hasn't and won't happen).
I think Mundine is tricky for Calzaghe. Mudinine's a hell of a fighter. His only drawback is his lack of fire. That seems to stop him reaching his potential.

It's funny, that Calzaghe doesn't like counter punchers but is great at beating strong/powerful straight ahead boxers (beat Mitchell & Brewer more emphatically than Ottke). Whereas Ottke would out counter any counter puncher just about (much better than Calzaghe vs Starie), but would struggle somewhat with strength.

I think I disagree - Ottke wasn't troubled much by power (Butler, Mitchell, etc.). His toughest fights were against Mundine and Reid, counterpunchers who, at least for parts fo the fight, beat Ottke at his own game. He also struggled with Brewer's because of the latter's huge reach advantage.

So what I find interesting is: although Ottke and Calzaghe have different styles - Ottke relying primarily on footspeed, Calzaghe on handspeed -- both tend(ed) to do well against folks who carry(ied) the fight to them. And neither like(d) it when they have(d) to find the opponent in the ring.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 28 Aug 2006, 12:58

pundit wrote:
viciousmaussa wrote:
pundit wrote: I'm not rating Mundine ahead of Calzaghe. "#2 or 3" was only to draw you in -- but I have Calzaghe and Kessler as #1/2 and Mundine at #3.

I disagree though that Calzaghe could toy with Mundine. Stylewise the evasive, slick Mundine is an unpleasant match-up for Calzaghe, who prefers immobile opponents (which is, in turn, the core reason I presume why this fight hasn't and won't happen).
I think Mundine is tricky for Calzaghe. Mudinine's a hell of a fighter. His only drawback is his lack of fire. That seems to stop him reaching his potential.

It's funny, that Calzaghe doesn't like counter punchers but is great at beating strong/powerful straight ahead boxers (beat Mitchell & Brewer more emphatically than Ottke). Whereas Ottke would out counter any counter puncher just about (much better than Calzaghe vs Starie), but would struggle somewhat with strength.
I think I disagree - Ottke wasn't troubled much by power (Butler, Mitchell, etc.). His toughest fights were against Mundine and Reid, counterpunchers who, at least for parts fo the fight, beat Ottke at his own game. He also struggled with Brewer's because of the latter's huge reach advantage.

So what I find interesting is: although Ottke and Calzaghe have different styles - Ottke relying primarily on footspeed, Calzaghe on handspeed -- both tend(ed) to do well against folks who carry(ied) the fight to them. And neither like(d) it when they have(d) to find the opponent in the ring.

Ottke did have some problems with stronger guys. I had him winning close fights with Johnson, Brewer, Mitchell but he didn't like being roughed up & he had to land a lot of pecking shots to offset the hard ones that he took.

I think with Reid it was a mixture of his physical strength and the fact that he made Ottke come to him. I think with Mundine, it was his brilliant physical talent that had him ahead (though not by far).

Ottke-Calzaghe, a dream fight

Axe · Post by **Axe** » 28 Aug 2006, 14:43

lvlarc_uk wrote:Mundine would of been KO'd by Lacy, Mitchell and beat by Reid, Woodhall and maybee even Starie. We are talking about a guy here that got KO'd by featherfisted Ottke. Infact Mundine got beat by Siaca who himself got KO'd, beat twice by Mitchell...

I agree with some of that. Mitchell wouldve definitely KOed Mundine and Woodhall would probably have done the job as well, on points.

Lacy wouldnt catch him though, he's too limited imo...bad matchup stylistically for Jeff. Reid would probably get outboxed as well.

Don't know enough about Starie to really comment on him.