Why does RSC on amateur results not count as a stoppage?

[Controversial]

This came up on another thread so I thought I’d ask as a general question.

On amateur bouts, fights resulted as TKO or KO count towards a fighters stoppage record (number of KO wins) however amateur fights that are resulted as RSC (ref stops contest) these are not counted as being a stoppage.

RSC and TKO normally mean the same thing so why does TKO get counted towards stoppage wins but RSC doesn’t?

Below is the wiki link on boxrec saying TKO and RSC are the same result.

https://boxrec.com/wiki/index.php/Technical_knockout

[Controversial]

Is there an official line to this query John?

[MikeKnight]

I'm interested in the answer...

[Greg Houston]

Under current IBA rules there is no TKO.
Stoppages are KO, RSC (RSC-I in the case of an injury), or Abandon.

[Controversial]

Under current IBA rules there is no TKO.
Stoppages are KO, RSC (RSC-I in the case of an injury), or Abandon.

TKO is used on boxrec amateur records though? Also it still doesn't explain why RSC doesn't count in the KO stats on boxrec. For example if a fighter stops someone and it gets recorded as RSC his record on boxrec would be displayed as 1-0 (0 KOS). So the stoppage isn’t counted as it displays it as 0 KO's. Whereas if its shown as KO/TKO it would be displayed as 1-0 (1 KO)

[Controversial]

Anyone able to shed any light on this? Is it just a glitch that boxrec isn't calculating the results properly or is there an official reason why RSC isn't counted as a stoppage?

[John]

Can you link to an example page, thanks.

[Controversial]

Can you link to an example page, thanks.

This is weird, MikeKnight posted the original question viewtopic.php?t=258926 that prompted my query, he wanted his record to be changed from TKO to RSC so it wasn't counted as a KO defeat. I said they are the same thing TKO/RSC/KO in that they are all counted in the KO column. However he showed the below amateur record for Woody Clark which at that time I looked the RSC losses weren't counted. However I've just looked again and they are now included! So I'm not sure what happened there. So anytime RSC it should be counted because thats what I thought was the case, I just couldn't work out why it wasn't in the below example.

Actually, RSC is used quite a bit on Boxrec. Here's Woody Clark's amateur record. It is full of TKOs and RSCs. https://boxrec.com/en/box-am/1058
He has 4 KO's listed on his Loss column...he had 3 TKO's and 1 KO loss for a total of 4. He had 2 RSC's...neither of them are counted in the "Loss By KO" column.
There are countless others, you just have to look. Most are amateur records. I posted one above, Wade Walker.
His fight was stopped...and given an RSC, not a TKO or KO. My fight against Lonzo Barnes is listed as an RSC in
the newspaper (I attached it in my first post), but Boxrec is classifying it as a TKO/KO.
I've never been counted out. I have always finished on my feet. So this "TKO" is not accurate on my record.
If Boxrec is going to misrepresent my record, I am requesting that they just delete the whole thing. Thank you.

I also saw the below post from margaret thatcher in 2020 bringing up the same question so can only assume they noticed RSC not counting on other records as well.

"Re: Suggestions for BoxRec
Post by margaret thatcher » Wed Mar 04, 2020 11:20 pm

I suggest that for amateur records, RSC/RSCH are counted as knockouts in the fighters' records. Those are basically just terms used in the ams to refer to stoppages.

So a guy who is 1-0 with that win by RSCH should be counted as 1-0 (1)

Some may say that because amateur fights are stopped so much faster than pro ones, it may be misleading to consider RSC as knockouts. I can understand that, but RSCH specifically refers to guys getting knocked out by head shots pretty much as they would in the pros, so it at least should be counted."

[Controversial]

I'm interested in the answer...

Mike, what other examples of RSC not counting as a KO can you show? That amateur record for Woody Clark you posted before no longer shows RSC being discounted so not sure if it were a glitch before or his record has been changed since then.

[MikeKnight]

I was looking at various amateur records last night and I noticed they all got changed! All of the RSC's turned into KO's on their records. Whether it be in the Win or Loss column. Now we are all on the same page. Thanks.

[Controversial]

I was looking at various amateur records last night and I noticed they all got changed! All of the RSC's turned into KO's on their records. Whether it be in the Win or Loss column. Now we are all on the same page. Thanks.

That’s good, all sorted then

[MikeKnight]

Yep, it looks that way. I appreciate it.

[MikeKnight]

I have another question....I noticed that RTD or corner retirements are not listed ast KO's in the amateur records on Boxrec, but in boxing they are considered "stoppages"...I am wondering why they aren't considered KO's. I noticed in the pro records on Boxrec, the RTDs are considered KO's. Check Sonny Liston's record. His first loss to Ali is counted as a KO against him, when he quit in the corner.
The same thing with DQs...The fight is STOPPED...because a competitor is disqualified...I am thinking it is also a "stoppage", and stoppages are classified as KOs.
Just some thoughts. It looks like the Pro records and Amateur records have a different set of criteria.

[Controversial]

I have another question....I noticed that RTD or corner retirements are not listed ast KO's in the amateur records on Boxrec, but in boxing they are considered "stoppages"...I am wondering why they aren't considered KO's. I noticed in the pro records on Boxrec, the RTDs are considered KO's. Check Sonny Liston's record. His first loss to Ali is counted as a KO against him, when he quit in the corner.
The same thing with DQs...The fight is STOPPED...because a competitor is disqualified...I am thinking it is also a "stoppage", and stoppages are classified as KOs.
Just some thoughts. It looks like the Pro records and Amateur records have a different set of criteria.

Maybe make a new post re this issue Mike and give a few links to records as examples where it’s different, i think sometimes new questions get missed if they are made in other posts.

[MikeKnight]

Okay, will do. Thanks.