Billy Tully wrote: ↑05 Jan 2024, 08:07
Doesn't the 'small heavies can't handle the big guys' narrative collapse under Usyk actively reigning as heavyweight champ?
They're just diluting an already shallow talent pool by splitting it in two.
Disastrous move motivated purely by sanctioning fees.
Dana White please just buy boxing somehow.
Do you think WBA/WBC are going to forbid (201-224) boxers to compete in unlimited, true HW division?
If not, then there is no big problem. No really talented HW boxer will go to BrW 201-224, no one.
Billy Tully wrote: ↑05 Jan 2024, 08:07
Doesn't the 'small heavies can't handle the big guys' narrative collapse under Usyk actively reigning as heavyweight champ?
They're just diluting an already shallow talent pool by splitting it in two.
Disastrous move motivated purely by sanctioning fees.
Dana White please just buy boxing somehow.
Do you think WBA/WBC are going to forbid (201-224) boxers to compete in unlimited, true HW division?
If not, then there is no big problem. No really talented HW boxer will go to BrW 201-224, no one.
I'm sure the WBC insist on a boxer weigh more than the below weight division. So got to be more than 154 to fight at 160.
Billy Tully wrote: ↑05 Jan 2024, 08:07
Doesn't the 'small heavies can't handle the big guys' narrative collapse under Usyk actively reigning as heavyweight champ?
They're just diluting an already shallow talent pool by splitting it in two.
Disastrous move motivated purely by sanctioning fees.
Dana White please just buy boxing somehow.
Do you think WBA/WBC are going to forbid (201-224) boxers to compete in unlimited, true HW division?
If not, then there is no big problem. No really talented HW boxer will go to BrW 201-224, no one.
I have no idea. Sugar Ray Leonard vs Donny Lalonde was a long time ago. But this new division muddies the heavyweight picture, dilutes the championship, further confuses the public and creates yet more reasons for fighters to cling to a title and not fight each other for years on end, which has become a chronic issue in modern boxing.
If you enjoyed the WBA 'ordinary' champ fiasco of the past 20 years, and the bogus WBO champs of the 90s, I guess you'll love the WBA and WBC's needless new title belts. 'No big problem' for you, real big problem for boxing.
Billy Tully wrote: ↑05 Jan 2024, 08:07
Doesn't the 'small heavies can't handle the big guys' narrative collapse under Usyk actively reigning as heavyweight champ?
They're just diluting an already shallow talent pool by splitting it in two.
Disastrous move motivated purely by sanctioning fees.
Dana White please just buy boxing somehow.
Do you think WBA/WBC are going to forbid (201-224) boxers to compete in unlimited, true HW division?
If not, then there is no big problem. No really talented HW boxer will go to BrW 201-224, no one.
I have no idea. Sugar Ray Leonard vs Donny Lalonde was a long time ago. But this new division muddies the heavyweight picture, dilutes the championship, further confuses the public and creates yet more reasons for fighters to cling to a title and not fight each other for years on end, which has become a chronic issue in modern boxing.
If you enjoyed the WBA 'ordinary' champ fiasco of the past 20 years, and the bogus WBO champs of the 90s, I guess you'll love the WBA and WBC's needless new title belts. 'No big problem' for you, real big problem for boxing.
This new BrW division "muddies" the heavyweight picture no more than did the creation of the CW division, 175+ to 190 (later 200), back in 1980s.
I'm strictly against belts "proliferation", i.e. the production of fake WBA and WBC belts in existing divisions ("regular", "franchise" and so on). But this has nothing in common with creation of an entirely new weight class (for better or for worse).
Billy Tully wrote: ↑05 Jan 2024, 08:07
Doesn't the 'small heavies can't handle the big guys' narrative collapse under Usyk actively reigning as heavyweight champ?
They're just diluting an already shallow talent pool by splitting it in two.
Disastrous move motivated purely by sanctioning fees.
Dana White please just buy boxing somehow.
Do you think WBA/WBC are going to forbid (201-224) boxers to compete in unlimited, true HW division?
If not, then there is no big problem. No really talented HW boxer will go to BrW 201-224, no one.
I'm sure the WBC insist on a boxer weigh more than the below weight division. So got to be more than 154 to fight at 160.
World Boxing Council Middleweight Title (Vacant title)
Saul Alvarez 155 lbs beat Miguel Cotto 153½ lbs by UD
Date: 2015-11-21
omalley wrote: ↑05 Jan 2024, 17:44
This new BrW division "muddies" the heavyweight picture no more than did the creation of the CW division, 175+ to 190 (later 200), back in 1980s.
I'm strictly against belts "proliferation", i.e. the production of fake WBA and WBC belts in existing divisions ("regular", "franchise" and so on). But this has nothing in common with creation of an entirely new weight class (for better or for worse).
The 175-190 cruisers didn't split the heavy division in two because no one had been that size since Patterson in the 60s.
This new division has been created right in the middle line of the heavies despite the fact the reigning heavyweight champion is smaller than the minimum heavyweight limit. Deontay Wilder who had 10, 12 heavyweight title fights, winning most by KO, is deemed 'too small' for heavyweight title fights. It's totally moronic, which is probably why you approve of it.
omalley wrote: ↑05 Jan 2024, 17:44
This new BrW division "muddies" the heavyweight picture no more than did the creation of the CW division, 175+ to 190 (later 200), back in 1980s.
I'm strictly against belts "proliferation", i.e. the production of fake WBA and WBC belts in existing divisions ("regular", "franchise" and so on). But this has nothing in common with creation of an entirely new weight class (for better or for worse).
The 175-190 cruisers didn't split the heavy division in two because no one had been that size since Patterson in the 60s.
The cruisers did split the heavy division in two, of course, because HW was 175+ then.
Leon Spinks 197¼ W-SD Muhammad Ali 224¼
Date: 1978-02-15
World Boxing Council Heavyweight Title (11th defense by Ali)
World Boxing Association Heavyweight Title (11th defense by Ali)
Young Evander Holyfield and other CW champions.
No really talented HW boxer will go to BrW 201-224, no one.
omalley wrote: ↑05 Jan 2024, 17:44
This new BrW division "muddies" the heavyweight picture no more than did the creation of the CW division, 175+ to 190 (later 200), back in 1980s.
I'm strictly against belts "proliferation", i.e. the production of fake WBA and WBC belts in existing divisions ("regular", "franchise" and so on). But this has nothing in common with creation of an entirely new weight class (for better or for worse).
The 175-190 cruisers didn't split the heavy division in two because no one had been that size since Patterson in the 60s.
The cruisers did split the heavy division in two, of course, because HW was 175+ then.
Leon Spinks 197¼ W-SD Muhammad Ali 224¼
Date: 1978-02-15
World Boxing Council Heavyweight Title (11th defense by Ali)
World Boxing Association Heavyweight Title (11th defense by Ali)
Young Evander Holyfield and other CW champions.
No really talented HW boxer will go to BrW 201-224, no one.
why not though, it's an easier belt to win, I imagine might juggle both weights.
Billy Tully wrote: ↑06 Jan 2024, 05:23
The 175-190 cruisers didn't split the heavy division in two because no one had been that size since Patterson in the 60s.
The cruisers did split the heavy division in two, of course, because HW was 175+ then.
Leon Spinks 197¼ W-SD Muhammad Ali 224¼
Date: 1978-02-15
World Boxing Council Heavyweight Title (11th defense by Ali)
World Boxing Association Heavyweight Title (11th defense by Ali)
Young Evander Holyfield and other CW champions.
No really talented HW boxer will go to BrW 201-224, no one.
why not though, it's an easier belt to win, I imagine might juggle both weights.
Because there are no money, fame, legacy in BrW, in comparison with HW. Some very good CW boxers may try BrW on their way to HW, yes.
omalley wrote: ↑05 Jan 2024, 17:44
This new BrW division "muddies" the heavyweight picture no more than did the creation of the CW division, 175+ to 190 (later 200), back in 1980s.
I'm strictly against belts "proliferation", i.e. the production of fake WBA and WBC belts in existing divisions ("regular", "franchise" and so on). But this has nothing in common with creation of an entirely new weight class (for better or for worse).
The 175-190 cruisers didn't split the heavy division in two because no one had been that size since Patterson in the 60s.
The cruisers did split the heavy division in two, of course, because HW was 175+ then.
Leon Spinks 197¼ W-SD Muhammad Ali 224¼
Date: 1978-02-15
World Boxing Council Heavyweight Title (11th defense by Ali)
World Boxing Association Heavyweight Title (11th defense by Ali)
Young Evander Holyfield and other CW champions.
No really talented HW boxer will go to BrW 201-224, no one.
So... Your argument is that the cruisers split the heavyweight division in two because... Flash in the pan fluke champ Leon Spinks weighed 197lbs when he upset Ali?
Your whole argument rests on one man who was well above the 190 cruiser limit anyway, and is in no way representative of the size of the standard heavyweight champ in those days -- Ali, Norton, Holmes, Tate, Weaver, Coetzee, Dokes...
You're either on the wind up or you're something I can't write because it'll get me banned. Either way you're too tedious to respond to. Bye.
Billy Tully wrote: ↑06 Jan 2024, 08:42
So... Your argument is that the cruisers split the heavyweight division in two because...
My argument is that before the creation of the CW there was ONE division, 175+ "old" HW.
And after the creation of the CW there were TWO divisions instead of the "old" HW,
- CW (175+ -- 190 (200))
- and the "new" HW, 200+ (190+ for some time).
These are facts.
omalley wrote: ↑06 Jan 2024, 06:10
The cruisers did split the heavy division in two, of course, because HW was 175+ then.
Leon Spinks 197¼ W-SD Muhammad Ali 224¼
Date: 1978-02-15
World Boxing Council Heavyweight Title (11th defense by Ali)
World Boxing Association Heavyweight Title (11th defense by Ali)
Young Evander Holyfield and other CW champions.
No really talented HW boxer will go to BrW 201-224, no one.
why not though, it's an easier belt to win, I imagine might juggle both weights.
Because there are no money, fame, legacy in BrW, in comparison with HW. Some very good CW boxers may try BrW on their way to HW, yes.
you don't know that, no one does, it's a new division, you've no insight into how it could develop. You can't say 'facts' or use italics like it somehow solidifies your argument. You're not mystic meg, more myopic mary.
why not though, it's an easier belt to win, I imagine might juggle both weights.
Because there are no money, fame, legacy in BrW, in comparison with HW. Some very good CW boxers may try BrW on their way to HW, yes.
you don't know that, no one does, it's a new division, you've no insight into how it could develop. You can't say 'facts' or use italics like it somehow solidifies your argument. You're not mystic meg, more myopic mary.
Oh, we've seen enough since the creation of the CW division. Was it popular? For many, many years it was forgotten weight class.
And now 'Super Cruiserweight' aka Bridgerweight... This is not some abstract new division.
Just read this very topic and sister topic viewtopic.php?t=261197
(Almost) no one is happy, (almost) no one is interested.
There is a strong opinion that Bridgerweight division is no more than an asylum for poor miserable second-class HW boxers.
