Much has been made lately of Vitali Klitchenko (ALL HAIL!!!) 'quitting' boxing, supposedly because he was 'frightened' of fighting Hasim Rahman!!!. Ludicrous as this is some have been led astray by these bogus cliams!. Now I am proposing the question about why Rocky Marciano retired when he did :x , in the prime of life (Younger than Vitali!! ) just when there was a new crop of challengers coming through! :x
Was Rocky injured??? or was Rocky disinclined to face these new challengers??? 8) ... who were actually younger than him!!.... especially a certain Floyd Patterson!
Veiws anyone, ...but lets keep it clean!!...
he was worn out having trained very hard for too long. His swarming style was enough to burn him out. He had to fight 2 return fights one each w/ Charles and Walcott based on their performances in the first go. He ran out of time and he knew that the best of him was gone. I still believe that if he fought Patterson in 1955 or 56 he would have knocked him out. He certianly didn't quit because he was afraid of Patterson.
Persoanlly I'm not buying it... in his retirement speech Rocky said he had no physical problems!... he didnt want to face the new wave of challengers, simple as that...
silkov wrote:Persoanlly I'm not buying it... in his retirement speech Rocky said he had no physical problems!... he didnt want to face the new wave of challengers, simple as that...
I agree. That said, It's not the same thing as being afraid of meeting them. He had earned the right to retire on top.
silkov wrote:Persoanlly I'm not buying it... in his retirement speech Rocky said he had no physical problems!... he didnt want to face the new wave of challengers, simple as that...
Marciano didn't retire so he wouldn't have to fight Patterson. That really doesn't make much sense. It's not like Patterson was the overwhelming #1 challenger or anything like that. Few people at the time would say that he was #1. It's not like people were screaming for a Patterson-Marciano fight right before Marciano retired. If Marciano had defeated Patterson and retired, then some people would saythat he should have fought Tommy Jackson or someone else. Where do you draw the line?
I would say it is possible he quit because he didn't want to face Patterson not because he was afraid but because he knew he was getting old, he knew he wouldn't be able to tackle the new wave of HW for long so he figured he had done enough it was time to retire, why risk it all by taking a chance against guys almost ten years younger than him.
Well exactly, Marciano realised he would be pushing the boat out if he carried on fighting, especially as there was a new generation of fighters coming up, many of whom would have been a significant challenge to Rocky...
After beating the big three: Moore, Charles, Walcott there just wasn't anybody out there who really could pull in the big pay days, let alone really give Marciano a challenge. Here was a man who was ALWAYS in perfect condition, could go 40-50 rounds if he wanted to, strong as a bull, tough as nails, knew no fear.
Who could really have threatened him? Satterfield? No. Baker? No. Walls? No. Valdes? No. Moore again? No. There just wasn't really anybody to face off with to generate the amount of money that a Walcott/Charles/Moore fight could have brought in.
I think Marciano could have been champion longer, and would have still retired undefeated, just a few things made him turn away: Al Weil and his money grubbing ways, Marciano was starting to 'dislike' the 'order' of training and preperation.
It wasn't anything else but that. If Marciano sincerly retired because of Floyd Patterson, who was seemingly the long-shot to beat Moore to begin with, why would Marciano always say that "If I say I could beat Patterson, you would think I was bragging. But if I said I couldn't, then I would be lying?"
AND...
Why would he even consider a comeback against Ingemar Johansson, who blew away Floyd Patterson with relative ease? If Patterson was such a risk, why fight a man who could pose as a greater risk?
If Marciano had stayed around the top men for his title were: Valdes, Jackson, Moore, Patterson [who was both a MW and LHW] and of course Baker and Satterfield.
Moore lost to Patterson, who defended against Jackson [whom Marciano beat up so easily in sparring], who defended it against nobodies from them on, then loses to Ingo, regains it, defends against Ingo and wins, defends against McNeeley.
Marciano beat Moore, Charles, Walcott, Louis and a slew of other contenders and former champions who would have beaten the shit out of the men Patterson fought with ease---Marciano would have stopped Patterson, or at least dropped him so many times in the fight that he would have got the decision over Patterson.
in case people forget, when marciano retired patterson had had only a couple measely fights at heavyweight with only one win over a top ranked contender, a close split decision over hurricane jackson. archie moore was considered the overwhelming favorite to be next heavyweight champion in 1956(marciano crushed moore in 9 one sided rounds) and was the big favorite over patterson.
when marciano retired......no one knew how good patterson really was going to be. he had fought at 168lb just one year prior to meeting marciano.
you said marciano afraid of the upcoming challengers?? . marciano feared no one.
like who?? marciano had just torn apart the # 1 heavyweight contender out there in 9 rounds, archie moore.
when marciano retired........
machen was 10-0 too inexperienced
folley was yet to be a top ranked contender and had suffered two knockout losses
C williams wasnt even fighting in 1956
liston wasnt a contender and would get sent to prison in 1956
patterson was very unproven
who was upcoming that truelly posed a threat in 1956 to marciano?
B. wanted to spend time with family. it was estimated from 1951-55 he spent only 150 days with his wife
C. aging, he was starting to age and showed signs of aging in his latest fights and he wasnt training as much or as hard anymore and he was nearing 33. swarmers never last as long and rocky could sense he was losing it.
had there been any really deserving challengers out there.....marciano would have stayed around and fought 1 more. but there werent.
>>>had there been any really deserving challengers out there.....marciano would have stayed around and fought 1 more. but there werent.<<<
And that is pretty much the truth. People can harp on Patterson, who had just turned heavyweight when Marciano retired, or others like Valdes, or any other, but there were no real challengers out there when Marciano retired...now there would be in two, or three years, but the main point is that there was not!
Why do people want to continue bringing up a truly great fighter, and try to pretend like he is even comparable to a dud like Vitali...plainly just because they are upset with people speaking the truth about a not great fighter...like somelse stated...it's purely child's play!
barry wrote:
...And that is pretty much the truth. People can harp on Patterson, who had just turned heavyweight when Marciano retired, or others like Valdes, or any other, but there were no real challengers out there when Marciano retired...now there would be in two, or three years, but the main point is that there was not!
Why do people want to continue bringing up a truly great fighter, and try to pretend like he is even comparable to a dud like Vitali...plainly just because they are upset with people speaking the truth about a not great fighter...like somelse stated...it's purely child's play!
Could not agree any more. Marciano may not have been the greatest Heavyweight Champion of all time (and whoever is, will always be open to discussion) but the plain truth is that Rocky had run out of bona fide challengers. He had fought everyone around, some more than once, and he was finding hard to stay motivated. His record speaks for itself.
silkov wrote:Persoanlly I'm not buying it... in his retirement speech Rocky said he had no physical problems!... he didnt want to face the new wave of challengers, simple as that...
I agree. That said, It's not the same thing as being afraid of meeting them. He had earned the right to retire on top.
Exactly, I'm not saying Rocky was 'afraid' but he could see that the fights were going to get harder and the path if he fought on would be 'rocky'... But those saying that there were no challengers out there for Marcinao are just deluding themselves, as there was a strong crop of young contenders coming up headed by Patterson... personally I cant help but feel let down that Rocky retired when he did without even fighting Patterson!...
>>>But those saying that there were no challengers out there for Marcinao are just deluding themselves<<<
As I said...there would be no solid challengers for two, three, even four years. Patterson would have been easy game for Marciano. He had the speed, but as Liston and Johansson demonstrated...not the durability!
Well fact, Patterson was koed by Liston twice, who would probably have done a simular job to Marciano... Marcinao never fought anyone as good as Liston or Ali... and the main fact is that Marciano retired rather than fight Patterson... if Patterson was an easy fight why didnt Rocky take it??...
See now what you state is opinion...the FACT is this...Marciano never was knocked out and he faced some pretty big punhers...he was hit well by some pretty big punchers, so odds are...Liston would not KO Marciano. If Bert Whitehurt could take what Liston had to offer then I'm pretty certain Marciano would as well...but Patterson...well we saw what happened there...two consecutive first round knockouts by Liston...Marciano had just as hard a punch as Liston, if not better!
barry wrote:See now what you state is opinion...the FACT is this...Marciano never was knocked out and he faced some pretty big punhers...he was hit well by some pretty big punchers, so odds are...Liston would not KO Marciano. If Bert Whitehurt could take what Liston had to offer then I'm pretty certain Marciano would as well...but Patterson...well we saw what happened there...two consecutive first round knockouts by Liston...Marciano had just as hard a punch as Liston, if not better!
Its not my opinion that Marciano retired surely?.... unless he had some fights I dont know about!. Patterson was the top contender and its obvious that he would have merited a shot had Rocky carried on fighting.
I think Liston had far more power than Rocky, he used to ko people clean out... often early in fights, while Rocky was more a wear them down type fighter... his one punch power is overrated imo... aside from that Liston was a far superior technical boxer and would probably bash Rocky up with the jab... look at how well a shot Louis did against Rocky with the jab until he ran out of gas!...
IrishRufusMurphy wrote:After beating the big three: Moore, Charles, Walcott there just wasn't anybody out there who really could pull in the big pay days, let alone really give Marciano a challenge. Here was a man who was ALWAYS in perfect condition, could go 40-50 rounds if he wanted to, strong as a bull, tough as nails, knew no fear.
Marciano had his sights on the 50th win. Marciano told Don Dunphy in the post fight interview of the moore fight that he would press on for the golden 50th win. Somewhere in-between the September 1955 fight with Moore and his April 1956 retirement Marciano claims to have injured his back. Does anyone know exactly when? Was a fight in the works before the injury happened?
When Marciano retired he told the press he probably has 3-4 four more fights left in him. This suggests he simply decided to walk away from the game on top and un-defeated. I don't beleive the injury was a major factor.
Rocky could have fought Harold Johnson in 1956. Johnson had already proved himself vs Moore and Charles. If not Johnson, perhaps Patterson.
supposedly because he was 'frightened' of fighting Hasim Rahman!!!. 
) just when there was a new crop of challengers coming through! :x 
