Then and now.

[Jimmy2025]

My favourite all time non-heavyweight fighter is Salvador Sanchez. By the time he died at just 23-years-old he had cemented his place, for me in the Top 20 p4p all time list and, I'd be surprised if he wasn't in everybody's Top 50. 44 (32) - 1 - 1 record against a killer's row.

Compare that to what we have now. Fighters are still seen as babies at the age he died, if they've turned pro by then at all. They rarely fight but they still somehow manage to hang about into their late 30s and into their 40s taking up room.

Am I looking back through rose tinted glasses or is boxing pretty shyte compared to back then?

[paultom]

My favourite all time non-heavyweight fighter is Salvador Sanchez. By the time he died at just 23-years-old he had cemented his place, for me in the Top 20 p4p all time list and, I'd be surprised if he wasn't in everybody's Top 50. 44 (32) - 1 - 1 record against a killer's row.

Compare that to what we have now. Fighters are still seen as babies at the age he died, if they've turned pro by then at all. They rarely fight but they still somehow manage to hang about into their late 30s and into their 40s taking up room.

Am I looking back through rose tinted glasses or is boxing pretty shyte compared to back then?

yes it's shite compared to then

[JC]

I agree with the general point (on age). Although, to be fair, Sanchez's weights of bantam-feather aren't really littered with old fighters even today. I suppose people either peak early or move up.

BTW the year Sanchez died (1982) what a year for champions, legends in pretty much every division – Holmes (HW), Spinks (LHW), Hagler (MW), Benetiez (LMW), Leonard (WW), Pryor (LWW), Arguello (LW), Chacon (SFW), Sanchez (FW), Gomez (SBW), Chandler (BW).

And most of them in their 20s at the time.

I don't think boxing is shit now, but that was obviously a crazy era

[keithmoonhangover]

I agree with the general point (on age). Although, to be fair, Sanchez's weights of bantam-feather aren't really littered with old fighters even today. I suppose people either peak early or move up.

BTW the year Sanchez died (1982) what a year for champions, legends in pretty much every division – Holmes (HW), Spinks (LHW), Hagler (MW), Benetiez (LMW), Leonard (WW), Pryor (LWW), Arguello (LW), Chacon (SFW), Sanchez (FW), Gomez (SBW), Chandler (BW).

And most of them in their 20s at the time.

I don't think boxing is shit now, but that was obviously a crazy era

Usyk, Bivol, Canelo, Bud and Inoue could all compete with those guys IMO. Inoue's the only one I would pick to win.

[dr_devious]

My favourite all time non-heavyweight fighter is Salvador Sanchez. By the time he died at just 23-years-old he had cemented his place, for me in the Top 20 p4p all time list and, I'd be surprised if he wasn't in everybody's Top 50. 44 (32) - 1 - 1 record against a killer's row.

Compare that to what we have now. Fighters are still seen as babies at the age he died, if they've turned pro by then at all. They rarely fight but they still somehow manage to hang about into their late 30s and into their 40s taking up room.

Am I looking back through rose tinted glasses or is boxing pretty shyte compared to back then?

It's very shyte compared to the 80s and 90s

[margaret thatcher]

ya i have noticed this a lot over past few years, gervonta davis fans were calling him 'just a baby' until he was almost 30. tbf, he is baby sized

[CaptainSpacerod]

Elite boxers today are paid too much and can afford to only fight once or twice a year thus helping to prolong their careers into their mid to late 30s in many cases

[Fray Bentos]

It was better then of course - probably because we were kids and they were men and now, we're old timers and we're watching kids fight - it's like stopping and watching a playground scrap between two third years - you feel like wanting to step in and break it up.

Also, the internet has ruined the mystique of boxers, I think for example - that there was no internet saved the likes of Frank Bruno or at least protected him. The likes of that middleweight who got his head caved in by Canelo wasn't done any favours by the internet and IFL - do I want to know the inner thoughts of the likes of him and I don't be we end up getting to know them and we end up not liking them (Billy Joe Saunders ) Do I want to know why David Allen couldn't be arsed to train and diet for a gimme Commonwealth title or Johnny Fisher's dad? Nothing against any of these people (except for Saunders) but sometimes less is more and would Spartacus have the same mystique as he did if he kept yapping all the time?

The exposure is massively different and there is more of a voice but all it does over a long term an especially if they don't know how to reign it in is for them to become massively dislikeable and you end up not bothering watching them when they fight.

But the main thing is that we're getting older and it simply doesn't have the same mystique anymore - I remember getting The Ring magazine from America a month or two late and seeing that Kool cigarettes advert on the back cover page and the The Ring reports around the world - Australia and Guyana would be heavily covered and I became interested in the career of Barrington Cambridge - what a name for a boxer! Always imagined him as a Bamber Gascoigne look-a-like coming into the ring with a cap and gown - none of that will ever be captured again.

[MightyWarrior]

Any excuse to talk about Salvador Sanchez, my favourite fighter of all time I often think what a shock it must’ve been for the both of them when they met, Azumah Nelson and Salvador Sanchez.

Nelson, a young fighter who knew he was going to be a superstar and had no fear at all facing this all-time great - and the realisation, at the midway point that this man from Mexico was something else entirely.

And Sanchez, arguably P4P number one at the time, thinking who the hell is this obscure kid from Africa, with hardly any fights plucked from nowhere on something like two weeks notice …how does he belong in the ring with me?

Then the shocking realisation of the talent in front of him. The fearless mighty warrior as they called him in Africa, coming right at him - a future all-time great he likely realised at some point.

Maybe my favourite fight of all is Sanchez Wilfredo Gomez, just for the ring band entrance and that first round alone. After that, it’s just a show of how Gomez had one of the greatest fighting hearts ever seen, as we watched the cold blooded brutal execution of a living legend.
Hard to imagine a more relaxed fighter than Sanchez that night, smiling and dancing round the ring before the first bell, getting ready to face one of the most fearsome fighters ever seen.

When I read the preview in BN with Graham Houston picking Sanchez, I was thinking what on earth is he thinking, how is this low-key light punching Mexican going to beat the sensational, 35-0 35 knockouts Puerto Rican superstar. A man who’d smashed the great Carlos Zárate 55-0 55 kos to pieces.
I’d just started to follow boxing, maybe these days I would’ve noticed that Sanchez had gone 45 rounds beating one of the hardest punchers ever seen Danny little red Lopez, so he had the chin and he had the weight too.

I should add that Gomez was way overconfident for this fight, and I think he was seen running in the desert in plastic bags, the day before the fight.

I was hooked forever from that moment on. And I so wanted to see Sanchez take on Alexis Arguello, and when I read the news one night of the car crash …boy, that’s a moment I’ll never forget

[Jimmy2025]

Any excuse to talk about Salvador Sanchez, my favourite fighter of all time I often think what a shock it must’ve been for the both of them when they met, Azumah Nelson and Salvador Sanchez.

Nelson, a young fighter who knew he was going to be a superstar and had no fear at all facing this all-time great - and the realisation, at the midway point that this man from Mexico was something else entirely.

And Sanchez, arguably P4P number one at the time, thinking who the hell is this obscure kid from Africa, with hardly any fights plucked from nowhere on something like two weeks notice …how does he belong in the ring with me?

Then the shocking realisation of the talent in front of him. The fearless mighty warrior as they called him in Africa, coming right at him - a future all-time great he likely realised at some point.

Maybe my favourite fight of all is Sanchez Wilfredo Gomez, just for the ring band entrance and that first round alone. After that, it’s just a show of how Gomez had one of the greatest fighting hearts ever seen, as we watched the cold blooded brutal execution of a living legend.
Hard to imagine a more relaxed fighter than Sanchez that night, smiling and dancing round the ring before the first bell, getting ready to face one of the most fearsome fighters ever seen.

When I read the preview in BN with Graham Houston picking Sanchez, I was thinking what on earth is he thinking, how is this low-key light punching Mexican going to beat the sensational, 35-0 35 knockouts Puerto Rican superstar. A man who’d smashed the great Carlos Zárate 55-0 55 kos to pieces.
I’d just started to follow boxing, maybe these days I would’ve noticed that Sanchez had gone 45 rounds beating one of the hardest punchers ever seen Danny little red Lopez, so he had the chin and he had the weight too.

I should add that Gomez was way overconfident for this fight, and I think he was seen running in the desert in plastic bags, the day before the fight.

I was hooked forever from that moment on. And I so wanted to see Sanchez take on Alexis Arguello, and when I read the news one night of the car crash …boy, that’s a moment I’ll never forget

I actually thought of you when I started the topic. Donkey's years ago you had a Salvador Sanchez avatar on one of the forums.

[MightyWarrior]

Oh you’re right, wow that was a long time ago

A few years ago I was driving just outside Mexico City in the hills on the way to somewhere and my friend pointed out that’s where Salvador Sanchez crashed. I heard he snuck out late one night from a training camp, but surely that can’t be right, because it was very soon after the Nelson fight.

The early 1980’s was a hell of a time, you had the untouchable big four - and then you had fighters like sanchez and Arguello and Pryor and a great champion like Larry Holmes at the top, who wasn’t really appreciated at the time as much as he should’ve been

[Jimmy2025]

Yes, that era got me hooked on boxing.

Carlos' point earlier about the Internet taking away the mystique of fighters definitely resonated. So too age, of course. We are old.

[JamesPhilips]

Yes, that era got me hooked on boxing.

Carlos' point earlier about the Internet taking away the mystique of fighters definitely resonated. So too age, of course. We are old.

Agreed. In some ways boxing is better though - it’s much more international. With the eastern bloc fighters, with Chinese fighters (not been many so far), India’s starting to build in the amateurs…. The US strangehold is gone. We get to see so many fights now on TV / internet in real time that we would never have been able to see before.

In other ways worse…. Too many titles. Celebrity boxing. Women’s boxing is very poor. And as Jimmy said all the social media takes away some mystique.

As we get older we get more cynical as well. When I was young you are so much more emotionally invested. But for years they said boxing is dying yet it’s in a healthy state IMO.

[Fray Bentos]

Yes, that era got me hooked on boxing.

Carlos' point earlier about the Internet taking away the mystique of fighters definitely resonated. So too age, of course. We are old.

Agreed. In some ways boxing is better though - it’s much more international. With the eastern bloc fighters, with Chinese fighters (not been many so far), India’s starting to build in the amateurs…. The US strangehold is gone. We get to see so many fights now on TV / internet in real time that we would never have been able to see before.

In other ways worse…. Too many titles. Celebrity boxing. Women’s boxing is very poor. And as Jimmy said all the social media takes away some mystique.

As we get older we get more cynical as well. When I was young you are so much more emotionally invested. But for years they said boxing is dying yet it’s in a healthy state IMO.

The boxing of today is miles ahead technically with the Eastern Europeans, when the wall came down and a load of them turned pro - I was expecting crash bang biff bash like Ivan Drago in a Rocky movie but what we got was Henry Maske that boring fornicating lightweight from wherever (Nazarov) - watching him defend his WBA title was the first time I turned over from the boxing to watch something else instead - I am not saying they were all boring, I liked watching Vassily Jirov who was the IBF cruiserweight champion but usually they were technically brilliant but it wasn't exciting - it depends on what you like of course but before the wall came down - a world title fight would be entertaining - very few weren't and they usually involved Carlos de Leon the yanks know how to put on a show and the fighters knew winning with style was part of the job. I think boxing kids today are missing out on the raw excitement of getting up at 3 am for a big show in Vegas, especially involving a British fighter or Tyson, Ali, Hagler, Hearns and his thousand yard stare - a full house in Dusseldorf watching Wlad grab and jab and now Riyadh?

Would I be a big boxing fan if I was 12 years old now and the answer is yeah - now as a gentleman of a certain vintage, I don't even bother watching the heavyweights.

[JamesPhilips]

Yes, that era got me hooked on boxing.

Carlos' point earlier about the Internet taking away the mystique of fighters definitely resonated. So too age, of course. We are old.

Agreed. In some ways boxing is better though - it’s much more international. With the eastern bloc fighters, with Chinese fighters (not been many so far), India’s starting to build in the amateurs…. The US strangehold is gone. We get to see so many fights now on TV / internet in real time that we would never have been able to see before.

In other ways worse…. Too many titles. Celebrity boxing. Women’s boxing is very poor. And as Jimmy said all the social media takes away some mystique.

As we get older we get more cynical as well. When I was young you are so much more emotionally invested. But for years they said boxing is dying yet it’s in a healthy state IMO.

The boxing of today is miles ahead technically with the Eastern Europeans, when the wall came down and a load of them turned pro - I was expecting crash bang biff bash like Ivan Drago in a Rocky movie but what we got was Henry Maske that boring fornicating lightweight from wherever (Nazarov) - watching him defend his WBA title was the first time I turned over from the boxing to watch something else instead - I am not saying they were all boring, I liked watching Vassily Jirov who was the IBF cruiserweight champion but usually they were technically brilliant but it wasn't exciting - it depends on what you like of course but before the wall came down - a world title fight would be entertaining - very few weren't and they usually involved Carlos de Leon the yanks know how to put on a show and the fighters knew winning with style was part of the job. I think boxing kids today are missing out on the raw excitement of getting up at 3 am for a big show in Vegas, especially involving a British fighter or Tyson, Ali, Hagler, Hearns and his thousand yard stare - a full house in Dusseldorf watching Wlad grab and jab and now Riyadh?

Would I be a big boxing fan if I was 12 years old now and the answer is yeah - now as a gentleman of a certain vintage, I don't even bother watching the heavyweights.

Some good points there. Although some of those 80s heavyweight fights were drab. And there have been some exciting eastern bloc fighters like Kostya Tszyu, Denis Lebedev etc. What I notice today is that refs allow clutching and grabbing and holding a lot. Look back to the fights of the 70s and 80s and the fighters rarely clinch. They work on the inside. Even when hurt they rarely clinched like they do today - also I find some modern US big names to be an awful watch, Hopkins, Mayweather. Johnny Nelson was also terrible in the late 80s title fights. Him and Carlos Deleon would’ve sent a speed head to sleep. Clinching and leaning on opponents needs to be reigned in - it’s not entertaining and not boxing. Like you say Wladimir was the king of that game and Tyson Fury also employs those ‘techniques’.