Kid Gavilan vs Shane Mosley

[Nile4000]

15/147, who wins?

[goose 5]

Gavilan by a shutout.

[elmersalsa]

The great Kid Gavilan wins by decision. Different class!

[gilgamesh]

Gavilan by a shutout.

Gavilan might win, but it ain't gonna be no shutout. Mosley was a great fighter as was Gavilan. Great fighters don't tend to lose easy.

[Cent0089]

Different class my a"s lol ....Mosley by close decision

[elmersalsa]

Different class my a"s lol ....Mosley by close decision

Kid Gavilan in his prime was in another level. A level that Shane Mosley never reached. Close decision by Mosley? My ass!

[gilgamesh]

Different class my a"s lol ....Mosley by close decision

Kid Gavilan in his prime was in another level. A level that Shane Mosley never reached. Close decision by Mosley? My ass!

Gavilan's greatest achievement was winning the Welterweight Championship. Mosley also did that, and picked up a World title at 154 pounds as well along with being a Lightweight Champion. He won more Championship bouts than Gavilan.

Ike Williams former Lightweight Champion defeated Gavilan once (albeit controversially apparently). Gavilan has many more fights than Mosley, but nothing on his record to suggest he's going to be able to make easy work out of Mosley. Mosley wasn't easy.

[elmersalsa]

Different class my a"s lol ....Mosley by close decision

Kid Gavilan in his prime was in another level. A level that Shane Mosley never reached. Close decision by Mosley? My ass!

Gavilan's greatest achievement was winning the Welterweight Championship. Mosley also did that, and picked up a World title at 154 pounds as well along with being a Lightweight Champion. He won more Championship bouts than Gavilan.

Ike Williams former Lightweight Champion defeated Gavilan once (albeit controversially apparently). Gavilan has many more fights than Mosley, but nothing on his record to suggest he's going to be able to make easy work out of Mosley. Mosley wasn't easy.

Kid Gavilan is not Vernon Forrest. He is three times better.

[gilgamesh]

Kid Gavilan in his prime was in another level. A level that Shane Mosley never reached. Close decision by Mosley? My ass!

Gavilan's greatest achievement was winning the Welterweight Championship. Mosley also did that, and picked up a World title at 154 pounds as well along with being a Lightweight Champion. He won more Championship bouts than Gavilan.

Ike Williams former Lightweight Champion defeated Gavilan once (albeit controversially apparently). Gavilan has many more fights than Mosley, but nothing on his record to suggest he's going to be able to make easy work out of Mosley. Mosley wasn't easy.

Kid Gavilan is not Vernon Forrest. He is three times better.

Is he? He certainly don't have the punching power of Forrest. I'd imagine he'd definitely keep a busier pace than Mosley, but Mosley would have a few things in his favor. Mosley is fast and powerful and a world class athlete. A Hall of Famer.

He's not a pushover.

[Cent0089]

Kid Gavilan in his prime was in another level. A level that Shane Mosley never reached. Close decision by Mosley? My ass!

Gavilan's greatest achievement was winning the Welterweight Championship. Mosley also did that, and picked up a World title at 154 pounds as well along with being a Lightweight Champion. He won more Championship bouts than Gavilan.

Ike Williams former Lightweight Champion defeated Gavilan once (albeit controversially apparently). Gavilan has many more fights than Mosley, but nothing on his record to suggest he's going to be able to make easy work out of Mosley. Mosley wasn't easy.

Kid Gavilan is not Vernon Forrest. He is three times better.

Just like Mosley is three times better than half of guys who deliver 30 losses, 5 draws and around 20 split decisions to Gavillan.

[elmersalsa]

Gavilan's greatest achievement was winning the Welterweight Championship. Mosley also did that, and picked up a World title at 154 pounds as well along with being a Lightweight Champion. He won more Championship bouts than Gavilan.

Ike Williams former Lightweight Champion defeated Gavilan once (albeit controversially apparently). Gavilan has many more fights than Mosley, but nothing on his record to suggest he's going to be able to make easy work out of Mosley. Mosley wasn't easy.

Kid Gavilan is not Vernon Forrest. He is three times better.

Is he? He certainly don't have the punching power of Forrest. I'd imagine he'd definitely keep a busier pace than Mosley, but Mosley would have a few things in his favor. Mosley is fast and powerful and a world class athlete. A Hall of Famer.

He's not a pushover.

I know that Shane Mosley is not a pushover, but, again, Kid Gavilan was in a different class. Different level. About 1 or two levels above. What a fighter the Cuban Hawk was.

[elmersalsa]

Gavilan's greatest achievement was winning the Welterweight Championship. Mosley also did that, and picked up a World title at 154 pounds as well along with being a Lightweight Champion. He won more Championship bouts than Gavilan.

Ike Williams former Lightweight Champion defeated Gavilan once (albeit controversially apparently). Gavilan has many more fights than Mosley, but nothing on his record to suggest he's going to be able to make easy work out of Mosley. Mosley wasn't easy.

Kid Gavilan is not Vernon Forrest. He is three times better.

Just like Mosley is three times better than half of guys who deliver 30 losses, 5 draws and around 20 split decisions to Gavillan.

Put Shane Mosley in that era and he would have about 25 to 40 losses. Different class the 40s and 50s fighters were.....Gil Turner, a Kid Gavilan victim in 1952, would also whup Mosley every day and twice on Sunday.

[gilgamesh]

There's really nothing on Gavilan's record to suggest he's on a different level than Mosley. Not to say he couldn't beat him, but there's no reason to think he's gonna dominate Mosley or vice versa. He has the natural size advantage, but Mosley is probably still the bigger puncher of the 2 of them. Both men have excellent chins so a KO for either man doesn't seem likely.

[gilgamesh]

Kid Gavilan is not Vernon Forrest. He is three times better.

Just like Mosley is three times better than half of guys who deliver 30 losses, 5 draws and around 20 split decisions to Gavillan.

Put Shane Mosley in that era and he would have about 25 to 40 losses. Different class the 40s and 50s fighters were.....Gil Turner, a Kid Gavilan victim in 1952, would also whup Mosley every day and twice on Sunday.

If you put him in that era and he'd have the same amount of losses as Gavilan doesn't that mean he's about the same level as Gavilan?

[elmersalsa]

There's really nothing on Gavilan's record to suggest he's on a different level than Mosley. Not to say he couldn't beat him, but there's no reason to think he's gonna dominate Mosley or vice versa. He has the natural size advantage, but Mosley is probably still the bigger puncher of the 2 of them. Both men have excellent chins so a KO for either man doesn't seem likely.

Kid Gavilan was in a different level by far. A top 50 all-time pound per pound boxing great. A jewel of Latin American boxing and the world.

Sugar Shane Mosley wouldn't even have a close fight with the likes of Sugar Ray Robinson or Ike Williams. Including Gavilan, that trio was a trio of boxing monsters.

A lot of people that saw the first Gavilan vs Robinson bout said that Gavilan was robbed. I don't think that Mosley would have make a close fight against Robinson. He eats too much leather.

[elmersalsa]

Just like Mosley is three times better than half of guys who deliver 30 losses, 5 draws and around 20 split decisions to Gavillan.

Put Shane Mosley in that era and he would have about 25 to 40 losses. Different class the 40s and 50s fighters were.....Gil Turner, a Kid Gavilan victim in 1952, would also whup Mosley every day and twice on Sunday.

If you put him in that era and he'd have the same amount of losses as Gavilan doesn't that mean he's about the same level as Gavilan?

I don't think that Sugar Shane would have excel in that era. Too many great champions and contenders. Those guys were not Antonio Margarito for crying out loud.

Mosley has so many deficiencies as a fighter. In that era, he would have not last long. He receives too many punches. That's very detrimental for those days.

Mosley I don't even rate him in the top 100 all-time pound per pound greatest boxers. Was he good? Yes. Great? No way at all. A superstar in his era? That's all he was.

[Expug]

When it comes to Gavilan , who was a terrific fighter, it wise to take a close look at some of his wins and losses. Rather than just the numbers. Frankie Carbo and company were pulling strings in a number of his fights.
In 51 he got the decision over Billy Graham that was clearly a robbery.
There were other peculiar results.
I’d give Moseley a good shot at beating him.

[elmersalsa]

When it comes to Gavilan , who was a terrific fighter, it wise to take a close look at some of his wins and losses. Rather than just the numbers. Frankie Carbo and company were pulling strings in a number of his fights.
In 51 he got the decision over Billy Graham that was clearly a robbery.
There were other peculiar results.
I’d give Moseley a good shot at beating him.

I am sorry, but Sugar Shane Mosley was not in Kid Gavilan's level. Different class.

[gilgamesh]

When it comes to Gavilan , who was a terrific fighter, it wise to take a close look at some of his wins and losses. Rather than just the numbers. Frankie Carbo and company were pulling strings in a number of his fights.
In 51 he got the decision over Billy Graham that was clearly a robbery.
There were other peculiar results.
I’d give Moseley a good shot at beating him.

I am sorry, but Sugar Shane Mosley was not in Kid Gavilan's level. Different class.

Shane Mosley competed in twice as many World title fights in spite of having half as many total bouts.

Mosley has a winning percentage of around 80%.. Gavilan has a winning percentage of around 75%

[gilgamesh]

Put Shane Mosley in that era and he would have about 25 to 40 losses. Different class the 40s and 50s fighters were.....Gil Turner, a Kid Gavilan victim in 1952, would also whup Mosley every day and twice on Sunday.

If you put him in that era and he'd have the same amount of losses as Gavilan doesn't that mean he's about the same level as Gavilan?

I don't think that Sugar Shane would have excel in that era. Too many great champions and contenders. Those guys were not Antonio Margarito for crying out loud.

Mosley has so many deficiencies as a fighter. In that era, he would have not last long. He receives too many punches. That's very detrimental for those days.

Mosley I don't even rate him in the top 100 all-time pound per pound greatest boxers. Was he good? Yes. Great? No way at all. A superstar in his era? That's all he was.

I haven't yet rated 100 fighters on my ongoing all time list, but I think Mosley will be in there still even after ive rated a few hundred of em. If not he'll be close.

I'm gonna need to rate Gavilan soon I guess to see where he lands for me.

[tiny_acres]

The great Kid Gavilan wins by decision. Different class!

A "DIFFERENT CLASS" only works so many times.
You use this argument with every mythical fight. It does not work here.
I like your opinion I do value it. Just don't use the same argument every time
it makes you sound like a schmuck

[gilgamesh]

The great Kid Gavilan wins by decision. Different class!

A "DIFFERENT CLASS" only works so many times.
You use this argument with every mythical fight. It does not work here.
I like your opinion I do value it. Just don't use the same argument every time
it makes you sound like a schmuck

Especially when everyone is coming up with reasons why they're not in a different class while you can't come up with any to back up your claim that Gavilan is definitely better.

[Cent0089]

The great Kid Gavilan wins by decision. Different class!

A "DIFFERENT CLASS" only works so many times.
You use this argument with every mythical fight. It does not work here.
I like your opinion I do value it. Just don't use the same argument every time
it makes you sound like a schmuck

Especially when everyone is coming up with reasons why they're not in a different class while you can't come up with any to back up your claim that Gavilan is definitely better.

These guys always tend to massively overrate boxers from past

[elmersalsa]

Now, what is the fuzz about saying that Kid Gavilan was in a different class?. He was in a different class! You guys can't see?

Shane Mosley was a good fighter. Extrictly world class! But, Kid Gavilan was about 2 levels above. I am not overrating nothing. It is what it is in my eyes!

The Cuban Hawk was a phenomenal fighter. He was so great, that American tv audiences wanted him on the main event bill no less than 30 times!

Mosley? I wouldn't pay to see none of his fights on ppv. The guy is not a top 100 all-time pound per pound fighter. Stop complaining.

[elmersalsa]

The great Kid Gavilan wins by decision. Different class!

A "DIFFERENT CLASS" only works so many times.
You use this argument with every mythical fight. It does not work here.
I like your opinion I do value it. Just don't use the same argument every time
it makes you sound like a schmuck

Shut the fuuuck up!