This is why people hate Joe Calzaghe

josh fg · Post by **josh fg** » 12 Oct 2006, 15:28

Calzaghe close to 'legend' status
CALZAGHE V BIKA

Live coverage, BBC Radio Five Live & BBC Radio Wales, Saturday 14 October, 2130 BST
Promoter allegedly has urged Joe Calzaghe to establish himself as an all-time global great.
Warren believes "legendary status" now awaits Calzaghe if he can see off Sakio Bika on Saturday and continue to reign for the remainder of his career.

Calzaghe will defend his WBO and IBF super middleweight belts in Manchester.

"Now is a crucial time in Joe's career, because he wants to go on to cement his status as a legend of world boxing and bow out as a winner," Warren said.

It will be the 19th title defence of the WBO belt that Calzaghe wrested from Chris Eubank nine years ago, but the first of his new title that the Welshman took from Jeff Lacy in March.

Warren believes the 34-year-old Calzaghe would have come out on top against any one of the 12-stone stars at their peak in the early 1990s.

"I would rate Joe as the finest British fighter I have seen during my time in boxing, and it is a pity he could not have proved that against the likes of Nigel Benn," Warren said.

Joe Calzaghe will make his 19th title defence against Sakio Bika

"Joe has compiled a phenomenal record - and to do what he has done against a backdrop of constant hand injuries shows what a special kind of fighter he is."

Twenty-seven-year-old Bika was impressed with Calzaghe's performance against Lacy and looked non-plussed at a press conference on Thursday when asked to identify a weakness in the Welshman.

Bika's trainer, Angelo Hyder, avoided potential embarrassment by joking: "Joe is a non-puncher. He hit Jeff Lacy 5,000 times in his last fight in March and could not knock him out!"

Bika, based in Australia, has not lost for four years and was on top of WBC champion Markus Beyer in his last fight in May before a head-butt forced the fight to be declared a technical draw.

Hyder added: "Sakio is going to come to fight, because he is a hungry fighter.

"His family's future depends on how he fights, and he has made every single sacrifice in order to make the most of this chance."

from BBC sport

Smit · Post by **Smit** » 12 Oct 2006, 16:27

josh fg wrote: "Joe has compiled a phenomenal record - and to do what he has done against a backdrop of constant hand injuries shows what a special kind of fighter he is."

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 12 Oct 2006, 16:57

Next topic.

Raff The Frenchman · Post by **Raff The Frenchman** » 12 Oct 2006, 17:46

Joe stepped up by facing Lacy, why is he stepping down?...Bika aint no real deal let's face it...

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 12 Oct 2006, 18:28

Raff The Frenchman wrote:Joe stepped up by facing Lacy, why is he stepping down?...Bika aint no real deal let's face it...

Hmmmm..... my take: Joe did not step up with Lacy -- FW only found an opponent who could be sold as a step up. Hence he isn't stepping down now either. He's just fighting his habitual level of opposition, perhaps even a notch above it.

Cheers, P

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 12 Oct 2006, 18:32

pundit wrote:
Raff The Frenchman wrote:Joe stepped up by facing Lacy, why is he stepping down?...Bika aint no real deal let's face it...
Hmmmm..... my take: Joe did not step up with Lacy -- FW only found an opponent who could be sold as a step up. Hence he isn't stepping down now either. He's just fighting his habitual level of opposition, perhaps even a notch above it.

Cheers, P

Quit with the bullshit, Lacy was a legit champion and had beaten some good comp. Most people picked him to win. Your Calzaghe witchhunt is getting ridiculous!

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 12 Oct 2006, 18:38

Pundit, Lacy picked Calzaghe: Fact.

Josh, that was Warren who said that though, not Calzaghe?

Warren said in an article he'd like to take Joe and Macca to America, but Joe prefers to have one at the Millenuim staduim.

Graham Brett · Post by **Graham Brett** » 12 Oct 2006, 18:40

Raff The Frenchman wrote:Joe stepped up by facing Lacy, why is he stepping down?...Bika aint no real deal let's face it...

Who did Benn fight after McLennan?

Calzaghe is better than Been Eubank and Collins

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 12 Oct 2006, 18:55

Graham Brett wrote:
Raff The Frenchman wrote:Joe stepped up by facing Lacy, why is he stepping down?...Bika aint no real deal let's face it...
Who did Benn fight after McLennan?

Calzaghe is better than Been Eubank and Collins

Them 3 have better names on their records including fighting each other, but Joe is better than all 3.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 12 Oct 2006, 18:59

Lacy was a credible opponent. Lacy's opponents were starting believe the mystique that Lacy was building. Calzaghe didn't believe it. JC is arrogant when it comes to his abilities and he refused to let the mouthy disrespectful jerk take his belt. He made a frightful puncher into an embarrassment, & it does take something special to do that. It was a great night of boxing.

That said, Bika is better than Lacy - in terms of skill. I'll eat my words if Bika embarrasses himself on Saturday. If Bika had come over here fighting for Commonwealth titles & smashing up our cocky white 160 and 168 pounders we'd be hailing him alongside Munyai, Asiku & Olusegun as a future world champion.

Ok, it's too early for Bika. He's too small. Blah blah.

But he's just come off a world title challenge & that was a nice little warmup.

Just as I like what I see in fighters like Andrade, I like some of the moves that Bika is capable of pulling off. Ppl are acting like he's another 'Ceasefire' McIntyre, but he's not!

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 12 Oct 2006, 19:01

Bika will get outclassed easily.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 12 Oct 2006, 19:14

We'll see!

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 12 Oct 2006, 19:40

nickd wrote:
pundit wrote:
Raff The Frenchman wrote:Joe stepped up by facing Lacy, why is he stepping down?...Bika aint no real deal let's face it...
Hmmmm..... my take: Joe did not step up with Lacy -- FW only found an opponent who could be sold as a step up. Hence he isn't stepping down now either. He's just fighting his habitual level of opposition, perhaps even a notch above it.

Cheers, P
Quit with the bullshit, Lacy was a legit champion and had beaten some good comp. Most people picked him to win. Your Calzaghe witchhunt is getting ridiculous!

You just confirmed the correctness of the phrase:
""FW only found an opponent who could be sold as a step up.""

Cheers,
P

dbf · Post by **dbf** » 12 Oct 2006, 19:49

slightly ot but I just saw the calzaghe documentary on ITV4, which wasnt too bad.

But why cant allegedly ever great Chris Eubank's name right? Its Chris Eubank isnt it? Yet he always says "Eubanks"!

bigynzing · Post by **bigynzing** » 12 Oct 2006, 19:53

pundit wrote:
nickd wrote:
pundit wrote: Hmmmm..... my take: Joe did not step up with Lacy -- FW only found an opponent who could be sold as a step up. Hence he isn't stepping down now either. He's just fighting his habitual level of opposition, perhaps even a notch above it.

Cheers, P
Quit with the bullshit, Lacy was a legit champion and had beaten some good comp. Most people picked him to win. Your Calzaghe witchhunt is getting ridiculous!

You just confirmed the correctness of the phrase:
""FW only found an opponent who could be sold as a step up.""

Calzaghe has never fought anybody.

Thats still "anybody" more than Kessler.

Cheers,
P

E · Post by E » 12 Oct 2006, 21:52

Graham Brett wrote:
Raff The Frenchman wrote:Joe stepped up by facing Lacy, why is he stepping down?...Bika aint no real deal let's face it...
Who did Benn fight after McLennan?

Calzaghe is better than Been Eubank and Collins

Right - BEnn was a warrior and one of our best but who did he really beat apart from the amazing fight against Mclellan?

Barkley - had lost his last 2
Mauro Galvano - good to win in Italy, but opponet a low grade G Rosi
De Witt - tough but only just top 10. Was KOd by non puncher Kalambay 3 fights before

And got beat by decent but not great fighters.

Actually think (apart from mclellan maybe and Joe would've handled him ) Jo's victories are much better - Woodhall, Reid, Eubank, Mitchell, LAcy, Sheika, Brewer and even Veit is OK.

Oh yeah and Pat Lawlor who beat legends Benitez and Duran..er OK maybe not.......

Lenny · Post by **Lenny** » 13 Oct 2006, 03:34

But why cant allegedly allegedly ever great Chris Eubank's name right? Its Chris Eubank isnt it? Yet he always says "Eubanks"!

I pretty sure his name is Eubanks mate

and Calzaghe may be a better fighter than the guys from the 90s but will never be held in as high a regard for many reasons.

fight Kessler then Adamek (or whoever else is the top light heavy) and win Joe and I think you can say you're one of the best of you generation but not the way your going.

yiddo14 · Post by **yiddo14** » 13 Oct 2006, 03:48

E wrote:
Graham Brett wrote:
Raff The Frenchman wrote:Joe stepped up by facing Lacy, why is he stepping down?...Bika aint no real deal let's face it...
Who did Benn fight after McLennan?

Calzaghe is better than Been Eubank and Collins

Right - BEnn was a warrior and one of our best but who did he really beat apart from the amazing fight against Mclellan?

Barkley - had lost his last 2
Mauro Galvano - good to win in Italy, but opponet a low grade G Rosi
De Witt - tough but only just top 10. Was KOd by non puncher Kalambay 3 fights before

And got beat by decent but not great fighters.

Actually think (apart from mclellan maybe and Joe would've handled him ) Jo's victories are much better - Woodhall, Reid, Eubank, Mitchell, LAcy, Sheika, Brewer and even Veit is OK.

Oh yeah and Pat Lawlor who beat legends Benitez and Duran..er OK maybe not.......

Eubank was gone when he fought Calzaghe.In fact,Eubank was never the same after Watson II.
IMO,a pre Watson Chris Eubank would have beat Calzaghe.

As for Calzaghe's opponents being better than Nigel Benns.....listen,ONE Gerald Mcllelan equals a 100 Richie Woodhalls,Robin Reids,Byron Mitchells etc......

Calzaghe was better than a prime Benn,a prime Watson and he is miles better than a prime Steve Collins.
These guys wil be remembered more fondly though,because they created a buzz in the division domestically with their series of fights and personalities(something which Joe struggles with unfortunately!)

Warren has'nt done Joe no favours by the nonsense he has come out with.
Joe should have gone to the US years ago.He would be a modern day great IMO if he had.

As for Warren wanting to take Enzo to the US.....yeah,I'am sure he will take it by storm!!!!!

computerrank · Post by **computerrank** » 13 Oct 2006, 04:06

Calzaghe dominates the Super Middleweight since seven years now 1999 - 2005 and 2006 seems to follow - more than any Super Middleweight before:

Top Ranks in annual division ratings:

14 Top Ranks: Sugar Ray Robinson
12 Top Ranks: Ricardo Lopez
11 Top Ranks: Tommy Ryan
10 Top Ranks: Muhammad Ali, Julio Cesar Chavez, Joe Louis
9 Top Ranks: Roy Jones, Jr., Azumah Nelson, Carlos Ortiz
8 Top Ranks: Jack Johnson, Floyd Mayweather, Jr., Jose Angel Napoles, Willie Pep, Pernell Whitaker
7 Top Ranks: Alexis Arguello, Joe Calzaghe, Joe Goss, Harry Greb, Emile Griffith, Marvin Hagler, Benny Leonard, Lennox Lewis, Carlos Monzon
6 Top Ranks: Ezzard Charles, Thomas Hearns, Virgil Hill, Larry Holmes, Oscar De La Hoya, Eder Jofre, Gene Tunney

Super Middleweight 1999 848.4 Joe Calzaghe
Super Middleweight 1999 733.3 Mads Larsen
Super Middleweight 1999 568.3 Robin Reid
Super Middleweight 1999 567.0 Dana Rosenblatt
Super Middleweight 1999 545.7 Sven Ottke
Super Middleweight 1999 537.8 Vinny Pazienza
Super Middleweight 1999 518.0 Markus Beyer
Super Middleweight 1999 516.7 Richie Woodhall
Super Middleweight 1999 514.5 Thomas Tate
Super Middleweight 1999 493.4 Robert McCracken
Super Middleweight 1999 491.2 David Starie
Super Middleweight 1999 482.0 Glenn Catley
Super Middleweight 1999 443.5 Byron Mitchell
Super Middleweight 1999 429.6 Davide Ciarlante
Super Middleweight 1999 408.1 Bruno Girard

Super Middleweight 2000 1573.3 Joe Calzaghe
Super Middleweight 2000 961.6 Sven Ottke
Super Middleweight 2000 946.6 Mads Larsen
Super Middleweight 2000 791.7 Dana Rosenblatt
Super Middleweight 2000 626.8 Glenn Catley
Super Middleweight 2000 614.5 Silvio Branco
Super Middleweight 2000 608.0 Bruno Girard
Super Middleweight 2000 555.2 David Starie
Super Middleweight 2000 504.4 James Butler
Super Middleweight 2000 499.1 Richie Woodhall
Super Middleweight 2000 495.8 Mario Veit
Super Middleweight 2000 484.3 Charles Brewer
Super Middleweight 2000 477.9 Cornelius Carr
Super Middleweight 2000 456.6 Dave Hilton
Super Middleweight 2000 454.8 Dingaan Thobela

Super Middleweight 2001 1438.2 Joe Calzaghe
Super Middleweight 2001 1083.3 Sven Ottke
Super Middleweight 2001 714.6 Thomas Tate
Super Middleweight 2001 626.6 Hector Camacho
Super Middleweight 2001 590.4 Eric Lucas
Super Middleweight 2001 579.1 Tito Mendoza
Super Middleweight 2001 572.5 David Starie
Super Middleweight 2001 546.5 Antwun Echols
Super Middleweight 2001 510.8 Kirino Garcia
Super Middleweight 2001 494.8 Sam Hill
Super Middleweight 2001 493.2 David Reid
Super Middleweight 2001 484.5 Robin Reid
Super Middleweight 2001 468.6 Byron Mitchell
Super Middleweight 2001 410.5 Brian Magee
Super Middleweight 2001 394.0 Markus Beyer

Super Middleweight 2002 1340.4 Joe Calzaghe
Super Middleweight 2002 1156.4 Sven Ottke
Super Middleweight 2002 730.3 Antwun Echols
Super Middleweight 2002 729.5 Eric Lucas
Super Middleweight 2002 649.4 Mads Larsen
Super Middleweight 2002 625.4 Brian Magee
Super Middleweight 2002 544.9 David Starie
Super Middleweight 2002 526.8 Robin Reid
Super Middleweight 2002 502.6 Anthony Mundine
Super Middleweight 2002 502.2 Syd Vanderpool
Super Middleweight 2002 494.8 Hector Javier Velazco
Super Middleweight 2002 467.5 Danilo Haussler
Super Middleweight 2002 466.2 Byron Mitchell
Super Middleweight 2002 462.8 Thomas Tate
Super Middleweight 2002 420.1 Markus Beyer

Super Middleweight 2003 1440.6 Joe Calzaghe
Super Middleweight 2003 1128.4 Sven Ottke
Super Middleweight 2003 897.0 Mads Larsen
Super Middleweight 2003 790.6 Brian Magee
Super Middleweight 2003 707.8 Anthony Mundine
Super Middleweight 2003 622.9 Danny Green
Super Middleweight 2003 614.3 Markus Beyer
Super Middleweight 2003 614.1 Antwun Echols
Super Middleweight 2003 519.0 Jeff Lacy
Super Middleweight 2003 490.8 Byron Mitchell
Super Middleweight 2003 488.3 Robin Reid
Super Middleweight 2003 409.1 Mikkel Kessler
Super Middleweight 2003 387.9 Kabary Salem
Super Middleweight 2003 363.5 David Starie
Super Middleweight 2003 332.5 Andre Thysse

Super Middleweight 2004 1492.6 Joe Calzaghe
Super Middleweight 2004 1131.5 Sven Ottke
Super Middleweight 2004 816.1 Jeff Lacy
Super Middleweight 2004 781.0 Sam Soliman
Super Middleweight 2004 717.7 Markus Beyer
Super Middleweight 2004 700.7 Mikkel Kessler
Super Middleweight 2004 650.2 Robin Reid
Super Middleweight 2004 610.5 Mario Veit
Super Middleweight 2004 600.3 Felix Sturm
Super Middleweight 2004 452.3 Kingsley Ikeke
Super Middleweight 2004 438.4 David Alfonso Lopez
Super Middleweight 2004 434.2 Scott Pemberton
Super Middleweight 2004 422.7 Syd Vanderpool
Super Middleweight 2004 408.8 Rudy Markussen
Super Middleweight 2004 405.1 Troy Rowland

Super Middleweight 2005 1831.1 Joe Calzaghe
Super Middleweight 2005 1223.0 Jeff Lacy
Super Middleweight 2005 1007.8 Mikkel Kessler
Super Middleweight 2005 843.0 Markus Beyer
Super Middleweight 2005 619.9 Carl Froch
Super Middleweight 2005 584.7 Rudy Markussen
Super Middleweight 2005 537.0 Robin Reid
Super Middleweight 2005 531.5 William Joppy
Super Middleweight 2005 513.8 Yusaf Mack
Super Middleweight 2005 494.7 Sergio Mora
Super Middleweight 2005 489.9 Lucian Bute
Super Middleweight 2005 466.7 Chad Dawson
Super Middleweight 2005 447.8 Allan Green
Super Middleweight 2005 440.8 Mario Veit
Super Middleweight 2005 427.6 Jackson Chanet

nickcat0 · Post by **nickcat0** » 13 Oct 2006, 04:11

For what it's worth , I don't hate Calzaghe , in fact he's one of my favourite British boxers .

I don't believe he's ducked anyone , and you can only beat the fighter standing in front of you .

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 13 Oct 2006, 04:26

Ron Borges came across as an arrogant wanker.

Dropping names like "Glen Jahnson", "Antonio Tarver", as if they're part of some pantheon of greats, "there's got to be a reason he didn't fight names like that". Er, Johnson just got beaten and Tarver just got exposed, refusing a fight with JC.

What the fvck was this guy saying of Lacy before march 2006? I wonder if it was glowing praise.

What have ppl been saying of Tarver? Paul Briggs, "He has the heart of a peach pit". LOL

Borges is so ugly he almost put me off having sex with my girlfriend.

That said, Clzaghe will have no one to blame but himself if he doesn't get the fvck on with it. Kessler, Beyer, Green, Tiozzo, Briggs, Adamek, Woods. Get up off your arse and beat 'em. How can a fighter who looked so exceptional vs Lacy ALLOW himself to fight at a lower level of opposition?

Wouldn't a handfull of those names look nice on a scalp list that includes Eubank, Reid, Woodhall, Brewer, Mitchell, Lacy & Sheika?

I want to see him go up to light heavy. That way everything changes. he's the challenger & he has it all to prove. He's in more 50-50 situations and this would actually bring the best out of him more consistently.

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 13 Oct 2006, 04:55

E wrote:
Graham Brett wrote:
Raff The Frenchman wrote:Joe stepped up by facing Lacy, why is he stepping down?...Bika aint no real deal let's face it...
Who did Benn fight after McLennan?

Calzaghe is better than Been Eubank and Collins

Right - BEnn was a warrior and one of our best but who did he really beat apart from the amazing fight against Mclellan?

Barkley - had lost his last 2
Mauro Galvano - good to win in Italy, but opponet a low grade G Rosi
De Witt - tough but only just top 10. Was KOd by non puncher Kalambay 3 fights before

And got beat by decent but not great fighters.

Actually think (apart from mclellan maybe and Joe would've handled him ) Jo's victories are much better - Woodhall, Reid, Eubank, Mitchell, LAcy, Sheika, Brewer and even Veit is OK.

Oh yeah and Pat Lawlor who beat legends Benitez and Duran..er OK maybe not.......

If Toney can get credit for beating Barkley then so should Benn as he did it faster and before Toney did.

punchers chance · Post by **punchers chance** » 13 Oct 2006, 05:58

But why cant allegedly allegedly ever great Chris Eubank's name right? Its Chris Eubank isnt it? Yet he always says "Eubanks"!

Lenny is right. His name is Eubanks.

He dropped the ‘s’ on the end, but his brothers were always called Eubanks. I think some people called him ‘Eubanks’ just to annoy him and they’ve just carried on with it.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 13 Oct 2006, 06:07

Max Molyneux wrote:
E wrote:
Graham Brett wrote: Who did Benn fight after McLennan?

Calzaghe is better than Been Eubank and Collins

Right - BEnn was a warrior and one of our best but who did he really beat apart from the amazing fight against Mclellan?

Barkley - had lost his last 2
Mauro Galvano - good to win in Italy, but opponet a low grade G Rosi
De Witt - tough but only just top 10. Was KOd by non puncher Kalambay 3 fights before

And got beat by decent but not great fighters.

Actually think (apart from mclellan maybe and Joe would've handled him ) Jo's victories are much better - Woodhall, Reid, Eubank, Mitchell, LAcy, Sheika, Brewer and even Veit is OK.

Oh yeah and Pat Lawlor who beat legends Benitez and Duran..er OK maybe not.......
If Toney can get credit for beating Barkley then so should Benn as he did it faster and before Toney did.

Fact is Nige absolutely annihilated Barkley, which really is something, because Barkley was one tough ass mofo.

punchers chance · Post by **punchers chance** » 13 Oct 2006, 06:20

He won that fight on the 3 knockdown rule rather than a total annihilation.
The last KD coming just as the bell went, but Barkley could have easily carried on.
I never liked that rule.

This is why people hate Joe Calzaghe

This is why people hate Joe Calzaghe

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Re: This is why people hate Joe Calzaghe