The Megeafight that never happened

thismodernlove · Post by **thismodernlove** » 11 Oct 2006, 14:44

Dariusz Michalczweski vs Roy Jones Jr.

who wouldve won ? (i know eveyrones going to say RJJ, but before you do i reccommend watching Tarver's right hand KO RJJ in the 2nd round... watch that about 10 times before you reply), also remember that Michalczweski was no joke... this guy could fight.

how would things have been different if Jones won, and if Michalczweski won?

personally i think Michalczweski wouldve stopped RJJ.

mattyp151 · Post by **mattyp151** » 11 Oct 2006, 14:49

If we're talking Prime vs Prime, RJ no doubt. RJ that got hit by Tarver was old and weight drained, and was a shadow of the guy that was unbelievably skilled before he stepped up to fight Ruiz. He was looking old the first time he fought Tarver, which was seriously the firs time in his career he looke human, and the guy that lost to Antonio and Glenncoffe wasn't the same guy that embarassed Toney and made the alltime highlight real vs Glen Kelly even in old age. The guy that showed up the night to fight Clinton Woods would've still beaten DM.

If you're gonna put up a question like this, do not put a comment in that you want to sway votes with (such as the Tarver comment).

vman · Post by **vman** » 11 Oct 2006, 14:51

im sorry, but imo jones lost alot of himself when he dropped back down from HW to LHW. that being said, i dont think that bhop would have won a rematch at THAT time, i dont think that DM would have won at that time, and i 100% feel that before HW, tarver whould have been outboxed 120-108 easily.
i seriously dont think anyone could have beaten jones at that time, he made a career mistake going to HW and coming back down. since the weight drop, he have not seen the RJJr we all knew... ive been watching his DVDs lately, (counterpunches, knockouts, powershots) and to watch him move, the speed in his punches as much as his upperbody is unbelieveable.
yes, im a jones fan, so u could expect an answer like mine. but i also try and be 100% down the middle as some know...

Parm · Post by **Parm** » 11 Oct 2006, 15:06

I cringe every time this guy starts a thread and says something stupid. RJJ losing to Dariusz....yeah....okay

JDGAFFLIN · Post by **JDGAFFLIN** » 11 Oct 2006, 15:12

Im an all time member of the Roycott Fanclub, and I still think that Roy would have Beat DM 100 fightsn out of 100 fights. No question.

DM was a fraud.

mattyp151 · Post by **mattyp151** » 11 Oct 2006, 15:23

Red Medicine wrote:In his prime, I think Roy would have beaten any light heavyweight in the history of the sport.

Bob Foster and Archie Moore may have had something to say about it.

JDGAFFLIN · Post by **JDGAFFLIN** » 11 Oct 2006, 15:55

Mattyp151 wrote:
Red Medicine wrote:In his prime, I think Roy would have beaten any light heavyweight in the history of the sport.
Bob Foster and Archie Moore may have had something to say about it.

As well as a Prime Quwai, Mustufa Mohhomed, Moorer, and a few others.

JC · Post by JC » 11 Oct 2006, 16:46

JDGAFFLIN wrote:
Mattyp151 wrote:
Red Medicine wrote:In his prime, I think Roy would have beaten any light heavyweight in the history of the sport.
Bob Foster and Archie Moore may have had something to say about it.
As well as a Prime Quwai, Mustufa Mohhomed, Moorer, and a few others.

Add Ezzard Charles to that list.

barry · Post by **barry** » 11 Oct 2006, 16:55

As someone else stated...someone who admits to being a person that does not like Jones...in 100 bouts between Jones and DM...Jones wins every time out! DM simply did not have the talent, ability, or quality punching power to score a lucky punch knock out against Jones!

TerribleTim2 · Post by **TerribleTim2** » 11 Oct 2006, 18:47

It seems RJJ lacked the confidence to get in the ring with DM. I've heard that RJJ would even tell interviewers not to bring up DM's name. RJJ recieved media recognition as the best light heavy weight and apparently he was satisfied with that.

Of course it also appears as if DM was not eager to make this fight either but I put a little more of the blame on RJJ. Jones was in a better postion to get this fight made.

mattyp151 · Post by **mattyp151** » 11 Oct 2006, 19:55

TerribleTim2 wrote:It seems RJJ lacked the confidence to get in the ring with DM. I've heard that RJJ would even tell interviewers not to bring up DM's name. RJJ recieved media recognition as the best light heavy weight and apparently he was satisfied with that.

Of course it also appears as if DM was not eager to make this fight either but I put a little more of the blame on RJJ. Jones was in a better postion to get this fight made.

roy didn't want to leave the US. After the Olympics, can't blame him.

BrocktonBlockbuster49 · Post by **BrocktonBlockbuster49** » 12 Oct 2006, 18:28

a peak roy jones would have beat DM in a one sided fight

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 12 Oct 2006, 18:29

BrocktonBlockbuster49 wrote:a peak roy jones would have beat DM in a one sided fight

119:109, 118:110, 116:111.

HomicideHenry · Post by **HomicideHenry** » 12 Oct 2006, 21:22

I think a prime Roy Jones could have beaten a majority of the past LHW champions, but he would have had trouble with guys like Billy Conn, Bob Foster, Ezzard Charles, Archie Moore and Micheal Spinks, if not lose to those men.

As far as who would win between RJ and DM...prime vs prime it would be Jones, but had Jones fought DM before facing off with Ruiz, in his lone HW experiment, and after the fact, I don't think Jones could have beaten him.

In my opinion Jones is 0-3 to Antonio Tarver, despite what the record books said. Jones did a 'Ray Leonard' on Tarver, like Leonard did to Hagler, throwing flurries in the last 10 to 30 seconds of the rounds to give the appearance he was winning.

Before the Ruiz fight and after, Jones was never the same. He may still be able to beat all the Prince Badi's in the world, but he cant beat Tarver, Johnson and if he ever did face off with DM before and after the fact, I don't think Jones would have won.

But that's just me.

TerribleTim2 · Post by **TerribleTim2** » 17 Oct 2006, 04:03

Jeez! Talk about getting carried away with the RJJ worship. Some of you guys really bought into the hype. A peak Roy could walk on water, raise the dead, cast out demons and blah blah blah. RJJ was a heavy mix of talent and hype.

barry · Post by **barry** » 17 Oct 2006, 04:29

>>>Jeez! Talk about getting carried away with the RJJ worship. Some of you guys really bought into the hype. A peak Roy could walk on water, raise the dead, cast out demons and blah blah blah. RJJ was a heavy mix of talent and hype<<<

No, but the reality of it is this...Jones could beat the shit out of anyone, as he so easily demonstarted, within 25 pounds of his weight range...period! That's not hype...that's reality!!!!

barry · Post by **barry** » 17 Oct 2006, 04:31

>>>A claim at the Lineal title he did have, but a true champion, he was not.<<<

Actually Dec...he did not even have that! He held two belts and as soon as he learned that he would have to defend those belts against fighters who probably could beat him, he ditched those belts and went on defending the bogus WBO title against that quality, third and fourth rate opposition that he fought throughout his career!

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 17 Oct 2006, 10:18

barry wrote:>>>A claim at the Lineal title he did have, but a true champion, he was not.<<<

Actually Dec...he did not even have that! He held two belts and as soon as he learned that he would have to defend those belts against fighters who probably could beat him, he ditched those belts and went on defending the bogus WBO title against that quality, third and fourth rate opposition that he fought throughout his career!

Sorry, barry, but it was the other way round. DM held three belts but each federation wanted him to fight a different opponent, the WBA within 6 (!) weeks. DM (and therefore a RJJ-DM matchup) fell victim to boxing politics, the IBF and (especially) WBA thought DM as title holder wouldn't sell.

Or do you seriously believe someone who just beat the shit out of future HOFer Virgil Hill would have been scared of Lou del Valle or William Guthrie?

barry · Post by **barry** » 17 Oct 2006, 10:42

>>>Sorry, barry, but it was the other way round. DM held three belts but each federation wanted him to fight a different opponent, the WBA within 6 (!) weeks. DM (and therefore a RJJ-DM matchup) fell victim to boxing politics, the IBF and (especially) WBA thought DM as title holder wouldn't sell.<<<

The WBO has only came to be considered along-side the WBA, WBC and IBF during the past few years...When DM fought Hill the WBO was considered like the WBU is considered today. And the orgs did not want him to fight within six weeks, they just wanted him to make the matches within six weeks...he could have fought a half a year later...all they wanted was for DM to make the fights, which he decided not to and dumped the two "respectable" belts for the lowly WBO. The WBC was still out there, it was ignored, but there was still a champion who had just as much right to be called champ as Hill, or DM did. The fact that the WBC was ignored throws a wrench in any lineal claim. It's like Calzaghe and Kessler today...neither man is the actual lineal champion and neither man will be unless they fight. Same goes back when DM and Hill fought. DM had a little better claim than the WBC champion, but to fairly be the true lineal champ DM would have had to beat the WBC champion, who at the time was I believe Tiozzo, which he didn't beat the WBC champ...in fact Tiozzo stopped DM later on in they're careers!

>>>Or do you seriously believe someone who just beat the shit out of future HOFer Virgil Hill would have been scared of Lou del Valle or William Guthrie?<<<

Well considering that before fighting Hill, Dm had faced mostly third rate opposition, then he fought Hill, who was a legitimate threat, but then DM came out after the Hill fight and instead of fighting a Guthrie, Del Valle, or any other light heavyweight who was considered a true top ten ranking light heavyweught at the time he instead chose to go back to the second and third-rate opposition that he had become accustomed to before the hill fight...he fought Nicky Piper right after Hill...he followed that with a fight against one Darren Zenner...and then he went against the ever "dangerous" Andrea Magi...and then it was Mark Prince and then Drake Thadzi and then Muslim Biarslonov...

Now I may be losing it, but although Guthrie and Del Valle were not the best of all-time they both were in fact light years ahead of the opponents that DM chose to fight. I don't think DM was scared of anyone, but I do think that he, or maybe it was his management, but one of them had no interest in fighting anyone who had an honest chance of beating DM.

The Great John L · Post by **The Great John L** » 17 Oct 2006, 10:57

barry wrote:…DM came out after the Hill fight and instead of fighting a Guthrie, Del Valle, or any other light heavyweight who was considered a true top ten ranking light heavyweught at the time he instead chose to go back to the second and third-rate opposition that he had become accustomed to before the hill fight...he fought Nicky Piper right after Hill...he followed that with a fight against one Darren Zenner...and then he went against the ever "dangerous" Andrea Magi...and then it was Mark Prince and then Drake Thadzi and then Muslim Biarslonov...

That is about as bad a stretch of opponents for any “title claimant” that I can recall. As you noted, MUCH less deserving than Guthrie and Del Valle…

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 17 Oct 2006, 12:06

barry wrote:>>>Sorry, barry, but it was the other way round. DM held three belts but each federation wanted him to fight a different opponent, the WBA within 6 (!) weeks. DM (and therefore a RJJ-DM matchup) fell victim to boxing politics, the IBF and (especially) WBA thought DM as title holder wouldn't sell.<<<

The WBO has only came to be considered along-side the WBA, WBC and IBF during the past few years...When DM fought Hill the WBO was considered like the WBU is considered today. And the orgs did not want him to fight within six weeks, they just wanted him to make the matches within six weeks...he could have fought a half a year later...all they wanted was for DM to make the fights, which he decided not to and dumped the two "respectable" belts for the lowly WBO. The WBC was still out there, it was ignored, but there was still a champion who had just as much right to be called champ as Hill, or DM did. The fact that the WBC was ignored throws a wrench in any lineal claim. It's like Calzaghe and Kessler today...neither man is the actual lineal champion and neither man will be unless they fight. Same goes back when DM and Hill fought. DM had a little better claim than the WBC champion, but to fairly be the true lineal champ DM would have had to beat the WBC champion, who at the time was I believe Tiozzo, which he didn't beat the WBC champ...in fact Tiozzo stopped DM later on in they're careers!

>>>Or do you seriously believe someone who just beat the shit out of future HOFer Virgil Hill would have been scared of Lou del Valle or William Guthrie?<<<

Well considering that before fighting Hill, Dm had faced mostly third rate opposition, then he fought Hill, who was a legitimate threat, but then DM came out after the Hill fight and instead of fighting a Guthrie, Del Valle, or any other light heavyweight who was considered a true top ten ranking light heavyweught at the time he instead chose to go back to the second and third-rate opposition that he had become accustomed to before the hill fight...he fought Nicky Piper right after Hill...he followed that with a fight against one Darren Zenner...and then he went against the ever "dangerous" Andrea Magi...and then it was Mark Prince and then Drake Thadzi and then Muslim Biarslonov...

Now I may be losing it, but although Guthrie and Del Valle were not the best of all-time they both were in fact light years ahead of the opponents that DM chose to fight. I don't think DM was scared of anyone, but I do think that he, or maybe it was his management, but one of them had no interest in fighting anyone who had an honest chance of beating DM.

You seem to agree with me though that DM was given no chance whatsoever to remain unified champ -- don't you. Roy Jones or Bernard Hopkins received different reatment from the major deferations.

As for lineal titles, the line was interrupted with Michael Spinks' move to heavyweight; but DM had certainly the best claim to it. But then, the lineal business doesn't count for much anyway in my book. Shannon Briggs was lineal HW champ; but he wouldn'tr have gotten a shot if the title would have meant anything. DM was for a short while the world's best l-h, then it was RJJ and DM was #2, and it's a shame that the two never fought.

Ezzard · Post by **Ezzard** » 17 Oct 2006, 12:23

Whilst I believe that Jones was the better fighter and that DM did not take on top quality opponents, I do agree that he wasn't given the same treatement as Jones or Hopkins and that it was almost impossible for him to remain as unified champion. I think this is due to the fact that he was not a big money maker.

Ambling Alp · Post by **Ambling Alp** » 17 Oct 2006, 13:52

A agree that Jones was the better fighter and probably would have won a had they fought. however, tot hink that Jones would have won 100 times out 100 is just silly. At the very least DM would have had a punchers chance.
Jones should have been screaming for a fight wioth DM; it was the only challenge for him in the lightheavyweight division. The divison was very weak outside of Jones and DM. Instead we were treated to mismatch after mismatch against one incompetent opponent after another. There are many lightheavyweights throughout history who would have easily beaten the lightheavyweight opponents that Jones did.

It's true that DM didn't seem eager to fight Jones either. Still some of the blame has to go to Jones. If he really wanted this fight to happen it would have. If he was that much better than DM, he should have been willing to fight in Germany. An fight with DM would have given us a better idea of just how good Jones really was.

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 17 Oct 2006, 14:48

Ambling Alp wrote:A agree that Jones was the better fighter and probably would have won a had they fought. however, tot hink that Jones would have won 100 times out 100 is just silly. At the very least DM would have had a punchers chance.
Jones should have been screaming for a fight wioth DM; it was the only challenge for him in the lightheavyweight division. The divison was very weak outside of Jones and DM. Instead we were treated to mismatch after mismatch against one incompetent opponent after another. There are many lightheavyweights throughout history who would have easily beaten the lightheavyweight opponents that Jones did.

It's true that DM didn't seem eager to fight Jones either. Still some of the blame has to go to Jones. If he really wanted this fight to happen it would have. If he was that much better than DM, he should have been willing to fight in Germany. An fight with DM would have given us a better idea of just how good Jones really was.

I don't know. Eric Harding, Montell Griffin, Reggie Johnson, Mike McCallum, Virgil Hill, Lou del Valle, Clinton Woods, Julio Gonzales -- these names would look good on anyone's resumee. People are a bit harsh with RJJ here. Isn't the truth rather that prime RJJ was so good that almost any opponent would look incompetent against him? I reckon prime RJJ would have boxed off DM's ears too, even though DM was the clear #2.

TerribleTim2 · Post by **TerribleTim2** » 17 Oct 2006, 18:52

barry wrote:>>>Jeez! Talk about getting carried away with the RJJ worship. Some of you guys really bought into the hype. A peak Roy could walk on water, raise the dead, cast out demons and blah blah blah. RJJ was a heavy mix of talent and hype<<<

No, but the reality of it is this...Jones could beat the shit out of anyone, as he so easily demonstarted, within 25 pounds of his weight range...period! That's not hype...that's reality!!!!

No, the reality is that RJJ and DM never fought. All we have is speculation.

The Megeafight that never happened

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