Hopkins looks to carry on for a long time.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 26 Nov 2006, 12:33

In his latest interview on fightnews, Hopkins states he is going to fight on for another 3-4 years.

I know he's a very spry fighter for his age, and I know we've seen the likes of Archie Moore fighting on until almost 50, but It would be a shame if Hopkins got hurt fighting on past the aged he promised his mother he would retire.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 26 Nov 2006, 13:21

Great shame really, he'll never have a better time to bow out than the Tarver fight, which I think had as much to do with Tarver being so bad as it had with Hopkins being so good.... if he carries on Hopkins will end up being beaten again and probably pretty soon... when will these guys learn?...

JC · Post by JC » 26 Nov 2006, 13:28

While Hopkins seems in many ways to be an old head on a far younger man's body I think age is catching up with him to a certain extent.

His biggest problem is his dropping workrate, imo that's what lost him the Taylor fights he was getting outworked in some rounds, and when you consider that Taylor is no buzzsaw himself you have to wonder how Hopkins would cope with a top level fighter with a good punch out-put.

When you look back on Hopkin's peak performances against say Glen Johnson, he would still sit back and counter but was also willing to go on the offensive when required. I haven't seen him do that for a while. As impressive as his win over Tarver was, the guy had a hugely inflated rep with very little susbstance, but it was fun watching Hopkins expose this.

Alough I guess if he's coming back to challenge at HW as has been suggested workrate may not be an issue.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 26 Nov 2006, 13:37

Really I think Tarver is shot... he looked awful in his last fights with Jones and Johnson and he seemed in awe of Hopkins as well... I think Hopkins could well be overpowered by some of the younger and stonger 175 fighters out there.... maybe he's hoping for another match with Taylor who could move up... but I doubt that he would win that... then there is a chance of a rematch with Jones which would make sense for Hopkins and would be a 'safe' fight for him... there is also the prospect of JC moving up perhaps to fight Hopkins... though I very much doubt it will happen unless Bernard agrees to come in at 168 and fight in Joes back garden with his kid as ref..... :x :x :x

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 26 Nov 2006, 13:47

If he challenges at HW then it will end in tears, he hasnt got the ammunition to succeed at heavyweight and is too old to be able to out speed the big men either... the likes of Klitchenko would just go right through him... its madness him even considering going up to heavyweight...

JC · Post by JC » 26 Nov 2006, 14:02

Yes I'm sure Kiltschko would go right through him but there talking about James Toney which is a different proposition.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 26 Nov 2006, 14:45

Toney would be too strong for Hopkins as well unless Bernard gets himself roided up like Toney too....

states · Post by **states** » 26 Nov 2006, 15:15

Hopkins is demonstrating, once again, just how hard it is for boxers to let go.

Bernard had the perfect opportunity to bow out at the right time: His losses against Taylor (I felt he lost both matches) were redeemed by beating a very, very overrated Tarver. If he wants to carry on it's his choice. But will he really get another chance, a la the Tarver fight, to bow out on top? I'm not sure. I bet Calzaghe is licking his lips at this announcement.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 26 Nov 2006, 15:22

Toney is the one guy I'd like to see him fight. Toney isn't a massive puncher at the weight, and I could see this being a very competitive fight, a lot would depend on how strong Hopkins was. I think Hopkins would be best served if he is to compete at heavyweight, coming in around 190-200 tops.

JC · Post by JC » 26 Nov 2006, 15:40

silkov wrote:Toney would be too strong for Hopkins as well unless Bernard gets himself roided up like Toney too....

I'm not so sure that he would if Bernard could come in between 190-200. I know Toney is weighing in at 230 but how much of that is actual useful weight and how much is fat.

Obviously whether Toney has been playing with his chemistry set lately is an unknown factor.

Bt anyway I still think he should stay retired.

glittermonkey · Post by **glittermonkey** » 26 Nov 2006, 16:53

Madness. I thought that Hopkins would be smarter than this, and buck the trend in much the same way as Lewis did.

While discussing Tarver on the current scene I said that I couldn't see any big fights for him below heavy. The same could be said for Hopkins. Taylor or Wright will outwork him at middle (again in Taylors case), as will Calzaghe at super middle. He's beaten 'the man' (I hate that phrase) at light heavy, there's no fight for decent money at cruiser, and he's just not big enough to be thinking about heavyweight.

I can't see why he'd return at all. Well and truly baffled.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 26 Nov 2006, 17:08

J-C wrote:
silkov wrote:Toney would be too strong for Hopkins as well unless Bernard gets himself roided up like Toney too....
I'm not so sure that he would if Bernard could come in between 190-200. I know Toney is weighing in at 230 but how much of that is actual useful weight and how much is fat.

Obviously whether Toney has been playing with his chemistry set lately is an unknown factor.

Bt anyway I still think he should stay retired.

Well Toney has been done for having roids in his blood, though he claimed it was due to stuff he'd taken to get over an injury....

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 26 Nov 2006, 17:12

glittermonkey wrote:Madness. I thought that Hopkins would be smarter than this, and buck the trend in much the same way as Lewis did.

While discussing Tarver on the current scene I said that I couldn't see any big fights for him below heavy. The same could be said for Hopkins. Taylor or Wright will outwork him at middle (again in Taylors case), as will Calzaghe at super middle. He's beaten 'the man' (I hate that phrase) at light heavy, there's no fight for decent money at cruiser, and he's just not big enough to be thinking about heavyweight.

I can't see why he'd return at all. Well and truly baffled.

Its another case of ego ruling the brain... imagine if Holifield had quit after beating Tyson, ...its a shame as I thought he was brighter than that, I doubt that his mother is very impressed... maybe she should lay the law down to him like Lewis' mother did to him... he was all set to comeback a while ago but his mum put her foot down and stopped it...

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 26 Nov 2006, 17:14

I thought his mother died?

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 26 Nov 2006, 17:17

jamesmcdonnell wrote:I thought his mother died?

whose Hopkins or Lewis'...

glittermonkey · Post by **glittermonkey** » 26 Nov 2006, 17:19

Hopkins'. Lewis' is alive and well as far as I know.

salaco · Post by **salaco** » 27 Nov 2006, 04:52

Cool, I had given up on the chance to see hopkins get KO'ed...the ideal xmas gift

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 27 Nov 2006, 06:34

silkov wrote:Great shame really, he'll never have a better time to bow out than the Tarver fight, which I think had as much to do with Tarver being so bad as it had with Hopkins being so good.... if he carries on Hopkins will end up being beaten again and probably pretty soon... when will these guys learn?...

If Tarver was so bad how did he beat Glen Johnson (most ppl have Tarver winning twice), Montel Griffin, Eric Harding, and Roy Jones (who looked good in that 2nd fight until the KO punch)?

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 27 Nov 2006, 07:23

Hopkins is far too cautious and calculating to ever get badly hurt I reckon - he should be fine if he wants to carry on.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 27 Nov 2006, 07:59

viciousmaussa wrote:
silkov wrote:Great shame really, he'll never have a better time to bow out than the Tarver fight, which I think had as much to do with Tarver being so bad as it had with Hopkins being so good.... if he carries on Hopkins will end up being beaten again and probably pretty soon... when will these guys learn?...
If Tarver was so bad how did he beat Glen Johnson (most ppl have Tarver winning twice), Montel Griffin, Eric Harding, and Roy Jones (who looked good in that 2nd fight until the KO punch)?

I didnt say Tarver was a 'bad' boxer, but he's been in a decline for his last three or four fights... watch his last bouts with Johnson and Jones and tell me he looked good in them?... the guys 37+ and he's shot... the Tarver of 3 years ago would have beaten Hopkins quite comfortably I think...

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 27 Nov 2006, 08:11

MightyWarrior wrote:Hopkins is far too cautious and calculating to ever get badly hurt I reckon - he should be fine if he wants to carry on.

No matter how cautious he is, if he winds up taking a big haymaker from Maskaev he could get hurt.

I'd actually really like to see him fight Toney. Great pre fight build up for that one, and two master craftsmen. I'd like to see toney lose some weight though, he's coming into the ring in pretty shocking condition these days.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 27 Nov 2006, 08:34

Ali was one of the cleverist boxers ever and look how his career ended, same with Robinson and even the ultra manipulative Leonard... if Hopkins goes up to heavyweight then he's plain foolish, you're taking about guys that hit far harder than anything he has experienced and Hopkins is hardly a nimble speedster at this point in his career. The wisest thing would be for him to stay at 175 and try and get some fights there, maybe Jones, Adamek or Calzaghe or Johnson... Toney would be just a freak fight at this stage... at least if he stays at 175 we may get to see some unification fights!...

MightyWarrior · Post by **MightyWarrior** » 27 Nov 2006, 09:00

jamesmcdonnell wrote: No matter how cautious he is, if he winds up taking a big haymaker from Maskaev he could get hurt.

I'd actually really like to see him fight Toney. Great pre fight build up for that one, and two master craftsmen. I'd like to see toney lose some weight though, he's coming into the ring in pretty shocking condition these days.

Well he shouldn't be messing with heavyweights that's true, but I'm not so sure how serious he is about that..real damage is usualy about accumulation rather than a single shot - and I doubt BH will allow himself to take too many - he's always been the ultimate pragmatist.

I'm more concerned with the absolutely fearless Toney: taking on the real hard hitting giants of the division - I doubt Hop would get in there with monsters like Peters & Wlad.
And Toney's iron chin and attitude means he'll be taking shots all night long - not good.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 27 Nov 2006, 09:04

silkov wrote:
viciousmaussa wrote:
silkov wrote:Great shame really, he'll never have a better time to bow out than the Tarver fight, which I think had as much to do with Tarver being so bad as it had with Hopkins being so good.... if he carries on Hopkins will end up being beaten again and probably pretty soon... when will these guys learn?...
If Tarver was so bad how did he beat Glen Johnson (most ppl have Tarver winning twice), Montel Griffin, Eric Harding, and Roy Jones (who looked good in that 2nd fight until the KO punch)?
I didnt say Tarver was a 'bad' boxer, but he's been in a decline for his last three or four fights... watch his last bouts with Johnson and Jones and tell me he looked good in them?... the guys 37+ and he's shot... the Tarver of 3 years ago would have beaten Hopkins quite comfortably I think...

he wasn't shot, he was still beating those guys though he's always had stamina problems.

I feel the distinction should be made. Good fighter, horrendous style, bad attitude = curtains vs the masterful, relatively reinvigorated Hopkins.

I think Hopkins slaughters him any year between 2000-2006

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 27 Nov 2006, 09:41

MightyWarrior wrote:
jamesmcdonnell wrote: No matter how cautious he is, if he winds up taking a big haymaker from Maskaev he could get hurt.

I'd actually really like to see him fight Toney. Great pre fight build up for that one, and two master craftsmen. I'd like to see toney lose some weight though, he's coming into the ring in pretty shocking condition these days.
Well he shouldn't be messing with heavyweights that's true, but I'm not so sure how serious he is about that..real damage is usualy about accumulation rather than a single shot - and I doubt BH will allow himself to take too many - he's always been the ultimate pragmatist.

I'm more concerned with the absolutely fearless Toney: taking on the real hard hitting giants of the division - I doubt Hop would get in there with monsters like Peters & Wlad.
And Toney's iron chin and attitude means he'll be taking shots all night long - not good.

Yes, Toney is a worry. His speech pattern sounds disturbingly like a man with serious damage in the pipeline, his voice is all gurgly and slurred.

Toney got tagged an awful lot against Peter last time out, a lot more than expected, and that's not good at his advanced age, with a very long career, and more importantly, thousands and thousands of rounds of sparring. Toney hasn't really been hit that much in his career, but it's well known now that sparring contributes just as much if not more to the cumulative effects on the brain induced by boxing. Toney's been having wars in the gym for nearly 20 years, and these days, as he does very little fitness training, he gets most of his training in the sparring sessions.

I've a nasty feeling we're going to see James get splattered by Peter this time around. If not Peter, then someone at heavyweight is going to give him a real kicking soon. Toney doesn't have the power at heavyweight to keep these guys off him for the whole fight, and someone like Peter will just keep on coming for the full 12 rounds trying to take your head off.