What do we expect of Taylor next year?

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 17 Dec 2006, 15:40

I like his talent & willingness to take tough fights. He is developping a great selection of shots, if only he'll use them more. However his showings have been far from conclusive and I didn't like seeing him clinch against Ouma. This year, he's proven to be a very promising work in progress. He belongs at the top level, but we need to see him excel at this level.

This is what i want to see:

1) a fight with a big, promising middle - Kelly Pavlik is even bigger than Taylor for his weight, hits hard and is unbeaten.
2) a fight with a genuine middleweight puncher - Miranda will do.
3) either a) a convincing win over Winky, or b) a fight with one of the paper champs/ ex paper champs (Carrera, Sturm, Abraham, Castillejo)

What does everyone else want to see from him in '07?

dr_devious · Post by **dr_devious** » 17 Dec 2006, 15:54

I'd like to see him fight Calzaghe or Wright. He should beat everyone in the MW division, but hes a boring fighter

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 17 Dec 2006, 15:58

Move up in weight as soon as possible, his stamina is terrible at 160, and I suspect that's making weight.

A fight with Calzaghe at 168

glittermonkey · Post by **glittermonkey** » 17 Dec 2006, 16:03

Agree. A fight will Calzaghe will show us exactly how good Taylor is. He'll actually be made to work, because if he doesn't (or can't) then Calzaghe will be all over him.

Plus there will be no legit excuses should he sit back and let the initiative be taken away from him like he has done in recent fights. At the higher weight he won't be able to claim that it's a struggle for him.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 17 Dec 2006, 16:04

That's the last thing I want to see next year, super middle. One pole to the next (fight someone like a Contender bloke or another jr middle, then an elite 168er). To me, that is part of Taylor unevenness. He should've been developed to deal with a busy fighter more commandingly, for instance.

Too much unfinished business at middle. Too many great fights that are possible. Taylor even said that he's at 160 to stay for a while - after the Ouma fight.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 17 Dec 2006, 16:06

On another note, it's not out of the question that Taylor can KO Calzaghe. Sure, Calzaghe would probably swarm all over him. Would probably keep taylor ineffective on the back foot.

But also, Joe has NO DEFENCE for a right hand. And Taylor happens to hit like a mule with the right hand.

Axe · Post by **Axe** » 17 Dec 2006, 16:08

All those fights would be great choices vicious. Im afraid, however, that we'll be seeing Taylor v Mora next year.

As long as he fights Winky in 2k7 though, I won't be disappointed.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 17 Dec 2006, 16:17

Axe wrote:All those fights would be great choices vicious. Im afraid, however, that we'll be seeing Taylor v Mora next year.

As long as he fights Winky in 2k7 though, I won't be disappointed.

If Taylor had a few more rounds like rd 6 (I think it was), where he landed combinations to bvreak WW's guard, he would've won hands dpwn.

definitely, Taylor NEEDS Winky.

Oscar de la Hoya was allowed to get away with inconclusive fights. But Taylor doesn't seem to seduce non boxing fans, so he's got to get on with it.

glittermonkey · Post by **glittermonkey** » 17 Dec 2006, 16:24

viciousmaussa wrote:If Taylor had a few more rounds like rd 6 (I think it was), where he landed combinations to bvreak WW's guard, he would've won hands dpwn.

That's the problem with Taylor. Can he fight like that for more than a couple of rounds per fight? Whether it's his stamina, or more of a mental problem, I'm not sure. But you see rounds like that and wonder why he didn't beat Hopkins, Wright and Ouma easily.

states · Post by **states** » 17 Dec 2006, 16:29

viciousmaussa wrote:On another note, it's not out of the question that Taylor can KO Calzaghe. Sure, Calzaghe would probably swarm all over him. Would probably keep taylor ineffective on the back foot.

But also, Joe has NO DEFENCE for a right hand. And Taylor happens to hit like a mule with the right hand.

I have to disagree, and disagree in a big way. Does Taylor really hit like a mule with the right hand? I don't think so. And whilst Calzaghe has always been open, when has he ever been in real trouble? Sure, he's been down, but he comes firing back. I'm sorry, but I don't see Taylor beating Calzaghe. And given that Frank 'reluctant' Warren would make Calzaghe-Taylor in a heartbeat, I doubt I'm alone.

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 17 Dec 2006, 17:20

To get pimped by Calzaghe.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 17 Dec 2006, 17:24

states wrote:
viciousmaussa wrote:On another note, it's not out of the question that Taylor can KO Calzaghe. Sure, Calzaghe would probably swarm all over him. Would probably keep taylor ineffective on the back foot.

But also, Joe has NO DEFENCE for a right hand. And Taylor happens to hit like a mule with the right hand.
I have to disagree, and disagree in a big way. Does Taylor really hit like a mule with the right hand? I don't think so. And whilst Calzaghe has always been open, when has he ever been in real trouble? Sure, he's been down, but he comes firing back. I'm sorry, but I don't see Taylor beating Calzaghe. And given that Frank 'reluctant' Warren would make Calzaghe-Taylor in a heartbeat, I doubt I'm alone.

Exactly, Calzaghe walked right into a massive free swinging right hook from Salem, and got straight up and continued like nothing happened, even though he never saw it coming. He was whacked by Byron Mitchell, and got up and proceeded to kick his arse.

Taylor couldn't really put a dent in the much smaller Ouma, so whether his shots will tickle Calzaghe's chin is doubtful. However, there is also the chance that at 168 he will hit a lot harder as he will be entering the ring in better condition.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 17 Dec 2006, 19:32

I wouldn't mind seeing Taylor in with that forgotton Middleweight, Kinglsey Ikeke. What has happend to him.

Taki... · Post by **Taki...** » 17 Dec 2006, 19:39

A dream year would be Taylor fighting Sergio Mora (can you see where this is going?) then fighting Calzaghe in a 'we beat the contenders' superfight.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 17 Dec 2006, 21:01

stujones wrote:I wouldn't mind seeing Taylor in with that forgotton Middleweight, Kinglsey Ikeke. What has happend to him.

I always wanted to see him in with Ikeke. I believe Kingsley is moving up to light heavyweight, he was a frigging massive middleweight at 6' 4".

shoutout · Post by **shoutout** » 18 Dec 2006, 03:09

jamesmcdonnell wrote:Move up in weight as soon as possible, his stamina is terrible at 160, and I suspect that's making weight.

A fight with Calzaghe at 168

good theory!! the extra weight definitely helped hopkins!!

shoutout · Post by **shoutout** » 18 Dec 2006, 03:11

stujones wrote:I wouldn't mind seeing Taylor in with that forgotton Middleweight, Kinglsey Ikeke. What has happend to him.

he has faded into bolivian (as tyson would say) since getting blasted by abraham!! never a good way to qualify to face a longer-reigning, more proven champ!!

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 18 Dec 2006, 05:05

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
states wrote:
viciousmaussa wrote:On another note, it's not out of the question that Taylor can KO Calzaghe. Sure, Calzaghe would probably swarm all over him. Would probably keep taylor ineffective on the back foot.

But also, Joe has NO DEFENCE for a right hand. And Taylor happens to hit like a mule with the right hand.
I have to disagree, and disagree in a big way. Does Taylor really hit like a mule with the right hand? I don't think so. And whilst Calzaghe has always been open, when has he ever been in real trouble? Sure, he's been down, but he comes firing back. I'm sorry, but I don't see Taylor beating Calzaghe. And given that Frank 'reluctant' Warren would make Calzaghe-Taylor in a heartbeat, I doubt I'm alone.
Exactly, Calzaghe walked right into a massive free swinging right hook from Salem, and got straight up and continued like nothing happened, even though he never saw it coming. He was whacked by Byron Mitchell, and got up and proceeded to kick his arse.

Taylor couldn't really put a dent in the much smaller Ouma, so whether his shots will tickle Calzaghe's chin is doubtful. However, there is also the chance that at 168 he will hit a lot harder as he will be entering the ring in better condition.

But when Calzaghe flurries his chin is up in the air and he doesn't see the punch coming. Byron Mitchell had him in trouble, with his raw power. He walked onto Salem's right hook. Taylor has better leverage in his shots and there's always a chance he would tag him badly with a right. There is speed and accuracy in some of Taylor's punching.

That said, the most likely thing to happen is that Calzaghe outworks him while he's on the ropes with his guard down.

lvlarc · Post by **lvlarc** » 18 Dec 2006, 05:10

Taylor has already said he doesn't plan on sticking around, he's obviously struggling to make the 160limit but I'm not sure if he fancies a fight with Calzaghe at 168.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 18 Dec 2006, 05:35

lvlarc_uk wrote:Taylor has already said he doesn't plan on sticking around, he's obviously struggling to make the 160limit but I'm not sure if he fancies a fight with Calzaghe at 168.

he did say that. and that scenario seemed likely considerig that Taylor has had trouble making 160 for a couple of years.

But after the Ouma fight (I think it was the post fight presser), he said he wants to stay at 160.

I do feel that if he went up to super middle he could undergo a Cotto-like transformation. But I think he needs more experience first. I believe he hasn't fully developed his style yet, which could be just as much a problem as his weight making.

I'll be happy if Taylor has some faster paced fights where more heavy leather is coming at him, vs people of his own size.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 18 Dec 2006, 08:00

The funny thing is, if Taylor fought Calzaghe, I reckon he would possibly outweigh joe come fight night. He was 12 stone 13 I think it was, for his fight with Ouma on the night of the fight, that's 181 lbs.

lvlarc · Post by **lvlarc** » 18 Dec 2006, 08:35

Though not as huge as Taylor, Miranda is another big middleweight that boils down to make 160, he came in at 173 against Gibbs.

The reason I wasn't sure if Taylor fancied a fight with Calzaghe is because a few months back or even weeks, Jermain was saying he would love to fight Calzaghe, he's said numerous times that he struggles to make 160...

Yet after his fight with Ouma, Taylor said "I'm comfortable at 160. I can make 160 easy" ???

Totally different tune now however, I'm thinking perhaps after the Ouma fight, Taylor's camp have advised him to stick at 160 and continue fighting with that big weight/size advantage ?

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 18 Dec 2006, 09:31

definitely, I think the Ouma fight has given him some perspective

lvlarc · Post by **lvlarc** » 18 Dec 2006, 09:45

Don't get me wrong, I think Taylor will fight Calzaghe, hopefully in the summer, but since the Ouma fight Taylor's tone has changed.

BBC's article 5th Dec http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/boxing/6199560.stm

"It's all but impossible for me to make middleweight now, and I plan to retire in two years when I reach 30."

After Ouma : "I'm comfortable at 160, I make 160 easy"

Seems strange to me.

Anyway, Taylor seems like the most likely opponent after Manfredo, and it will probably be in America.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 18 Dec 2006, 10:18

The other possibility Terrence, is that the Ouma performance has dented his confidence in his punching. Tough as Ouma is, it's not like he's never been dropped before, Karmazin managed it. Taylor tried in the 1st and 2nd to hammer Ouma, but couldn't really put a dent in him with single shots.

I think he would do better against Calzaghe than Lacy did, as he is more mobile, but it's hard to see him either stopping Joe, or matching his workrate. He would undoubtedly have his moments though.