The Cobra v The Grim Reaper , who wins and how ?

THEBUTCH · Post by **THEBUTCH** » 31 Jan 2007, 11:44

Froch is reportedly waiting for Robin Reid to respond to an offer to box the British Super middleweight champion. Despite Reid coming up short against the best it would still be a good test for Froch.

Chesney_Chambers · Post by **Chesney_Chambers** » 31 Jan 2007, 11:48

Its a no contest IMO Carl wins comfortably late KO or wide UD.

I like Robin Reid and respect what he's achieved, but allegedly he hasn't been a regular in the gym for the past 2 years and his performances have reflected it.

THEBUTCH · Post by **THEBUTCH** » 31 Jan 2007, 11:50

Wouldn't Reid's strength and experience alone give Carl something to think about ? Froch can be tagged and Robin packs a wallop.

Lenny · Post by **Lenny** » 31 Jan 2007, 11:53

after watching these two fight each other it certainly won't be the viewers...

surely Froch can aim higher than trying to resurrect the reaper?

KOJOE90 · Post by **KOJOE90** » 31 Jan 2007, 11:56

I like Robin Reid but he is in the twighlight of his career. Froch is too fresh, too sharp and too hungry for the faided Reaper.

Froch on points or just maybe a late stoppage.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 31 Jan 2007, 12:01

Sadly, Robin's best days are behind him. He looked pretty good during the Ottke fight, but he's been far too inactive over the last few years, and his training obviously isn't the best either. Unless Reid could get incredibly motivated, I think he loses a snoozer. I doubt Froch would stop him, Lacy hit him with everything but the kitchen sink before stopping him, and Froch's output just isn't that high.

Chesney_Chambers · Post by **Chesney_Chambers** » 31 Jan 2007, 12:02

THEBUTCH wrote:Wouldn't Reid's strength and experience alone give Carl something to think about ? Froch can be tagged and Robin packs a wallop.

Carls chin looks solid enough though, I just don't see Robin having the speed or ambition to land regular enough to stop Carl.

Personally I don't like this fight, it smacks of a 'One last payday' fight for RR. RR is seriously on the wane and Froch is in his prime, the fight would have been very interesting if both were at the top of their game.

I'd much prefer to see Carl in with an established top-level European operator or a top 15 world ranked opponent

Lenny · Post by **Lenny** » 31 Jan 2007, 12:05

Carl won't take out Reid with single shots and we'll be lucky if Reid throws enough to win a round let alone hurt Froch.

Really boring fight, the only time Reid has entertained in years was to showcase Lacy's offence. The only positive I can think of would be to get a recognisable name on Froch's record.

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 31 Jan 2007, 12:07

This was being mooted a couple of fights ago but now given Reid's inactivity and vulnerable showings i think Froch would win comfortably. Always been a Reid fan to be honest, made the most of his ability and scored a great win away from home in Italy over Nardiello. Think he beat Calzaghe too but that's a different story.

m1kee50 · Post by **m1kee50** » 31 Jan 2007, 12:36

Froch Vs Sam Soliman is good for Froch IMO, he is looking for a profile raiser, Soliman is a bigger name than he is.....

caster · Post by **caster** » 31 Jan 2007, 14:27

Froch would win very comfortably IMHO.

boxerrob2005 · Post by **boxerrob2005** » 31 Jan 2007, 14:43

I think Froch wins on points, but i reckon the Robin Reid who peaked around the Nardiello/Wharton/ Calzaghe fights would beat froch, but sadly that fighter is long gone.

harrygreb · Post by **harrygreb** » 31 Jan 2007, 18:49

agreed, i hope it doesnt happen. i paid to see reid against some idiot 2 years ago and i'd still like my money back.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 31 Jan 2007, 19:10

I think Carl now could beat a prime Reid, never rated Robin.

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 31 Jan 2007, 19:47

stujones wrote:I think Carl now could beat a prime Reid, never rated Robin.

If Prime could trouble Calzaghe do you really think Froch could trouble a prime Reid?

Froch's poor mans Roy Jones Impressions and Low guard will cost him eventually, a punch won't always save you.

Froch now would win due to Reid being shot though, but Reid was world class, Froch has yet to prove that and hasn't even fought for the EBU yet.

I could Imagine Froch's mouth afterwards, he was robbed against Calzaghe and I beat him! Even worse If he sparks Reid.

glittermonkey · Post by **glittermonkey** » 31 Jan 2007, 19:55

stujones wrote:I think Carl now could beat a prime Reid, never rated Robin.

Pretty bold statement Stu, considering he's a an olympic medalist, he gave Calzaghe his hardest fight, provided a masterclass in how to win a title away from home, and was nothing short of excellent against the underrated Wharton. Froch has yet to prove himself European class, let alone prove himself capable of beating true world class operators, which is what Reid was in his day. Not a fighter to everyone's taste, but to say the current version of Froch would beat him is a touch premature.

As for the fight; I'm of the same opinion as Mr. Albert. There are better challenges for someone who rates his talent so highly. There is little to gain for Carl in fighting a man who is clearly past his prime, inactive, and undermotivated. Froch would win easily now.

THEBUTCH · Post by **THEBUTCH** » 01 Feb 2007, 11:14

I still think there is some mileage left in a Froch-Reid clash, as long as it's for the British title and not some spurious alphabet title. Froch is probably a step down from Lacy who was in great form that night, and Robin still gave that one a fair go. If he's not intent on using his spoilling tactics, Reid could still make a decent fight of this one IMO.

For me it's still a good British title fight, and I bet even some of the sceptics would have to watch it even for curiosity value.

Chesney_Chambers · Post by **Chesney_Chambers** » 01 Feb 2007, 11:36

THEBUTCH wrote:I still think there is some mileage left in a Froch-Reid clash, as long as it's for the British title and not some spurious alphabet title. Froch is probably a step down from Lacy who was in great form that night, and Robin still gave that one a fair go. If he's not intent on using his spoilling tactics, Reid could still make a decent fight of this one IMO.

For me it's still a good British title fight, and I bet even some of the sceptics would have to watch it even for curiosity value.

Oh I'd definately watch it, I just don't think RR has the willing/dedication anymore to stand a chance of beating Carl.

WildWaylon · Post by **WildWaylon** » 02 Feb 2007, 16:54

Yes I agree even though the fight looks onesided you have to watch it - You just never know Reid could pull a big punch from nowhere and skittle the over confident arrogant Froch - RR has the power and experiance but lacks stamina and will in the late part of his career, but you still cant write him off completely, upsets happen from time to time in boxing - Froch is going to cop a big one with his lack of defense off somebody soon and good chin or not with a few follow up punches Froch will be beaten - His style will be his letdown when he steps up another level to world class - I would like to see him to take on Lacy - Pretty certain Lacy would get the better of him - Froch hasnt got the workrate of Calzaghe which won the fight for Joe when he fought Lacy - Lacy certainly has the power to KO Froch and we know Froch has his own big bombs so that would be a far better matchup - So Froch v Reid would probably go the distance with Froch winning on points especially in the later rounds - Certainly not a contender for fight of the year.

caster · Post by **caster** » 02 Feb 2007, 17:25

Froch fairly easily!

Froch doesn't endear the fans, but I believe he's definetly a winner.

I think he'll suprise a few people.

Reid V Froch would have been a very good fight a few years ago, but not now.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 02 Feb 2007, 17:57

glittermonkey wrote:
stujones wrote:I think Carl now could beat a prime Reid, never rated Robin.
Pretty bold statement Stu, considering he's a an olympic medalist, he gave Calzaghe his hardest fight, provided a masterclass in how to win a title away from home, and was nothing short of excellent against the underrated Wharton. Froch has yet to prove himself European class, let alone prove himself capable of beating true world class operators, which is what Reid was in his day. Not a fighter to everyone's taste, but to say the current version of Froch would beat him is a touch premature.

As for the fight; I'm of the same opinion as Mr. Albert. There are better challenges for someone who rates his talent so highly. There is little to gain for Carl in fighting a man who is clearly past his prime, inactive, and undermotivated. Froch would win easily now.

He did well against Wharton no doubt, excellent fight and I enjoyed the performance - but lets not forget it was a majority decision. I thought Reid won by 4-5 rounds, but the way he boxed that night was excellent, no doubt.

However, Wharton underated? I'm not so sure about that.... A draw vs Lou Gent (powerful fighter Gent, but not European class), a struggle with Fidel Castro Smith (who was underated) - then when he stepped up to true world class he got outclassed, far more easily than Rob Reid did. Plus he was 31, had a long career and was struggling with the weight - not exactly Roy Jones was it. Wharton was European class no doubt, but not world class even in his prime (which he wasn't when he fought Reid).

As for Calzaghe, Joe was a bit green in those days - but still had no sparring and was poisioned in the run up to the fight. Hardly ideal preperation, didn't his hand go also in the fight. I scored the fight for Rob Reid - but it his testament to his ability that he didn't win out of sight the state Calzaghe was in. I have slated Joe as much as anyone, but I think he has now finally proven (it took the Brewer, Mitchell, Lacy fights) that Joe wasn't even 60% when he fought Robin Reid - and yet it was still close. Eubank, Collins, and I even think Woodhall would have beaten that Calzaghe comfortably enough.

Oh Vincenzo Nardeillo, yes great achievement on paper - going out there and making sure the fight doesn't go to the cards. However, it was only Vincenzo Nardeillo - one of the biggest loose cannons (in the ring) to hold a world belt. Wharton dealt with him, not the biggest punching Richie Woodhall handled him with ease, as did Benn and many others. Most of his fights end in KO defeats - yet at the time of the KO the fight was very very close on fair cards. That sort of indicates Reid's level. No way would Woodhall or even Froch been close on the cards with Nardiello. I would have no doubt that Froch, Woodhall, hell even David Starie would have beaten Nardiello in Italy or anywhere.

For me, Reid's best performance was his honourable loss to a faded Ottke. He did well there also.

The guy took a boxing lesson in his prime vs Silvio Branco and lost IMO to Hasine Cherifi. Quality opperators but not of Calzaghe's level, which is really why I think the Calzaghe performance flattered him an awful lot. I haven't even mentioned the Malinga fight!

The only world class fighter Reid beat was Nardiello, and that was the equivalent of Hatton vs Calos Maussa (albeit away from home). Nardiello was not really world class, but got a lucky decision vs a cagey veteran who must hate British judges. Wharton wasn't world class (European level), and he didn't beat Charifi in many peoples eyes.

I still wouldn't mind seeing it, cause I don't see Reid as being as shot as other people do - just was overated in his apparent pomp.

harrygreb · Post by **harrygreb** » 02 Feb 2007, 18:11

this is an excellent post, stu. good well considered crit. still think reid is shot, though. perhaps not shot, just not got his heart in it anymore.

SticknMove · Post by **SticknMove** » 02 Feb 2007, 18:19

I think that Reid was never committed enough to the sport to reap (no pun intended) the rewards that his talent suggested. It is testament to his talent that he could go missing and come back and be competitive in fights over a period of time.

Obviously other avenues in his life have been available to him that he couldn't turn down, for good or bad. Froch will win this one, I am sure, but Reid will give him something to think about depending on how ambitious he is at this very late stage in his moth bitten career.

pundit · Post by **pundit** » 02 Feb 2007, 19:14

Prime Reid wipes the floor with Froch, but year-beyond-his-prime coming-out-of-retirement Reid should be there for the taking.

glittermonkey · Post by **glittermonkey** » 02 Feb 2007, 21:20

stujones wrote:
glittermonkey wrote:
stujones wrote:I think Carl now could beat a prime Reid, never rated Robin.
Pretty bold statement Stu, considering he's a an olympic medalist, he gave Calzaghe his hardest fight, provided a masterclass in how to win a title away from home, and was nothing short of excellent against the underrated Wharton. Froch has yet to prove himself European class, let alone prove himself capable of beating true world class operators, which is what Reid was in his day. Not a fighter to everyone's taste, but to say the current version of Froch would beat him is a touch premature.

As for the fight; I'm of the same opinion as Mr. Albert. There are better challenges for someone who rates his talent so highly. There is little to gain for Carl in fighting a man who is clearly past his prime, inactive, and undermotivated. Froch would win easily now.
He did well against Wharton no doubt, excellent fight and I enjoyed the performance - but lets not forget it was a majority decision. I thought Reid won by 4-5 rounds, but the way he boxed that night was excellent, no doubt.

However, Wharton underated? I'm not so sure about that.... A draw vs Lou Gent (powerful fighter Gent, but not European class), a struggle with Fidel Castro Smith (who was underated) - then when he stepped up to true world class he got outclassed, far more easily than Rob Reid did. Plus he was 31, had a long career and was struggling with the weight - not exactly Roy Jones was it. Wharton was European class no doubt, but not world class even in his prime (which he wasn't when he fought Reid).

As for Calzaghe, Joe was a bit green in those days - but still had no sparring and was poisioned in the run up to the fight. Hardly ideal preperation, didn't his hand go also in the fight. I scored the fight for Rob Reid - but it his testament to his ability that he didn't win out of sight the state Calzaghe was in. I have slated Joe as much as anyone, but I think he has now finally proven (it took the Brewer, Mitchell, Lacy fights) that Joe wasn't even 60% when he fought Robin Reid - and yet it was still close. Eubank, Collins, and I even think Woodhall would have beaten that Calzaghe comfortably enough.

Oh Vincenzo Nardeillo, yes great achievement on paper - going out there and making sure the fight doesn't go to the cards. However, it was only Vincenzo Nardeillo - one of the biggest loose cannons (in the ring) to hold a world belt. Wharton dealt with him, not the biggest punching Richie Woodhall handled him with ease, as did Benn and many others. Most of his fights end in KO defeats - yet at the time of the KO the fight was very very close on fair cards. That sort of indicates Reid's level. No way would Woodhall or even Froch been close on the cards with Nardiello. I would have no doubt that Froch, Woodhall, hell even David Starie would have beaten Nardiello in Italy or anywhere.

For me, Reid's best performance was his honourable loss to a faded Ottke. He did well there also.

The guy took a boxing lesson in his prime vs Silvio Branco and lost IMO to Hasine Cherifi. Quality opperators but not of Calzaghe's level, which is really why I think the Calzaghe performance flattered him an awful lot. I haven't even mentioned the Malinga fight!

The only world class fighter Reid beat was Nardiello, and that was the equivalent of Hatton vs Calos Maussa (albeit away from home). Nardiello was not really world class, but got a lucky decision vs a cagey veteran who must hate British judges. Wharton wasn't world class (European level), and he didn't beat Charifi in many peoples eyes.

I still wouldn't mind seeing it, cause I don't see Reid as being as shot as other people do - just was overated in his apparent pomp.

Fair points all.

I take it from your post that you would have Reid at a fringe world class level then. That is still a level that Froch is totally unproven in, and while he can look very classy at British level, it remains to be seen exactly how good he is in relation to today's higher level European fighters, let alone fighters that have mixed in the class that Reid has. Maybe I'll change my tune when Froch moves up another level in terms of opposition, but until then, I still think it's early to say that a fighter only proven domestically, could beat a fighter proven to be, at worst, lower world class.